Manchester United 2021-2022: Any trophy will do

Zomp

Moderator
Moderator
SoSH Member
Aug 28, 2006
13,942
The Slums of Shaolin
Yeah i guess her dad gave a statement too that in a way supported Mason and the United fans were in agreement that it was terrible and that we should be done with him.

teammates are unfollowing him on Twitter and Instagram, the club shop has pulled all merchandise with his name on it.
 

SocrManiac

Tommy Seebach’s mustache
SoSH Member
Apr 15, 2006
8,632
Somers, CT
A meteoric rise to super stardom at a club like United and a national team like England, the attention, the abuse... These must be psychologically trying to navigate for anybody, let alone teenagers. Are the players well-supported during such an ascension? It's not difficult to see how a monster could be created from such circumstances.

This is not meant in any way to condone what Greenwood has done. It's about protecting kids (and those around them) now and in the future.

I apologize for cluttering up the United thread- this probably needs to be discussed elsewhere. I'm still a little not okay from recapping this stuff this morning.
 

CPT Neuron

Got Pitching?
SoSH Member
Dec 4, 2001
3,515
Biddeford, ME
The audio files and images available for review are repulsive. There is no punishments Stern enough 4 Tim, with the caveat being that he is guilty as all evidence appears to point towards, and it is refreshing to see the club make a definitive stand immediately without any type of ambiguity.
 

Zomp

Moderator
Moderator
SoSH Member
Aug 28, 2006
13,942
The Slums of Shaolin
They released a statement saying that he "will not return to training or play in matches until further notice".

I'm not well versed enough in the way England handles their criminal cases but I was under the impression that while an investigation is going on it is not smart to comment or do anything too rash as it could be seen as giving the accused party the defense that he wasn't subject to a fair trial because of public material. There is an article about it behind a paywall on The Independent's website, I'm just reading the cliffnotes on the United subreddit.

The author's larger point is that its bigger than United. That its a problem in football and sport in general and I agree 100%.
 

cromulence

Member
SoSH Member
Aug 25, 2009
6,699
There's definitely something to that. For a while, the BBC was still saying "a 20 year old" had been arrested, even after ESPN and other American outlets were saying it was Greenwood and the team had announced he was suspended. They did eventually name him, but I'm not sure what the threshold is. It was similar with Gylfi Sigurdsson - everyone knew who it was, but the UK media wouldn't say his name.
 

Mighty Joe Young

The North remembers
SoSH Member
Sep 14, 2002
8,401
Halifax, Nova Scotia , Canada
They released a statement saying that he "will not return to training or play in matches until further notice".

I'm not well versed enough in the way England handles their criminal cases but I was under the impression that while an investigation is going on it is not smart to comment or do anything too rash as it could be seen as giving the accused party the defense that he wasn't subject to a fair trial because of public material. There is an article about it behind a paywall on The Independent's website, I'm just reading the cliffnotes on the United subreddit.

The author's larger point is that its bigger than United. That its a problem in football and sport in general and I agree 100%.
Oh … agree 100% as well. I didn’t mean to be ripping the United board as such. As mentioned the article uses the Greenwood case as a jumping off point. And one suspects UK law prohibits naming perps in this case.
 

Zomp

Moderator
Moderator
SoSH Member
Aug 28, 2006
13,942
The Slums of Shaolin
Its the daily mail so I'd wait for another source to report it, but its the logical move.

In that article it also says Lingard, Rashford and Fred all re-followed him on Instagram but that isn't true.
 

OCST

Sunny von Bulow
SoSH Member
Jan 10, 2004
24,483
The 718
Oh … agree 100% as well. I didn’t mean to be ripping the United board as such. As mentioned the article uses the Greenwood case as a jumping off point. And one suspects UK law prohibits naming perps in this case.
Gylfi Sigurdsson was arrested on some sort of sex-abuse charge just before the season started. He has been persona non grata ever since in the news and in all Everton publications- they just tersely announced that it was a member of the first-team squad (for a day, people thought it was Fabian Delph).

The Everton board I frequent issued a stern warning to the chatters that due to UK defamation law, we couldn't even mention the name or the dopes, or whatever they're called, could be charged.

So I would expect much less discussion in the press than you'd find in the States.
 

