Josh Gordon Suspended Indefinitely for Substance Violation (Again)

Harry Hooper

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Just a pre-emptive observation: this may be a case of not making himself available for testing.

Edit: Sounds like Schefter has some details..
 
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Koufax

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Yes, he seems like a genuinely good guy. It's a shame.
 

Jed Zeppelin

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An all-time What-If player; over 2400 yards in his first two seasons as a 21/22 year old catching passes primarily from Brandon Weeden and Jason Campbell.
 

Gash Prex

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It may be cold but I believe the calculation was that his off field risk no longer outweighed his on field production.
 

CoffeeNerdness

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If Sunday was his last game he finished his career making an amazing, diving 50 yard grab and throwing a pick.

Surprised to see PEDs rolled into the suspension. He did seem to bounce back awfully quickly from having his leg turned into a pretzel though. Is Adderall a PED in NFL land?
 

axx

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I knew it! It was a bad idea for Seattle to pick him up.

Is Weed considered a PED?
 

BigSoxFan

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An all-time What-If player; over 2400 yards in his first two seasons as a 21/22 year old catching passes primarily from Brandon Weeden and Jason Campbell.
Substances probably stole a HOF career. He was that talented. His ridiculous 2013 season of 1,646 yards was done in 14 games. Was on pace for like 100/1900/11. Hope he gets the help he needs.
 

McBride11

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Poor kid. Hope he is able to get some help

Now if this is all because he was popping a few edibles then really shame on the NFL.
Beat your kids, cool, smoke so weed? Hell no.
 

lexrageorge

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Until we know more details, we should probably lay off the weed jokes.

But, I do have to ask, as an aside: WTF was Carroll thinking about having him throw a pass? From what I can tell, he's never thrown one either professionally or in college ball.
 

mauidano

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Sad news. Still hoping he gets the help he obviously needs.
Unfortunately he is going to have to start to handle this on his own. His NFL career is likely over now. I hope he has good family, it’s going to be very dark days ahead for him. I wish him the best but not confident.
 

BusRaker

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Ugh was really rooting for him in any uniform. Busted for the cheating and fun stuff at the same time as well. I'm bummed
 

Mugsy's Jock

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But, I do have to ask, as an aside: WTF was Carroll thinking about having him throw a pass? From what I can tell, he's never thrown one either professionally or in college ball.
Well, I'd assume they tried it out in practice a few times and it looked pretty good.
 

Van Everyman

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A few thoughts:

1. This sure puts the “He ran 22MPH on a treadmill recovering from injury” thing into perspective, doesn’t it?

2. Is former PED enthusiast Tim Montgomery (who Gordon trained with during last season’s suspension) implicated in any of this? There have been whispers that Montgomery is still involved with PEDs in recent years as he’s become a well regarded trainer.
 
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reggiecleveland

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An all-time What-If player; over 2400 yards in his first two seasons as a 21/22 year old catching passes primarily from Brandon Weeden and Jason Campbell.
If a freak injury comes up, maybe you say , "what if?" What if Orr, Namath had been rested instead of playing hurt as youngsters. But Josh Gordon? How many chances does he need for us to see this is what was always going to happen. Short of lovking him up and letting him out to play, this is who he is.
 
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I maintain that catching 87 passes for 1646 yards and 9 touchdowns, while being thrown to by Brandon weeden and Jason campbell, while being drunk and high, is the most impressive athletic achievement in the history of humanity.
 

reggiecleveland

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I maintain that catching 87 passes for 1646 yards and 9 touchdowns, while being thrown to by Brandon weeden and Jason campbell, while being drunk and high, is the most impressive athletic achievement in the history of humanity.
It's the reverse Gretzky! or Reverse Blair Macdonald.
Macdonald scored 46 goals on Gretzky's line then after being traded was out of the NHL within a year.
 

DJnVa

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Patriots cut him for reasons not related to substance abuse anyway.

Kind of a cold take...
I'm not sure that's something we can really state definitively.


It sucks though. There's gonna be a 30 for 30 on him in like 20 years and I have no idea if the final ending will be happy or sad.
 

GeorgeCostanza

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Gordon is auctioning his Pats SB ring. I hope it’s because it holds no sentimental value to him and not because he’s hard up. Bums me out either way. Still rooting for him to succeed in life.

