NBA trade deadline "official" rumors and news

[wade boggs chicken dinner]

GSW picked up a 2021 pick. The 2020 draft is ill regarded.

Generally, ascribing savings to this move is a bit silly, since it was possible to shed the Spellman and Evans contracts otherwise. Spellman was a positive value asset even. Maybe you need to attach a 2nd rounder to Evans. Wiggins himself makes more than Russell does.

I'm not trying to say that GSW couldn't have figured out how to shed salary otherwise but it seems to me that a deal that (1) gets rid of a player that apparently had fallen out of favor, (2) sheds the necessary contracts, and (3) gets a lightly protected 1st round draft pick is a huge win whether or not Wiggins actually produces anything.

OTOH, as some writer noted, there is some cost to making your best player happy. Still, I would have thought that DLo would have been available in the summer at a reduced price. I'll also note that MIN went into luxury tax territory with all of their moves.

This article - https://zonecoverage.com/2020/timberwolves/with-dangelo-russell-glen-taylor-is-letting-gersson-rosas-do-his-thing/ - suggests that new MIN leadership is really trying to be smart about rebuilding the team and is hampered by MIN not being a free agent destination so I guess they are just happy getting rid of Wiggins. Still, giving away what should be a pretty high draft pick doesn't strike me as a smart way of doing business.

 

[lovegtm]

I'm not trying to say that GSW couldn't have figured out how to shed salary otherwise but it seems to me that a deal that (1) gets rid of a player that apparently had fallen out of favor, (2) sheds the necessary contracts, and (3) gets a lightly protected 1st round draft pick is a huge win whether or not Wiggins actually produces anything.

OTOH, as some writer noted, there is some cost to making your best player happy. Still, I would have thought that DLo would have been available in the summer at a reduced price. I'll also note that MIN went into luxury tax territory with all of their moves.

This article - https://zonecoverage.com/2020/timberwolves/with-dangelo-russell-glen-taylor-is-letting-gersson-rosas-do-his-thing/ - suggests that new MIN leadership is really trying to be smart about rebuilding the team and is hampered by MIN not being a free agent destination so I guess they are just happy getting rid of Wiggins. Still, giving away what should be a pretty high draft pick doesn't strike me as a smart way of doing business.

Yeah, I almost would rather have seen them YOLO and go unprotected 2020 and keep the 2021, given the apparent disparity in draft classes. Failing that, top-5 protect rather than top-3. I get why it's unappealing to bet on your team being bad next year too, but when you're Minny, you have to swallow some rough pills at some point.

 

[bowiac]

This article - https://zonecoverage.com/2020/timberwolves/with-dangelo-russell-glen-taylor-is-letting-gersson-rosas-do-his-thing/ - suggests that new MIN leadership is really trying to be smart about rebuilding the team and is hampered by MIN not being a free agent destination so I guess they are just happy getting rid of Wiggins. Still, giving away what should be a pretty high draft pick doesn't strike me as a smart way of doing business.

Really just comes down to which player is a more toxic asset, Wiggins or Russell. I can see good cases either way. Both guys have roughly $90M in salary coming up, and neither one belongs anywhere near a good team's starting lineup. Russell has more obvious NBA skills as a shooter and passer, but has more obvious deficits (defense), while Wiggins is just sort of generally below average at every aspect of NBA basketball.

I think my estimation of both front offices has diminished to be honest. I think I'd have rather gone ahead with Wiggins and kept the pick if I were Minnesota. And Myers likewise comes out looking clueless within the initial signing of Russell at the expense of a good first rounder plus $117M in salary (and salvaging it by trading Russell for a similarly toxic contract and a pick doesn't bring him to even).

 

[lovegtm]

Really just comes down to which player is a more toxic asset, Wiggins or Russell. I can see good cases either way. Both guys have roughly $90M in salary coming up, and neither one belongs anywhere near a good team's starting lineup. Russell has more obvious NBA skills as a shooter and passer, but has more obvious deficits (defense), while Wiggins is just sort of generally below average at every aspect of NBA basketball.

I think my estimation of both front offices has diminished to be honest. I think I'd have rather gone ahead with Wiggins and kept the pick if I were Minnesota. And Myers likewise comes out looking clueless within the initial signing of Russell at the expense of a good first rounder plus $117M in salary (and salvaging it by trading Russell for a similarly toxic contract and a pick doesn't bring him to even).

