Koji to the DL with a broken wrist

mauidano

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Sorry for Koji. At this point, it doesn't matter too much.  See you in a couple weeks Koji-san hopefully.  Closer by committee, a couple of pitching spots open now with Masterson gone and Koji DL'd.
 

Rasputin

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I hope to heck Farrell goes out of his way to cut down on the use of Tazawa because if not, he's going to be using him even more and Tazawa might actually explode.
 

Hee Sox Choi

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Since we're discussing who to bring up for Koji, I really don't understand why someone like Hinojosa got waived over releasing Breslow or Masterson.  Did you see his performance a few days ago in Philly?  Here it is, 94 & filthy and the announcers were very impressed.  3 IP 5 Ks
 
http://m.mlb.com/phi/video/v339591283
 

Hee Sox Choi

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Coachster said:
I'm a little nervous that Ronald Belisario is about to be our closer.
Don't be.  August 4th: 
 
The Red Sox have released reliever Ronald Belisario, the club’s Triple-A affiliate announced on Twitter.
 

Tyrone Biggums

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Hee Sox Choi said:
Don't be.  August 4th: 
 
The Red Sox have released reliever Ronald Belisario, the clubs Triple-A affiliate announced on Twitter.
The way this season is going it's probably Breslow.
 

jscola85

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DaveRoberts'Shoes said:
Well, that sucks
 
Eh, it sucks for Koji but this will open up a roster spot for someone like Hembree, Aro or Layne to prove they belong as part of the 2016 bullpen.  And if they go up in flames, we at least end up with a higher draft pick and have more clarity that the bullpen will be a big need to upgrade in the offseason.
 

TheYellowDart5

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jscola85 said:
 
Eh, it sucks for Koji but this will open up a roster spot for someone like Hembree, Aro or Layne to prove they belong as part of the 2016 bullpen.  And if they go up in flames, we at least end up with a higher draft pick and have more clarity that the bullpen will be a big need to upgrade in the offseason.
 
And hey, Uehara won't be wasting his last innings on a go-nowhere team. Him getting the last six weeks of the season of isn't the worst thing to happen, though it means that any lead of three runs or fewer is almost guaranteed to be blown from here on out.
 

DaveRoberts'Shoes

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jscola85 said:
 
Eh, it sucks for Koji but this will open up a roster spot for someone like Hembree, Aro or Layne to prove they belong as part of the 2016 bullpen.  And if they go up in flames, we at least end up with a higher draft pick and have more clarity that the bullpen will be a big need to upgrade in the offseason.
I know, but I always enjoy watching him pitch and it was one of the few reliably good things in this dumpster fire of a season
 

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jscola85 said:
Eh, it sucks for Koji but this will open up a roster spot for someone like Hembree, Aro or Layne to prove they belong as part of the 2016 bullpen.  And if they go up in flames, we at least end up with a higher draft pick and have more clarity that the bullpen will be a big need to upgrade in the offseason.
I don't think more clarity on that point is possible. But sure, trying to determine if there are any keepers in the group should be the priority.

In the long run(thinking about 2016), saving the wear and tear is probably a good thing. But damn, I love watching Koji pitch.
 

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A parting gift from Justin Masterson, whose inability to close out a 7-2 lead brought Koji into the game.
 

DennyDoyle'sBoil

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Players currently on the Red Sox active roster who were on the World Series roster less than two years ago:  Breslow, Taz, Xander, Papi.
 
That's absolutely astounding.
 
I'm with BMHH -- while I can rationalize the aspects of having Koji take the rest of the season off, watching him and Papi were about all that I enjoyed this year.  Two months is a long time to be stuck with this bunch.   
 

