Jayson Tatum Needs His Own Thread

RorschachsMask

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Tatums assist percentage is now up 40% over last year, while his turnover percentage is a career low. He still gets tunnel vision too much, but you can see his confidence as a playmaker growing.

Dude is becoming an incredibly balanced player.
 
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benhogan

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It shouldn't matter, but I don't want Tatum to make the All-Star team, without Jaylen Brown.

Tatum's ceiling, when he puts on 15 more lbs of muscle, will be a top 10 NBA player. JT's defensive positioning and instincts are very underrated.

 

luckiestman

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It shouldn't matter, but I don't want Tatum to make the All-Star team, without Jaylen Brown.

Tatum's ceiling, when he puts on 15 more lbs of muscle, will be a top 10 NBA player. JT's defensive positioning and instincts are very underrated.

What is the All Star team in the East? I don’t watch enough non Celtic ball to really know.

I know Giannis, Embiid, Butler, and Siakam are good.

Kemba should make it.

Why not both Jays?
 

camneely

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What is the All Star team in the East? I don’t watch enough non Celtic ball to really know.

I know Giannis, Embiid, Butler, and Siakam are good.

Kemba should make it.

Why not both Jays?
JT and JB are both worthy of a selection, in my opinion. If GH picks up where he left off, he should probably get one as well.

As for the rest of the East, Trae Young and Bradley Beal are both sure things. If Kyrie comes back, I think he'll probably make it (if only based on reputation). But honestly, I'd put Charlotte's Devonte Graham above Kyrie at this point, given the discrepancy in games played. Maybe VanVleet too.
 

benhogan

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What is the All Star team in the East? I don’t watch enough non Celtic ball to really know.

I know Giannis, Embiid, Butler, and Siakam are good.

Kemba should make it.

Why not both Jays?
You can probably just go to the scoring leaders and use that as an initial guide.

Giannis, Trae, Beal, Siakam, Embiid, Zach Levine, Kemba, Butler, Brown, Tatum

Maybe some double/double bigs: Drummond, Sabonis

big reputations: Ben Simmons, Middleton, Kyrie, Kevin Love, Blake Griffin, Lowry

under the radar: Brogdon, VanVleet, Graham, Fournier, Hayward



 
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benhogan

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Given where Tatum is right now, how would you handle extension talks this summer, as the Celtics?
Start at Brown's number and expect to go higher.

Wouldn't be shocked if he wouldn't settle for anything less than max. And you pay it
 

chilidawg

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What is the All Star team in the East? I don’t watch enough non Celtic ball to really know.

I know Giannis, Embiid, Butler, and Siakam are good.

Kemba should make it.

Why not both Jays?
Who I think deserve it:

Giannis
Embiid
Butler
Young
Siakem

Tatum
Drummond
Walker
Beal
Isaac

Sabonis
Brogdon
Simmons
Brown
Middleton

I'd leave Irving, Lowry and Hayward off because they've missed so much time. Irving just for spite as well.
 

lovegtm

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Start at Brown's number and expect to go higher.

Wouldn't be shocked if he wouldn't settle for anything less than max. And you pay it
The question is more whether you can get him to give up anything. Everyone knows he’s getting maxed, so you probably go for 5 years without a player option. How do incentives work on the full 5-year extensions? I seem to recall Simmons had some of his as incentives.
 

Jimbodandy

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The question is more whether you can get him to give up anything. Everyone knows he’s getting maxed, so you probably go for 5 years without a player option. How do incentives work on the full 5-year extensions? I seem to recall Simmons had some of his as incentives.
Yes. Maybe you can sell him on building a bit better around him with a couple more bucks to spend, but it's at or near the max and it's still a bargain.
 

benhogan

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The question is more whether you can get him to give up anything. Everyone knows he’s getting maxed, so you probably go for 5 years without a player option. How do incentives work on the full 5-year extensions? I seem to recall Simmons had some of his as incentives.

Simmons' contract features a 15 percent trade kicker and no options. Simmons would also get further compensation if he earns an All-NBA selection in 2019-20 thanks to "designated rookie extension language" in the deal
 

nighthob

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I don’t think you can go five years on a rookie extension without maxing. The only concession I’d want if I were Boston would be no player option so that I have him locked up for six years total.
 
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Eddie Jurak

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Start at Brown's number and expect to go higher.

