The only thing different between most 80 somethings in a nursing home suffering from dementia and this guy is a smokeshow of a girlfriend. Telling your girl it's okay to fuck Magic Johnson? That's like failing some kind of mini mental exam for rich guys.
Microballing: Steve Ballmer's LA Clippers
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but what did he specifically say on that recording that was hateful? Yes - bizarre and stupid, but not hateful. I heard his GF repeatedly accuse him of being hateful and him repeatedly denying it and saying he loves minorities...
yeah for rich dudes dating young dumb smokeshows the open relationship thing is supposed to go the other way...
yeah for rich dudes dating young dumb smokeshows the open relationship thing is supposed to go the other way...
Did you listen to the whole thing? That was pretty sad.
Whatever his levels of prejudice and racism are... he isn't long for this world.
On the other hand, her twisted evil will likely be around for a long time.
Whatever his levels of prejudice and racism are... he isn't long for this world.
On the other hand, her twisted evil will likely be around for a long time.
Donald Sterling set to receive Lifetime Achievement Award from NAACP (again): http://t.co/CJEnt5U1QP
Did you even listen to it?
"It bothers me a lot that you want to broadcast that you’re associating with black people. Do you have to?"
"You can sleep with [black people]. You can bring them in, you can do whatever you want. The little I ask you is not to promote it on that ... and not to bring them to my games."
"It bothers me a lot that you want to broadcast that you’re associating with black people. Do you have to?"
"You can sleep with [black people]. You can bring them in, you can do whatever you want. The little I ask you is not to promote it on that ... and not to bring them to my games."
I guess Doc knew what he was getting into, but to compare this troglodyte to Wic in terms of owners, well, again, Doc knew what he was buying into.
It really surprises me that anyone comes out of this with anything other than a demand that Sterling be relieved of ownership. The fact that 'he's done it before' only means he should have never been an owner in the first place.
Sure, sometimes taping people without their knowledge is bad. But this particular instance doesn't seem the time to focus on that detail.
edit:
This pretty much covers my reaction:
http://espn.go.com/blog/marc-stein/post/_/id/2172/no-escape-route-for-sterling-this-time
double edit:
And what a giant piece of shit.
Sure, sometimes taping people without their knowledge is bad. But this particular instance doesn't seem the time to focus on that detail.
edit:
This pretty much covers my reaction:
http://espn.go.com/blog/marc-stein/post/_/id/2172/no-escape-route-for-sterling-this-time
double edit:
And what a giant piece of shit.
I just hope the Clippers play, and play hard, despite the calls to quit from hacks like Olbermann. We need the illusion that professional athletes want to win. Punishing the fans is not the way to teach Sterling a lesson. Let the league figure out how to put him out to pasture. He has no place in sports ownership. Silver needs to make that happen. He knows that.
As for the privacy issue, yes, I can agree for the most part. If the gold-digger broke laws, she should be prosecuted. But I also think that sports team ownership makes you a public figure, and that carries extra responsibility. Maybe there's a whistle-blower aspect to this case, not that she seems noble enough to be doing this for that reason.
As for the privacy issue, yes, I can agree for the most part. If the gold-digger broke laws, she should be prosecuted. But I also think that sports team ownership makes you a public figure, and that carries extra responsibility. Maybe there's a whistle-blower aspect to this case, not that she seems noble enough to be doing this for that reason.
There's no process to relieve someone of ownership is there?
Could the NBA refuse to schedule Clipper games next year? I assume not.
Could the NBA refuse to schedule Clipper games next year? I assume not.
You can't just go and take shit someone has owned for years away from them just because he holds unpopular opinions, and makes statements that are socially unacceptable.
The NBA will have to much more subtly find a way to segue the Clippers into a new ownership situation than just demand that this guy not be an owner anymore.
Of course, in that market, with a good team, fan base, etc, the sale.of the Clippers stands to put a LOT of money is this prick's pocket. I guess he can go somewhere other than LA and spend it partying with Frank McCourt for a few years until he goes off to burn in Hell.
