Liverpool 2019-2020: Let's Talk About Six, Baby

Mighty Joe Young

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After that horror show at Shrewsbury , a few thoughts ..

- Thank God Gomez has stepped forward as neither Matip nor (especially) Lovren looked anywhere close to being first team ready.

- While I’ve liked what I’ve seen of Larouci in the past he seemed completely exposed. No pace, instincts or awareness

- it was games like this where Milner is sorely missed.

- Fabinho isn’t replacing Henderson anytime soon.

- Minimina seems miscast as a CF .. I’d prefer him as a #8

- Adrian was Pool’s MOTM.

- both Jones and Chirivella were very good.

- as was a Neco Williams - I think he has a bright future. Harvey Elliott played like he was 16.
 
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SoxFanInCali

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Ings always looked good when he was healthy enough to play, it was just one injury after another. I'm happy for him that he's been able to bounce back.

And let's face it, given the transfer dealings between the clubs, Southampton deserves some success from a guy they bought from Liverpool.
 

DLew On Roids

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Here's the next 8 league games.

@West Ham
Southampton
@Norwich
West Ham
@Watford
Bournemouth
@Everton
Palace

Anything can happen on any given day, but after surviving a run of Leicester City, Wolves, Sheffield United, Spurs, Man United, and Wolves again with no dropped points, I'll take this stretch.

City away and Chelsea at Anfield are the only games left against the current top 8. Other tricky games include Everton and Arsenal away.

They are calling Mane's injury a "muscle tweak". I'd expect him to miss a few games.
As of now, if City drop 3 or more points in their next 7, Liverpool can clinch with the Palace match and earn a guard of honour at the Etihad.

Raz clapping for Joe Gomez and the rest of the English and European champions would be exquisite.
 

Dummy Hoy

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As of now, if City drop 3 or more points in their next 7, Liverpool can clinch with the Palace match and earn a guard of honour at the Etihad.

Raz clapping for Joe Gomez and the rest of the English and European champions would be exquisite.
This is of course given that Liverpool drop none, right?
 

koufax32

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So some serious magic would need to occur for the dream scenario of raising the trophy at Goodison.
 

fletcherpost

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This is of course given that Liverpool drop none, right?
Right. But all banter and dream scenarios aside, i think Liverpool fans are really just loving the fact that this is not going to the wire, they are going to win the league, there will be no biting of nails as far as the League Title is concerned. It's not complacency to start figuring out the permuations that would lead to clinching at City or Vs Everton - it's just a consequence of the luxury of having a huge lead and the best team on an amazing unbeaten run. If they clinch it against a mid table side the joy will be just as...er...joyus.

But you know this. And your time will come. The Owls are a sleeping giant steeped in history and they'll go from pavement to penthouse in our lifetimes.
 

Dummy Hoy

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Right. But all banter and dream scenarios aside, i think Liverpool fans are really just loving the fact that this is not going to the wire, they are going to win the league, there will be no biting of nails as far as the League Title is concerned. It's not complacency to start figuring out the permuations that would lead to clinching at City or Vs Everton - it's just a consequence of the luxury of having a huge lead and the best team on an amazing unbeaten run. If they clinch it against a mid table side the joy will be just as...er...joyus.

But you know this. And your time will come. The Owls are a sleeping giant steeped in history and they'll go from pavement to penthouse in our lifetimes.
I do know this and I am just being kind of a dick...can't help that when it comes to Liverpool. This last 18 months is filled with enough joy for The Reds that adding schadenfreude at Raheem Sterlings expense seemed a bit much.

This run under Klopp has been magnificent, and they've deserved every accolade (from nuetrals) and hardware they've earned. They've bought the right players, they've developed the players they had (or bought), and they've showed the kind of mental fortituide that champions have- all while playing football that is pleasing to the viewer.
Right now there are only two questions about their Premiership season.
1) Can they go undefeated?
2) Can they break 100 points?

I of course hope the answer to both of those is no, but even if it is, you'd have to be stupid or sour to not appreciate what we're witnessing.

But you're wrong likely about Wednesday, Mart. And that's okay. I get to watch them play every week, my children enjoy watching with me, and someday I will get to Hillsborough, so in the end, what more could I ask for?
 

fletcherpost

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I do know this and I am just being kind of a dick...can't help that when it comes to Liverpool. This last 18 months is filled with enough joy for The Reds that adding schadenfreude at Raheem Sterlings expense seemed a bit much.

