Liverpool 2019-2020: Let's Talk About Six, Baby

PedroSpecialK

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I think the past two performances really underscore Henderson's importance in the side. No midfield presence in either match in terms of pressing or incisive passing when he's out of the team - hope he's back for Atlético
 

SoxFanInCali

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If they don't recover against Atletico, it's going to make for as anticlimactic an end as possible to a title-winning season.
 

67YAZ

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Good news - the Captain should be back for the Atleti tie. Bad news - Alison injured a hip muscle and is out for Bournemouth.


Edit- Or Alison might be out through the international break.
 
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67YAZ

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Amazing what Milner brings to the side. It wasn’t just the clearance off the line - it was continuing to rise the ref well after the bad no call on the opening goal, it was throwing his body into tackles and clearances, it was sprinting his ass off to chase 50/50 balls... he brings an intensity and edge like Henderson does. I’m not sure it inspires his teammates as much as it does wear down opponents and annoys the hell out of them. It works!
 
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pedro1918

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Martino said something like - I don’t think that is the kind of call VAR is supposed to overturn. He thinks judgement calls should be left to the on field referees. I don’t think he ever said it wasn’t a foul, but I could be forgetting.

Of course, VAR is allowed to review judgement calls, so that opinion is not relevant to today’s game anyway.
 

JayMags71

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Martino said something like - I don’t think that is the kind of call VAR is supposed to overturn. He thinks judgement calls should be left to the on field referees. I don’t think he ever said it wasn’t a foul, but I could be forgetting..
You’re probably right. I was really just making a crappy joke. I muted him a few seconds into his schpiel.
 

Clears Cleaver

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Wither Firmino? He has been invisible for weeks and weeks outside the Club world championship. The year comes down to Wednesday. they get eliminated and the season is basically over in terms of games to watch until they clinch.
 

swiftaw

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Amazing what Milner brings to the side. It wasn’t just the clearance off the line - it was continuing to rise the ref well after the bad no call on the opening goal, it was throwing his body into tackles and clearances, it was sprinting his ass off to chase 50/50 balls... he brings an intensity and edge like Henderson does. I’m not sure it inspires his teammates as much as it does wear down opponents and annoys the hell out of them. It works!
If Liverpool don’t offer him a coaching job after he retires then they’ll be missing out.
 

coremiller

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SoxFanInCali

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So now the season basically comes down to getting 2 wins before the coronavirus shuts down the league.
 

SocrManiac

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Somewhat cross posting from the match thread... I can’t blame Adrian. He has always been capable of pulling of a stunning, world-class save and following it up by kicking it into his own net. He was never intended for the CL and he has earned more than his share of the league trophy. Asking him to perform on this stage was always a roll of the dice. Based on his weekend performance, today should be absolutely no surprise that he wasn’t on form.

I am more concerned about Alisson. If he becomes an injury variable moving forward, there’s a huge problem. A keeper 85-90% of his overall ability with improved durability would prove more valuable in the long run. Defenses need stability in the back to provide confidence moving forward. As soon as Van Dijk needs eyes growing out of his man bun to ensure his rearguard, he’s going to reduce his effectiveness ahead. That snowballs to his central pairing, which puts leashes on Robertson and TAA. We love to debate which of Alisson or Van Dijk is more crucial, but at this level and in this system, they’re both critical. If anything, that’s the side’s biggest weakness.
 

SoxFanInCali

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Liverpool could end up winning the title in a different jersey than they have worn all year. The new deal with Nike kicks in June 1st, so any games pushed back beyond that date may end up being played in a new shirt.
 

Jimy Hendrix

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It's also the fun Nike innovation of being the same shit everyone else gets, yes? It's another spin on the "teal/turquoise and blobs" thing that Spurs and I think a few other teams have also had in some form in the past few years.
 

pedro1918

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When they finish the season, they will finish in New Balance kits.

Why Nike will let Liverpool lift the title in New Balance kit

A potential dispute has been avoided after Nike informed Liverpool “it’s only right” that they complete the 2019-20 season wearing their current New Balance kit.

Nike’s lucrative five-year contract with the Premier League champions-elect officially begins on June 1, 2020. As a result the American company could have pushed for Jurgen Klopp’s side to wear the new kit for all fixtures held after that date.

That raised the prospect of captain Jordan Henderson lifting the trophy wearing Nike, which would have been a devastating blow to New Balance given the value which would be attached to those images.