The NBA will have to much more subtly find a way to segue the Clippers into a new ownership situation than just demand that this guy not be an owner anymore.
Of course, in that market, with a good team, fan base, etc, the sale.of the Clippers stands to put a LOT of money is this prick's pocket. I guess he can go somewhere other than LA and spend it partying with Frank McCourt for a few years until he goes off to burn in Hell.
Fred not Lynn said:
That would be my assumption... that said, the NBA sanctions players for doing/saying shit all the time. I suppose it's collectively bargained that the league can do that stuff to players.
I actually think a good course of action would be for the players to refuse to play until he agrees to sell the team. Of course, the odds of NBA players ever doing anything taking a stand for social justice involving anything other than a symbolic stand is zero.
I'd settle for them being introduced and each coming out with a sign that says Donald Sterling is a bigot. Then do it every game until he sells. I double dare the NBA to sanction them.
TMZ reports that she is being sued by the family for embezzling more than $1.8 million... and according to them, anyway - said she'd "get even."
So... there's the motive.
* I wonder when she made the tape.
So... there's the motive.
* I wonder when she made the tape.
Note to self - no mistresses!
Honestly it really depends on how much the mainstream media cares about it. It does look like it's going to blow up but it is the Clippers so you never know. They could find the airplane tonight and it's a non story by Monday.
seageral said:
Honestly it really depends on how much the mainstream media cares about it. It does look like it's going to blow up but it is the Clippers so you never know. They could find the airplane tonight and it's a non story by Monday.
In MA, it's illegal to record a conversation with someone without their knowledge.riboflav said:
Doc seems to have handled things in a focused yet dignified manner. To his credit he's not muting in any way how pissed he and his team are over this:
That's true in about 12 states (including CA), in the rest single-party consent is sufficient. Maryland's another all-party consent state, that came up with the Linda Tripp tapes during the Lewinsky scandal.Myt1 said:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Telephone_recording_laws#All-party_consent_states
Some of the reactions on this thread made me think the dude was actually lynching people. Some old rich dude said something racist... privately? Oh wow. The level of outrage is about as funny as sterling being in denial that his lady is "mixed"
I don't believe in punishing people for their private beliefs no matter how strange they are. You guys planning on boycotting the clips/warriors game?
I don't believe in punishing people for their private beliefs no matter how strange they are. You guys planning on boycotting the clips/warriors game?
Doc has some nice words that basically come down to...."whatever"
I feel the same. Sterling is a rich goof cuckold, it is a non event as to how it will impact me watching his basketball team.
I feel the same. Sterling is a rich goof cuckold, it is a non event as to how it will impact me watching his basketball team.
Well, i agree it's more a matter of "look at that pathetic old creep" rather than an urgent political issue, but it is still...pretty f-ing shocking to hear this dinosaur going off. It's also a big deal for the Clippers, in re a potential distraction. And it's a big deal for the NBA in terms of its public image. Silver can't be happy -- I have no idea what options the league has, but they have a huge PR issue on their hands.
So a gold digging piece of crap hooks up with a racist piece of crap. What a match made in heaven, or more likely hell. The outcome is hardly surprising as more comes out.
Read the story. Donald Sterling's WIFE is suing Stiviano for having an affair with Sterling. The suit essentially calls Stiviano a gold digger, and seeks to have the courts force Stiviano to return 1.8 million dollars in gifts that she received from Sterling during the course of the affair. The suit doesn't claim embezzlement, that's just a word Sterling used today. Basically, Sterling paid her for sex and his wife's not happy about it.Fred not Lynn said:
I'm not shocked at all, I'm shocked its on tape maybe. but I find the incongruence in this dudes life odd. He has a biracial gf a black head coach and pays a bunch of black dudes millions of dollars. If chapelle still had his show this could be a bit.