I've gone back and forth on this trade, and your post basically sums up my thoughts exactly. I guess I line towards DLo being better, just because if he develops a bit more offensively, there are lots of ways to sort of hide bad defensive guards with length. (Although playing with KAT is maybe the worst possible scenario in that regard.)

 

[CreedBratton]

Follow up on the above tweet.

View: https://twitter.com/AdamHimmelsbach/status/1225988052297928706

damn, Williams would have been nice.

 

[the moops]

But good NBA players don't sign with teams that play in cold climate cities or boring, out of the way places with little night life...

Marvin Williams is an OK player. He is only managing to play less than 20 minutes a game for one of the worst teams in the league. I wouldn't try and extrapolate what truly good NBA players do from this case.

 

[Average Game James]

But good NBA players don't sign with teams that play in cold climate cities or boring, out of the way places with little night life...

I know this was in jest, but Milwaukee is actually considered a sneaky OK city from NBA standards. It’s a little over an hour from Chicago, so pretty easy access to night life there.

 

[the moops]

Looks like MKG also being bought out. Always liked him. Too bad he never learned to shoot.

 

[DeJesus Built My Hotrod]

Marvin Williams is an OK player. He is only managing to play less than 20 minutes a game for one of the worst teams in the league. I wouldn't try and extrapolate what truly good NBA players do from this case.

Agreed. He would have been a nice-to-have but given that a bunch of folks here who know basketball were struggling with whom to cut for him. In short, Williams, or more precisely the delta between Williams and whoever is getting those minutes isn't very large.

 

[lovegtm]

Agreed. He would have been a nice-to-have but given that a bunch of folks here who know basketball were struggling with whom to cut for him. In short, Williams, or more precisely the delta between Williams and whoever is getting those minutes isn't very large.

Agree, although I think he helps Milwaukee because you can play him for Ilyasova while keeping the floor spaced. Probably why he chose Milwaukee—it’s unclear which minutes he’d be getting in Boston when rotations tighten.

 

[Devizier]

No chance Marvin Williams would crack the Celtics rotation. Does he push Williams out of the wing/big role? Seems like that would be a bad idea. He would have been insurance and not particularly good insurance either.

 

[NomarsFool]

I would cut Green for someone over 6'8" no problem. Green doesn't suck, and I know he brings some energy some nights. But, I don't think the team has that much of a need for what he brings to the table. I'd like some insurance at big, and I think Marvin Williams would have provided that.

Green is the only logical candidate to go for a buyout, I think. VP's a possibility, but pretty unlikely, I'd say.

 

[wade boggs chicken dinner]

I would cut Green for someone over 6'8" no problem. Green doesn't suck, and I know he brings some energy some nights. But, I don't think the team has that much of a need for what he brings to the table. I'd like some insurance at big, and I think Marvin Williams would have provided that.

Green is the only logical candidate to go for a buyout, I think. VP's a possibility, but pretty unlikely, I'd say.

Green is supposed to be developing into a defensive stopper. He’s too athletic to give up on that just yet...

 

[mcpickl]

No chance Marvin Williams would crack the Celtics rotation. Does he push Williams out of the wing/big role? Seems like that would be a bad idea. He would have been insurance and not particularly good insurance either.

Probably.

For me he would've been the second non-center off the bench after Smart.

At a minimum, after the Celtics top 5 guys and the two centers, would be another option with Wanamaker/Semi/Grant for Brad to deploy depending on matchups and/or which of the four are playing well.

 

[NomarsFool]

As much as I like how Grant is developing, unfortunately, he just isn't very long and doesn't seem to have much in the way of vertical leap. So, I feel like I see a lot of plays where he is playing perfect position, hands straight up, and players just shoot over him. It's sort of the same problem that Semi has. Of course, if Grant was 2" taller he would have been a top 10 pick - that's the reality. You can't teach height, as they say.

So, that is where I'd see a useful buyout - would be someone who is just a bit taller (and of course has some skill). But, we're talking about the #15 bench guy - so no biggie either way.