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DennyDoyle'sBoil said:
I'm with BMHH -- while I can rationalize the aspects of having Koji take the rest of the season off, watching him and Papi were about all that I enjoyed this year.  Two months is a long time to be stuck with this bunch.   
Really? You're not enjoying EdRod? Xander isn't giving you any pleasure?  JBJ's over-the-shoulder catch and triple/home run yesterday was pure misery? Mookie's no fun at all? Henry Owens' first win was nothing to you? Rusney's .819 OPS since his latest callup is just something to be stuck with?  You don't take any pleasure at all in watching a 30-year-old knuckleballer make Yankees look stupid?
 
If the only reason you follow baseball is to count the wins, then you're kind of missing out on a lot of fun.
 

etakbear

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Well, there goes the season...oh wait.

I love watching Koji. Is a bright side that he's more likely to be back next year?

And yes, the kids are fun to watch, when they aren't injuring themselves (talking to you, Mookie)
 

DennyDoyle'sBoil

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iayork said:
Really? You're not enjoying EdRod? Xander isn't giving you any pleasure?  JBJ's over-the-shoulder catch and triple/home run yesterday was pure misery? Mookie's no fun at all? Henry Owens' first win was nothing to you? Rusney's .819 OPS since his latest callup is just something to be stuck with?  You don't take any pleasure at all in watching a 30-year-old knuckleballer make Yankees look stupid?
 
If the only reason you follow baseball is to count the wins, then you're kind of missing out on a lot of fun.
 
Yeah, momentary occasions of joy -- and EdRod is getting close to appointment television on a weekly basis.  
 
My point was not entirely clear, I'll grant you, but my thoughts were connected -- that is, I was talking about the players on the roster that were on the WS team, which is why I mentioned Koji and Papi.  (No excuse for not mentioning X.)  While I root for the laundry and watching younger players get integrated is great, the point I was trying to make, perhaps not that well, is that some sense of continuity is nice.  I wish we were watching the kids develop on a team that had at least a semblance of bridge to glory days just a year and a half removed.  In a second shitty year in a row, sometimes it's nice to watch yesterday's heroes even if just to have a good association past glory.  Every time Koji is on the mound, at least on some level I'm still smiling thinking about how awesome it was whenever he came into the game in 2013.  With Pedrioa and now Koji going down, there isn't much of a bridge left is all.
 

BeantownIdaho

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The next two months should be an unofficial try-out for the future closer role. Why not use this time when it doesn't matter to see what some of the younger kids have in the tank for the 9th inning. 
 

Rasputin

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BeantownIdaho said:
The next two months should be an unofficial try-out for the future closer role. Why not use this time when it doesn't matter to see what some of the younger kids have in the tank for the 9th inning. 
 
Because that's a terrible way to break in new pitchers.
 

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DaveRoberts'Shoes said:
I know, but I always enjoy watching him pitch and it was one of the few reliably good things in this dumpster fire of a season
Baseball is stupid. I hate baseball.
 

Plympton91

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Rasputin said:
 
Because that's a terrible way to break in new pitchers.
 
It's also obvious that none of them have anything close to the stuff necessary to pitch high leverage innings.  We don't need to watch them torch starts by Owens, Wright, and Rodriguez to figure that out.  That's what scouts are for. 
 
I keep saying this season can't get any worse, and then it does. 
 
As for Ian's list of silver linings, yeah, great.  Those will happen without me wasting perfectly awesome late summer and fall evenings in front of a television set watching a team going nowhere.
 

Rasputin

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Plympton91 said:
 
It's also obvious that none of them have anything close to the stuff necessary to pitch high leverage innings.
No it isn't. If you're too warped and bitter to just watch a game and enjoy it, maybe you should just pretend baseball doesn't exist until late February.
 

catomatic

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Plympton91 said:
 
It's also obvious that none of them have anything close to the stuff necessary to pitch high leverage innings.  We don't need to watch them torch starts by Owens, Wright, and Rodriguez to figure that out.  That's what scouts are for. 
 
I keep saying this season can't get any worse, and then it does. 
 