Wouldn't be shocked if he wouldn't settle for anything less than max. And you pay it
Yes. He's either getting the max in an extension next year or he is hitting RFA and then getting the max.
 

scottyno

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Not sure how much stock people put in RPM numbers, but this seasons were released for the first time today. Tatum 4th in the entire nba and 2nd in defense. Not really a surprise since we know he's killing it in plus minus and on off, and advanced stats love his defense.


edit: Noticed this is being discussed in the general Cs thread already
 

Pablo's TB Lover

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I was thinking anecdotally last night, after his 3 turnovers in quick succession, I'm not seeing the "leap" we expected this year. But looking at the *somewhat flawed this early* PER stat, he is only a point behind JB who has a year more of experience and has apparently taken quite a leap himself early this year. And with the RPM and plus/minus numbers mentioned above, I think it is a matter of my lyin' eyes. It may be that Tatum is the only guy Brad trusts to put out on an island with a cast of reserve-level players, and he just tries too hard in those situations.
 

bellowthecat

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Tatum had a meh game last night mostly because he didn't look fully engaged. He was clearly taking possessions off on both sides and just not playing with enough energy. Looking ahead to the Sixers game tonight maybe? He'd been on an absolute tear before last night though. Looks to be improving in a lot of ways so far this seasom despite being challenged with new responsibilities.
 

lovegtm

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I was thinking anecdotally last night, after his 3 turnovers in quick succession, I'm not seeing the "leap" we expected this year. But looking at the *somewhat flawed this early* PER stat, he is only a point behind JB who has a year more of experience and has apparently taken quite a leap himself early this year. And with the RPM and plus/minus numbers mentioned above, I think it is a matter of my lyin' eyes. It may be that Tatum is the only guy Brad trusts to put out on an island with a cast of reserve-level players, and he just tries too hard in those situations.
He's making a pretty big leap defensively imo, and is generally able to be an anchor of those Tatum+flotsam units just by not turning it over. As bellowthecat noted, he wasn't engaged last night for whatever reason. I cut a fair amount of slack for that in the regular season: 82 games is a lot and life happens.
 

shoelace

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I was thinking anecdotally last night, after his 3 turnovers in quick succession, I'm not seeing the "leap" we expected this year. But looking at the *somewhat flawed this early* PER stat, he is only a point behind JB who has a year more of experience and has apparently taken quite a leap himself early this year. And with the RPM and plus/minus numbers mentioned above, I think it is a matter of my lyin' eyes. It may be that Tatum is the only guy Brad trusts to put out on an island with a cast of reserve-level players, and he just tries too hard in those situations.
He did just come off a 5 game stretch where he was putting up essentially 24/8/3.4 with 2 steals and 1.4 blocks a game while shooting 42% from three. If we look at the raw numbers, he looks like a less efficient scorer than he was as a rookie, but he's being guarded differently, his usage is up and he's generally being asked to do more. I don't think we should look past the leap it takes to go from being a tertiary option playing 30ish minutes a game and scoring 15 points to playing 35 minutes a game and scoring 20 as a primary option. There will be duds, but it's just part of his development. I don't care if he goes 2 for 11 shooting off the dribble threes every couple of games, I want him to keep doing that shit because I believe the efficiency will come with experience.
 

Pablo's TB Lover

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ry, but -love this-Red Auerbach of th
He did just come off a 5 game stretch where he was putting up essentially 24/8/3.4 with 2 steals and 1.4 blocks a game while shooting 42% from three. If we look at the raw numbers, he looks like a less efficient scorer than he was as a rookie, but he's being guarded differently, his usage is up and he's generally being asked to do more. I don't think we should look past the leap it takes to go from being a tertiary option playing 30ish minutes a game and scoring 15 points to playing 35 minutes a game and scoring 20 as a primary option. There will be duds, but it's just part of his development. I don't care if he goes 2 for 11 shooting off the dribble threes every couple of games, I want him to keep doing that shit because I believe the efficiency will come with experience.
Agree: I don't like that his overall FG% is down to 41.1 reflecting a downturn in 2-point shooting, but am in favor with the 6.8 3-Pt Attempts per game (3.0 in rookie year, 3.9 last year). He's shooting a low percentage from distance, but due to his accurate history I feel like the accuracy will continue to rise as he gets accustomed to non-spot up threes like he was primarily shooting a few years ago.
 

lovegtm

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This is a bit of a personal rant, and no one here is doing this, but looking just at raw efficiency/TS (can we call this Duncan/LeRoux'ing?) just isn't that useful in analyzing a player's impact on winning. I would much, much rather have current Tatum than rookie Tatum.
 

