Kevin Durant Sweepstakes

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Durant will throw a huge temper tantrum to try to kill the deal even if they can agree on terms. I say go for it though. Both Jay's are walking when their deals are up anyway.
Why would Durant be upset? He'd still get paid, and he might well collect another ring in the process.
 

JCizzle

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I love the aggressive play here. Is Danny still running the team from Utah in his spare time?

As others have noted, the extra years for KD are a big sell for me. That said, Jaylen is probably my favorite player on the current team so this would be tough to see if it does happen from a sentiment perspective.
 

Eddie Jurak

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I love the aggressive play here. Is Danny still running the team from Utah in his spare time?

As others have noted, the extra years for KD are a big sell for me. That said, Jaylen is probably my favorite player on the current team so this would be tough to see if it does happen from a sentiment perspective.
Danny was timid in his later years. If there is aggressiveness here, it is all Brad.
 

wade boggs chicken dinner

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With this now public, the Celtics now have some pressure to close the deal. Jaylen seems like the kind of principled guy to leave money on the table to prove a point.
Even though the Cs have been great at keeping discussions in-house, Brad had to know that at some point, the discussions would be leaked - if only, as you note, to try to create leverage.

I have to believe they have already contacted both JT and JB about these discussions. From interviews of JT about the Olympics team, it seems that JT and KD got along pretty well (JT mentioned that KD has annointed JT as the next face of the US team) so it's probably not an issue with JT.

As for JB, hopefully the Cs have his pulse pretty well measured. It would suck to have next season derailed because of this.
 

Kliq

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A JB-for-Durant swap would make me dramatically less invested in the Celtics and imo, have a strong possibility of throwing this entire franchise off the rails.
 

Senator Donut

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*Superstar* NBA players don't want to live in Boston.
Show your work. The last three times Boston has had max cap space, they’ve been able to fill it easily (Walker, Hayward, Horford). This isn’t Indiana who has gaping cap space and nothing to spend it on.
 

Pablo's TB Lover

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*Superstar* NBA players don't want to live in Boston.
KD did spend 8 years in OKC which is not a "sexy" NBA city and pretty much only left due to the chemistry with Russ deteriorating and the stagnation of the franchise. I wouldn't lump him in with the same mindset as say LeBron, when it comes to choosing cities. He seems a little more concerned with the guys he's working with rather than the city as a whole.
 

Mooch

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A JB-for-Durant swap would make me dramatically less invested in the Celtics and imo, have a strong possibility of throwing this entire franchise off the rails.
Sorry to hear about the former but let’s have you make the case for the latter.
 

Van Everyman

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I wrestle with the emotions of this as a fan. On one hand, it obviously makes the team better on paper and on the court, assuming health. On the other, the team just came off a year where if they hadn’t had to spend 2.5 months playing the starters 40+ minutes a game to revamp and learn the system, I think they actually wipe the floor with everyone in the playoffs and get a ring. Am I certain of that? Of course not. But I don’t think anyone was beating the January-April/pre-TL injury of this team. Which is to say, I *think* this team has enough to put together title runs for several years and bring home multiple rings.

But I’m not sure of it. So even if I kind of find the idea of swapping a player I love as a fan in Jaylen—homegrown, exciting, conscientious—for a mercurial supertalent/Top 5-10 all time player a little distasteful, I’m not completely closing my mind to it. Because you just never know in the NBA.
 

radsoxfan

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Boston may not be KD’s preferred location but unless there are some unknown issues with him and Tatum/Ime (or Kyrie has brainwashed him), he could do a lot worse. KD doesn’t have a no-trade clause and 4 years left on his deal, so in theory he could end up in plenty of places he likes much less than Boston.

As others mentioned, my opinion about dealing Jaylen depends on what’s going on behind the scenes. If they think he is going to want out, for whatever reason, a trade makes some sense. If they think Jaylen is committed long term, I kind of just want them to run it back with Brogdon/Gallo add ons.
 

snowmanny

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I love Jaylen, and I hope he stays in Boston forever. But I was pleasantly surprised he didn't take off for Atlanta, and if he is likely to go this is a GFIN year and KD is an upgrade. I don't really trust Durant: he left GSW for no particular reason and he's leaving BKN for no particular reason (after getting a free full year's salary from them) but for 1-2 years the C's would be monster.

Amusing that after Smart getting mentioned left and right in trade talks he is* the sticking point on Durant. But it sort of makes sense: this would be such a GFIN move that doing it only makes sense if you have all the other exact pieces in place and Smart is one of those.

