Kyrie is dirty rotten no good and we have schadenfreude…?

[HomeRunBaker]

Yes, but the very fact it is Kyrie changes everything. Kyrie’s market is different than any other star because he’s seen as a selfish dickhead with zero ability to focus on winning and an endless capacity to cause distractions that disrupt team chemistry. That notion severely limits his market. This demand reinforces that perception and -in do doing- hurt’s Kyrie’s chances of getting a big contract this off-season.

I think you are missing the point that was being made. The fact that Kyrie is the player here does diminish his market severely……which makes this move even BETTER because it is him as he’d essentially have no market come summer if he remained a Net through this year. The point we are making is that he has a chance to secure a deal with say, the Lakers, if he goes there and they make a deep run…..and LeBron pushes for him so he isn’t playing with a Schroder/Beverly-like backcourt again next year.

 

[HomeRunBaker]

Not me. I value and respect loyalty and working towards a championship far more than chasing money.

That is honorable of you (I mean this sincerely) if that is what drives you. I’ve heard many people say these words, not meaning you bc I don’t know, yet they have also left previous employees for a raise with another company.

 

[djbayko]

https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/35587968/nets-kyrie-irving-calf-soreness-trade-request

That could also be the team holding him out to prevent screwing up a potential deal. Westrbook is also questionable today... </big_eyes>

 

[Smokey Joe]

I think you are missing the point that was being made. The fact that Kyrie is the player here does diminish his market severely……which makes this move even BETTER because it is him as he’d essentially have no market come summer if he remained a Net through this year. The point we are making is that he has a chance to secure a deal with say, the Lakers, if he goes there and they make a deep run…..and LeBron pushes for him so he isn’t playing with a Schroder/Beverly-like backcourt again next year.

This is actually the best thing for the Nets as well. They can honor his trade request, possibly get an asset and avoid the bad optics of another contract fight this summer or looking like Smeagol "Go away, and don't come back!"

 

[HomeRunBaker]

That could also be the team holding him out to prevent screwing up a potential deal. Westrbook is also questionable today... </big_eyes>

Good chance we’ve seen the last of Russ The Laker. See my 6th man award thoughts in the gambling thread that may be something you’d be interested in.

 

[joe dokes]

That could also be the team holding him out to prevent screwing up a potential deal. Westrbook is also questionable today... </big_eyes>

Yes it could. But..
1. This his Kyries M.O..
2. I think only a catastrophic injury would mess up a deal. (Which is always a possibility, to be sure.).

Kyrie is the cannibal in the room with the guy who's missing an arm. Whats the likely scenario?

 

[lexrageorge]

They would have the full MLE and the bi-annual to use. But yea, their roster would be pretty thin

LeBron, AD, Kyrie, Damien Jones and Max Christie would account for $139M. If they bring back Rui, they would be snug against the hard cap threshold and may not have enough room for the full MLE. So Kyrie would be taking a significant risk hoping that the Fakers could squeeze him into their cap after a sign-and-trade. From his view, far better to get traded there now.

He seemed resigned to the fact that the Nets are not a contender based on his comments after they got blown out in Boston. Philly, Bucks, Celtics are all better, and the Nets getting by the Heat or the Cavs is no certainty either.

 

[radsoxfan]

He’s an enormous upgrade over the other dreck that the Lakers put out there. He’s a real solid and smart player who can matchup with multiple positions. His contract is pretty good moving forward as role players will be making $20m+.

On paper a AD, LeBron, Kyrie, Hachimura lineup is a freakin beast. Reeves is an ideal role player with the Beverly insanity. I want this for purely selfish reasons just like Kyrie.

I know this is a Kyrie thread but since we’re getting into the Lakers/Hachimura… he is awful.

Like end of bench, barely playable bad. He’s not even a decent rotation player on a good team.

I’m on my phone so won’t post his DARKO but it’s -2 his entire career. He’s just not good in any way.

