Finals crowds are never going to be as loud as playoff crowds in other rounds because of the number of league people and corporate sponsors accounting for a some of the tickets.
NBA Finals: Celtics vs Mavs
- Thread starter RorschachsMask
- Start date
Random stat that may only interest me: The Mavs were +69 in scoring margin heading into the Finals. Will they end the playoffs with a positive margin?
If so, it would be because the Celtics kicked the shit out of them (Boston wins the next 3 games by an average of 17 points). It has me thinking, is it theoretically possible for 15 of 16 playoff teams (everyone but the champ) to have a negative point differential in the playoffs?
I have no idea. I just like that Jaylen is trying to whip Boston fans into a frenzy and is saying that our efforts are important. I’m not sure that I believe it but it also seems like chicken soup — might help/couldn’t hurt!
Probably, but it's also theoretically possible for losing teams to be positive in point differential.
Certainly. The Orlando Magic, who lost in round 1, are currently 3rd in playoff net rating.
….
Jason Kidd is and always has been an awful human being. It’s shameful the NBA media lets him hold the job he does.
https://www.espn.com/blog/new-york/brooklyn-nets/post/_/id/19596/history-of-jason-kidds-past-incidents
What Joe should say is roughly “Jason Kidd is a guy who intentionally hit his wife in the face, so we don’t care one iota about his opinion on anything and neither should you.”
Jason Kidd is and always has been an awful human being. It’s shameful the NBA media lets him hold the job he does.
https://www.espn.com/blog/new-york/brooklyn-nets/post/_/id/19596/history-of-jason-kidds-past-incidents
I get it but the situations are not the same. And the rest of their track records are not either. Though it is of course all bad. Jaylen probably is the better messenger!
Last edited:
Game 1- Celtics scored 36 points on 25 possessions where Luka defended Jaylen (16 on 14 possessions) or Tatum (20 on 11 possessions.
3/1: Celtics scored 28 points on 14 possessions where Luka defended Tatum/Jaylen.
1/22: Celtics scored 37 on 32 possessions.
This isn’t going away for Dallas lol.
3/1: Celtics scored 28 points on 14 possessions where Luka defended Tatum/Jaylen.
1/22: Celtics scored 37 on 32 possessions.
This isn’t going away for Dallas lol.
On a related note, his knee injury seems to flare up selectively. Also, if his knee has an issue, it should be on the injury report.
That’s actually an insult to Harden.
Luka is huge factor on the defensive end. Just not for Dallas.
That was the era. Lots of bad defensive players in the 70s.
Last edited:
Nah just about right.. Rockets Harden was similarly lazy, both actually solid post defenders... Harden has better feet when he tries and got better later in his career on effort
...remind me what the final margin was in the game against GSW where they tried the masterstroke of "let Jaylen take warmup 3s"?
I believe it was 50. We won by 50 or so.
Charlotte also had a game a year or so ago where they seemed intent to take away Tatum's passing options, and make him put up video game numbers. He, too, put up 50.
Maybe they have to try it, and maybe the Jays will have a bad shooting night, but if this is your biggest worry, then you have no worries.
To be clear, I'm running through exercises of "what could I try as Dallas", because a) their base options suck b) NBA coaches have a way of surprising you with the solutions they can come up with.
As you note, however, Boston has run the gauntlet of facing those solutions, and found answers all year. Spo, JBB, and Carlise is a pretty creative set of guys to get through.
Mavs going to get their skull cracked tomorrow, I don’t even have any nerves.
So Celtics will lose by 19.
So Celtics will lose by 19.
I'm not sure why, but the report that he kicked her in the belly too always seemed to me...what's the word?...just a more vividly awful image. I know that both are equally horrible, so I don't want to lessen what a scumbag he is for hitting her in the face. But somehow the image of a grown man kicking his wife (or any woman) in the belly always sticks with me when I see his smug, arrogant face.
What a douche.
I generally disdain hate for players/coaches. A multiple offending woman beater like Kidd merits it, though, and it certainly merits being mentioned occasionally amid all the media ball-washing.
I err towards the EJ optimism scale and I'm in the same boat, so we're definitely getting rocked.
There's a weird narrative that really castigates Boston fans for going after him for it, while really underemphasizing what Kidd did. I get that it's tasteless to chant wifebeater at a guy in front of his wife, but that doesn't make the guy not a wifebeater.
After rewatching the game I noticed when KP is in the Celtics put a guard , White, Jrue, Even Pritchard in the dunk spot putting small Mav in the key on drives meaning they have to send extra help on drives leading to threes. Will Dallas try to go zone against his look?
Oh, for sure, it's a useful exercise. I just don't find that option - should they choose it - to be one that worries me.