This run under Klopp has been magnificent, and they've deserved every accolade (from nuetrals) and hardware they've earned. They've bought the right players, they've developed the players they had (or bought), and they've showed the kind of mental fortituide that champions have- all while playing football that is pleasing to the viewer.
Right now there are only two questions about their Premiership season.
1) Can they go undefeated?
2) Can they break 100 points?

I of course hope the answer to both of those is no, but even if it is, you'd have to be stupid or sour to not appreciate what we're witnessing.

But you're wrong likely about Wednesday, Mart. And that's okay. I get to watch them play every week, my children enjoy watching with me, and someday I will get to Hillsborough, so in the end, what more could I ask for?
I actually agree with you re: Raheem Sterling. I know it's just fan banter but Sterling has done a lot of good things off the field of late (he's not perfect, I'm thinking of the Joe Gomez stuff). His stance regarding racism in the UK has been to his credit. But yeah, Liverpool fans will rub it in if they can and it's just fan banter i think.

I do think Wednesday will get it together at some point. I really do. I say the same about Leeds.
 

Dummy Hoy

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I actually agree with you re: Raheem Sterling. I know it's just fan banter but Sterling has done a lot of good things off the field of late (he's not perfect, I'm thinking of the Joe Gomez stuff). His stance regarding racism in the UK has been to his credit. But yeah, Liverpool fans will rub it in if they can and it's just fan banter i think.

I do think Wednesday will get it together at some point. I really do. I say the same about Leeds.
I find Liverpool fans fascinating...they're seen as obnoxious in the UK and I feel like the American Reds are obnoxious for the same reasons, but there's something more there. And you can guess which group I interact with more.

Wednesday will be in the top flight again (as will Leeds), but I don't know in what form (will they be Wolves? Leicester? Brighton? Derby? QPR? City? The mind boggles).

And maybe you and I should interact in another medium instead of clogging up the Victory Party. :love:
 

fletcherpost

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I find Liverpool fans fascinating...they're seen as obnoxious in the UK and I feel like the American Reds are obnoxious for the same reasons, but there's something more there. And you can guess which group I interact with more.

Wednesday will be in the top flight again (as will Leeds), but I don't know in what form (will they be Wolves? Leicester? Brighton? Derby? QPR? City? The mind boggles).

And maybe you and I should interact in another medium instead of clogging up the Victory Party. :love:
I clog everything up. You know where to find me.
 

Leskanic's Thread

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Right. But all banter and dream scenarios aside, i think Liverpool fans are really just loving the fact that this is not going to the wire, they are going to win the league, there will be no biting of nails as far as the League Title is concerned.
While I have supported Liverpool from afar for almost 20 years, I am not enough of a diehard footie fan to truly speak for Liverpool fans. I will just note that I have never been able to shake the fatalist streak of my Boston sports upbringing. So in the same way that I was worried Foulke could blow the 3-0 lead in game 4 of the 2004 World Series (because what would be more of an epic way to continue a trophy-less streak than to instantly become the second team to lose a three-games-to-none series lead?) until Renteria's ball settled into his glove, I'm not going to count this title as having been won until the final whistle is blown on the game that results in a mathematical impossibility of second place.

I'm not saying Fletch is wrong...I'm saying that I am. But I can't help it.
 

fletcherpost

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While I have supported Liverpool from afar for almost 20 years, I am not enough of a diehard footie fan to truly speak for Liverpool fans. I will just note that I have never been able to shake the fatalist streak of my Boston sports upbringing. So in the same way that I was worried Foulke could blow the 3-0 lead in game 4 of the 2004 World Series (because what would be more of an epic way to continue a trophy-less streak than to instantly become the second team to lose a three-games-to-none series lead?) until Renteria's ball settled into his glove, I'm not going to count this title as having been won until the final whistle is blown on the game that results in a mathematical impossibility of second place.

