Kyrie has lost 13 straight to the Cs and we have schadenfreude!!!

Euclis20

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The Nets presumably already know what teams would offer for Durant. They shopped him before the season and didn’t like the offers then. I don’t see why they would change substantially.
They have an idea and Durant's general value has gone down (he's 6 months older and has suffered yet another leg injury) but the league has changed and there could be some better opportunities now (midseason) that weren't available when everyone was optimistic about their rosters late last summer.

Thankfully this didn't happen, but what if instead of having the best record in the league, Boston were struggling around .500 and there was some smoke about Jaylen leaving after next season? Would that make the Celtics likely to sweeten their reported Jaylen+ deal from last summer? Toronto was reportedly one of the Durant suitors as well, with Scottie Barnes being the sticking point. Has his lack of improvement (and the underwhelming performance by the Raptors as a whole) made them more or less likely to offer more for Durant? I believe Phoenix and Miami were atop his reported list when the trade demand first broke. Both teams have been just ok overall, but have shown flashes when healthy. Does either look to go all in now? I'll repeat that even as his overall value has declined to age and injury, it only takes one team to say that the NEED him this year, he's the piece that puts them over.

That aside - he's hurt, and no one is giving up a monster package for a 34 year old out with a knee injury, with no return date.
 

BigSoxFan

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They have an idea and Durant's general value has gone down (he's 6 months older and has suffered yet another leg injury) but the league has changed and there could be some better opportunities now (midseason) that weren't available when everyone was optimistic about their rosters late last summer.

Thankfully this didn't happen, but what if instead of having the best record in the league, Boston were struggling around .500 and there was some smoke about Jaylen leaving after next season? Would that make the Celtics likely to sweeten their reported Jaylen+ deal from last summer? Toronto was reportedly one of the Durant suitors as well, with Scottie Barnes being the sticking point. Has his lack of improvement (and the underwhelming performance by the Raptors as a whole) made them more or less likely to offer more for Durant? I believe Phoenix and Miami were atop his reported list when the trade demand first broke. Both teams have been just ok overall, but have shown flashes when healthy. Does either look to go all in now? I'll repeat that even as his overall value has declined to age and injury, it only takes one team to say that the NEED him this year, he's the piece that puts them over.

That aside - he's hurt, and no one is giving up a monster package for a 34 year old out with a knee injury, with no return date.
Yup. And this is why Nets should have dealt KD. Old players get hurt.
 

radsoxfan

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This could absolutely end up being the case, and if/when that happens the Nets should just stand pat. I say this knowing full well how much of an unreliable flake Kyrie is, but when he and Durant were healthy, the Nets were one of the 6-7 teams in the league with a legit chance to win the title. Them rolling the dice that they rediscover the chemistry from just a few weeks ago is what they should do.
I guess it depends how likely you think the Nets are to win a title. A top player on a title contender rarely asked for a trade midseason, so it’s uncharted waters to some degree.

Seems to me Bos, Phi, and Mil are all still clearly ahead of the Nets. If I owned the Nets, I would say GTFO.
 

Cellar-Door

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Basically, he’s trying to get to LA so that they can resign him for the max. Can’t imagine any other team (that would interest him) would offer him that, though I’m not even certain LA would.
If he’s really just posturing with Brooklyn he clearly doesn’t understand why they don’t want to extend him. This crap is the very reason he hasn’t already been extended..
Well yes, but he's not going to change. The reason they haven't dumped him for very little already is twofold... 1 he's good, but more important is 2. KD wants him and KD is a top 5-8 player in the league. In the offseason Kyrie saying he wanted a trade got KD to say he wanted a trade, and tied them together, his camp probably thinks they can do it again here... either KD comes out to support him and pressure the Nets, or he gets traded to someone who will give him a big contract extension.... win win for him.
 

HomeRunBaker

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Westbrook winning 6th Man of the Year despite being traded mid-season as a dump would probably make heads around here explode.
I’ll be discussing this in the gambling thread tomorrow once the markets re-open but this may create tremendous opportunities if Russ does get traded. The acquiring team is likely going to start him and even though he would still qualify for the award (must come off bench more than games started) it wouldn’t appear the voters can check off a box for a guy who started the final 25 or so games of the season with another team. Recency bias is real to the voters.
 

kazuneko

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Well yes, but he's not going to change. The reason they haven't dumped him for very little already is twofold... 1 he's good, but more important is 2. KD wants him and KD is a top 5-8 player in the league. In the offseason Kyrie saying he wanted a trade got KD to say he wanted a trade, and tied them together, his camp probably thinks they can do it again here... either KD comes out to support him and pressure the Nets, or he gets traded to someone who will give him a big contract extension.... win win for him.
Only a desperate team would offer him a big extension- and he wouldn’t have any interest in signing with such a team.
His best option was to quietly play hard for the rest of the season so some contender, somewhere would think he’d learned his lesson and offer him a big extension . This trade request torpedoes that potentiality and, in do doing, limits his chance of signing with any contender for big money. That’s why it was an idiotic move - though that is hardly shocking as it’s Kyrie’s narcissism that consistently drives his decisions..
 