However, following discussions between Billy Hogan — Liverpool’s managing director and chief commercial officer — and both suppliers, it has been agreed that the change of kits won’t happen mid-season, regardless of whether the remaining fixtures are held after the end of May due to the ongoing coronavirus pandemic.
And apparently, this will be the new home kit. I'm not sure if the fear of something truly awful makes me think this is "not bad" or I find the green completely superfluous.

 
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dirtynine

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When they finish the season, they will finish in New Balance kits.

Why Nike will let Liverpool lift the title in New Balance kit



And apparently, this will be the new home kit. I'm not sure if the fear of something truly awful makes me think this is "not bad" or I find the green completely superfluous.

One reason I’ve always felt Liverpool and the Sox made sense as partners is the colors - not just the primary red and white, but they share a history with that Fenway-esque chalky green. The Sox also have navy of course, and Pool uses a lot of complimentary yellow/gold. But the visual connection is uncommonly strong.

Long way of saying: I like this look.
 

Mighty Joe Young

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Some interesting quotes coming from Klopp .. related via Carlo Ancelotti .. he viewed letting the Spanish travelling fans into the UK for the CL match at Anfield as “criminal” .. and thought the match shouldn’t have been played at all.

 

Mighty Joe Young

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There was a co-ordinated -Europe wide - playing of YNWA on radio stations a week or two ago .. all at 7:30am ..

My lord that clip has power .. I was bawling too, and I don’t have loved ones on the other side of the door .. god bless health workers everywhere. They are the heroes.

Liverpool FC may be losing its anthem to the greater good.
 

PedroSpecialK

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The shit FSG are pulling with furloughing staff and taking advantage of a program aimed at helping small businesses is shameful.

I just hope the public backlash forces the club to change course.
 

67YAZ

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The pandemic is taking the mask off the basic business-pr dynamic of all professional sports - they are a business that cultivates a public image of being a community institution.

FSG’s ruthless pursuit of monetizing everything possibly related to Liverpool has brought the club to a level of success not seen in decades, and the future looks just as bright since the team has drummed up record profits while investing in the stadium, the academy, training facilities, and young or in-prime players. And one of the key intangible assets that FSG have traded on is the historic connection between club and city. I have no doubt that folks in the marketing department watched that video of healthcare workers singing YNWA, and before the tears had dried, started thinking of ways to incorporate that into the clubs COVID-19 strategy.

Yes, without a doubt, the workers should not have been furloughed, and maybe public pressure will cause FSG to reverse course like back during the ticket price hike fiasco.

But I also believe the public pressure should go further.the Captain is raising funds from the players to the NHS. The club should match that total amount in donations made to the health care systems of every nation represented in the squad - Brazil, Egypt, Senegal, etc. Think bigger and broader, use those record profits to build a greater relationship between the club and supporters worldwide.

Edit: The pressure worked.
 
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Dummy Hoy

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And they have reversed course.

Liverpool Reverse Course on Furlough

Doesn't take away the hit of the initial decision but at least later is better than never.
Very true, and credit to them for reversing the decision. I'm as critical of the club and its fans as anyone, but I think it was a large percentage of fans braking the usual solidarity to pressure the club that made the difference,


The pandemic is taking the mask off the basic business-pr dynamic of all professional sports - they are a business that cultivates a public image of being a community institution.
Your whole post was well said, but I thought this was the key. The biggest issue I have here is there are still a handful clubs whose fans buy the mystique that they are Mes Que un Club, and in the Premiership era, I'm not sure that's the case.

But again, credit to the many fans that stood up for what is right, not what is Red. And credit to FSG for having the soul enough to care about the bad PR.
 

Mighty Joe Young

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And they have reversed course.

Liverpool Reverse Course on Furlough

Doesn't take away the hit of the initial decision but at least later is better than never.
Not before time .. at least these guys pay attention to public opinion - particularly Spirit of Shankly and the like. This sort of thing is not something American sports moguls have to deal with and , to their credit, FSG seems to get it.
 

OilCanShotTupac

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Very true, and credit to them for reversing the decision. I'm as critical of the club and its fans as anyone, but I think it was a large percentage of fans braking the usual solidarity to pressure the club that made the difference,




Your whole post was well said, but I thought this was the key. The biggest issue I have here is there are still a handful clubs whose fans buy the mystique that they are Mes Que un Club, and in the Premiership era, I'm not sure that's the case.