 

[Cellar-Door]

Kyrie demanding a trade as soon as BKN told him they wouldn't give him a max unless it had guarantee stipulations, and LAL made it tough to get his full max in FA is an okay business decision. It's the reasons that lead to BKN refusing to guarantee him that anger people. Also... he demanded a trade then went home and started re-posting the shittiest people he could as a way to pressure Tsai into giving him what he wanted. That's another reason people dislike him.

 

[DeJesus Built My Hotrod]

Man everyone keeps going to the Lakers but Hollinger has the Clips as another landing spot. To me it makes the most sense all around. They have bodies/salaries to match, a trade makes sense for their roster/results and Ballmer can afford to keep Irving around if he so chooses.


Maybe Ballmer doesn't want the headache or the team doesn't like Kyrie's fit from a chemistry perspective. But I am definitely watching them as an outside destination as I think it makes them far more formidable.

 

[benhogan]

HRB question, if Kyrie ends up a Laker where does Vegas put them as far as title odds?

TOP3?

 

[ElUno20]

HRB question, if Kyrie ends up a Laker where does Vegas put them as far as title odds?

TOP3?

Does defense not exist in this world? The lakers cant guard anyone and theyre adding another turnstile.

 

[Euclis20]

Does defense not exist in this world? The lakers cant guard anyone and theyre adding another turnstile.

They finished 19.5 games below their Vegas projected win total last year, and are on track to finish 6 games under their Vegas projected win total this year. Their title odds far outstrip their projected win total (they started the year tied for 9th in title odds with Denver, despite being just 17th in win total). I agree with you that Kyrie doesn't turn the 12th place team out west that is 20th in both offensive and defense rating and 24th in overall net rating into a top tier title contender. However, I think that Vegas (and large chunks of the NBA media) will disagree with both of us. They will overhype and overrate the Lebron Lakers just as they have ever since their mickey mouse title.

 

[DeJesus Built My Hotrod]

They finished 19.5 games below their Vegas projected win total last year, and are on track to finish 6 games under their Vegas projected win total this year. Their title odds far outstrip their projected win total (they started the year tied for 9th in title odds with Denver, despite being just 17th in win total). I agree with you that Kyrie doesn't turn the 12th place team out west that is 20th in both offensive and defense rating and 24th in overall net rating into a top tier title contender. However, I think that Vegas (and large chunks of the NBA media) will disagree with both of us. They will overhype and overrate the Lebron Lakers just as they have ever since their mickey mouse title.

How can anyone calculate the odds of something when the initial conditions - Kyrie isn't on the Lakers yet and the cost is part of the calculus- haven't even been met? What is the methodology?

 

[HomeRunBaker]

HRB question, if Kyrie ends up a Laker where does Vegas put them as far as title odds?

TOP3?

Was discussed yesterday in gambling thread. I played Lakers to win WC at a ridiculous +1600 price before it was adjusted and posted immediate there……it’s down to +700 this morning. The 6th man award is in there too…..ton of value if you expect Russ to be moved and back starting as I do.

 

[SemperFidelisSox]

Windhorst has been saying that the Clippers really like Fred VanFleet and would go after him hard if Toronto becomes sellers, but the risk is passing on Kyrie now and then the Raptors keep VanFleet.

 

[radsoxfan]

Does defense not exist in this world? The lakers cant guard anyone and theyre adding another turnstile.

For that it’s worth, Kyrie seems to be grading out as pretty average but not terrible on D.

Very different than someone like Trae Young.

 

[Euclis20]

How can anyone calculate the odds of something when the initial conditions - Kyrie isn't on the Lakers yet and the cost is part of the calculus- haven't even been met? What is the methodology?

None of this involves Kyrie, the numbers I quoted are preseason odds. My point is that the media and Vegas will endlessly overhype and overrate the Lebron Lakers, as we can see from how they've actually performed over the last year and a half. Add Kyrie to the mix, and it will be more of the same. They will instantly be seen as the favorite to come out of the West, and likely the co-favorites (along with the Celtics) to win it all.

 

[bankshot1]

He’s a scorpion. It’s in his nature.

Yup. He's stung LeBron, then Tatum and Green Teamers and now Durand and the Bridge and Tunnel crowd.