lexrageorge

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Kyrie's trade request is rational in a selfish way. The teams with cap space this coming offseason are all in rebuilding mode. So the only path for him to leave the Nets in the offseason is a sign-and-trade, which immediately hard caps Kyrie's new team. The Lakers could make it work by renouncing most of their pending free agents, so maybe that's sufficient. But their roster would be LeBron, Davis, Kyrie, Hachimura and min salary vets.
 

Ferm Sheller

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Are those C's fans who are dialed into the NBA a little more than I am hoping that he goes to a C's competitor or not? Like what are the most/least desirable places you'd like to see him go?
 

lovegtm

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The Lakers also could offer swaps in 26 and 28 in addition to picks, right?

Those are incredibly valuable assets (to the point that they should be able to cash that all in for more than just Kyrie).
 

bankshot1

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Why couldn't KI just play nice for the balance of this year (extension or not) and if no satisfactory deal was reached then walk away into FA?

Does team destruction and chaos have to follow this guy's missteps?

This guy is a seasonal rental.

NFW I'd mortgage the future for KI.

He is not worth it.
 

HomeRunBaker

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Kyrie's trade request is rational in a selfish way. The teams with cap space this coming offseason are all in rebuilding mode. So the only path for him to leave the Nets in the offseason is a sign-and-trade, which immediately hard caps Kyrie's new team. The Lakers could make it work by renouncing most of their pending free agents, so maybe that's sufficient. But their roster would be LeBron, Davis, Kyrie, Hachimura and min salary vets.
Yes, once you get past that this is Kyrie and break it down logically the request makes a ton of sense for the player on a number of levels. It’s a big business so the selfish part doesn’t bother me as much as some. I’m just glad he’s no longer our problem.
 

the moops

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The Lakers could make it work by renouncing most of their pending free agents, so maybe that's sufficient. But their roster would be LeBron, Davis, Kyrie, Hachimura and min salary vets.
They would have the full MLE and the bi-annual to use. But yea, their roster would be pretty thin
 

HomeRunBaker

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They would have the full MLE and the bi-annual to use. But yea, their roster would be pretty thin
One could argue that it may be better off thin than with the crap that they currently employ. If I’m LeBron the GM it’s a no-brainer to go this route……you can find ways to replace Lonnie Walker, Thomas Bryant and Dennis Schroder.
 

benhogan

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Yes, once you get past that this is Kyrie and break it down logically the request makes a ton of sense for the player on a number of levels. It’s a big business so the selfish part doesn’t bother me as much as some. I’m just glad he’s no longer our problem.
yep. This is 100% about $$$. Any team that trades assets (Miami/Lakers) for Kyrie at this moment will have to give him the max.

Newsflash: Kyrie operates out of self-interest

The part I find funny is how fast NBA vets on NBAtv are putting all the blame on the Nets for this dysfunction.
"3 Superstars asking to be traded, must be Brooklyn's fault" was an interesting take
 

HomeRunBaker

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By the end of the season, after up-close inspection, they'll finally realize how mediocre Rui is...
He’s an enormous upgrade over the other dreck that the Lakers put out there. He’s a real solid and smart player who can matchup with multiple positions. His contract is pretty good moving forward as role players will be making $20m+.

On paper a AD, LeBron, Kyrie, Hachimura lineup is a freakin beast. Reeves is an ideal role player with the Beverly insanity. I want this for purely selfish reasons just like Kyrie. :)
 

benhogan

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He’s an enormous upgrade over the other dreck that the Lakers put out there. He’s a real solid and smart player who can matchup with multiple positions. His contract is pretty good moving forward as role players will be making $20m+.

On paper a AD, LeBron, Kyrie, Hachimura lineup is a freakin beast. Reeves is an ideal role player with the Beverly insanity. I want this for purely selfish reasons just like Kyrie. :)
Rui at $20MM/yr is a mistake that I don't doubt the Lakers will make. The Wizards haven't missed him one bit.

I know he comes with a Gonzaga stamp of approval, but smart players find ways to add value. Rui never has. Whether he's starting or coming off the bench he's been a consistent negative player each and every season. +/- per 100. On-Off. ORtg/DRtg. VORP. BPM. However, you want to look at it...Plus he's brittle as all heck for a young player.