But again, credit to the many fans that stood up for what is right, not what is Red. And credit to FSG for having the soul enough to care about the bad PR.
the core issue is too dire to play club one upmanship but community engagement is one area where Everton surpasses LFC and most every club anywhere:


All clubs run outreach programs, of course, and employ staff members to work in the communities they call home. But few, if any, can match Everton’s for size and scope. The buildings that house Everton in the Community cost more than $10 million to develop; the program’s annual budget is around $4 million. It has 125 staff members and 145 volunteers. It works in more than 200 locations: schools, youth clubs, community centers.


There is barely a part of life in Liverpool — and particularly in the L4 postal code that is home to both Goodison Park and Anfield, Liverpool’s stadium, and among the most deprived areas in Britain — that the club does not touch.

It oversees more than 40 social programs, focused on issues as diffuse as mental health and serious organized crime; it reaches more than 20,000 people a year. Last year, Everton won a grant of 700,000 pounds, or about $925,000, to lead a government scheme on Merseyside to tackle gang culture. It has a presence in 150 schools. In September 2015, it became the first club to launch its own school.

{snip}

It is not just the scale of Everton’s work that marks it as different, though; it is the scope of it, too. Everton goes into areas other clubs — and other charities, even — might find “intimidating,” as Barrett-Baxendale put it. Sue Gregory, Everton in the Community’s director of youth engagement, recalls representatives of other teams marveling at the fact that Everton — in theory, just a soccer club — was prepared to work with convicted criminals, drug dealers, members of gangs. “You could see it as the club risking its brand,” she said.


Although fans sometimes grumble about the club being a charity with a football side attached, EitC is a source of pride among Blues.

There’s been a lot of this on Everton Twitter:

View: https://twitter.com/nsno/status/1247261935562883073?s=21


View: https://twitter.com/chriswoolley16/status/1247219284151013384?s=21


so yeah, obviously fans have an agenda to crap on the rival side, but this is one area (the only?) where the club across the park gets it right and FSG just whiffs.
 

Dummy Hoy

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Not before time .. at least these guys pay attention to public opinion - particularly Spirit of Shankly and the like. This sort of thing is not something American sports moguls have to deal with and , to their credit, FSG seems to get it.
I'm not sure being shamed into a U-Turn that is probably financially based constitutes "getting it."
 

Mighty Joe Young

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I'm not sure being shamed into a U-Turn that is probably financially based constitutes "getting it."
In Peter Moore’s apology he kind of indicated the original furlough decision came straight from FSG ( Henry and Werner) - which is not surprising - they being very successful business people. You may be right that FSG still sees this through a financial lens and that the long term hit in public image wasn’t worth the short term gain. Or they were surprised by community backlash.

by “get it” I think I was referring to the impact of supporters - Not sure they are capable of understanding, let alone embracing the club’s socialist roots.
 

Dummy Hoy

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In Peter Moore’s apology he kind of indicated the original furlough decision came straight from FSG ( Henry and Werner) - which is not surprising - they being very successful business people. You may be right that FSG still sees this through a financial lens and that the long term hit in public image wasn’t worth the short term gain. Or they were surprised by community backlash.

by “get it” I think I was referring to the impact of supporters - Not sure they are capable of understanding, let alone embracing the club’s socialist roots.
Thanks for the clarification. Pretty sure we agree on this one.
 

OilCanShotTupac

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In Peter Moore’s apology he kind of indicated the original furlough decision came straight from FSG ( Henry and Werner) - which is not surprising - they being very successful business people. You may be right that FSG still sees this through a financial lens and that the long term hit in public image wasn’t worth the short term gain. Or they were surprised by community backlash.

by “get it” I think I was referring to the impact of supporters - Not sure they are capable of understanding, let alone embracing the club’s socialist roots.
It's not just the club's roots - it's the culture of club football. It's the distinction between a franchise and a club. These really once were, and to a certain extent still are, "clubs," ie voluntary associations of like minded people. The employees would have been "the club" in 1890, and the fans would view them as such today.

Also, the Northwest generally is still leftist. Even when Boris stunned the world with his huge victory, Liverpool and its environs and other northern cities were the last holdout in England of traditional Labour. I can show you dozens of tweets from Evertonians calling FSG and LFC a bunch of fucking Tories who love to bring down the working class.

This is not just a goof- this is really misunderstanding the culture.
 

