Kyrie is dirty rotten no good and we have schadenfreude…?

joe dokes

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What an asshole is all I can say. And the ADL does not look good in all of this - the initial check without any apology was an obvious sign that he was not being accountable.
Id like to think that the deal was that he was going to apologize and that ADL, check in hand, was surprised at the actual statement. But its possible that that is not how it went down.

Remember when Celtics fans hated Kyrie just because he quit on the team? How quaint.
 

Reverend

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I understand that people are thinking this is the end for Irving in the NBA and it might be. However there are scenarios where, with gentle coaching by say, Klutch Sports consultants, Kyrie winds up playing elsewhere after a period of reflection and an apology.

Also, I have no proof of it but it would not shock me at all if a good number of NBA players share the same zip code in terms of having similar views as Kyrie. Point being that he may be a lot more welcome in other locker rooms than we'd like to believe.

Again, that's just a sense I have and I am about as close to an NBA locker room as most others here.
Is there still a Russian basketball League?
Dammit, @Lose Remerswaal ; I was expecting a “gentile coaching” joke from you here!
 

Groovenstein

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Ive never thought you can change too many bigots' minds.
I once listened to a podcast with Deeyah Khan for a guest. She discussed her experience making her documentary, White Right, in which she met and talked with a number of white nationalists. She was able to connect with and win over a surprisingly high number of them simply by talking to them, asking about their concerns, and just generally forcing them to confront the fact that she was not the thing they thought she was. Turns out you can actually reach a few people when you see the humanity in them and don’t just call them bigoted pieces of shit.
 

InstaFace

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No argument. Just saying that if cameras followed most of us from age 16 to age 37, they'd see a lot worse shit than a bad and selfish human rights take over a league partner. It's a big fuckup, but it's basically one big fuckup in the entire adult life of a guy whose fuckups we would all know. It's pretty remarkable.
edit: misinterpreted the post. But I'll leave this: If you're dubbed King James, heavy is the head that wears the crown.
 
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jon abbey

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The same is true for every star in the NBA. Very few go off the deep end like this.

You're making excuses for him. Yes, just every one of us said, did or at least believed some shit we're not proud of when we were teenagers or young adults. Growth is part of the human condition. But if you take up the mantle of a public figure, and you use that to put the spotlight on yourself, with that comes responsibility. Heavy is the head that wears the crown.

Put another way: If Mike Trout was a hate-filled bag of grievance, we'd have no idea, would we? You can "shut up and dribble" if you so choose, as a pro athlete, and be largely left alone. It costs you some sponsor dollars, some tongues will wag, and some would call it a missed opportunity to do good. But you don't have to insist on having everyone pay attention to you. Many do anyway - such are the privileges of sports - and then they use it for money, for good, or for awesome. How many use it for spreading anti-semitic conspiracies, or the equivalent?
Pretty sure the post you are answering was about LeBron, not Nazi Irving.
 

DennyDoyle'sBoil

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I took it to mean...I can't be an anti-semite. Watch the movie...I'm a descendant from the original jews. Today's jew stole that from me and my people.
Oh, 100%. I used to loathe LeBron when he was the Celtics' main antagonist in the eastern conference, but all fair complaints about him start and stop with what happens on the court (like the whining expectantly for calls). Off the court, he is a model husband and dad, a model public figure, clearly someone with a ton of integrity and moral compass. Sports would be a far better place if its heroes were more like LeBron James.
Thanks guys. Looks like it did not play well with the Nets.
 

Tangled Up In Red

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Like, to what extent has he been suspended for being antisemitic?
I assume close to 100%
This is the slippery slope crux for me.

I grew up in/around sports teams where you could be a) devoutly Christian (in act, if not practice); b) silent about religion (don't rock the boat); c) a super-star (coaches look the other way). Else you're off the team.
I fear one of my favorite college football programs largely operates this way.

That makes me really uncomfortable, too.

Edit: I see this is a sorta false equivalence... and am struggling to tie off my thinking/fear/concern.
 
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jon abbey

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I grew up in/around sports teams where you could be a) devoutly Christian (in act, if not practice); b) silent about religion (don't rock the boat); c) a super-star (coaches look the other way). Else you're off the team.
I fear one of my favorite college football programs largely operates this way.

That makes me really uncomfortable, too.
If it's Clemson, they absolutely do, but you know that already.
 

Groovenstein

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I assume close to 100%
This is the slippery slope crux for me.

I grew up in/around sports teams where you could be a) devoutly Christian (in act, if not practice); b) silent about religion (don't rock the boat); c) a super-star (coaches look the other way). Else you're off the team.
I fear one of my favorite college football programs largely operates this way.

That makes me really uncomfortable, too.
I’d recommend not reading SCOTUS’s recent Bremerton decision.
 

lars10

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I assume close to 100%
This is the slippery slope crux for me.