He's running out of frogs to carry him.

btw hear that the Scorpions are now out of business.

too soon?

 

[benhogan]

Was discussed yesterday in gambling thread. I played Lakers to win WC at a ridiculous +1600 price before it was adjusted and posted immediate there……it’s down to +700 this morning. The 6th man award is in there too…..ton of value if you expect Russ to be moved and back starting as I do.

nice work at +1600

If he ends up in LA will you start laying it off on the initial Kyrie euphoria, or will you drink the purple & gold kool-aid?

 

[nattysez]

Man everyone keeps going to the Lakers but Hollinger has the Clips as another landing spot. To me it makes the most sense all around. They have bodies/salaries to match, a trade makes sense for their roster/results and Ballmer can afford to keep Irving around if he so chooses.

I had the same thought earlier today. PG and Kawhi aren't getting any younger. However, the Clippers don't have a first-round pick until 2027, so they might have a tough time making an offer that's a lot better than what the Lakers can offer (unless KD doesn't want to play with Russ).

 

[kazuneko]

I think you are missing the point that was being made. The fact that Kyrie is the player here does diminish his market severely……which makes this move even BETTER because it is him as he’d essentially have no market come summer if he remained a Net through this year. The point we are making is that he has a chance to secure a deal with say, the Lakers, if he goes there and they make a deep run…..and LeBron pushes for him so he isn’t playing with a Schroder/Beverly-like backcourt again next year.

I could see the Lakers wanting him for a run in 23’, - and if it gets them a championship it’s a trade that’s worth making. But I don’t see a trade like that leading to what Kyrie supposedly wants : a 4/year $200 million max. Why would the Lakers even consider that? After all, what other suitors will there be and would any of them really be interested in Kyrie for anything close to that contract?

 

[DeJesus Built My Hotrod]

None of this involves Kyrie, the numbers I quoted are preseason odds. My point is that the media and Vegas will endlessly overhype and overrate the Lebron Lakers, as we can see from how they've actually performed over the last year and a half. Add Kyrie to the mix, and it will be more of the same. They will instantly be seen as the favorite to come out of the West, and likely the co-favorites (along with the Celtics) to win it all.

Entirely fair.

I was really responding to the initial inquiry. How can we determine the odds of the Lakers winning with Kyrie when they haven't dealt for him yet? We don't even have trade parameters and people are already expecting real time title odds. I am curious how that works.

 

[HomeRunBaker]

I could see the Lakers wanting him for a run in 23’, - and if it gets them a championship it’s a trade that’s worth making. But I don’t see a trade like that leading to what Kyrie supposedly wants : a 4/year $200 million max. Why would the Lakers even consider that? After all, what other suitors will there be and would any of them really be interested in Kyrie for anything close to that contract?

No I don’t see the 4/200 but if he stayed in Brooklyn until the summer he seriously could enter next season without a team. At least with the Lakers they would likely keep him (if LeBron says so) should they make a good run.

 

[HomeRunBaker]

nice work at +1600

If he ends up in LA will you start laying it off on the initial Kyrie euphoria, or will you drink the purple & gold kool-aid?

I’ll see if makes sense to hedge if they make the WC Finals or maybe even Semi’s if the numbers make sense. Deal may not get done and I threw away money but I expect it to, the market expects it to and I got in ahead of the market. Can’t ask for anything more.

 

[nighthob]

(unless KD doesn't want to play with Russ).

I think that goes without saying.

 

[Reverend]

None of this involves Kyrie, the numbers I quoted are preseason odds. My point is that the media and Vegas will endlessly overhype and overrate the Lebron Lakers, as we can see from how they've actually performed over the last year and a half. Add Kyrie to the mix, and it will be more of the same. They will instantly be seen as the favorite to come out of the West, and likely the co-favorites (along with the Celtics) to win it all.

For anyone who missed it, a couple of weeks ago Shaw quite hilariously complained in the show that there was a “conspiracy” to make them talk about LAL even though “they stink.” He wouldn’t let it go either; it was pretty awesome.

