Liverpool 24-25: Going Dutch

67YAZ

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Salah's people working through Simon Hughes to express "exasperation" at the pace of contract talks. I'll take it as a positive that Mo is actually pushing this in the media. But I am grasping at straws.
 

Kliq

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From a neutral perspective, I don't really understand what the hold-up would be on Salah's extension--I suppose its just length and FSG not wanting to have too many years of poor Salah performance?

It's clear that Salah is still playing at a very high level, and it's also clear that Liverpool is reliant on him and his sensational quality and consistency to compete. Liverpool have a squad right now that is capable of winning every competition--multiple trophies over the next few years. You've got to pull the trigger on satisfying your talisman, even if he is 32. He's a legendary player that the fans love--I think fans are savvy enough to understand that maybe in two or three years Salah's on way too high wages for his production level, but it was worth paying him the extension because the team was going all in and Mo has earned it.

Also---if he ends up being on too high wages in a year or two--can't you just sell him off to the Saudis?
 

SocrManiac

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This ownership group has proven it can be ruthless, and Salah's second half production hasn't been historically great. He's typically a shell of himself after an AFCON.

I do wish this wasn't playing out in the media, but only a player of Salah's stature can leverage himself against the club and have a hope of coming out on top.

There's some thought that a lot of this also has to do with the other contract situations and the different progression paces. Trent's is probably the holdup for both sides. He could blow up the wage structure.

This just has the potential of getting ugly all around, and it's happening during one hell of a season.
 

67YAZ

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There's some thought that a lot of this also has to do with the other contract situations and the different progression paces. Trent's is probably the holdup for both sides. He could blow up the wage structure.
I think you’re right about Trent & Mo both waiting on the other. And likely VVD, too, as he’ll look to slot in at the next salary tier on a short term deal. If Mo hits £500k/week for 2 years, Virg has to be thinking £350k for 2, right?

But I also think FSG’s reliance on performance clauses is at work here. The club has walked a fine line in maintaining a clear wage structure based on guaranteed salaries & then offering a wide array of bonuses based on team and individuals results. My sense is that FSG relies on these a lot more than their peers, which is probably good business and a workable position when negotiating the with the large majority of players. But Mo, VVD, and Trent are well established stars who know what they’re worth on the market I can see why Trent would balk at an offer that offers him £250k each season he leads the league in assists when his agent is hearing through the grapevine that Madrid with offer €50m to sign on and a pay out for his parents and so on.
 

67YAZ

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Ornatein reporting that LFC have put a contract offer to Big Virg. Hopefully this will break open the dam.
 

67YAZ

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Ornstein says not so fast over in the Athletic. He relays that LFC have finally made an opening offer and an actual deal will take some some time. But there’s at least offers on the table for all 3 now. Not sure what took so fucking long.
 

pedro1918

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Map Ref. 41°N 93°W
Liverpool staff Christmas party shut down over fears of drug-taking

Liverpool’s staff Christmas party at the city’s Anglican cathedral had to be shut down early due to fears over drug-taking.

The Premier League leaders had rented the cathedral, one of the city’s most iconic landmarks, for around 500 staff to attend on Thursday night.

But the party was cut short after searches by venue officials — triggered by an unrelated medical emergency — revealed suspected drug paraphernalia in the toilets.

The emergency saw a staff member receive medical treatment after collapsing at the event, but was not drugs related.

As originally reported by The Daily Mail, the club then decided to bring the party to an early halt, around 30 minutes before the bars were due to close.

Football staff including Arne Slot and the club’s players did not attend the gathering at the 120-year-old cathedral, which provides its own security for events.
Seems less than ideal. Good grief.
 

thehitcat

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With Gomez doing his Hamstring (the guy cannot get a break) and Konate still a week away and probably not ready for 90 just yet. Should I assume we'll see Quansah partnering Big Virj next Sunday against Man City?
 

thehitcat

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United and yes probably. It’s either him or Endo in a pinch I guess
Yup not sure how I saw that as Citeh when it was clearly a red logo. Time for new glasses and also that's a good point I forgot about Endo potentially in that spot. I wonder if they start Quansah and have both Endo and hopefully Konate on the bench.
 

allstonite

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Yup not sure how I saw that as Citeh when it was clearly a red logo. Time for new glasses and also that's a good point I forgot about Endo potentially in that spot. I wonder if they start Quansah and have both Endo and hopefully Konate on the bench.
I forgot Gravbenberch filled in when Robertson got his red a couple of weeks ago and looked pretty great. But I think it would be Quansah so they don’t mess with the midfield unless absolutely necessary
 