I grew up in/around sports teams where you could be a) devoutly Christian (in act, if not practice); b) silent about religion (don't rock the boat); c) a super-star (coaches look the other way). Else you're off the team.
I fear one of my favorite college football programs largely operates this way.

That makes me really uncomfortable, too.

Edit: I see this is a sorta false equivalence... and am struggling to tie off my thinking/fear/concern.
Can you explain to me a little more what the slippery slope here is? That if you have any anti-religious beliefs and choose to talk about them that you could be suspended?
 

joe dokes

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I once listened to a podcast with Deeyah Khan for a guest. She discussed her experience making her documentary, White Right, in which she met and talked with a number of white nationalists. She was able to connect with and win over a surprisingly high number of them simply by talking to them, asking about their concerns, and just generally forcing them to confront the fact that she was not the thing they thought she was. Turns out you can actually reach a few people when you see the humanity in them and don’t just call them bigoted pieces of shit.
I guess my unbreakable cynicism says connections like this are possible on an individual level. But I suspect many of the individual connections of the Kyries (and Beasley's) of the world are of the "Hey. I have a Black friend; I cant be racist" variety. Or "I know you're not one of *those* Jews."
 

luckiestman

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Has the Union reacted to “suspension until….” language yet? That seems a bit much. If he was fined or given a defined suspension I could see players Union not saying anything. Suspended until you repeat the exact words we tell you to say … I can’t imagine the players will like that.
 

Groovenstein

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I guess my unbreakable cynicism says connections like this are possible on an individual level. But I suspect many of the individual connections of the Kyries (and Beasley's) of the world are of the "Hey. I have a Black friend; I cant be racist" variety. Or "I know you're not one of *those* Jews."
I would guess that your suspicion is correct. I’d also guess that it’s a much (though not entirely) different animal, trying to reach the super-successful rich guy used to getting his way versus trying to reach the rank-and-file nationalist of much lesser means.
 

jon abbey

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Has the Union reacted to “suspension until….” language yet? That seems a bit much. If he was fined or given a defined suspension I could see players Union not saying anything. Suspended until you repeat the exact words we tell you to say … I can’t imagine the players will like that.
I don't follow these things as closely as some of you, but wasn't Donald Sterling forced to sell his team largely because of racist comments?
 

luckiestman

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I don't follow these things as closely as some of you, but wasn't Donald Sterling forced to sell his team largely because of racist comments?
I would say solely, not largely. Is your point that Kyrie should be disqualified from playing in the NBA?
 

Gash Prex

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Anytime your employer calls you out publicly as being “unfit” to be associated with them, you are done with them
 

Reverend

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Also, I have no proof of it but it would not shock me at all if a good number of NBA players share the same zip code in terms of having similar views as Kyrie. Point being that he may be a lot more welcome in other locker rooms than we'd like to believe.

Again, that's just a sense I have and I am about as close to an NBA locker room as most others here.
I have almost no doubt you are correct. But he has to pass by the front office to get to the locker room.
Hey everyone, while we’re all here: Does anyone know if the Nets has a policy about being homophobic? Or about holding discriminatory beliefs towards the LGBTQ+ community more generall?

Asking for some family.


*This is not directed at the posts quoted, which are just a jumping-off point.
 

Sprowl

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Remember when Celtics fans hated Kyrie just because he quit on the team? How quaint.
A much earlier version of this thread was titled "Mr. Chemistry".

Because sometimes it's not enough just to destroy a team.
 

luckiestman

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Hey everyone, while we’re all here: Does anyone know if the Nets has a policy about being homophobic? Or about holding discriminatory beliefs towards the LGBTQ+ community more generall?

Asking for some family.


*This is not directed at the posts quoted, which are just a jumping-off point.
Holding beliefs is a weird statement.

I know Rondo got fined for calling referee Bill Kennedy a “fucking faggot” but don’t recall a suspension.

https://deadspin.com/nba-ref-bill-kennedy-announces-hes-gay-days-after-rajo-1747937581/amp
 

Reverend

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He’s suspended because he is not properly civilized and he is blatantly offending people based on their religion. We do not have the technology to suspend people for just their thoughts.
Well, we do if they tell us what they are. And here, the Nets are demanding an affirmative statement.

I’m not saying they’re wrong, I’m saying this is a huge can of worms. Which I’m, of course, fine with; as you know, I like worms.
 

E5 Yaz

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Well, we do if they tell us what they are. And here, the Nets are demanding an affirmative statement.

I’m not saying they’re wrong, I’m saying this is a huge can of worms. Which I’m, of course, fine with; as you know, I like worms.
I thought you like cans
 

braudimusprime

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I don't follow these things as closely as some of you, but wasn't Donald Sterling forced to sell his team largely because of racist comments?
Sterling wasn't forced to sell the team. His wife sold the team, in part by getting a court to agree that he didn't have the mental capacity to oversee the team.
 