 

[ManicCompression]

100% agree here. Like I said before, if it wasn’t Kyrie doing this we’d be lauding the player for this smart business decision.

No other player would have to do a move like this because they'd just be normal human and sign an extension with the current team that they're on. This is a one-of-one situation because Kyrie is singular in his assholeness.

This is only logical in that Kyrie is not living on this planet (probably couldn't find it because he's looking for the wrong shape). No one is giving him a max extension. I don't think anyone wants to sign him longer than two years. I can't wait for the Nets contract offer to come out just to see if he even sniffs that from his new team. The logical move is to be a good soldier, do well in the playoffs, and then do a sign and trade if you don't want to stay with the Nets. Or, just stay with the Nets and play with your so-called best friend!

 

[HomeRunBaker]

No other player would have to do a move like this because they'd just be normal human and sign an extension with the current team that they're on. This is a one-of-one situation because Kyrie is singular in his assholeness.

This is only logical in that Kyrie is not living on this planet (probably couldn't find it because he's looking for the wrong shape). No one is giving him a max extension. I don't think anyone wants to sign him longer than two years. I can't wait for the Nets contract offer to come out just to see if he even sniffs that from his new team. The logical move is to be a good soldier, do well in the playoffs, and then do a sign and trade if you don't want to stay with the Nets. Or, just stay with the Nets and play with your so-called best friend!

How can you make this statement without having any idea what the terms of the extension offer were? This stalemate wasn’t really unexpected as we all are pretty much in agreement that the Nets shouldn’t offer anything more than a 1 or 2-yr deal……which Kyrie was never going to accept from them. Please ask for trades all the time when they don’t agree with what they feel is a lowball offer. This isn’t new.

 

[benhogan]

How can you make this statement without having any idea what the terms of the extension offer were? This stalemate wasn’t really unexpected as we all are pretty much in agreement that the Nets shouldn’t offer anything more than a 1 or 2-yr deal……which Kyrie was never going to accept from them. Please ask for trades all the time when they don’t agree with what they feel is a lowball offer. This isn’t new.

Again, I wish Boston Kyrie had asked for a trade before the deadline (Ainge probably could have read the tea leaves better)

Irving is actually doing the Nets a favor. In a seller's market, the Nets can get something

 

[luckiestman]

How can you make this statement without having any idea what the terms of the extension offer were? This stalemate wasn’t really unexpected as we all are pretty much in agreement that the Nets shouldn’t offer anything more than a 1 or 2-yr deal……which Kyrie was never going to accept from them. Please ask for trades all the time when they don’t agree with what they feel is a lowball offer. This isn’t new.

I think the point is if Kyrie acted like a balanced person he would not have gotten lowballed.

 

[soxhop411]

View: https://twitter.com/lawmurraythenu/status/1622044859778359297?s=46&t=_FV0V1wjwOnznpZ5wv7cKg

Sources tell @TheAthletic that the LA Clippers have made a strong offer to the Brooklyn Nets for Kyrie Irving, and that head coach Tyronn Lue is open to coaching Irving again after the two won a championship with Cleveland Cavaliers in 2016.
Cc
@ElUno20

 

[ifmanis5]

Woj agrees and adds that the Nets really want to move him.
View: https://twitter.com/wojespn/status/1622047445659095041

The Nets are proceeding in talks as though they’re determined to find a deal for Irving ahead of Thursday’s trade deadline, sources said.

 

[InstaFace]

I'd prefer Not The Clippers, as they might be able to actually come out of the west as a result.

 

[the moops]

No other player would have to do a move like this because they'd just be normal human and sign an extension with the current team that they're on

Players leave their current teams all the time when they hit free agency. Even ones who have been offered extensions

 

[the moops]

Powell, Kennard, and Mann works in the trade machine

 

[DeJesus Built My Hotrod]

Powell, Kennard, and Mann works in the trade machine

The names are key. Powell, Mann and Kennard give the Nets a credible return in terms of NBA bodies which is what they need absent a KD deal. They can also put a Wall or Jackson in the trade as a salary offset and presumably because they don't want to lose both of Mann or Kennard.