Timpf has made the film-based case that Boston's defensive weak point is pick and roll. That KP doesn't have the mobility to handle all variations of the play, and certainly not switches. If Dallas came at us tomorrow emphasizing several different types of PNR action, particularly stuff that gets a guard on a big and then looks for the lob (which as we all know, they're great at), I bet they could get good success on it until CJM finds the counter.
He gives good copy. You get away with a lot of shit when you act like a buddy to the media guys.
They should, Legler pointed this out. The issue is you can't play zone when Kyrie and Luka are freelancing. If they don't get into position, you still are going to have open 3s.
If you are the Mavs there are couple of things you have to do.
1) You need off ball action to get Tatum off the lob. Tatum is so disruptive playing the 5 in defense and it pretty much kills the Mav's non Kyrie/Luka offense. Raja Bell was suggesting using ram screens but possibly using a wide pindown off the ball would work. In reality it means the Mavs need to execute off ball movement.
2) Luka HAS to stay in front of Tatum and Brown on defense. Shit I would tell Luka to drop off Tatum. But Luka needs to keep those guys in front him way better because:
3) Mavs cannot collapse into the lane each time Brown and Tatum blow by the primary defender especially with Tatum, make him have to decide to finish to the hoop.
4) Luka probably needs to stop hunting the bigs so much and start hunting White for post ups. Luka is not fast enough to take advantage of Al. He is better up backing down White.
5) Kyrie needs to move more off ball [works with above] and start bringing the ball up more because Luka will be sucking wind playing some D. If White is on Kyrie, having Kyrie bring it up and get into two man action with Luka could open things up.
6) Slow the game down. Some people were saying speed up, but the Mavs want to muck things up and have the Celtics settling. Lively was fantastic in really ruining the Celtics rhythm in the third. Dare the refs to call you.
Mavs need to decide if they think they can slow down the Cs 3 point shooting. They have given up 15+ 3pm and 42+ 3pa in each of the 3 games this year. Given the personnel, there is no reason to think they can slow this down. That leads me to believe the Mavs need to shoot as many 3s as they can and hope the variance breaks in your favor. There’s a reason the only 2 games these playoffs the Cs have lost is when the opponent catches fire from 3.
Play slowly to limit possessions, shoot lots of threes (more Hardaway and Kleiber, less Gafford and DJJ), get everyone back to prevent fast breaks, and pray that’s enough 4 out of 6 games. If they wait until after they lose game 2 it will be impossible to win 4 out 5 against this Celtics team. So they need to try this immediately. I doubt Kidd will do this but that’s what I think is clear at this point that they need to try.
Play slowly to limit possessions, shoot lots of threes (more Hardaway and Kleiber, less Gafford and DJJ), get everyone back to prevent fast breaks, and pray that’s enough 4 out of 6 games. If they wait until after they lose game 2 it will be impossible to win 4 out 5 against this Celtics team. So they need to try this immediately. I doubt Kidd will do this but that’s what I think is clear at this point that they need to try.
Jaylen Brown was heard singing this tune in preparation for G2 and facing Luka.
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IDBVW4BXZPo
View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IDBVW4BXZPo
Miami has the best and most experienced zone in the league. They nearly beat a superior Philly team with it in the play-in (they would have, if Nic Batum hadn't gone out of his mind).
When they tried running it against Boston in Round 1, the Celtics shredded it, and Spoelstra completely stopped using it.
I'm not sure why Dallas would expect to have a different result (outside of maybe 1-2 initial confused possessions).
View: https://www.twitter.com/celtics/status/1799426295043936289
The Celtics in-house production team is so good. The Patriots had a generational dynasty and their team media looked like public access productions.
The Celtics in-house production team is so good. The Patriots had a generational dynasty and their team media looked like public access productions.
Bob Ryan ultimately paid a greater professional price for saying he wanted to smack Jason Kidd’s wife than Kidd did for actually punching her in the face.
I lived in New Jersey at the time and can remember the outrage some had… at Ryan. “The nerve… disrespecting another man’s wife like that!”
I think about that not infrequently; it left something of an impression on me, that juxtaposition.
I think Sports Illustrated’s puff PR piece to help rehab Kidd’s image was the last thing I ever read from them. Reilly had clearly gone to mailing it in, the internet was on the rise, so I had known the end was nigh for them… but that piece of shit article really surprised me.
Really, the whole of the league’s Teflon Kidd Project pisses me off. And there’s so much, as per @PedroKsBambino ’s link. Does he have compromising photos of, like, everyone? I don’t fucking get it.
Wasn't it bc his wife and (maybe) kid were in the building? I don't remember that far back but I thought it was this.