67YAZ

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I forgot Gravbenberch filled in when Robertson got his red a couple of weeks ago and looked pretty great. But I think it would be Quansah so they don’t mess with the midfield unless absolutely necessary
Bruno should be out with his red, but if Amorim stays true to shape, he’ll still find a way to get an extra man in the midfield. Point being, Grav should have a busy day and we’ll probably see Quansah marking Hojlund so that Virg can sweep the gaps.
 

allstonite

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Bruno should be out with his red, but if Amorim stays true to shape, he’ll still find a way to get an extra man in the midfield. Point being, Grav should have a busy day and we’ll probably see Quansah marking Hojlund so that Virg can sweep the gaps.
They appealed his previous red and had it rescinded so he will only miss the one game and will be back Sunday. But agree with your larger point

https://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/bruno-fernandes-misses-liverpool-game-30663071
 

PedroSpecialK

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If his sights were set on Madrid when he insisted on a 4 rather than 6 year contract the last time around, not much the club could do. No way to really compete with a £80-100m signing bonus sweetener that another club can offer.

Plenty of speculation that he was effectively gone when Klopp announced his departure. If he chooses to go when Liverpool are arguably the best team on earth, I can only imagine what that does for his legacy. Same time, he’s been in the same place for his whole life, not many other chances he’ll get for a 9 figure payday. It is kind of sad if there’s any truth to this move being driven by his desire to win the Ballon d’Or
 

67YAZ

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I get it from Trent’s point of view. He’s been with Liverpool since he was 6. Madrid is floating huge numbers in front of him. He would get to play for the most hallowed club in the world, one where few Englishmen have had a chance…but where his good pal Jude currently stars. It’s a massive adventure for the young man. It would be a sad day for LFC, but I won’t begrudge him. It’s more on FSG for not locking him down sooner.
 

67YAZ

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Rumor going that PSG are interested in Mo, which makes a ton of sense. FSG are on track to fuck up this squad. Sigh.
 

Auger34

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Rumor going that PSG are interested in Mo, which makes a ton of sense. FSG are on track to fuck up this squad. Sigh.
Is this unprecedented for a club as big as Liverpool? Letting 3 players hit free agency (or whatever its called in EPL terms) that are this important and potentially losing them for nothing? Seems really crazy that it got to this point
 

coremiller

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Rumor going that PSG are interested in Mo, which makes a ton of sense. FSG are on track to fuck up this squad. Sigh.
Not saying this rumor is false. But if I were Mo Salah's agent, and I wanted to put pressure on Liverpool to raise its offer, I would definitely start a rumor that PSG are interested.
 

67YAZ

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Not saying this rumor is false. But if I were Mo Salah's agent, and I wanted to put pressure on Liverpool to raise its offer, I would definitely start a rumor that PSG are interested.
I think if makes sense for PSG because Mo is still a world class attacker and he’s the most famous Muslim in the world. PSG has lost a lot of star power in recent years, so getting Salah on BeIN sports every week is at least a good brand investment if not financial one.
 

Mighty Joe Young

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I think if makes sense for PSG because Mo is still a world class attacker and he’s the most famous Muslim in the world. PSG has lost a lot of star power in recent years, so getting Salah on BeIN sports every week is at least a good brand investment if not financial one.
From PSG’s point of view I think it’s more of “hey! look at me” thing in the event the LFC negotiations break down - as opposed to them sticking there noses in.
 

Morgan's Magic Snowplow

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If Salah prioritizes money, he'll take the insane Saudi offer that is probably already on the table. If he prioritizes winning big trophies and his legacy, he'll stay at Liverpool.

I have a hard time seeing the calculus by which he goes to PSG. He's not going to move to Paris for an extra 100k per week if he could move to Riyadh for an extra 100m per year.
 

Kliq

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If Salah prioritizes money, he'll take the insane Saudi offer that is probably already on the table. If he prioritizes winning big trophies and his legacy, he'll stay at Liverpool.

I have a hard time seeing the calculus by which he goes to PSG. He's not going to move to Paris for an extra 100k per week if he could move to Riyadh for an extra 100m per year.
Wouldn't the answer be that PSG provides both? It's not like PSG won't be a contender for every trophy in Europe.
 

Morgan's Magic Snowplow

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Wouldn't the answer be that PSG provides both? It's not like PSG won't be a contender for every trophy in Europe.
I don't think PSG is much of a CL contender at this point, at least beyond the "any decent side could have a luck run" level of contention. And I'm not sure Salah would put much value on any of the domestic trophies in France.