 

Kenny F'ing Powers

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Jesus. My heart sunk when I saw this post bumped. I got a bit of relief while the page was loading thinking maybe someone just added a note in here for his reinstatement.

Nope.

This sucks.
 

bsj

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I'm saying he is one of the players who through his own mistakes has wasted the most God given talent, or at least is on the short list, of players who have played in the league
 

Kenny F'ing Powers

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I'm saying he is one of the players who through his own mistakes has wasted the most God given talent, or at least is on the short list, of players who have played in the league
I think the wording - primarily the use of the word "wasted" - was the point.

And I thought it was kind of funny.
 

mauf

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I'm saying he is one of the players who through his own mistakes has wasted the most God given talent, or at least is on the short list, of players who have played in the league
Addiction is an illness. There’s a volitional component, sure, but Josh Gordon is tormented by demons that you and I will never understand. I don’t think it’s accurate to describe the root of his current pitiable state as merely a series of “mistakes.”
 

kelpapa

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I'm saying he is one of the players who through his own mistakes has wasted the most God given talent, or at least is on the short list, of players who have played in the league
Yea, that was my point.
 

johnmd20

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Addiction is an illness. There’s a volitional component, sure, but Josh Gordon is tormented by demons that you and I will never understand. I don’t think it’s accurate to describe the root of his current pitiable state as merely a series of “mistakes.”
They are nothing less than mistakes. He's been given the solution. He's had loads of help. Many people threw themselves in front of him to help him and it didn't matter. That is nothing less a willingness to not change and to not consider an alternative way of living.

Now don't get me wrong, I am not calling it a moral failing by Gordon and I have gobs of sympathy for him. He's going to have huge challenges ahead of him and his regrets might be monumental. This is a disease and I feel for the guy and what he's fighting. But continually relapsing is a mistake. It's a slip. Whatever you want to call it but he does have some culpability. Nobody held him up and forced him to drink or take drugs.

This story just sucks.
 

BroodsSexton

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They are nothing less than mistakes. He's been given the solution. He's had loads of help. Many people threw themselves in front of him to help him and it didn't matter. That is nothing less a willingness to not change and to not consider an alternative way of living.

Now don't get me wrong, I am not calling it a moral failing by Gordon and I have gobs of sympathy for him. He's going to have huge challenges ahead of him and his regrets might be monumental. This is a disease and I feel for the guy and what he's fighting. But continually relapsing is a mistake. It's a slip. Whatever you want to call it but he does have some culpability. Nobody held him up and forced him to drink or take drugs.

This story just sucks.
Totally. I mean, just think of all those people who make mistakes with multiple heart attacks.

“Nobody held him up and forced him to drink or take drugs.”

Literally true. But maybe ignores the reality of addiction and illness? Admittedly, there’s some cognitive dissonance between the concepts of free will and addiction, but we can acknowledge that the latter exists without denying the former, and call the consequences of addiction the same thing that we call the consequences of any other illness—symptoms. People suffering from addiction use drugs. It’s not a mistake, it’s a tautology.

Put another way, the term “mistake” semantically transforms the issue into a moral issue, whether you like it or not, when it appears this guys is dealing with a clinical, physiological problem. At least that’s my armchair philosophizing and medicalizing. How we talk about things affects how we understand them. I don’t know how one can use the word “culpability” without implying a moral judgment.

But we’ve all had this discussion before, so <shrug>. All the help in the world and some people can’t recover.
 
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johnmd20

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Totally. I mean, just think of all those people who make mistakes with multiple heart attacks.

“Nobody held him up and forced him to drink or take drugs.”

Literally true. But maybe ignores the reality of addiction and illness? Admittedly, there’s some cognitive dissonance between the concepts of free will and addiction, but we can acknowledge that the latter exists without denying the former, and call the consequences of addiction the same thing that we call the consequences of any other illness—symptoms. People suffering from addiction use drugs. It’s not a mistake, it’s a tautology.

Put another way, the term “mistake” semantically transforms the issue into a moral issue, whether you like it or not, when it appears this guys is dealing with a clinical, physiological problem. I mean, at least that’s my armchair philosophizing and medicalizing.

But we’ve all had this discussion before, so <shrug>. All the help in the world and some people can’t recover.
I'm 16 years sober. I know and understand the struggle. It's an inside job. Addiction is a mental illness. But to use your woeful heart attack example, it would be like having 6 heart attacks and the doctor being like, "you have to stop eating Big Macs and smoking," and the person continually eating big macs and smoking two packs a day. Or it would be like a diabetic not taking insulin.