MiracleOfO2704

not AWOL
SoSH Member
Jul 12, 2005
9,528
The Island
Yeah, remember that the 30 for 30 doc on Hillsborough couldn’t be shown when it was released in North America because the new coroner’s inquest was underway. It’s fairly clear they won’t allow anything to influence a case, even if it’s obvious who it’s about.
 

Jimy Hendrix

Member
SoSH Member
Jun 15, 2002
5,846
What is going on for the past week in this locker room? Is everybody mouthing off to every journalist in earshot, or are there just one or two guys who cannot stop talking?
 

Zomp

Moderator
Moderator
SoSH Member
Aug 28, 2006
13,942
The Slums of Shaolin
Its disheartening. I've never seen a group of players go from likeable to so unlikeable in one season. People will point to Ronaldo coming in as the difference but I don't know. The most baffling part of the season has been Maguire and Shaw's drop off since the euros.
 

Morgan's Magic Snowplow

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 2, 2006
22,345
Philadelphia
My guess is that there are a few players who were Ole's guys and now find themselves on the outside and they're not happy about it. Shaw, AWB, and Rashford would be my first three guesses.
 

Jimy Hendrix

Member
SoSH Member
Jun 15, 2002
5,846
Whoever is whining made the mistake of being too specific, IMO. Todays thing of "we spend too much time on structure and organization instead of skills drills" rings a bit weird. They're trying to implement a new structured pressing system in the middle of the season, what the hell else would you expect?
 

scotian1

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 19, 2005
16,324
Kingston, Nova Scotia
Simply they are not good enough and the powers behind the team including the Glazers had no interest in improving the team through the transfer window. Everybody knew they needed a holding midfielder but none was added. To top everything off players who wanted to leave with the Manager's apparent blessing were refused. They are a mess and too many of them are forgetting or just don't care there is no I in the word TEAM.
 

Zomp

Moderator
Moderator
SoSH Member
Aug 28, 2006
13,942
The Slums of Shaolin
We'll see. He could be great. Could be Villas Boas.

I always lean on the optimistic side of things but seeing as my hopes were never higher than at the beginning of this season since SAF retired I just hope its a slow process where improvement is made
 

Morgan's Magic Snowplow

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 2, 2006
22,345
Philadelphia
I think ETH is a great appointment in theory but the big question is whether the club really backs him, not just with money in the transfer market but with attempts to remake the roster and footballing style of the club.

IMO, there are a lot of big name players at United who don't really fit his Guardiola-esque style of possession based and high line football. If he is to succeed he will end up having to transition them out, and they are unlikely to go quietly. There is also an ingrained tendency within the United hierarchy to defend the club brand and its brand ambassadors - ie stars - above all else. But many of the brand ambassadors - Rashford, Maguire, Cristiano, maybe even Bruno with his high-risk style of play - are questionable fits for ETH.
 

67YAZ

Member
SoSH Member
Dec 1, 2000
8,729
Don’t disagree with Morgan, but I’ll add that ETH’s time at Bayern and Ajax means he understands how to function as a manager within clubs that have much larger structure to recruitment, development, retention, etc.

Of course, a key difference is that Bayern and Ajax have clear philosophies and identities - on and off the pitch - while ManU have been flailing around for those since Fergie hung up his whistle.

ETH is unlikely to be the guy who imposes an identity on the club, but he definitely knows how to be a leader within a structure that realizes a philosophy. So is Ralf gonna be the man with the plan? Or does someone else have the vision?
 

Zososoxfan

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 30, 2009
9,208
South of North
I think ETH is a great appointment in theory but the big question is whether the club really backs him, not just with money in the transfer market but with attempts to remake the roster and footballing style of the club.

IMO, there are a lot of big name players at United who don't really fit his Guardiola-esque style of possession based and high line football. If he is to succeed he will end up having to transition them out, and they are unlikely to go quietly. There is also an ingrained tendency within the United hierarchy to defend the club brand and its brand ambassadors - ie stars - above all else. But many of the brand ambassadors - Rashford, Maguire, Cristiano, maybe even Bruno with his high-risk style of play - are questionable fits for ETH.
Hard agree with the bolded. ETH needs to assert himself and be confident, and Rangnick and the club need to support him. Otherwise, it's just more of the same.