Eddie Jurak

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I was thinking anecdotally last night, after his 3 turnovers in quick succession, I'm not seeing the "leap" we expected this year. But looking at the *somewhat flawed this early* PER stat, he is only a point behind JB who has a year more of experience and has apparently taken quite a leap himself early this year. And with the RPM and plus/minus numbers mentioned above, I think it is a matter of my lyin' eyes. It may be that Tatum is the only guy Brad trusts to put out on an island with a cast of reserve-level players, and he just tries too hard in those situations.
What you aren't taking into account here is his increased usage. For all but the most elite offensive players, the Harden/Lebron/Giannis types, there's a tradoff between efficiency and usage. The more a plyer is asked to create his own offense instead of being a beneficiary of others, the more his efficiency will slide. That's part of the story with Tatum. Brown's usage has increase gradually as he's been in the league longer, while Tatum's has risen more dramatically, especially this year - his usage is nearly as high as Walker's.
 

lovegtm

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What you aren't taking into account here is his increased usage. For all but the most elite offensive players, the Harden/Lebron/Giannis types, there's a tradoff between efficiency and usage. The more a plyer is asked to create his own offense instead of being a beneficiary of others, the more his efficiency will slide. That's part of the story with Tatum. Brown's usage has increase gradually as he's been in the league longer, while Tatum's has risen more dramatically, especially this year - his usage is nearly as high as Walker's.
Yup. An even more granular way to think about it is that the constraints on usage increase are mostly dependent on skillset. For LeBron/Harden/Giannis, the constraint on them increasing usage is that they'd get tired. Aside from scheme considerations (trapping Harden, successfully playing Giannis as a non-shooter), they can just keep increasing usage without real negative effects. Incidentally, the "getting tired" constraint is a very real one, as we've seen multiple times with Harden in the playoffs.

For someone like Tatum, the constraint to him increasing usage is that he needs the ball in advantage situations to generate profitable possessions. There are only so many of those per game, and teams can do things to take them away from you. What he's trying to do right now is improve his ability to generate his own advantage situations.

Usually players go through that part of their learning on bad teams, just because of the way the lottery works. Not many people watch those games, so we incorrectly have an impression of stars as fully formed. Tatum is in a weird place where he has to go through that process on a contender. More casual fans aren't used to watching that phase of player development (they're not masochists who watch bad teams), and so it feels "bad" to them.
 

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Tatum's efficiency around the rim has gone through a somewhat bizarre dip, which is not where I would expect increased defensive attention to manifest.
 

lovegtm

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Tatum's efficiency around the rim has gone through a somewhat bizarre dip, which is not where I would expect increased defensive attention to manifest.
Yeah, I think there are two main possible explanations here, with the first being more likely:
1. It's just one of those things, and will improve with regression and also maybe some skill improvement.
2. The types of attempts he's generating at the rim now are qualitatively different from the types he got when he was mainly attacking closeouts his rookie season.
 

Pablo's TB Lover

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What you aren't taking into account here is his increased usage. For all but the most elite offensive players, the Harden/Lebron/Giannis types, there's a tradoff between efficiency and usage. The more a plyer is asked to create his own offense instead of being a beneficiary of others, the more his efficiency will slide. That's part of the story with Tatum. Brown's usage has increase gradually as he's been in the league longer, while Tatum's has risen more dramatically, especially this year - his usage is nearly as high as Walker's.
And I am with you that this is a good thing, regardless of short term pains. Regular season games in December should only matter to your team-building plans so much.

It is time to start figuring out Tatum's ceiling, if for nothing else that once giving him the max he and JB are the cornerstones of the franchise. There won't be flexibility to change tack after this year or next whenever Danny extends him.
 

lovegtm

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And I am with you that this is a good thing, regardless of short term pains. Regular season games in December should only matter to your team-building plans so much.

It is time to start figuring out Tatum's ceiling, if for nothing else that once giving him the max he and JB are the cornerstones of the franchise. There won't be flexibility to change tack after this year or next whenever Danny extends him.
Barring some completely out-of-nowhere trade, he's getting maxed. The only question is whether it's a player option for the 5th year or not.
 