I hope it doesn't affect the players performance. Maybe the Latina goddess or whatever he called her is a golden state warriors operative.
I hope it doesn't affect the players performance. Maybe the Latina goddess or whatever he called her is a golden state warriors operative.
luckiestman said:
I don't see anyone reacting all that badly to this story - and where are the people saying they are boycotting games?
That said, per this report the percentage of black players in the NBA is 76.3 (81 percent were players of color). As many have stated before, Sterling is well known for being a horrible owner and for his discriminatory business practices. However, this is the first time that his views have been aired publicly, even if they weren't meant to be shared beyond a private conversation.
You may not think its a big deal but when you look at the league player demographics, it is indeed, an issue. While it may not affect you, I can understand how it might extremely difficult for someone to take money from a guy who may judge people on the basis of their skin color.
It's a big deal that Sterling is a racist. These comments aren't really a big deal (to me) because anyone who knows anything about Sterling already knows he is a racist and a scumbag. I would be shocked if he didn't talk this way behind closed doors to be honest.
That said, the comments certainly put his loathsome existence in the national spotlight, which can only be a good thing. I don't really know how much power Silver has in a situation like this, but a Marge Schott-like suspension would be nice. Obviously the real goal is to get him to sell the team, but that could be tough.
That said, the comments certainly put his loathsome existence in the national spotlight, which can only be a good thing. I don't really know how much power Silver has in a situation like this, but a Marge Schott-like suspension would be nice. Obviously the real goal is to get him to sell the team, but that could be tough.
Myt1 said:
Yes, if she did this in CA without his consent, then that appears to be illegal and she should be treated as a criminal. I was getting more at that this sort of thing - recording/monitoring of private actions followed by public flogging or employee discipline or other cultural punishment - is becoming socially acceptable and that disturbs me. I understand, however, that Sterling, as a demonstrated racist and very unsympathetic character, is not the best example or jumping off point for this discussion and will step aside.
I guess I should clarify that I basically completely agree with what radsoxfan said above.
He's old. his son-in-law is next in line and will be owner soon. they could lifetime suspend Sterling from games, but there's no mechanism for stealing a hundred million dollar asset from someone just because he's a jerk. That would be mob rule.
yes I listened to the whole tape. I went in expecting it to be a huge smoking gun b/c of everything I knew about him & the way the media characterized the tape but he didn't strike me as very hateful - just sort of old, tired, stupid, pathetic and very bizarre. On the tape he gets repeatedly asked why he hates minorities and denies it every time and says he loves minorities and is good friends with and has high respect for certain ones. He just has a weird aversion to his GF being seen in public with them, which is especially weird b/c she is one. It just strikes me as very strange & bizarre & illogical but not really hateful. If he really hated minorities, he probably would not be in a serious relationship with one or be fine with GF sleeping with them. It's also probably worth mentioning that he's currently suing her for stealing millions from him which explains why she repeatedly baited him in a conversation she was recording; it would not surprise me at all if she tried to extort him before going public.
I knew he was a racist jerk all along & it's been very well documented in the public record. If anything he should have been hung out to dry for his slumlord history in LA and all the stuff that came out in the Elgin Baylor trial. This tape is a big nothingburger compared to that.
He's old. his son-in-law is next in line and will be owner soon. they could lifetime suspend Sterling from games, but there's no mechanism for stealing a hundred million dollar asset from someone just because he's a jerk. That would be mob rule.
yes I listened to the whole tape. I went in expecting it to be a huge smoking gun b/c of everything I knew about him & the way the media characterized the tape but he didn't strike me as very hateful - just sort of old, tired, stupid, pathetic and very bizarre. On the tape he gets repeatedly asked why he hates minorities and denies it every time and says he loves minorities and is good friends with and has high respect for certain ones. He just has a weird aversion to his GF being seen in public with them, which is especially weird b/c she is one. It just strikes me as very strange & bizarre & illogical but not really hateful. If he really hated minorities, he probably would not be in a serious relationship with one or be fine with GF sleeping with them. It's also probably worth mentioning that he's currently suing her for stealing millions from him which explains why she repeatedly baited him in a conversation she was recording; it would not surprise me at all if she tried to extort him before going public.
