Jaylen Brown, Year 7

HomeRunBaker

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Bill Walton broke his foot, I believe, by tripping over a sprinkler head in his yard.
Bird was well known for his late night bar escapades…..I always questioned that “I hurt my back working on my mothers driveway” excuse. No media or phone cameras back then I’d sure like to have been a fly on that wall.
 

Jimbodandy

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Bird was well known for his late night bar escapades…..I always questioned that “I hurt my back working on my mothers driveway” excuse. No media or phone cameras back then I’d sure like to have been a fly on that wall.
Yeah a lot of folks back then knew some guy who worked in the garden who knew a guy who said that Bird got in a bar fight and broke his hand and shit like that. Heard it more than once.
 

DGreenwood

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Do we know where these stitches are? I feel like it makes a huge difference. Unfortunately, from the story, it sounds like the logical place would be on his palm.
 

PedroKsBambino

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This is also the first time I’ve seen a media member saying what Scal has been saying for a while, that Tatum is the scoring leader based on total points
the Celtics should absolutely be seen by Jaylen publicly pushing for him…glad they are doing it. Wyc probably should make a comment about it before playoffs start too….
 

benhogan

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the Celtics should absolutely be seen by Jaylen publicly pushing for him…glad they are doing it. Wyc probably should make a comment about it before playoffs start too….
I think all postseason votes are due by noon Monday. Michael Wilbon said his votes have already been submitted.

Hopefully, the Celtics did a stealth Jaylen Brown at Forward PR campaign by contacting every voter.

In Los Angeles, Actors, Directors, Producers, Studios, and the entire entertainment industry shamelessly put up billboards and take out advertisements in the rags to promote themselves during Awards season. For your consideration...
 

pjheff

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Do we know where these stitches are? I feel like it makes a huge difference. Unfortunately, from the story, it sounds like the logical place would be on his palm.
I heard the webbing between his index and middle fingers.
 

RorschachsMask

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Simmons and Russillo both voted him 3rd team, with Butler/AD/Luka taking up their second team spots.

So far, he’s been on every leaked all nba team. It’s only 3 as of now, but it’s a good sign.
 
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HomeRunBaker

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the Celtics should absolutely be seen by Jaylen publicly pushing for him…glad they are doing it. Wyc probably should make a comment about it before playoffs start too….
We are still waiting for Wyc. I’m still skeptical he wants to write another $100m or so to him and silence does speak volumes some times.
 

Van Everyman

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Simmons and Russillo both voted him 3rd team, with Butler/AD/Luka taking up their second team spots.

So far, he’s been on every leaked all nba team. It’s only 3 as of now, but it’s a good sign.
AD? As in, the guy who's played 12 less games, scores less PPG and who is second banana on a team that is barely scraping into the playoffs? What is Simmons' argument here for him over Jaylen? "I live in LA and see AD more"?
 

RorschachsMask

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AD? As in, the guy who's played 12 less games, scores less PPG and who is second banana on a team that is barely scraping into the playoffs? What is Simmons' argument here for him over Jaylen? "I live in LA and see AD more"?
I don’t think he should be getting votes at forward, but I’m guessing they are weighing advanced stats and especially defense quite a bit. AD is just a monster on that end, and scored 26 on elite efficiency.

I also don’t think he’s played enough games, I just don’t think the writers care all that much about it, despite what some say.
 
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tbb345

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AD? As in, the guy who's played 12 less games, scores less PPG and who is second banana on a team that is barely scraping into the playoffs? What is Simmons' argument here for him over Jaylen? "I live in LA and see AD more"?
I think the answer here is that the voters, individually and as a group, really don’t show much consistency in how they vote or what they decide.

I also think that there’s so much information and stats available that some of them can get stuck in the weeds and forget about some of the more obvious factors (record, place on team, etc).

I’m kind of stunned that Simmons and Russillo (more Simmons) didn’t have Jaylen as the 2nd team forward. Also, who the hell voted Luka as a forward?
 