DeJesus Built My Hotrod

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Tatum's efficiency around the rim has gone through a somewhat bizarre dip, which is not where I would expect increased defensive attention to manifest.
I am on my phone but I took a gander at Tatum's shot chart this year and this 76ers game in particular. Obviously Philadelphia has the length and defense to slow any scorer.

However it looks like the book on Tatum is what we already know - force him into midrange shots and mostly from the center of the court. Teams seem to be living with those takes while chasing him off the arc or helping when he drives to the rim (which would maybe explain the dip you cite). If this is the right read, he has to adjust again.

Eye test and all that but he seems to be able to do that now.
 

wade boggs chicken dinner

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Tatum's efficiency around the rim has gone through a somewhat bizarre dip, which is not where I would expect increased defensive attention to manifest.
Why not? If a guy is the third scorer on the team, the defense is shaped to take away the top (and perhaps second) options. That guy might just have to beat one recovering defender to get to the rim.

Everyone's focus is now on JT. He now has to beat multiple defenders to get to the rim and the way he does it - goes around, not through - he's often at odd angles or has to shoot some what I would consider high difficulty chances.

I would think at some point some of those "going around" plays will turn into contact and FTs, which will help both his scoring and his percentages.

The best thing about this year is that JT - and JB too but this isn't his thread - is learning what it means to be a top scorer on a good team. He's not there yet but if he was there, what would we be talking about? :cool:
 

benhogan

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One things is obvious- Celtics aren't winning (much less beating good teams) when Tatum struggles offensively. The stat of the day:
View: https://twitter.com/bostonsportsinf/status/1205493695249821698

Jayson Tatum
Celtics last 50 games
reg season

Points ≥ 17 - (23-6, .793)
Points ≤ 16 - (8-13, .381)

To the naked eye there appears to be a difference
MAX Tatum now!

I suspect his 23-27 seasons will lead to a higher and more consistent scoring from Tatum than his 21yr old season.

Throw in 24-28yr old Jaylen Brown leaping alongside...

Prepare yourselves for many 65-win seasons (.793%) folks :drunk:
 

Jimbodandy

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Why not? If a guy is the third scorer on the team, the defense is shaped to take away the top (and perhaps second) options. That guy might just have to beat one recovering defender to get to the rim.

Everyone's focus is now on JT. He now has to beat multiple defenders to get to the rim and the way he does it - goes around, not through - he's often at odd angles or has to shoot some what I would consider high difficulty chances.

I would think at some point some of those "going around" plays will turn into contact and FTs, which will help both his scoring and his percentages.

The best thing about this year is that JT - and JB too but this isn't his thread - is learning what it means to be a top scorer on a good team. He's not there yet but if he was there, what would we be talking about? :cool:
Good threads today.

This a also a good reminder of how lucky we are. Both of the young wings are currently good players at the NBA level.
Yet both JT and JB are very young and learning on the job currently. JT (and JB, but not his thread) will have some nights where what they're doing isn't exactly working. But that doesn't mean that it's the wrong thing to be doing. Every time that Tatum takes that step back, step left three, I think "that's not a good shot for him". Yet, it is for Harden and a few others. Well, at one point it wasn't for those guys. Same with Jaylen trying Thybulle off ths dribble last night.

Proofs Of Concept sometimes show that, yes, I can do this. Sometimes they show that, no, this wasn't the right idea. But they always teach. There's good value in that. And when you can do it while still being a solid NBA player, that's the part where we are lucky.

Once Tatum starts figuring out how to get those calls at the rim and starts getting some star treatment, all fucking bets are off. Star is the limit for this kid.
 

amarshal2

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It’s too bad there’s no statistic for “in control” vs “rushed/out of control” (that I know of). Nuancing earlier points I’ve made I’ve noticed games where Tatum has put in the effort to play in control and games where he lets it go.

There are times he slows down and uses his height to shoot over a guy or his skill to create separation without rushing and he looks really good and smooth. Bottom of the net at what feels like >50%. I’m actually okay with Tatum taking in control mid range jumpers (inside 12 feet or so). When he’s balanced and in control he fulfills his promise.

Too often he’s rushing floaters or putting too much movement into his 3’s or falling in love with the corner fade away and when he rushes I think he shoots like 30%. He’s pretty bad. He needs to get the in control play down and then he can slowly start to push himself.