This has not happened in the NBA. Closest there is +25 by the 1954-55 Nationals. The Nets in 1976 notably won the ABA title and finished at a net 0. New York's opponent, Denver, won their first series against the Colonials despite a net -6 point differential in the seven games. Kentucky finished that postseason with a positive point differential.
It's possible for every single playoff team to finish with a negative point differential if there's enough blow outs the other way!
Just to put the the numbers to the post:
Regular Season: 39.5 3pa, 14.6 3pm, 36.9%
Playoffs: 33.5 3pa, 12.3 3pm, 36.7%
Game 1 Finals: 27 3pa, 7 3pm, 25.9%
Cs absolutely crushed The Mavs’ 3 pointer game and, as per @Jakarta post, it pretty clearly appears not to be just a matter of
They were always in the building. She’d get court side seats where she would very ostentatiously play with their kid to demonstrate what a beautiful wonderful happy family they were in an attempt to land a TV gig. It was totally gross.
During the game I was amazed Luka got this shot off, now I know how...Loudini, the Master of Illusion
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/wygbtMF04gk
https://www.youtube.com/shorts/wygbtMF04gk
That is gross. But, IDK how you deal with that when you're a victim (I think repeated victim). It's got to be awful making certain choices especially soon after the incidents. Maybe this is more V&N stuff and we should move it there. So, I'm not here to forgive Kidd at all, but I think the optics at the time in 2002 weren't great with her and their kid sitting in front of cameras. But, yeah, that was a choice the Kidds made. He's ultimately the villain in the story and has not suffered many repercussions.
It is but he arguably traveled twice. He passed the ball to himself (you can argue the dribble was interrupted by the arm grab) and then it's a photo finish of whether he got his shot off before landing. I don't think he did. It's easier to slow and show shot when you are allowed to land prior to release. It's the most effective "fake" in the world to be allowed to do this.
Well, this is not a sight you see every day. JM talking to Pep:
https://x.com/MHershgordon/status/1798456988155986299
P. S. Pep Guardiola is one of the most successful and respected soccer/football managers in the world. Apparently, Joe called Pep the "best coach in any sport":
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pep_Guardiola
https://x.com/MHershgordon/status/1798456988155986299
P. S. Pep Guardiola is one of the most successful and respected soccer/football managers in the world. Apparently, Joe called Pep the "best coach in any sport":
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Pep_Guardiola
Joe and his kid went to Manchester to see Pep/City train earlier this year (during All-Star break)
Not only did Luka land, with both feet before he released the ball BUT his right foot heel touched and then arched up off the floor to give his shot extra lift.
Then Luka yells at the Refs F--K with his arms raised about a no-call, when he wasn't touched at the rim
Yikes that's a pretty impressive miss by the Refs & the telecast, but not shocking.
Must get Luka back into this game, Ratings!
Joe said they’ve become good friends over the years in his interview yesterday I believe? He said one thing he’s taught him about is spacing. Picture was posted somewhere in these threads a few days ago.
This all reads spot on to me with the exception of #4.
Luka playing post ball with White is something I actively hope he does as a Cs fan. The big roll game has been so dangerous for them because it can result in super high efficiency situations - Luka layups, lobs, or open looks from 3 for a role player after help comes.
Luka on White is mostly just going to result in Luka mid-range shots. He might get down low some, but ultimately I don't think the Cs are going to rush to help White on that matchup, so you're still in the same bind you are now where they can't create an advantage that forces help. They need to get the Cs to rotate to get their role players some easy 3s. I think the best shot is to stick to the PnR but with the off ball action you mention in #1.
Also, as far as #4 in the quoted post, Luka blew by Al a couple times pretty easily.
DAL played some zone with Kleber. I can't find the zone stats but Kleber was -19. Hard to play "Tatum rules" defense when in zone.
https://www.theringer.com/nba/2024/6/7/24173614/luka-doncic-kyrie-irving-dallas-mavericks-boston-celtics-nba-finals-2024
‘People are making a big deal out of it’: Celtics’ Sam Hauser downplays his quick-release three-pointer from Game 1
Sam Hauser downplays his Game 1 quick-release three-pointer (boston.com)
“I work on it every day in practice. You don’t really get an opportunity to shoot them in the game very often,” he told reporters during Saturday’s media day. “I maybe had one or two throughout this season. But that one just happened to be in the NBA Finals and people are making a big deal out of it.”
Sam Hauser downplays his Game 1 quick-release three-pointer (boston.com)
“I work on it every day in practice. You don’t really get an opportunity to shoot them in the game very often,” he told reporters during Saturday’s media day. “I maybe had one or two throughout this season. But that one just happened to be in the NBA Finals and people are making a big deal out of it.”