*possibly
 

moondog80

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I love Jaylen, and I hope he stays in Boston forever. But I was pleasantly surprised he didn't take off for Atlanta, and if he is likely to go this is a GFIN year and KD is an upgrade. I don't really trust Durant: he left GSW for no particular reason and he's leaving BKN for no particular reason (after getting a free full year's salary from them) but for 1-2 years the C's would be monster.
53596
 

Cellar-Door

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Sorry to hear about the former but let’s have you make the case for the latter.
Yeah there is this weird take going around that KD is some constant malcontent who derails teams.... he really isn't.

He was in OKC for 8 years, and was great, arguably held back late by Westbrook, then he decided he wanted a ring, went to GS and was great won 2 rings, probably would have won 3 in 3 years if he didn't get hurt. Then he was going to be out for a year, decided he wanted to come back on a new team with his friends... came back, dragged an injured team within inches of the finals. Then Kyrie blew up, and he decided he'd like another real run at a title.

KD is surly on twitter, but he's a guy who goes out and plays hard wherever he is, and this is the first time ever he's asked for a trade. This isn't Kyrie, or Harden.
 

Devizier

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If you’re looking for reasons why Durant wouldn’t want to come here, there are two extremely easy ones to reach for:

1) His friendship with Kyrie and
2) It furthers the front running narrative that has plagued his career
 

Kliq

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Boston may not be KD’s preferred location but unless there are some unknown issues with him and Tatum/Ime (or Kyrie has brainwashed him), he could do a lot worse. KD doesn’t have a no-trade clause and 4 years left on his deal, so in theory he could end up in plenty of places he likes much less than Boston.

As others mentioned, my opinion about dealing Jaylen depends on what’s going on behind the scenes. If they think he is going to want out, for whatever reason, a trade makes some sense. If they think Jaylen is committed long term, I kind of just want them to run it back with Brogdon/Gallo add ons.
Oh god, this is going to be like the Mookie discourse all over again, isn't it? People defending the trade by saying that Brown wanted out and there was no way to keep him in Boston, and people blasting the trade by saying that the Celtics made no real effort to extend him.

Durant is getting old, has a long injury history, and just laid an egg in the playoffs. Celtics would be chasing the last generation of superstars instead of focusing on the current generation of people who are actually going to win titles (well okay, Tatum is part of the latter). It's a massive gamble to intentionally shorten your championship window without any guarantee of actually increasing your championship odds--and doing it for a famously mercurial player like Durant.
 

BigSoxFan

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Boston may not be KD’s preferred location but unless there are some unknown issues with him and Tatum/Ime (or Kyrie has brainwashed him), he could do a lot worse. KD doesn’t have a no-trade clause and 4 years left on his deal, so in theory he could end up in plenty of places he likes much less than Boston.

As others mentioned, my opinion about dealing Jaylen depends on what’s going on behind the scenes. If they think he is going to want out, for whatever reason, a trade makes some sense. If they think Jaylen is committed long term, I kind of just want them to run it back with Brogdon/Gallo add ons.
I may be biased and irrational here but I don’t trust anyone who willingly associates themselves with Kanye. Jaylen is a smart dude but I could totally see Kanye Rich Paul’ing him. If this move happens, I think the Celtics’ brass might have similar concerns.
 

RG33

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And if they win a title - it’s worth it.

I’d rather have a title and 12 years of mediocrity then 13 years of contending without a ring.
Could you please start posting in the Chris Sale thread. Thanks.
 

DJnVa

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If you’re looking for reasons why Durant wouldn’t want to come here, there are two extremely easy ones to reach for:

1) His friendship with Kyrie and
Didn't he say he wanted out literally the day Kyrie said he was staying? They may be friends but it seems like KD may be over it.
 

DJnVa

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Oh god, this is going to be like the Mookie discourse all over again, isn't it? People defending the trade by saying that Brown wanted out and there was no way to keep him in Boston, and people blasting the trade by saying that the Celtics made no real effort to extend him.
Durant ain't Verdugo.
 

Senator Donut

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Not a single one of those players are superstars.
Are the geographical preference of stars significantly different from that of "superstars?" We've rarely seen superstars (however that is defined) reach free agency, but by all accounts Boston was competitive for Durant himself when he was on the open market.
 

radsoxfan

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Durant ain't Verdugo.
Haha yeah… We would be getting the best current player in the trade. And the most expensive long term commitment. Nothing like the Mookie scenario.

I am also partial to keeping Jaylen honestly, we just made the finals and currently have the highest win over/under for next year. No reason to make a trade for now over the future.

Just pointing out how I can understand the calculus changes if there is something under the surface with Jaylen’s long term desire to be in Boston.
 