Diabetes is a disease. There is a cure. There is a cure for addiction, too. Some people don't want to take the medicine.

edit - you clearly chose to not read my post and just responded quickly and emotionally. Good job.
 

Van Everyman

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Not so fast on Gordon’s recent reinstatement


such a shame
Honestly my first reaction to this news was, “Well, he’ll just get reinstated again next year and then we’ll go through all this again.” It is def. sad but as bad as the NFL’s handling of his suspensions was initially the league doesn’t seem to be doing Gordon any favors with three constant reinstatements either.

Have we ever really gotten to the bottom of why the Pats cut ties with him last year? It wasn’t like it was his first slip up and Brady seemed to love him personally.

Was it Easterby no longer being around to take care of him? Was it the PEDs also being part of the suspension? Or were they just not willing to have a guy on the roster who repeatedly screw up?
 

BroodsSexton

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I'm 16 years sober. I know and understand the struggle. It's an inside job. Addiction is a mental illness. But to use your woeful heart attack example, it would be like having 6 heart attacks and the doctor being like, "you have to stop eating Big Macs and smoking," and the person continually eating big macs and smoking two packs a day. Or it would be like a diabetic not taking insulin.

Diabetes is a disease. There is a cure. There is a cure for addiction, too. Some people don't want to take the medicine.

edit - you clearly chose to not read my post and just responded quickly and emotionally. Good job.
I read your post several times. I’m not going to argue with your personal experience getting sober. I admire it. I’m also not comfortable passing moral judgments on people who are less successful, for whatever reason, in fighting addiction. Sometimes you stop eating Big Macs and you still succumb to heart disease (yes it’s a very imperfect analogy, which was more rhetorical in nature than anything). I dont know Josh Gordon, and surely haven’t treated him. But his inability to succeed despite the availability of extensive support and resources only makes me more sympathetic, in a sense, to his struggles. It doesn’t tend to make me more judgmental. But that’s my take—doesn’t have to be yours, I guess.
 

johnmd20

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I read your post several times. I’m not going to argue with your personal experience getting sober. I admire it. I’m also not comfortable passing moral judgments on people who are less successful, for whatever reason, in fighting addiction. Sometimes you stop eating Big Macs and you still succumb to heart disease (yes it’s a very imperfect analogy, which was more rhetorical in nature than anything). I dont know Josh Gordon, and surely haven’t treated him. But his inability to succeed despite the availability of extensive support and resources only makes me more sympathetic, in a sense, to his struggles. It doesn’t tend to make me more judgmental. But that’s my take—doesn’t have to be yours, I guess.
I said it isn't a moral failing. I am not making a moralistic judgement. I'm pretty sure Josh doesn't want to have to deal with these consequences. And I said I have a tremendous amount of sympathy for him, because I've actually witnessed scores of people die from this disease. It's brutal and it sucks. But I've also watched every person who died not being willing to change and just wanted to do it their way. I have also seen hundreds(thousands maybe?) of people recover from this disease. There IS a solution. It would be obnoxious to not acknowledge there is a solution, while also having sympathy for the people who choose not to take that path.

Josh didn't take that path. He took his own and did it his own way. (again, nobody held him up in a dark alley at gunpoint and forced the substances into his body and there is a responsibility to acknowledge that, or else it's just like, "Oh well, what can you do, it's a disease after all.") And it will ultimately result in the ruination of his life and it could also take his life. I have nothing but sympathy, I wish he did take the path.
 

Oppo

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Ready for him to give up public life and never be heard from again, getting and staying clean
 

Dahabenzapple2

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I'm 16 years sober. I know and understand the struggle. It's an inside job. Addiction is a mental illness. But to use your woeful heart attack example, it would be like having 6 heart attacks and the doctor being like, "you have to stop eating Big Macs and smoking," and the person continually eating big macs and smoking two packs a day. Or it would be like a diabetic not taking insulin.

Diabetes is a disease. There is a cure. There is a cure for addiction, too. Some people don't want to take the medicine.

edit - you clearly chose to not read my post and just responded quickly and emotionally. Good job.
I’m 16 years clean. Without total surrender to the fellowship I ended up in on or about November 10th or 15th, 2004 I would have never stopped using. I only ended up there because I was arrested and lost absolutely everything that mattered to me.