I knew he was a racist jerk all along & it's been very well documented in the public record. If anything he should have been hung out to dry for his slumlord history in LA and all the stuff that came out in the Elgin Baylor trial. This tape is a big nothingburger compared to that.
I agree with those saying that the comments on tape are somewhat contradictory and weird. And everyone familiar with Sterling knows the guy has an awful reputation as a person. However, in today's environment and for the NBA, its players and fans, this IS a big deal. Did you read Doc's comments above? He clearly thinks its a big deal and he is a pretty measured guy by all accounts.
This story is only likely to get bigger over the next few days.
This story is only likely to get bigger over the next few days.
JohntheBaptist said:
Sorry, I didn't see this until now. I would disagree with the notion that no one would care if you said really dumb stuff like Sterling. Surely, you (or at least most of us SoSHers) belong to several communities such as a PTA, church, school, youth soccer team, neighborhood, job/company, etc. If I record the really dumb stuff you say and upload it to the Internet or post it to my Facebook page so that all our common friends can view it, then it will greatly impact your life. If it happened to me, I would surely lose my job (varsity coach) and have to move out my (diverse) neighborhood. Even then, it could follow me to wherever I move to if it's on the Internet and I still wouldn't have the chance to repent and start over. You are not allowed to make a mistake on the Internet, after all.
This just doesn't go for uttering stupid racist shit. I can think of a lot of dumb things I said especially when I was 20 or 24 years old that could get me into trouble among my friends and colleagues if they were posted to the Internet today.
The most popular current player and one of the best players of all time thinks it's a big deal:
http://blogs.herald.com/miami_heat/2014/04/complete-transcript-of-lebrons-response-on-donald-sterling-so-powerful-so-raw-read-to-very-last-sent.html
http://blogs.herald.com/miami_heat/2014/04/complete-transcript-of-lebrons-response-on-donald-sterling-so-powerful-so-raw-read-to-very-last-sent.html
It's too bad the Kevin Garnett to LAC deal didn't happen, his reaction would probably give Sterling a stroke.
luckiestman said:
it's not shocking that Sterling is a racist, but I think you're fooling yourself in 2 ways. 1, it's shocking in that you just don't hear shit like this often anymore. When is the last time an owner of a professional franchise was publicly outed using language so completely out of touch with our norms? It's shocking in the base sense of the word: highly unusual/contrary to common behavior.
ALiveH said:
I can't really go so far as to say it's not really hate, but it's also shocking in this second sense: just f-ing weird. He's clearly just a sad, messed up dude with his Latina/black gf....if it was just your everyday racism -- use of the N word or whatever -- then, again, I'd find it easier to buy the "not shocking argument." But beyond the blatant racism, how twisted and just weird makes it shocking in a 2nd sense.
LeBron's full comments are excellent:Toe Nash said:
http://deadspin.com/lebron-james-there-is-no-room-for-donald-sterling-in-1568198962
Say what you will about LeBron's move to Miami and how he handled it. But the guy has come on strong both on the court and off the last few years.
OK, you're a varsity coach. If someone caught you on record barfing up racist garbage--or something else that similarly calls into question your influence on young people--then put it up online and you lost your job over it and your defense was "I call bullshit that was meant to be private," the "breach of privacy" (and how much of a breach is it? Are there many closet/ secret racists? Isn't a racist usually fairly satisfied with their take on the world?) wouldn't really move me, and I'd consider you 100% to blame for what happened. I'd see that as a victory for accountability, not some horrifying sea change that will eradicate my private life going forward. You say "dumb," but I'd argue that in fact no, no one on the internet would care about you or I saying something "dumb." They may, of course, care if we are saying something hateful, abusive, prejudiced or similarly socially unacceptable--but even then, I'm not a varsity coach. What could I say that anyone would even bat an eye toward?