Sam Ray Not

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I wouldn’t want the Warriors to trade Wiggins straight up for Durant, and Brown is younger and better than Wiggins, so I totally get where the “No on Brown for KD” sentiment is coming from.

And obviously, we’re not talking a straight up trade in either case.
 

BigSoxFan

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I wouldn’t want the Warriors to trade Wiggins straight up for Durant, and Brown is younger and better than Wiggins, so I totally get where the “No on Brown for KD” sentiment is coming from.

And obviously, we’re not talking a straight up trade in either case.
Easier said after having watched your team win its 4th title in like 7 years. Durant is a luxury item for the Warriors. He may be needed for other teams like the Celtics, Heat, etc. to get past the Warriors.
 

Kliq

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If the trade offer isn't true; the Celtics probably need to come out with a public statement that it isn't true and they aren't looking to trade Jaylen Brown. If there is concern about resigning Brown in the future, him knowing that they've been dangling him out as trade bait a few months after they were two wins from a title is not going to help matters.
 

Jakarta

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I wonder if the Cs think they are selling high on Jaylen. He’s had a weird off-season - signing with Kanye, hanging out with Kyrie, liking the Wiggins tweet about regretting getting vaxxed. All individually explainable but when put together perhaps signs that it’s time to move on. The FO would obviously have lots of other info that would guide their decision better than this. Maybe Jaylen even wants to play with Kyrie now.
 

Pablo's TB Lover

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If you’re looking for reasons why Durant wouldn’t want to come here, there are two extremely easy ones to reach for:

1) His friendship with Kyrie and
2) It furthers the front running narrative that has plagued his career
I would temper point #2 by saying that the Celtics have not won a title yet whereas the Warriors won the championship and lost in the Finals the 2 years prior to KD arriving. And the C's were not perceived as a slam dunk to make the Finals besides Five Thirty Eight or whomever had those crazy high odds. Without the Middleton injury, a majority of reporters close to the league would have picked the Bucks to advance to the Finals (and win the title).

The only real KD "front running" claim that could be made was for the Warriors. Even in Brooklyn, he was jumping to a franchise with Kyrie that was not remotely close to a title. KD is going to make ANY team a front-runner by joining them.

Besides the above, although he requested it KD is being traded as opposed to a free agent this time around. He has a lot of control, but not 100% control of where he gets sent. By default, only teams that have some shot at the title are going to be pursuing KD.
 

EvilEmpire

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If Durant doesn't want Boston, and this is the best that Brooklyn can do right now, leaking this deal might convince him to reconcile and stick around for another season without drama.
 

Cellar-Door

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Oh god, this is going to be like the Mookie discourse all over again, isn't it? People defending the trade by saying that Brown wanted out and there was no way to keep him in Boston, and people blasting the trade by saying that the Celtics made no real effort to extend him.

Durant is getting old, has a long injury history, and just laid an egg in the playoffs. Celtics would be chasing the last generation of superstars instead of focusing on the current generation of people who are actually going to win titles (well okay, Tatum is part of the latter). It's a massive gamble to intentionally shorten your championship window without any guarantee of actually increasing your championship odds--and doing it for a famously mercurial player like Durant.
Maybe, but less likely, because the NBA contract situation is so different. Jaylen Brown is going to be an UFA in 2 years, there is no situation in which it makes any sense for him not to be, he's not taking a paycut.
 

Kliq

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Maybe, but less likely, because the NBA contract situation is so different. Jaylen Brown is going to be an UFA in 2 years, there is no situation in which it makes any sense for him not to be, he's not taking a paycut.
I'm talking about the back-and-forth we've had since the Mookie trade and the debate about whether or not we could resign him or not and how that impacts how people have viewed the trade; with people speaking definitively about it one way or the other depending on their perspective on the trade. If you liked the Mookie trade, you argue that Mookie wasn't going to re-sign with Boston and if you didn't like the trade, you complain about how the Sox didn't make a real offer.

The actual mechanisms of the trade are of course, going to be very different than the actual Mookie trade.
 

Cellar-Door

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I'm talking about the back-and-forth we've had since the Mookie trade and the debate about whether or not we could resign him or not and how that impacts how people have viewed the trade; with people speaking definitively about it one way or the other depending on their perspective on the trade. If you liked the Mookie trade, you argue that Mookie wasn't going to re-sign with Boston and if you didn't like the trade, you complain about how the Sox didn't make a real offer.