If I separate from that program I will use again even though I KNOW it will destroy me. Even though I’ve had relative incredible success eventually over the years.

I have dear friends who are using right now destroying their lives even though they KNEW it would destroy their lives. All because for whatever reason they separated themselves from the principles of the program. And of course like John I’ve seen many good people die from the horrors of active addiction.

Why do some addicts keep using? Without surrender NOTHING is possible, with surrender ANYTHING is possible.

Sounds like rhetoric? Simple truths for addicts. Addiction is maybe the only disease that is self-diagnosed and I had to do it. I needed members with long terms of complete abstinence to show me the way. Then I had to be willing to do whatever it takes.

90 meetings in 90 days. Sponser. Service. All of it.

Maybe there are other ways - I don’t know. It’s the hardest thing I ever had to do in my life and I did it at 44 years old totally broken physically, mentally and completely without hope 7 date before the Sox won the 2004 series. Then I found guys like Jimmy the Tooth, Friendly Phil, Phil N, Scoop, John D, Coby, Wonder Bread Mike, Kenny Spike - and all the rest of these serious recovering addicts. Then I was willing to follow them proverbially to the end of the earth.

I find it doubtful like many others that Josh has ever surrendered to anything like what I did. Not sure my way is his but it won’t work if it is HIS way. Addicts alone are in bad fucking company.

Yet I take limited credit as I had no intention of getting or staying clean. Maybe he needs to forget about Football. Probably getting in the way. Recovery is about getting clean, very rarely initially about getting the job or career back. First I had to get ME back and understand that NOTHING mattered except my clean date. Those addicts taught me that.

Taught me that a thousand plus bus rides on the 758 bus to Bergen pines 6 days a week - often twice a day - for 2 years was what mattered.

Prayers for Josh Gordon and my lost friends
 
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I’m 16 years clean. Without total surrender to the fellowship I ended up in on or about November 10th or 15th, 2004 I would have never stopped using. I only ended up there because I was arrested and lost absolutely everything that mattered to me.

If I separate from that program I will use again even though I KNOW it will destroy me. Even though I’ve had relative incredible success eventually over the years.

I have dear friends who are using right now destroying their lives even though they KNEW it would destroy their lives. All because for whatever reason they separated themselves from the principles of the program. And of course like John I’ve seen many good people die from the horrors of active addiction.

Why do some addicts keep using? Without surrender NOTHING is possible, with surrender ANYTHING is possible.

Sounds like rhetoric? Simple truths for addicts. Addiction is maybe the only disease that is self-diagnosed and I had to do it. I needed members with long terms of complete abstinence to show me the way. Then I had to be willing to do whatever it takes.

90 meetings in 90 days. Sponser. Service. All of it.

Maybe there are other ways - I don’t know. It’s the hardest thing I ever had to do in my life and I did it at 44 years old totally broken physically, mentally and completely without hope 7 date before the Sox won the 2004 series. Then I found guys like Jimmy the Tooth, Friendly Phil, Phil N, Scoop, John D, Coby, Wonder Bread Mike, Kenny Spike - and all the rest of these serious recovering addicts. Then I was willing to follow them proverbially to the end of the earth.

I find it doubtful like many others that Josh has ever surrendered to anything like what I did. Not sure my way is his but it won’t work if it is HIS way. Addicts alone are in bad fucking company.

Yet I take limited credit as I had no intention of getting or staying clean. Maybe he needs to forget about Football. Probably getting in the way. Recovery is about getting clean, very rarely initially about getting the job or career back. First I had to get ME back and understand that NOTHING mattered except my clean date. Those addicts taught me that.

Taught me that a thousand plus bus rides on the 758 bus to Bergen pines 6 days a week - often twice a day - for 2 years was what mattered.

Prayers for Josh Gordon and my lost friends
Thanks for sharing. Glad you’re sober. Good luck today, tomorrow and the ones after that. One day at a time. Happy holidays. Go, Sawx.
 

Zedia

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I want nothing but total recovery and peace for the guy, but I’m wondering how keeping him from playing football is helping in any way. Even if it’s a “tough love” kind of thing, I don’t see how that’s the domain of an employer, especially if it’s legal substances.