Mueller's Twin Grannies

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They won't because he wildly popular among the players, and....I bet more players agree with him than anyone wants to admit
This may not be the thread for this, but I saw some musings on Twitter today that Irving and 'Ye are not the biggest antisemites in Black community, but they may be the most vocal. Saw that Kendrick (I'm assuming Lamar), Nas, and others have been making not-so-thinly veiled allusions in their songs for a long time, but they keep their noses clean so nobody really notices. I'm not a hip-hop aficionado, but IF true, this kind of thinking may run a lot deeper than people realize in that community.
 

Scoops Bolling

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I once listened to a podcast with Deeyah Khan for a guest. She discussed her experience making her documentary, White Right, in which she met and talked with a number of white nationalists. She was able to connect with and win over a surprisingly high number of them simply by talking to them, asking about their concerns, and just generally forcing them to confront the fact that she was not the thing they thought she was. Turns out you can actually reach a few people when you see the humanity in them and don’t just call them bigoted pieces of shit.
Daryl Davis is another guy known for doing this. He's convinced dozens of Klansmen to leave the KKK, and my recollection is that his approach is largely the same kind of thing; he talks to them, finds some way to connect (music, food, whatever), and by forging that human connection over time he's then able to start questioning about them their beliefs and challenging them, as you say, forcing them to confront that he isn't what they thought.

The question of course is how to do forge those connections en masse, particularly in segregated, rural, or otherwise disconnected communities.
 

Reverend

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This may not be the thread for this, but I saw some musings on Twitter today that Irving and 'Ye are not the biggest antisemites in Black community, but they may be the most vocal. Saw that Kendrick (I'm assuming Lamar), Nas, and others have been making not-so-thinly veiled allusions in their songs for a long time, but they keep their noses clean so nobody really notices. I'm not a hip-hop aficionado, but IF true, this kind of thinking may run a lot deeper than people realize in that community.
Ever see the album cover for I am… ?

I bought my own copy of The Egyptian Book of the Dead from a guy’s table in Penn Station back in ‘99. He had lots of other… stuff, too.

I mean, this all goes way further than some of these Black Israelite and adjacent movements. And it shouldn’t be surprising; once slave owners who felt guilty and tried to justify the “curious” arrangement by Christianizing their slaves, well, intentionally reading the Book of Exodus to an enslaved population is a heckuva an idea, yeah? And over the years, people took the ideas in a lot of different directions, and they ain’t all gonna be Marley.
 
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luckiestman

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This may not be the thread for this, but I saw some musings on Twitter today that Irving and 'Ye are not the biggest antisemites in Black community, but they may be the most vocal. Saw that Kendrick (I'm assuming Lamar), Nas, and others have been making not-so-thinly veiled allusions in their songs for a long time, but they keep their noses clean so nobody really notices. I'm not a hip-hop aficionado, but IF true, this kind of thinking may run a lot deeper than people realize in that community.
Google: Farrakhan Rap Stars. You will get a couple of hits on that search
 

Groovenstein

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Daryl Davis is another guy known for doing this. He's convinced dozens of Klansmen to leave the KKK, and my recollection is that his approach is largely the same kind of thing; he talks to them, finds some way to connect (music, food, whatever), and by forging that human connection over time he's then able to start questioning about them their beliefs and challenging them, as you say, forcing them to confront that he isn't what they thought.

The question of course is how to do forge those connections en masse, particularly in segregated, rural, or otherwise disconnected communities.
Makes me think of that Heineken (?) commercial where they have pairs of people who unknowingly hate each other share a beer, and some of them end up changed for the better. Such a great commercial.
 

Marciano490

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Makes me think of that Heineken (?) commercial where they have pairs of people who unknowingly hate each other share a beer, and some of them end up changed for the better. Such a great commercial.
Life sure would be better if it was like beer commercials, my brother.
 

joe dokes

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Hey everyone, while we’re all here: Does anyone know if the Nets has a policy about being homophobic? Or about holding discriminatory beliefs towards the LGBTQ+ community more generall?

Asking for some family.


*This is not directed at the posts quoted, which are just a jumping-off point.
Being? I doubt it. Acting on it? I hope so.
 

Kliq

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I was listening to the Lowe Post yesterday with Nick Friedell, and both Nick and Zach said that Kyrie has zero trade value at the moment around the league, "radioactive" was the term they used.

Now, it is the NBA and somebody who is very talented will always get a bunch of chances. It wouldn't surprise me at all with just a little bit of time for things to simmer down, that someone makes a play for Kyrie. Or the Nets bring him back because their season looks to be going up in flames.