Grant Williams, who has struggled recently, is a much better role player, that is constantly available & more efficient offensively. Grant will struggle to get $20MM/yr

Rui is a classic minutes-on-a-bad team player that will get you paid regardless of performance. That's a contract you just don't want.

On paper a AD, LeBron, Kyrie, Hachimura any fungible defense-first 4/5, Reeves lineup is a freakin beast.
 
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bigq

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I know Kyrie is an excellent basketball player particularly on offense, he is having a strong season statistically and he is going to get a max contract from a team because that is the way the NBA works but man that is going to be a toxic contract. Thank goodness the Celtics will not be signing him.
 

HomeRunBaker

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Rui at $20MM/yr is a mistake that I don't doubt the Lakers will make. The Wizards haven't missed him one bit.

I know he comes with a Gonzaga stamp of approval, but smart players find ways to add value. Rui never has. Whether he's starting or coming off the bench he's been a consistent negative player each and every season. +/- per 100. On-Off. ORtg/DRtg. VORP. BPM. However, you want to look at it...Plus he's brittle as all heck for a young player.

Grant Williams, who has struggled recently, is a much better role player, that is constantly available & more efficient offensively. Grant will struggle to get $20MM/yr

Rui is a classic minutes-on-a-bad team player that will get you paid regardless of performance. That's a contract you just don't want.

On paper a AD, LeBron, Kyrie, Hachimura any fungible defense-first 4/5, Reeves lineup is a freakin beast.
Plus/Minus really??? ALL role players are going to look crappy on bad teams as they are not impact players. Lakers have won 3 of 5 on a road trip (including a punt game w/o AD & LeBron), and he matches up MUCH better defensively as he matches up at multiple paitions unlike Schroder/Beverly who he replaced. Since he was acquired and since you insist…..he has a +14 in those 5 games! Whoa! PLUS 14!!! Lol I kid, stat is meaningless.

I mean if you want to argue that a big switchable wing isn’t a better fit on this team than Schroder/Beverly have at it. It really isn’t even close and a big upgrade to their rotation.
 

Kliq

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Yeah but no matter where he goes he is going to be miserable, will continue to embarrass himself and likely contribute to a toxic, losing culture. Kyrie himself is the problem, and that is something that he fails to realize.
 

kazuneko

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I know Kyrie is an excellent basketball player particularly on offense, he is having a strong season statistically and he is going to get a max contract from a team because that is the way the NBA works but man that is going to be a toxic contract. Thank goodness the Celtics will not be signing him.
It will be interesting to see if this is true - but I really don’t think it’s that simple. Most contenders will have little interest in committing to this guy - with the only exception being LAL (maybe). If that doesn’t work out, which team offers him that max deal? I mean, maybe the Rockets or some other lottery team might, but Kyrie won’t have any interest in signing with a team like that. If any other contender is interested it would probably be a short-term contract for less money, and I’m not sure Kyrie’s pride would allow him to agree to that.
 

kazuneko

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100% agree here. Like I said before, if it wasn’t Kyrie doing this we’d be lauding the player for this smart business decision.
Yes, but the very fact it is Kyrie changes everything. Kyrie’s market is different than any other star because he’s seen as a selfish dickhead with zero ability to focus on winning and an endless capacity to cause distractions that disrupt team chemistry. That notion severely limits his market. This demand reinforces that perception and -in do doing- hurt’s Kyrie’s chances of getting a big contract this off-season.
 

benhogan

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Plus/Minus really??? ALL role players are going to look crappy on bad teams as they are not impact players. Lakers have won 3 of 5 on a road trip (including a punt game w/o AD & LeBron), and he matches up MUCH better defensively as he matches up at multiple paitions unlike Schroder/Beverly who he replaced. Since he was acquired and since you insist…..he has a +14 in those 5 games! Whoa! PLUS 14!!! Lol I kid, stat is meaningless.

I mean if you want to argue that a big switchable wing isn’t a better fit on this team than Schroder/Beverly have at it. It really isn’t even close and a big upgrade to their rotation.
For sure, RUI is better than what they had, but that was a pretty low bar.

As far as +/- & On-Off, it means something after 4 seasons. After 5 Laker games playing with Bron/AD, agreed it means nothing.
On a crappy Wizards team, he should at least post 1 season of neutral On-Off. Especially since he mixed in starting/bench over 4 seasons. His other adv metrics also scream mediocrity. JAG. Good for him if can swindle them out of ~$20MM/yr, I'll be cheering hard for Jeannie & Rob to get pen & pad out.

Kyrie/AD/Bron, are 3 All-NBA players when healthy mentally/physically. So just throw in a 4/5 that will play high-effort D (you don't need to pay RUI to do that) + a shooter like Reeves that plays with effort.