 

[ifmanis5]

Clippers are a cursed franchise. As soon as he gets there all his knees get blown out. Guarantee it.

 

[nighthob]

Clippers are a cursed franchise. As soon as he gets there all his knees get blown out. Guarantee it.

Isn’t the curse fulfilled by getting the Demon Kyzuzu in the first place?

 

[The Social Chair]

Kyrie on the Clippers is hilarious. Presti is crossing his fingers it happens.

 

[Euclis20]

I'd prefer Not The Clippers, as they might be able to actually come out of the west as a result.

Unless he's bringing with him the secret to keeping both Kawhi and George healthy, I don't see how it really moves the needle. Plus I feel like the last thing the Clippers need is another unreliable all-star, but on the bright side, if the improbable happens and he helps them win a title, it makes the Lakers look even worse than they already are.

 

[Smokey Joe]

A willingness to take on Kyrie after he has trashed three teams is a de facto intelligence test for GMs and owners. If they are willing to take him on, they fail.

 

[Van Everyman]

Yup. He's stung LeBron, then Tatum and Green Teamers and now Durand and the Bridge and Tunnel crowd.

He's running out of frogs to carry him.

btw hear that the Scorpions are now out of business.

too soon?

If he goes to the Lakers, does that mean Lebron gets stung twice?

 

[bankshot1]

If he goes to the Lakers, does that mean Lebron gets stung twice?

No it means he said Beetlejuice three times

 

[Jimbodandy]

OK we get it, Kyrie is a terrible person. He is giving us a chance to concoct ridiculous trades though.

LAL - Kyrie, Olynyk
BRK - Conley, Poeltl, Gay
UTA - Westbrook, LAL 2026 1st, BRK 2025 1st
SAS - Simmons, a couple 2nds

No trade suggestions with the Lakers would be complete without them getting everything that they want and some random 4th team getting completely shafted.

 

[JCizzle]

How can you make this statement without having any idea what the terms of the extension offer were? This stalemate wasn’t really unexpected as we all are pretty much in agreement that the Nets shouldn’t offer anything more than a 1 or 2-yr deal……which Kyrie was never going to accept from them. Please ask for trades all the time when they don’t agree with what they feel is a lowball offer. This isn’t new.

Players promoting Holocaust denying films is relatively new, yes? What other examples can we pull from to make the situations similar? Dude is a shit head. I'm not sure why everything needs to be viewed devoid of context.

 

[HomeRunBaker]

Players promoting Holocaust denying films is relatively new, yes? What other examples can we pull from to make the situations similar? Dude is a shit head. I'm not sure why everything needs to be viewed devoid of context.

What the heck does any of this have to do with Kyrie being happy to accept a lowball offer?

 

[benhogan]

No trade suggestions with the Lakers would be complete without them getting everything that they want and some random 4th team getting completely shafted.

That's funny & true. I think folks are pretty careful around here with fake trades that favor the Celtics. BUT I guess we're conditioned to the Lakers getting somewhat 'gifted' talent.

OK we get it, Kyrie is a terrible person. He is giving us a chance to concoct ridiculous trades though.

LAL - Kyrie, Olynyk
BRK - Conley, Poeltl, Gay
UTA - Westbrook, LAL 2026 1st, BRK 2025 1st
SAS - Simmons, a couple 2nds

are Linda Rambis & the LA Times behind this fake trade? jk

 

[Devizier]

What the heck does any of this have to do with Kyrie being happy to accept a lowball offer?

It certainly affects his value. And also how people will and should regard matters of his self interest.

 

[joe dokes]

What the heck does any of this have to do with Kyrie being happy to accept a lowball offer?

Because the very phrase "kyrie being happy" is meaningless nonsense, when one considers the context of previous times when "kyrie has been happy" (or not happy) and compared it to the happiness or unhappiness of non-shitheads.
Normal words, phrases and descriptors dont apply to him. Nor should normal approaches to valuation and considering him as part of a successful team. Some GM, though, will definitely fail to heed the lesson.