Further, you expressed this event as some bad omen for freedom of expression, which my post intended to disagree with. Yes it happens to famous people occasionally now, but it just does not happen to John Q. Internet-User. Yes, the scenario you describe could happen; but more often than not when these things gain internet traction it isn't because some librarian got caught by a nefarious dickhead saying something backwards and misinformed and got herself fired by an evil internet tidal wave. It's because someone in a position for the community to care about got caught saying/ doing something that isn't OK even in private and called into question whether they deserve the community's continued support (NBA owner, varsity coach, etc).
Ultimately, when you say things like that, you incur consequences. That one of them was a person looking for leverage taking those monologues as an opportunity isn't really an issue to me. Of course she did. That's the kind of bad shit that happens when you put that out into the world. Standing around wringing one's hands about how awful the gold-digger is and how this is all an affront on our privacy misses the point. This is a good thing to me--it means people give a shit about someone being blithely racist, and there are actual negative social consequences to putting that out there. Putting her motives aside for a second, the reason she recorded it was because she knew people would hear it and not put up with it (creating leverage for herself), which is a good thing.
So yes, I am very comfortable living in a world with increased chances for someone like Donald Sterling to get caught as the person he truly is, and for the reaction from the community to be a rejection of it and not an outcry over his bruised privacy.
Further, you expressed this event as some bad omen for freedom of expression, which my post intended to disagree with. Yes it happens to famous people occasionally now, but it just does not happen to John Q. Internet-User. Yes, the scenario you describe could happen; but more often than not when these things gain internet traction it isn't because some librarian got caught by a nefarious dickhead saying something backwards and misinformed and got herself fired by an evil internet tidal wave. It's because someone in a position for the community to care about got caught saying/ doing something that isn't OK even in private and called into question whether they deserve the community's continued support (NBA owner, varsity coach, etc).
Ultimately, when you say things like that, you incur consequences. That one of them was a person looking for leverage taking those monologues as an opportunity isn't really an issue to me. Of course she did. That's the kind of bad shit that happens when you put that out into the world. Standing around wringing one's hands about how awful the gold-digger is and how this is all an affront on our privacy misses the point. This is a good thing to me--it means people give a shit about someone being blithely racist, and there are actual negative social consequences to putting that out there. Putting her motives aside for a second, the reason she recorded it was because she knew people would hear it and not put up with it (creating leverage for herself), which is a good thing.
So yes, I am very comfortable living in a world with increased chances for someone like Donald Sterling to get caught as the person he truly is, and for the reaction from the community to be a rejection of it and not an outcry over his bruised privacy.
Sterling is a public figure, and I think it's useful to know what public figures say behind closed doors. What knowing the identity of a recorder should tell me is how and how much to discount what the recording says i.e. is there a possibility the recording was deliberately taken out of context, as with the Shirley Sherrod case, or resurfacing something that the recorder knows is not currently true? I am not a lawyer and so can't speak to the legality of recording Governor Romney's 47% speech (done in Florida), but even if the recording was done by a hard-core Democrat, that wouldn't invalidate my assessment of what the speech conveys.
Even if Sterling's recorder was the diggingest gold-digger that ever dug gold, with a million-dollar monetary motive for releasing the recording right now, that wouldn't change my judgement that the recording shows that he is an awful racist that shouldn't be owning an NBA team - unless her motives meant that there was a possibility that the recording really isn't of Sterling but someone else, or there's some way she manipulated Sterling's words to create a false impression (neither of which I have seen suggested so far; I'm happy to take back my words if there really is some doubt on the authenticity of the recording).
riboflav: I agree that the permanence of "dumb shit said as a kid" resurfacing because of technology is problematic, but I hope - and think - society probably will eventually learn to discount that kind of thing. The Sterling case just isn't such a case. It doesn't appear to be one where a man said these things 50 years ago and is being unfairly judged by the public without any consideration of what his present-day views really are. Neither does it seem that his words were taken out of context. If a varsity coach says really racist stuff in private to one of his assistants who then records it and uploads it, sure it will impact his life permanently. I just think a secret recording that reveals your character is the kind of thing that _should_ have a permanent impact. When the secret video recording of Mike Rice shouting homophobic slurs at his Rutgers players and throwing basketballs at them came out, should he not have been fired?