Deathofthebambino

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Simmons and Russillo both voted him 3rd team, with Butler/AD/Luka taking up their second team spots.

So far, he’s been on every leaked all nba team. It’s only 3 as of now, but it’s a good sign.
Who put AD as a forward?

On what planet is AD a forward?

Embiid/Jokic/AD are the 3 centers for the 3 teams, that should be the one spot that nobody really argues, IMO.
 

jmcc5400

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Who put AD as a forward?

On what planet is AD a forward?

Embiid/Jokic/AD are the 3 centers for the 3 teams, that should be the one spot that nobody really argues, IMO.
Sabonis played 79 games. He deserves third team over AD, I think, even though AD is a much better player.
 

Deathofthebambino

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Sabonis played 79 games. He deserves third team over AD, I think, even though AD is a much better player.
I'm fine with that too, but in no way should AD get an honorary forward spot because the 3 centers are filled up. It's ridiculous.

Wasn't Simmons the one bitching that they are going positionless for All NBA in the future, but now we have AD at forward, Luka at forward, etc. It's already positionless, apparently.
 

RorschachsMask

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Who put AD as a forward?

On what planet is AD a forward?

Embiid/Jokic/AD are the 3 centers for the 3 teams, that should be the one spot that nobody really argues, IMO.
They both had Sabonis third team center, Russillo had AD second team forward.

Edit: Simmons has Luka at second team forward.
 

PedroKsBambino

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I agree, I'd vote for Sabonis over AD though I get the case for AD based on how good he is when he plays.

AD historically pushed to be considered (and actually played) at 4 not 5. I think we're probably at the end of that, but this year he still views himself that way and at the margin that probably enters the league's calculus a bit
 

tbb345

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I'm fine with that too, but in no way should AD get an honorary forward spot because the 3 centers are filled up. It's ridiculous.

Wasn't Simmons the one bitching that they are going positionless for All NBA in the future, but now we have AD at forward, Luka at forward, etc. It's already positionless, apparently.
He had a whole 20 minute segment whining about how it ruins NBA history with Russillo, how it was so reactionary, and it’s “trophy culture” ..and then he puts Luka at forward. Classic Simmons
 

lovegtm

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Reasonable people: really worried about all the 63-game player "edge cases" who would get screwed in the new CBA's system

All-NBA voters: fuck it, AD 2nd team!

Really glad that this nonsense is getting reined in next year; the voters are irresponsible.
 

Euclis20

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Reasonable people: really worried about all the 63-game player "edge cases" who would get screwed in the new CBA's system

All-NBA voters: fuck it, AD 2nd team!

Really glad that this nonsense is getting reined in next year; the voters are irresponsible.
AD, Curry and Durant are three guys with history and per game stats that are unimpeachable, but in different ways, their absences really hurt their teams this year (although it feels like GS has as easy a 1st round matchup as one can have against a healthy, higher seeded team). I will be very happy taking some of the decision making out of the hands of voters, part-time players don't deserve the vote.
 

InstaFace

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Can we got to PAxton Crawford for comment?

Note: I really thought he died? But he didn't good for him!
I only vaguely remember the story about him falling out of a hotel bed onto a water glass and getting stitches. But googling led me to his big steroid use admission, which was not super fun.

The official stories? Wade Boggs once hurt himself taking off his cowboy boots. Jim Corsi once slipped getting out of the shower. As for former Sox prospect Paxton Crawford, he allegedly rolled out of bed and fell on a water glass, resulting in stitches in the back of his shoulder. (There must be more to that story.)

Now we have White Sox catcher Toby Hall, who recently hurt his shoulder trying to plant a shaving cream pie in the face of teammate Jermaine Dye.
Add another to the annals, I suppose.

Also, I hope he doesn't get all-NBA, having two supermaxes on the books will severely crimp POBOBS' ability to round out the roster the way we need to. And I think he signs the non-supermax max deal when we offer it, if that's all we're allowed to offer.
 

jose melendez

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Vaughn Eshelman burned his hands after setting a fire in a hotel while heating a baby bottle, though I vaguely recalled in turned out to be more sinister.