As for Ian's list of silver linings, yeah, great.  Those will happen without me wasting perfectly awesome late summer and fall evenings in front of a television set watching a team going nowhere.
I've actually become really excited about watching Red Sox baseball for the next 6 weeks—they have a golden opportunity to learn a bunch that they otherwise might not have. It's likely they'll make a bunch of good, informed player evaluations over this stretch that they otherwise might not have made. In a way, this season's failure is golden for a team with this many hi-level prospects. 
 

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What makes you say this?
Even good prospects have an adjustment period when transitioning to the majors. Doing that with the game on the line is a great way to make them think more about the results than the process. They need to think about the process.
 

the1andonly3003

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catomatic said:
I've actually become really excited about watching Red Sox baseball for the next 6 weeks—they have a golden opportunity to learn a bunch that they otherwise might not have. It's likely they'll make a bunch of good, informed player evaluations over this stretch that they otherwise might not have made. In a way, this season's failure is golden for a team with this many hi-level prospects. 
Didn't a lot of us say this last August? And August of 2012?
 

Plympton91

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catomatic said:
I've actually become really excited about watching Red Sox baseball for the next 6 weeksthey have a golden opportunity to learn a bunch that they otherwise might not have. It's likely they'll make a bunch of good, informed player evaluations over this stretch that they otherwise might not have made. In a way, this season's failure is golden for a team with this many hi-level prospects. 
I disagree. It's garbage time. Meaningless games with no pressure against soon to be expanded rosters and, especially for relievers with mediocre stuff, a basically meaningless sample size.

Anything they see over the next seven weeks could as easily be misinformation as information.
 

JimD

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Rasputin said:
 
Because that's a terrible way to break in new pitchers.
 
Hembree has 114 minor league saves.  Yeah, he's not really a prospect but why not give him a shot and see what happens?  Losses = better draft position and all.
 

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Rasputin said:
Even good prospects have an adjustment period when transitioning to the majors. Doing that with the game on the line is a great way to make them think more about the results than the process. They need to think about the process.
Since the season is not on the line and it's one of many games left to get a look at players, I think this is the optimum time for them to focus on process rather than results - since in the big picture of this season the results are not as meaningful. When the rosters expand bring up some late innings guys and see what they can do in the 9th. Let's see what Taz, Layne, Ross or even Joe Kelly could do in the 9th. Putting Breslow out there in the 9th for every save opportunity isn't going to better this team for the future.  
 

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Rasputin said:
Yeah, and?
 
Yep. Seems like there's a lot of people here that would be happier as Yankee fans. 
 
And I'll take the shit from anyone who that pisses off.
 
"wahhh! my team isn't winning...baseball sucks because there's nothing to watch unless my team is winning...you old fucks with your nostalgia of the old fucking days should just go and die because maybe you were still happy even though your teams wasn't winning...whahhh! but we pay really high prices to watch this team and it's owned by spoiled rich guys who are obliged to give us a winning team and if they don't win you can take your baseballs and shove them up your rookie's asses...there are no other teams to follow because if they're not my winning team baseball sucks"
 
Feel free to criticize decisions and how money is spent and how the manager sucks and what losers some folks are, but don't turn around and be bitter fucking babies if things don't work out. It's still a beautiful sport. It's still summertime, and Jack Daniels still does its trick.
 

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catomatic said:
I've actually become really excited about watching Red Sox baseball for the next 6 weeks—they have a golden opportunity to learn a bunch that they otherwise might not have. It's likely they'll make a bunch of good, informed player evaluations over this stretch that they otherwise might not have made. In a way, this season's failure is golden for a team with this many hi-level prospects.
Absolutely. This is the silver lining in a disappointing season. And let's see who steps up to play spoiler against teams fighting for the playoffs.
 

BeantownIdaho

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geoduck no quahog said:
 
Yep. Seems like there's a lot of people here that would be happier as Yankee fans. 
 
And I'll take the shit from anyone who that pisses off.
 