 

[Imbricus]

So, I feel like I see a lot of plays where he is playing perfect position, hands straight up, and players just shoot over him. It's sort of the same problem that Semi has.

I've watched him a lot, and yeah, I see some of this, with people shooting over him. But he's not Semi at all. Grant has blocked and stripped a few guys underneath who have been trying to get up shots. He's a lot smarter than Semi, even if he's not blessed with a lot of length and athleticism. And he does a lot of the little things right. He's got a little problem in being foul prone, but he'll get better on that.

 

[Euclis20]

I've watched him a lot, and yeah, I see some of this, with people shooting over him. But he's not Semi at all. Grant has blocked and stripped a few guys underneath who have been trying to get up shots. He's a lot smarter than Semi, even if he's not blessed with a lot of length and athleticism. And he does a lot of the little things right. He's got a little problem in being foul prone, but he'll get better on that.

Grant has more than twice as many blocks in about a half a season as Semi has had his entire career (28 to 12). This says more about Semi than it does about Grant, as the former is historically bad at blocking shots, especially considering his value is essentially as a wing defensive stopper. Freaking Isaiah Thomas has just 2 fewer blocks over the last 2.5 years than Semi, and that's only because Semi has played more than twice as many games as Isaiah over that stretch. It's really remarkable.

 

[JakeRae]

Grant Williams blocks shots at a perfectly respectable 3.3% rate. As an illustration of just how bad Semi is at shot blocking, his rate rounds to 0.0%. Or, if you prefer per 36 numbers to normalize across playing time, Williams averages 1.3 blocks per 36 while Semi is at 0.2.

Grant Williams isn’t a shot blocker by any stretch. For example, Theis is at 5.7% and 2.2 blocks per 36. But shot blocking and contesting is not a weakness for him.

 

[Sam Ray Not]

Absolutely perfect tank game in GS. Warriors run out a starting five of Bowman-Lee-Wiggins-Paschall-Chriss, with a rotation featuring five G-leaguers and four guys playing the first game in a Ws uniform ... and battle the Lakers down to the wire. 125-120, Lakeshow.

Wiggins 24 pts on 12 fga, 5 stl
Chriss 26 pts on 15 fga, 9 reb, 2 blk
Bowman 11 ast
Poole 19 pts on 12 fga
Smailagic 10 pts on 5 fga in 14 minutes

Wiggins stepped right off the plane and looked like a better fit than DLo in Kerrball from the moment he stepped on the court, including several strong takes/cuts to the rim and some reasonably effective iso D on LeBron.

 

[InstaFace]

But good NBA players don't sign with teams that play in cold climate cities or boring, out of the way places with little night life...

Or, worse, small-market teams.

More seriously, this underscores why it's important for the health of the league for the Bucks to convince Giannis to take the supermax. It's basically the whole reason they invented it.

 

[nighthob]

Antetokounmpo seems to have signed a 25% max extension, so I think the Bucks are screwed. You need the first bump to 30% to get the early 35% I believe.

EDIT: Check that, he signed an early extension so he’s eligible for a 35% max salary if he re-signs with the Bucks.

 

[lovegtm]

Antetokounmpo seems to have signed a 25% max extension, so I think the Bucks are screwed. You need the first bump to 30% to get the early 35% I believe.

EDIT: Check that, he signed an early extension so he’s eligible for a 35% max salary if he re-signs with the Bucks.

This also goes back to our Tatum discussion and why I’m hoping he just misses All-NBA next year

 

[nighthob]

I would really like no hard feelings tainting the process for Tatum. Especially as NBA stars from another team are already recruiting him.

In any event, he’s almost certainly making all NBA this year, so it’s probably a moot point.

 

[slamminsammya]

Tatum is going to make all NBA this year? Really? I am surprised - are voters that evolved in their accounting of defense and on/off impact?

 

[lovegtm]

Tatum is going to make all NBA this year? Really? I am surprised - are voters that evolved in their accounting of defense and on/off impact?

This would be relevant next year, since that’s what counts for whether his 2nd deal starts at 25 or 30% of the cap. The most likely structure by far is Simmons’ deal: Tatum gives up the 5th year player option in exchange for the escalation to 30% if he qualifies with the Rose Rule.

It’s unlikely he gets All-NBA this year, especially if Butler and AD count as forwards.