I'm not saying Fletch is wrong...I'm saying that I am. But I can't help it.
I totally understand, and that's the unique joy of being a fan. All the statistics in the world don't make you rational, even if you rationalize. Some bookies are offering 1/500 odds on Liverpool winning the league - risk 500 to win a dollar. And to lose the league Liverpool have to drop the kind of points that they haven't dropped for a good while. They have to become Norwich.

It must be amazing to have the doubts and trepidation alongside the feeling that yeah 'we're gonna finally do it - probably' and you need that 'probably' just in case. It's protection from utter heartbreak...or maybe not quite that cos if Liverpool did throw it away it would be the greatest choke of all time i reckon.

 

SoxFanInCali

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So some serious magic would need to occur for the dream scenario of raising the trophy at Goodison.
They've already said they aren't going to present the trophy until the Chelsea game at Anfield, the last home game of the season (assuming they have clinched before the final game at Newcastle).

That's fine, just gives Klopp the time to get Curtis Jones into 3 more games to make him eligible for a winner's medal.
 

DLew On Roids

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This is of course given that Liverpool drop none, right?
They’ve taken 100 of the last 102 available points. Beating Norwich away and Bournemouth at home doesn’t seem far-fetched.

And Raheem Sterling can fuck right off. If you say you want to leave to win trophies, I’m going to be petty about rubbing your face in it when we win the big ones in front of you. Also, if he can stop trying to break Dele Alli’s ankle, that’d be nice.
 

Dummy Hoy

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He left and he got better at football and he did win trophies.

I guess I don’t know that with everything going as good as it possibly could, being petty would spring to my mind. I could be wrong though...i don’t seem to get too many chances like this. I appreciate your honesty about it it though- we all be different.
 

DLew On Roids

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Man, if there’s one thing I figured I could get consensus on with a Boston sports crowd, it’s the joy of being petty and vindictive in victory.
 

koufax32

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Man, if there’s one thing I figured I could get consensus on with a Boston sports crowd, it’s the joy of being petty and vindictive in victory.
We have three threads called “The Nation’s Tears.” This place has its black belt in petty.

About to start a footie one called “Jose’s Tears” or something like that.
 

PedroSpecialK

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Man, if there’s one thing I figured I could get consensus on with a Boston sports crowd, it’s the joy of being petty and vindictive in victory.
As someone who's lost their voice yelling at Ryan Kesler as recently as last year for being a dick in a losing effort during the 2011 finals... agreed
 

SocrManiac

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Henderson’s wife just popped, 9 months and a day after the CL Final.

Salah’s went 9 months and a day after they beat Barca.
 

67YAZ

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Ugh, Salah needs a rest. But I get it from the Egyptian point of view - he's their greatest ever player (apologies to Aboutrika & Bibo), and they are pushing for as much success as possible while Salah is in his prime. Just pray to whatever god you keep that his legs don't fall off.

The club is also in the final stretch with planning and approvals for expanding the Anfield Road stands. It will grow the gameday capacity to 61K, and it looks like FSG will finance the £60m cost as opposed to making their own loan to the club. A year ago, 'Pool announced a 2018 profit of £125m, up from about £40m the year before. They are also carrying £155m in debt, £100m of that back to FSG. The business side of things seems healthy, and continued stadium renovation should be a great investment.
 

DLew On Roids

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The UEFA record for the largest winning points margin in a season is 31, by PSG in 2015-16. Croatia, Latvia, Denmark, France, Greece, Scotland, and Wales are the only UEFA nations that have had a club win the title by more than 25 points. You can add Finland to that list if you reduce the number to 22 points for City's game in hand.
 

67YAZ

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Klopp says the Captain has a strained hammy, out around 3 weeks. The health and depth in the midfield is otherwise good right now. This can be Keira’s opportunity to shine.
 

coremiller

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Liverpool are defending European champions and having the best PL season ever and you guys are still going out of you way to take potshots at a player Liverpool sold for an enormous fee two years ago that allowed them to buy their best player. C'mon guys, enjoy the good times.
 

67YAZ

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Liverpool post record revenues of £533m, post £42m pre-tax profit despite over £220m spent on transfers & new contracts.

The club is in excellent financial health right now. Getting all these new contracts done plus the addition of Alison while also making a profit is fantastic. The proposed £60m expansion of the Anfield Road side will keep the revenues growing as will this year’s new deal with Nike.

if only the Liverpool owners could give the Red Sox owners a few tips about financial planning...
 

coremiller

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Liverpool post record revenues of £533m, post £42m pre-tax profit despite over £220m spent on transfers & new contracts.