In fact, a fragile player like RUI is an absolutely terrible selection since his inability to stay on the court is a dreadful thing to pair with AD & Kyrie. You'd want to build continuity around them as much as possible.
 
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Marciano490

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Why couldn't KI just play nice for the balance of this year (extension or not) and if no satisfactory deal was reached then walk away into FA?

Does team destruction and chaos have to follow this guy's missteps?

This guy is a seasonal rental.

NFW I'd mortgage the future for KI.

He is not worth it.
He’s a scorpion. It’s in his nature.
 

InstaFace

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I'd really not like the Prince of Douchebaggery to once again be rewarded for his actions by being able.to go exactly where he wants.
Do we even know where that would be?

It's a poisoned chalice - maybe he upgrades a rotation this year, but he'd have to be persuaded through an extension offer, and anyone extending 2023-Kyrie at $47M is going to deserve what they get, which will not be a lot of team glory.

If the people running all 30 NBA teams were fully rational, rather than entitled princelings of owners, he would end up in FA this summer and his best offer would be a contract that's like $15-20M for 2 years plus an option. Something the acquiring team could get out of if need be. But right now all this "opportunity" is is a chance to further-widen the divide between the professionally-managed teams and the moron-run ones. Kyrie is a wedge issue.

Decades from now, we're going to look back and declare that Lebron's greatest feat, the testament to his greatness, was dragging a team whose #2 player was Kyrie Irving to a championship.
 
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bigq

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It will be interesting to see if this is true - but I really don’t think it’s that simple. Most contenders will have little interest in committing to this guy - with the only exception being LAL (maybe). If that doesn’t work out, which team offers him that max deal? I mean, maybe the Rockets or some other lottery team might, but Kyrie won’t have any interest in signing with a team like that. If any other contender is interested it would probably be a short-term contract for less money, and I’m not sure Kyrie’s pride would allow him to agree to that.
Everything you say is logical and makes sense to me. Will be interesting to see how it plays out. There are only so many All-NBA caliber players out there and it just takes one team to fall in love with his instant offense and take the Kyrie plunge. At the same time every GM in the NBA knows about his warts at this point.
 

joe dokes

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Are those C's fans who are dialed into the NBA a little more than I am hoping that he goes to a C's competitor or not? Like what are the most/least desirable places you'd like to see him go?
I don't care. He's just not dependable enough to make a team a serious contender except on paper.
 

Caspir

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I'd really not like the Prince of Douchebaggery to once again be rewarded for his actions by being able.to go exactly where he wants.
What actions? Do you hate all players that request trades? The Nets won’t give him the max (I wouldn’t either), and as a result, he requested a trade.This is, like, very normal behavior in professional sports. Without a trade, he is looking at shitty options in the off-season. HRB is absolutely right that this is extremely rational behavior, and if it were another star player, nobody would even blink.
 

RG33

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100% agree here. Like I said before, if it wasn’t Kyrie doing this we’d be lauding the player for this smart business decision.
I don’t know. If Kyrie was into making smart business decisions, he would probably sign the extension with the Nets and play with KD and Simmons the rest of his career in his hometown. This is just a petulant child looking for attention because he didn’t get his way. There’s nothing that should be lauded here in my opinion.
 

the moops

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OK we get it, Kyrie is a terrible person. He is giving us a chance to concoct ridiculous trades though.

LAL - Kyrie, Olynyk
BRK - Conley, Poeltl, Gay
UTA - Westbrook, LAL 2026 1st, BRK 2025 1st
SAS - Simmons, a couple 2nds
 

Euclis20

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What actions? Do you hate all players that request trades? The Nets won’t give him the max (I wouldn’t either), and as a result, he requested a trade.This is, like, very normal behavior in professional sports. Without a trade, he is looking at shitty options in the off-season. HRB is absolutely right that this is extremely rational behavior, and if it were another star player, nobody would even blink.
Let's ignore for a moment that absolutely no rational player with Kyrie's skills, stats and playoff history would be in this situation (even considering his age and injury history, a rational actor in Kyrie's shoes wouldn't have any problem getting a fully guaranteed max deal with his current title contending team). Setting all of that aside, when was the last time a player good enough to start in the all-star game demanded a midseason trade away from his title contending team because he was unhappy with his contract?

People who think Lebron will be able to keep Kyrie happy and productive are crazy. Kyrie already demanded a trade away from Lebron once! In what world can we believe that Kyrie has the capacity to learn from his mistakes? He goes to the Lakers, and 12-18 months now we start getting stories about how he doesn't like being on a team with aging Lebron and crippled AD. Maybe we'll start hearing stories about how much he misses his good friends Jayson Tatum and Jaylen Brown, and would love to get the gang back together.