This is really the difference between Hayward and Brown offensively vs Tatum. Arguably Tatum is the most talented of the three when you put it all together, but right now Hayward and Brown are much more efficient offensive players because they know how to slow down and play in control. In Hayward’s case he’s just a super savvy player but in Brown’s case the lights just flicked on pretty recently.

This isn’t a year to try and win every game. This is a year to develop. I hope Tatum’s utilization stays about the same and the coaching staff takes weeks like this to work on how he can stay in control, take the right shot, or make the right play. To be what we all want him to be he needs to be focusing on improving his efficiency without just dramatically lowering his utilization.

While it does seem like two small steps forward one small step back, his offensive numbers are trending in the right direction. He’s steadily improved his TS% (.536 this month which is respectable), his assists, and his offensive rating while holding his utilization’s steady to up each month this year. (His d rating and rebounding have come down a bit but his +\- has actually improved). His sub .400 FG% is really where the focus needs to be.
 
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Kenny F'ing Powers

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It’s too bad there’s no statistic for “in control” vs “rushed/out of control” (that I know of). Nuancing earlier points I’ve made I’ve noticed games where Tatum has put in the effort to play in control and games where he lets it go.

There are times he slows down and uses his height to shoot over a guy or his skill to create separation without rushing and he looks really good and smooth. Bottom of the net at what feels like >50%. I’m actually okay with Tatum taking in control mid range jumpers (inside 12 feet or so). When he’s balanced and in control he fulfills his promise.

Too often he’s rushing floaters or putting too much movement into his 3’s or falling in love with the corner fade away and when he rushes I think he shoots like 30%. He’s pretty bad. He needs to get the in control play down and then he can slowly start to push himself.

This is really the difference between Hayward and Brown offensively vs Tatum. Arguably Tatum is the most talented of the three when you put it all together, but right now Hayward and Brown are much more efficient offensive players because they know how to slow down and play in control. In Hayward’s case he’s just a super savvy player but in Brown’s case the lights just flicked on pretty recently.

This isn’t a year to try and win every game. This is a year to develop. I hope Tatum’s utilization stays about the same and the coaching staff takes weeks like this to work on how he can stay in control, take the right shot, or make the right play. To be what we all want him to be he needs to be focusing on improving his efficiency without just dramatically lowering his utilization.

While it does seem like two small steps forward one small step back, his offensive numbers are trending in the right direction. He’s steadily improved his TS% (.536 this month which is respectable), his assists, and his offensive rating while holding his utilization’s steady to up each month this year. (His d rating and rebounding have come down a bit but his +\- has actually improved). His sub .400 FG% is really where the focus needs to be.
Doesnt this just come down to poise and experience? Some guys have it earlier in their career, but most guys end up finding their rhythm and control if given the opportunity.
 

nighthob

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Yeah, they're force-feeding Tatum to grow his game, as turning him into a Paul George type player (elite two way player) is their path forward to contention. So I imagine a lot of this is the NBA version of toss the baby into the pool and force him to swim. As he gains comfort in his new role, and continues to add size/strength, he'll adjust.
 

DeJesus Built My Hotrod

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It’s too bad there’s no statistic for “in control” vs “rushed/out of control” (that I know of). Nuancing earlier points I’ve made I’ve noticed games where Tatum has put in the effort to play in control and games where he lets it go.

There are times he slows down and uses his height to shoot over a guy or his skill to create separation without rushing and he looks really good and smooth. Bottom of the net at what feels like >50%. I’m actually okay with Tatum taking in control mid range jumpers (inside 12 feet or so). When he’s balanced and in control he fulfills his promise.

Too often he’s rushing floaters or putting too much movement into his 3’s or falling in love with the corner fade away and when he rushes I think he shoots like 30%. He’s pretty bad. He needs to get the in control play down and then he can slowly start to push himself.

This is really the difference between Hayward and Brown offensively vs Tatum. Arguably Tatum is the most talented of the three when you put it all together, but right now Hayward and Brown are much more efficient offensive players because they know how to slow down and play in control. In Hayward’s case he’s just a super savvy player but in Brown’s case the lights just flicked on pretty recently.