The club is in excellent financial health right now. Getting all these new contracts done plus the addition of Alison while also making a profit is fantastic. The proposed £60m expansion of the Anfield Road side will keep the revenues growing as will this year’s new deal with Nike.

if only the Liverpool owners could give the Red Sox owners a few tips about financial planning...
Just wait until FSG sell Salah this summer because they "can't afford" to give him a contract extension.
 

Zososoxfan

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VVD is the big one who has not re-upped yet, so...
Great question and one that I'm sure has been bandied about here before--who is the most indispensable player to Liverpool's current success? I'd say VVD, but the fact that you could make a reasonable argument for TAA, Robertson, Firmino, Mane, and Salah shows just how system-oriented the side is.
 

SocrManiac

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I think VVD is the one guy the system relies on. His presence in the back gives TAA and Robertson the almost unrestricted freedom they need to push and stay forward with confidence. If there’s a stretch where they’re relying on a pair out of Lovren (god-for-fucking-bid), Matip, and Gomez, that will spell a world of hurt.
 

Dummy Hoy

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Great question and one that I'm sure has been bandied about here before--who is the most indispensable player to Liverpool's current success? I'd say VVD, but the fact that you could make a reasonable argument for TAA, Robertson, Firmino, Mane, and Salah shows just how system-oriented the side is.
I'd take Robbo off that list (and he's great) and add Allison.

I think Pool's most important players are up the middle in Allison, Van Dijk, and Firmino. The wide forwards and FB, as great as they all are, feel like you could replace them with a similar style player and the system chugs on. Van Dijk is such a unique blend of power, speed, and brains; Allison so good at communicating, shot stopping, and moving the ball; Firmino does the kind of hold up and distribution that few players with his scoring touch and positional awareness can muster. I bet putting Marcus Rashford in place of Mane or Salah doesn't change much (although I think they are both better than him right now).
 

67YAZ

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I think VVD is the one guy the system relies on. His presence in the back gives TAA and Robertson the almost unrestricted freedom they need to push and stay forward with confidence. If there’s a stretch where they’re relying on a pair out of Lovren (god-for-fucking-bid), Matip, and Gomez, that will spell a world of hurt.
I think all Liverpool fans would agree Lovren is the most dispensable player.
 

Zososoxfan

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I'd take Robbo off that list (and he's great) and add Allison.

I think Pool's most important players are up the middle in Allison, Van Dijk, and Firmino. The wide forwards and FB, as great as they all are, feel like you could replace them with a similar style player and the system chugs on. Van Dijk is such a unique blend of power, speed, and brains; Allison so good at communicating, shot stopping, and moving the ball; Firmino does the kind of hold up and distribution that few players with his scoring touch and positional awareness can muster. I bet putting Marcus Rashford in place of Mane or Salah doesn't change much (although I think they are both better than him right now).
I think this is right, but I think you are probably giving Allison a bit too much credit. He's in the top 3-4 of keepers worldwide (MATS, Oblak, and maybe Ederson) but even with that, I feel like Liverpool would still be Liverpool with De Gea, Courtois, or any other elite but not world-class keeper. VVD is the best CB by a wide margin, full stop. He's a huge advantage to whatever team has him. Firmino may not be the best pure 9 in the world, but his overall package allows the wingers to do their thing and helps the MF. So I agree that he's up there.
 

Dummy Hoy

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That's fair on Allison, but it's a pretty small group you could replace him with. I don't think De Gea for instance could do the job he does in the Liverpool system, nor Courtois.
 

67YAZ

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Firmino may not be the best pure 9 in the world, but his overall package allows the wingers to do their thing and helps the MF. So I agree that he's up there.
For the first few years, I thought Liverpool needed to find a backup for Firmino because Klopp's preferred system doesn't work without him. But then I realized there really isn't another player out there who does everything Firmino does. Minamino is the first player I've seen Klopp deploy as a straight replacement for Firmino, no change in shape or tactic. Minamino has been pretty nondescript in that role so far, but maybe he grows into it.

In any case, here's Firminos spider chart, which is pretty great.

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