The actual mechanisms of the trade are of course, going to be very different than the actual Mookie trade.
Oh I get it, just saying that the mechanics of the NBA are different. In baseball you have a lot of ways to sign a guy early, and you can ALWAYS offer the most money. In the NBA it's less clear. You can't always extend at a good price, and while you hypothetically can offer the most to re-sign a guy, the structures of things mean it's often immaterial given opt-outs, where guys can make more if they're willing to bet on themselves every few years (also off-court stuff can be more lucrative than on-court, and taxes matter more given the max ceiling). So with MLB there is less risk with years left on a guy's deal than the NBA, where you know you're going to have to go to UFA and hope, and that you don't really have the ability to overbid.
 

Jimbodandy

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I'm talking about the back-and-forth we've had since the Mookie trade and the debate about whether or not we could resign him or not and how that impacts how people have viewed the trade; with people speaking definitively about it one way or the other depending on their perspective on the trade. If you liked the Mookie trade, you argue that Mookie wasn't going to re-sign with Boston and if you didn't like the trade, you complain about how the Sox didn't make a real offer.

The actual mechanisms of the trade are of course, going to be very different than the actual Mookie trade.
It really has absolutely zero to do with the Mookie situation except in how people would overreact and make awful takes.
 

boca

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Aren't the contracts more important than the ages when you're talking about championship windows?

4 years of KD versus 2 of Jaylen.
 

dhellers

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Maybe, but less likely, because the NBA contract situation is so different. Jaylen Brown is going to be an UFA in 2 years, there is no situation in which it makes any sense for him not to be, he's not taking a paycut.
And what are the chances that Durant wants out after a year? Or two? For top tier players, length of contract means very little in the modern NBA.
In other words --for top tier players a two year window might be the efficient time horizon to use when planning.

OTOH I do agree with Kliq -- KD is an aging machine who has had serious injuries. 3 years from now he is likely to be an financial obstacle (ala Wall, Westbrook, etc). Alas, that is a scenario where a >2 year window is likely.
 

Sam Ray Not

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Easier said after having watched your team win its 4th title in like 7 years. Durant is a luxury item for the Warriors. He may be needed for other teams like the Celtics, Heat, etc. to get past the Warriors.
I get that part, though I don’t think the Cs with additions of Brogdon and Gallo, and the young core one more year experienced and battle-tested. are any worse of a bet going forward than the Warriors with their aging core. They could easily be a better bet, depending how Steph ages at 34.

Durant v Brown and Durant v Wiggins are similar in that you’re upgrading massively on offense while downgrading youth, durability, and defensive versatility (since I don’t think KD at 34 can chase young fast guards and wings around the perimeter the way Wiggs and JB can). Then you throw in all the intangible/sentimental stuff. and all the other assets you have to kick in … I dunno, just doesn’t seem worth it to me.
 

Kliq

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It really has absolutely zero to do with the Mookie situation except in how people would overreact and make awful takes.
Alright guys, I regret bringing Mookie up, which was a joke I was making about the insanity of potential discourse.
 

Mooch

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And what are the chances that Durant wants out after a year? Or two? For top tier players, length of contract means very little in the modern NBA.
In other words --for top tier players a two year window might be the efficient time horizon to use when planning.

OTOH I do agree with Kliq -- KD is an aging machine who has had serious injuries. 3 years from now he is likely to be an financial obstacle (ala Wall, Westbrook, etc). Alas, that is a scenario where a >2 year window is likely.
Three years from now, that expiring contract is a major asset.
 

ZMart100

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If the trade offer isn't true; the Celtics probably need to come out with a public statement that it isn't true and they aren't looking to trade Jaylen Brown. If there is concern about resigning Brown in the future, him knowing that they've been dangling him out as trade bait a few months after they were two wins from a title is not going to help matters.
I think there's a good chance that being offered for one of the all time greats is not taken as an insult by Brown.
 

Light-Tower-Power

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I would personally drive Jaylen Brown to Brooklyn if it nets us KD, especially if Brad can keep Smart. I am salivating over the possibility of a Brogdon, Smart, Tatum, KD, Williams starting five. They would be instant title favorites, and likely by a large margin.
 

bsan34

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And what are the chances that Durant wants out after a year? Or two? For top tier players, length of contract means very little in the modern NBA.
In other words --for top tier players a two year window might be the efficient time horizon to use when planning.

OTOH I do agree with Kliq -- KD is an aging machine who has had serious injuries. 3 years from now he is likely to be an financial obstacle (ala Wall, Westbrook, etc). Alas, that is a scenario where a >2 year window is likely.
I mean, if KD is healthy and wants out in a year, then you contact OKC, NOLA, and Memphis for their respective treasure troves.
 

Jimbodandy

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Alright guys, I regret bringing Mookie up, which was a joke I was making about the insanity of potential discourse.
Fwiw my post was acknowledgment that you're on target about what will be said if this happens. Preemptive complaining about a possible future state, which my wife already says that I do way too often.