On the financial side, the Saudi offer is likely to be so much higher that it just makes it hard to imagine anybody who is really motivated by money going for the small pay raise. He quite possibly is deciding between offers that on an annual basis are in the range of 20m (Liverpool), 25m (PSG), and 200m (Saudi). Who doesn't want the extra 180m but is willing to make a bunch of sacrifices for an extra 5m?
 

67YAZ

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Quansah went off due to illness today. How strange, frustrating season continues.
 

SoxFanInCali

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The derby game at Goodison has been rescheduled for Wednesday 2/12. Falls in between the FA Cup trip to Plymouth and a home matchup against Wolves.
 

67YAZ

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Sigh. Jota an injury doubt after complaining of discomfort in training.
 

SocrManiac

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Jota will not enjoy his body’s response to being 40 where “slight discomfort” will be the best he ever feels.
 

Mighty Joe Young

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Jota will not enjoy his body’s response to being 40 where “slight discomfort” will be the best he ever feels.
Slot’s presser today indicated Jota is out for a few weeks … sigh , the lad is made of glass. Strictly guessing it’s a muscle injury of some sort - which would be predictable given he was returning from the long term injury. He had said he “felt something” in his Forrest cameo.

edit - yep, muscle injury
Diogo Jota 'out for weeks' as Arne Slot reveals what injury Liverpool striker has suffered
https://www.liverpoolecho.co.uk/sport/football/football-news/diogo-jota-out-weeks-arne-30822262?utm_source=app
 
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67YAZ

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Slot rotating heavily for PSV - the traveling squad doesn’t include Salah, Trent, Konate, VVD, Alison, Grav, or Macca.

Liverpool have secured a top-2 finish regardless of result and Slot made a point in his last presser that finishing first vs second might not result in a better machine up given the quality squads scrambling to quality still. Top the table and end up playing PSG in the next round? Some reward. The rest for star players is more valuable.
 

Morgan's Magic Snowplow

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Slot rotating heavily for PSV - the traveling squad doesn’t include Salah, Trent, Konate, VVD, Alison, Grav, or Macca.

Liverpool have secured a top-2 finish regardless of result and Slot made a point in his last presser that finishing first vs second might not result in a better machine up given the quality squads scrambling to quality still. Top the table and end up playing PSG in the next round? Some reward. The rest for star players is more valuable.
As far as I can tell, there really isn't any difference between first and second. The teams you potentially face in the R16 or other non-seeded teams in your side of the bracket are all randomly determined. For example, they'll use some kind of random draw to decide whether the 15 or 16 seed plays the 17 or 18 seed in your part of the bracket whether you are 1st or 2nd.

Its also not actually clear to me whether the 1 seed automatically gets the 4 seed on their side of the draw (with the 2 and 3 in the other half) or whether that's randomly determined as well (kind of looks like the latter from this diagram).

95461
 

SoxFanInCali

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Yeah, basically 1 and 2 go in a draw to see which half of the bracket they end up in, as do 3 and 4, 5 and 6, etc. So having clinched top 2, Liverpool have nothing to play for other than the pride of finishing top in this round.
 

SocrManiac

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I sort of like the idea of being the first team to top the table in this phase and hold what might be a neat record.
 

67YAZ

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Liverpool banked £83.8m in prize money for topping the table. PAY MO SALAH.
 

67YAZ

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Trent felt something in his thigh, scans set to determine the severity. Might not be bad if he had a short break & got his head right.
 

67YAZ

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Not much in the way of specifics, but Trent avoided serious injury and is expected to play again this month.
 

Pesky Pole

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Paul Joyce with the report of “days not weeks” which is great news. He probably misses Carabao and FA Cup and is maybe back after that.
 

Mighty Joe Young

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So - in the broohaha following the Derby a story in The Echo featured an interview with Pickford whereupon he revealed that after the collision at the end of regulation he asked Oliver how much extra time he was going to add - to which Oliver replied 97.5

http://sonsofsamhorn.net/index.php?threads/liverpool-24-25-going-dutch.42752/


Now - this raises some interesting questions - to whit

- Is it common for players to ask this?
- is it common for refs to answer ?
- isn’t this an unfair advantage if only one side has this info?

This is like my bank’s special low interest Visa card rate which they don’t advertise - but , if asked nicely will give you.

The story is going round that Slot’s red card was due to an overly aggressive handshake. Really?
 

SocrManiac

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The story is going round that Slot’s red card was due to an overly aggressive handshake. Really?
Slot has said he regretted what he said. If it was for the handshake, this is going to get even uglier. There’s video going around of Pep shaking Oliver’s hand even more aggressively. If the manager of the team that helps pad Oliver’s bank account gets away with it and Slot doesn’t, well… Yeah. Uglier.