This isn’t a year to try and win every game. This is a year to develop. I hope Tatum’s utilization stays about the same and the coaching staff takes weeks like this to work on how he can stay in control, take the right shot, or make the right play. To be what we all want him to be he needs to be focusing on improving his efficiency without just dramatically lowering his utilization.

While it does seem like two small steps forward one small step back, his offensive numbers are trending in the right direction. He’s steadily improved his TS% (.536 this month which is respectable), his assists, and his offensive rating while holding his utilization’s steady to up each month this year. (His d rating and rebounding have come down a bit but his +\- has actually improved). His sub .400 FG% is really where the focus needs to be.
I think there is something to Tatum trying to do too much and I think other posters are correct in that the Celtics are willing to live with it as he continues to adjust to higher utilization.

That said, his shot chart (this season) is kind of a mess imo. I also think that opposing teams are inducing him into taking shots that are either lower percentage types overall (e.g. midrange) or just one he has shown trouble converting. If I am correct, he and the coaching staff have to adjust. Stevens is good at this stuff from what I have seen so I bet they figure it out.

27486
 

Devizier

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I wonder how much of Tatum's sloppy play comes when he is tired. He's taking a huge jump in usage from secondary option (19-22% his first two years) up to lead option (28%) this year. That means he is being asked to finish a lot more possessions. He also seems to be handling the ball/initiating possessions a lot more this year. A lot less standing around for him. And on top of all that, he's playing 10% more minutes per game.

This is all part of the growth process and frankly it's encouraging.
 

slamminsammya

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Whats going on with that right corner?

I remember like 3 years ago when Marcus' 3p% was like 28 I held out hope since he shot 45% from the corners or something. That chart is like the opposite of that.
 

lovegtm

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Whats going on with that right corner?

I remember like 3 years ago when Marcus' 3p% was like 28 I held out hope since he shot 45% from the corners or something. That chart is like the opposite of that.
He takes a lot of tough, contested, late-clock step-backs from there. Relatively few of those are catch-and-shoot (if memory does not betray me).
 

slamminsammya

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He takes a lot of tough, contested, late-clock step-backs from there. Relatively few of those are catch-and-shoot (if memory does not betray me).
That makes sense, thanks. His rookie year I recall a pretty fair number of corner catch and shoots. Obviously that's no longer his role now that they are making him initiate and more involved.
 

lovegtm

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That makes sense, thanks. His rookie year I recall a pretty fair number of corner catch and shoots. Obviously that's no longer his role now that they are making him initiate and more involved.
Yeah, exactly. Comparing rookie year Tatum stats to his stats now, given what he's asked to do, is a fairly useless exercise. It's more similar to watching something like Devin Booker's 2nd and 3rd years, where he was pretty inefficient while Phoenix was force-feeding him in order to develop his playmaking. Tatum's just under way more of a spotlight than your typical young ball-dominant guy, because he almost made the Finals as the lead guy as a rookie, so everything about him gets endlessly dissected.
 

lovegtm

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Tatum is looking more and more in-control on offense as the year goes on. That early year force-feeding while he was inefficient is starting to pay off.
 

amarshal2

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Oct 25, 2005
4,757
Tatum is looking more and more in-control on offense as the year goes on. That early year force-feeding while he was inefficient is starting to pay off.
TS% by month (3pt %)
Oct: .482 (.483)
Nov: .520 (.313)
Dec: .561 (.354)

Steady improvement all year. His usg and assist rates have also increased every month. He seems to be finding it. Here’s hoping we’re still early in the curve.
 

lovegtm

Member
SoSH Member
Apr 30, 2013
6,312
Kiev, Ukraine
TS% by month (3pt %)
Oct: .482 (.483)
Nov: .520 (.313)
Dec: .561 (.354)

Steady improvement all year. His usg and assist rates have also increased every month. He seems to be finding it. Here’s hoping we’re still early in the curve.
Eye test gives a lot of reason for optimism. I’ll post a link to his NBA Stats shot videos when I have time, but he’s a lot more under control now at all 3 levels.

As far as where he is on the curve: he’s a senior in college. He will be a lot better when he’s 24 imo. Once/if his stepback 3 is perfected, he’ll be perennial All-NBA.
 

TripleOT

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 4, 2007
2,620
Tatum's having a solid December 23.8/7/3.3 on 44/35/89% shooting. Two poor outings, losses against the Sixers and Pacers, and seven good to great games, all wins, by an average of 16.5 ppg.