Vinho Tinto

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The pandemic is taking the mask off the basic business-pr dynamic of all professional sports - they are a business that cultivates a public image of being a community institution.
I'll echo the "Great post" sentiment.

Over the past couple of years, I've really mentally dug into how club culture has changed into resembling the American franchise model. I've always felt that the Bruins are the best example of how passionate a fanbase can be for an entity that is owned by a group they despise; but Bruins fans don't really have a choice for an alternative. It's either root for the local team or choose another franchise somewhere else in North America.

In football, clubs were typically founded by members of the community. They grew organically and the values they promoted a segment of the local population. If a club was not right for you, you could support another club that is either in the same city or near by (Or maybe you're really crazy and choose a club based on enjoyment from watching the team play and not geography). That dynamic is still found in football, but is pretty much dead at the highest levels of the game. Massive clubs are revenue cranking de-facto franchises at best and elaborate tax/money laundering schemes at worst.

But it is still nice to know that if a fan of the game doesn't want to support that, they can still choose to support a smaller club. Yes, their existence is irrelevant in the big scheme of things; but you can find a team that suits you. I'd rather options, in the various clubs that football can offer to area, over hoping that the ownership group I hate eventually moves on and sells to a Robert Kraft or Steve Ballmer.

Sorry for the non-LFC specific post. I just wish FSG hadn't fully revealed their cynical underbelly.
 

Mighty Joe Young

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If you can access the Athletic they have a good round up of the flip flop


The take away is indeed FSG really has no clue as to the club’s culture.
 

candylandriots

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I'll echo the "Great post" sentiment.

Over the past couple of years, I've really mentally dug into how club culture has changed into resembling the American franchise model. I've always felt that the Bruins are the best example of how passionate a fanbase can be for an entity that is owned by a group they despise; but Bruins fans don't really have a choice for an alternative. It's either root for the local team or choose another franchise somewhere else in North America.

In football, clubs were typically founded by members of the community. They grew organically and the values they promoted a segment of the local population. If a club was not right for you, you could support another club that is either in the same city or near by (Or maybe you're really crazy and choose a club based on enjoyment from watching the team play and not geography). That dynamic is still found in football, but is pretty much dead at the highest levels of the game. Massive clubs are revenue cranking de-facto franchises at best and elaborate tax/money laundering schemes at worst.

But it is still nice to know that if a fan of the game doesn't want to support that, they can still choose to support a smaller club. Yes, their existence is irrelevant in the big scheme of things; but you can find a team that suits you. I'd rather options, in the various clubs that football can offer to area, over hoping that the ownership group I hate eventually moves on and sells to a Robert Kraft or Steve Ballmer.

Sorry for the non-LFC specific post. I just wish FSG hadn't fully revealed their cynical underbelly.
This is one of the things that I love about international soccer. I love the things that my club in Berlin stands for and does. It's really a cool thing. We don't see it hardly at all in the US. The only kind of thing that could possibly spring to mind is the difference between White Sox and Cubs fans, and that's probably pushing it. Maybe there is another example or two, but it's a stretch for sure.

I wasn't as aware of this when I glommed onto my first club team in England, but could see it in action when I first went to Selhurst Park following their last promotion. I went there expecting to see two corporate teams (they were playing Arsenal), and was delighted to see what Palace was even after reaching the top flight.

I've been watching "Sunderland Until I Die" on Netflix (which is nice for a footy fix if you need one) and have really enjoyed seeing the relationship between that club and the community. I'm still annoyed about the time they crushed Palace 4-0 on a Monday night though.
 

67YAZ

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This is one of the things that I love about international soccer. I love the things that my club in Berlin stands for and does. It's really a cool thing. We don't see it hardly at all in the US. The only kind of thing that could possibly spring to mind is the difference between White Sox and Cubs fans, and that's probably pushing it. Maybe there is another example or two, but it's a stretch for sure.

I wasn't as aware of this when I glommed onto my first club team in England, but could see it in action when I first went to Selhurst Park following their last promotion. I went there expecting to see two corporate teams (they were playing Arsenal), and was delighted to see what Palace was even after reaching the top flight.

I've been watching "Sunderland Until I Die" on Netflix (which is nice for a footy fix if you need one) and have really enjoyed seeing the relationship between that club and the community. I'm still annoyed about the time they crushed Palace 4-0 on a Monday night though.
Right now the Guardian is doing a minute-by-minute live commentary on the Liverpool-Palace 1990 FA Cup semifinal. That’s a fix for both of us.