"wahhh! my team isn't winning...baseball sucks because there's nothing to watch unless my team is winning...you old fucks with your nostalgia of the old fucking days should just go and die because maybe you were still happy even though your teams wasn't winning...whahhh! but we pay really high prices to watch this team and it's owned by spoiled rich guys who are obliged to give us a winning team and if they don't win you can take your baseballs and shove them up your rookie's asses...there are no other teams to follow because if they're not my winning team baseball sucks"
 
Feel free to criticize decisions and how money is spent and how the manager sucks and what losers some folks are, but don't turn around and be bitter fucking babies if things don't work out. It's still a beautiful sport. It's still summertime, and Jack Daniels still does its trick.
X10.....ah the good ol' days of two years ago. 
 

E5 Yaz

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catomatic said:
I've actually become really excited about watching Red Sox baseball for the next 6 weeks—they have a golden opportunity to learn a bunch that they otherwise might not have. It's likely they'll make a bunch of good, informed player evaluations over this stretch that they otherwise might not have made. In a way, this season's failure is golden for a team with this many hi-level prospects. 
 
I agree with this, except for the word "likely." We can hope they do this. 
 
For me, the worst type of team to follow is the 75-81 win type of team -- not very good, not truly bad, just bleh. So this team is worth following, particularly is they can help knock the Yankees out of a playoff spot
 

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geoduck no quahog said:
Yep. Seems like there's a lot of people here that would be happier as Yankee fans. 
 
And I'll take the shit from anyone who that pisses off.
 
"wahhh! my team isn't winning...baseball sucks because there's nothing to watch unless my team is winning...you old fucks with your nostalgia of the old fucking days should just go and die because maybe you were still happy even though your teams wasn't winning...whahhh! but we pay really high prices to watch this team and it's owned by spoiled rich guys who are obliged to give us a winning team and if they don't win you can take your baseballs and shove them up your rookie's asses...there are no other teams to follow because if they're not my winning team baseball sucks"
 
Feel free to criticize decisions and how money is spent and how the manager sucks and what losers some folks are, but don't turn around and be bitter fucking babies if things don't work out. It's still a beautiful sport. It's still summertime, and Jack Daniels still does its trick.
Amen .. Genuflecting to the most awesome post in the past four months. The entitlement around here is off the charts.
 

the1andonly3003

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BeantownIdaho said:
Yeah, and the next year they won the series in 2013 - seems credible for 2012.  
guess what, most of the players on that 2013 team are no longer playing in Boston and never became the future
 

DennyDoyle'sBoil

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geoduck no quahog said:
Yep. Seems like there's a lot of people here that would be happier as Yankee fans. 
 
And I'll take the shit from anyone who that pisses off.
 
"wahhh! my team isn't winning...baseball sucks because there's nothing to watch unless my team is winning...you old fucks with your nostalgia of the old fucking days should just go and die because maybe you were still happy even though your teams wasn't winning...whahhh! but we pay really high prices to watch this team and it's owned by spoiled rich guys who are obliged to give us a winning team and if they don't win you can take your baseballs and shove them up your rookie's asses...there are no other teams to follow because if they're not my winning team baseball sucks"
 
Feel free to criticize decisions and how money is spent and how the manager sucks and what losers some folks are, but don't turn around and be bitter fucking babies if things don't work out. It's still a beautiful sport. It's still summertime, and Jack Daniels still does its trick.
I. Will. Not. Be. Shamed.

Good post. I hate to be in the like-a-Yankees-Fan group, but I just have a hard time jumping to any kind of silver lining on this one. Koji is just a bunch of awesomeness. He's fun, and funny, and good, and whether the team is 40-60 or 60-40, having to wait a year to see him pitch again just sucks.
 

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the1andonly3003 said:
guess what, most of the players on that 2013 team are no longer playing in Boston and never became the future
Nor were they supposed to. Gomes, Vic, Nap, did you really think these guys were the future? Salty? David Ross?

Jesus, people, it's like to weren't even paying attention.