Even if Sterling's recorder was the diggingest gold-digger that ever dug gold, with a million-dollar monetary motive for releasing the recording right now, that wouldn't change my judgement that the recording shows that he is an awful racist that shouldn't be owning an NBA team - unless her motives meant that there was a possibility that the recording really isn't of Sterling but someone else, or there's some way she manipulated Sterling's words to create a false impression (neither of which I have seen suggested so far; I'm happy to take back my words if there really is some doubt on the authenticity of the recording).
riboflav: I agree that the permanence of "dumb shit said as a kid" resurfacing because of technology is problematic, but I hope - and think - society probably will eventually learn to discount that kind of thing. The Sterling case just isn't such a case. It doesn't appear to be one where a man said these things 50 years ago and is being unfairly judged by the public without any consideration of what his present-day views really are. Neither does it seem that his words were taken out of context. If a varsity coach says really racist stuff in private to one of his assistants who then records it and uploads it, sure it will impact his life permanently. I just think a secret recording that reveals your character is the kind of thing that _should_ have a permanent impact. When the secret video recording of Mike Rice shouting homophobic slurs at his Rutgers players and throwing basketballs at them came out, should he not have been fired?
I lived in LA during the Elgin Baylor trial and the whole slumlord / DOJ situation. It was followed pretty closely by the local media and all my sports fan friends were talking about what a scumbag racist he was. In that case, it was a matter of proven public record that he was a scumbag racist and that his racism was actively hurting the well-being of certain minorities.
And, if average Joe's like me knew all this, then all the NBA insiders knew all this and 10x as much with all the personal interactions & anecdotes probably going around of what a racist scumbag he was.
And, the NBA did...nothing. And Magic Johnson and Lebron James and Jesse Jackson at the time said...nothing. And, Chris Paul and Doc Rivers had no problem signing on with him and taking his millions.
So, I guess I just have mixed feelings. This tape is nothing compared to all that other stuff everyone already knew and it seems like everyone is using it as a politically opportune time to just pile on to him. I definitely feel like he deserves everything he's got coming & worse, but I also think it's shedding a light on how certain individuals (like those mentioned above) are being political opportunists cause now it's cool to slam him.
And, if average Joe's like me knew all this, then all the NBA insiders knew all this and 10x as much with all the personal interactions & anecdotes probably going around of what a racist scumbag he was.
And, the NBA did...nothing. And Magic Johnson and Lebron James and Jesse Jackson at the time said...nothing. And, Chris Paul and Doc Rivers had no problem signing on with him and taking his millions.
So, I guess I just have mixed feelings. This tape is nothing compared to all that other stuff everyone already knew and it seems like everyone is using it as a politically opportune time to just pile on to him. I definitely feel like he deserves everything he's got coming & worse, but I also think it's shedding a light on how certain individuals (like those mentioned above) are being political opportunists cause now it's cool to slam him.
LeBron is quoted as saying "There is no place for Sterling in this league, man. There it is."
and that "Adam [Silver] has to do something quickly".
http://www.hothothoops.com/2014/4/26/5656710/lebron-takes-strong-stance-against-sterlings-comments
A strong but calm headed statement. My respect for LeBron just went way up.
and that "Adam [Silver] has to do something quickly".
http://www.hothothoops.com/2014/4/26/5656710/lebron-takes-strong-stance-against-sterlings-comments
A strong but calm headed statement. My respect for LeBron just went way up.