In 2013, the team signed a bunch of guys to relatively short contracts because they looked at the system and saw that Bogaerts was close and everyone else was going to need some time.

On 2014 we broke in some kids and it went poorly.

In 2015, the kids are doing better and the guys we got for 2013 are gone because they served their purpose and now we have better options.
 

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catomatic said:
I've actually become really excited about watching Red Sox baseball for the next 6 weeks—they have a golden opportunity to learn a bunch that they otherwise might not have. It's likely they'll make a bunch of good, informed player evaluations over this stretch that they otherwise might not have made. In a way, this season's failure is golden for a team with this many hi-level prospects. 
How are six weeks of evaluations going to help make good, informed decisions? History is littered with guys who had a hot month-plus and then did nothing or had a terrible start and then went on to fine careers.
 

Red(s)HawksFan

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Super Nomario said:
How are six weeks of evaluations going to help make good, informed decisions? History is littered with guys who had a hot month-plus and then did nothing or had a terrible start and then went on to fine careers.
 
Change the perspective.  It isn't six weeks to evaluate or make decisions.  It's six weeks for a whole bunch of guys to get their feet wet or gain more experience and hasten their transition to the big leagues.  For some guys the transition is instantaneous (the Trouts of the world), for some it takes a couple months (Pedroia), for some it might take a year or more for the lights to go on, and for some it never clicks.  But regardless of where each player falls on that spectrum, what can it hurt to use the last six weeks to expose a whole bunch of players who could be contributors to this team for the next few years?
 
A lot of these players have already been evaluated and decisions made about them, with more evaluations and decisions to come.  They're not about to decide any of these players' futures based on the next six weeks, but having that data added to the mix can't exactly hurt.
 

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Is it possible to (a) wildly appreciate 2013, (b) be disappointed with 2014 and 2015, (c) somewhat enjoy watching the kids play out a lost season, (d) prefer we not be having a lost season, and (e) not think I'm "entitled" to a championship every year?

Because that's where I'm, at but from the posts here it's not possible to have nuanced thoughts like these. I should either be thrilled to watch any baseball or I'm a knuckle dragging Yankee fan.
 

InsideTheParker

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E5 Yaz said:
 
I agree with this, except for the word "likely." We can hope they do this. 
 
For me, the worst type of team to follow is the 75-81 win type of team -- not very good, not truly bad, just bleh. So this team is worth following, particularly is they can help knock the Yankees out of a playoff spot
The Sox have one more game against the Yankees than against the Blue Jays. That makes Koji's absence, which makes Red Sox losses much more likely, favor the Yankees.
 

Plympton91

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Super Nomario said:
How are six weeks of evaluations going to help make good, informed decisions? History is littered with guys who had a hot month-plus and then did nothing or had a terrible start and then went on to fine careers.
Bingo.

And the negativity comes from the fact that the major league pitching staff may be the worst one assembled in the post war era, the pitching staff at Pawtucket also sucks, and the pitching staff at Portland sucks, and the pitching staff at Salem sucks, and the pitching staff at Greenville sucks.

Where is this team going to find pitching in the next 3 years?

And it's not about being entitled. It's about having priorities. Sometimes I wish I were a retired old guy with an empty nest who could invest 3 hours a day in a bad baseball team. But it's not always what I'd want and it's definitely not the as age of life I'm at. Bad baseball is way down the list of things to do.
 

jscola85

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I disagree wholeheartedly that you cannot generate useful inferences from the last 50 games this year.  Things like K rate, BB rate, and HR rate for hitters all stabilize after less than 250 PAs and similar for pitchers. Giving guys like Owens and Wright extended looks, as well as folks like Shaw, JBJ, Swihart, etc. will at least let the org see if they can be contributors in some form for 2016.
 

The Gray Eagle

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50 games is plenty of time to scout and evaluate your players and get lots of useful information on how they might play next year. Stats don't even necessarily enter into it.
 
Of course, you need competent scouts and evaluators to be able to do that successfully. And that is the problem with this organization.