There's Andy Yount...
 

Spelunker

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Vaughn Eshelman burned his hands after setting a fire in a hotel while heating a baby bottle, though I vaguely recalled in turned out to be more sinister.


There's Andy Yount...
And Glenallen Hill going all @Marciano490 on us.

Hill landed himself on the disabled list because he woke from a nightmare about spiders chasing him, and in a frightened semiconscious state, he fell through a glass table and suffered scrapes and bruises on his feet, knees and elbows.
 

Cellar-Door

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i think if you don't have a hard floor the case for AD over Jaylen is pretty clear.... he's a lot better?
They score identically per 100 possessions, AD does it more efficiently, he's a significantly better rebounder, Jaylen is a bit better on assisting others, but AD turns it over less.
And on the other end, Jaylen is a medicore defender and AD is an All-Defense type defender.

Basically, Jaylen vs. AD comes down to... how many more minutes from Jaylen is worth the difference in how good they are.
 

jmcc5400

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i think if you don't have a hard floor the case for AD over Jaylen is pretty clear.... he's a lot better?
They score identically per 100 possessions, AD does it more efficiently, he's a significantly better rebounder, Jaylen is a bit better on assisting others, but AD turns it over less.
And on the other end, Jaylen is a medicore defender and AD is an All-Defense type defender.

Basically, Jaylen vs. AD comes down to... how many more minutes from Jaylen is worth the difference in how good they are.
Well, sure, but the point people have been making is that AD has not been a forward this year. Virually all of his minutes have been logged at Center. https://cleaningtheglass.com/stats/player/816/lineups#tab-four_factors
 

Cellar-Door

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Well, sure, but the point people have been making is that AD has not been a forward this year. Virually all of his minutes have been logged at Center. https://cleaningtheglass.com/stats/player/816/lineups#tab-four_factors
he's eligible there though, and honestly the 'lineups' stuff is mostly guesswork... is AD playing center in those or is Vanderbilt? How do you define it. Like against the Grizzlies.. Vanderbilt matched up on JJJ to let AD roam.

Positions are pretty dumb in general, it's why it's good they are going to positionless in the future, because there is not much difference between C and PF or SF/PF or SF/SG for most teams. really Point Guard and a few traditional Centers are the only guys who aren't switching around on both ends.
 

RorschachsMask

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Redick and Broussard have him second team at forward.

Broussard also has Luka second team forward and Tatum first team guard.
 

Deathofthebambino

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Tatum guard, Davis forward…..what are we even doing here?
It's a fucking joke. Luka at fucking forward, but we have to campaign to get Jaylen as a Forward?

Tatum at guard, Davis at forward?

Broussard has AD at Forward, Luka at Forward and Tatum at Guard. That's the type of shit that should disqualify someone from having a vote in the future. Either they aren't watching the games, have no idea what's going on or they are actively trying to screw someone or prop someone else up.
 

benhogan

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Redick and Broussard have him second team at forward.

Broussard also has Luka second team forward and Tatum first team guard.
The more I think about it the 65-game/minute/positionless voting requirement next season not only will get superstars to potentially play a bit more BUT keep these morons in the media in line.

Maybe Broussard just started his positionless approach this year and went TOP15? IDK

NOTE: any vote for Jaylen at Forward along with AD and Luka at Forward really helps Brown/Celtics a lot.
 

Kliq

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I don't understand the science behind Luka at forward and Tatum at guard. If you think they are both All-NBA players, why not just put them at their proper positions? Is it trying to get one a first-team and one on a second-tema?
 

Deathofthebambino

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I don't understand the science behind Luka at forward and Tatum at guard. If you think they are both All-NBA players, why not just put them at their proper positions? Is it trying to get one a first-team and one on a second-tema?
It can't be that, because he has to know that Tatum will get the majority of his votes at forward, so he'll be listed as a forward no matter what when the awards come out. That guard vote essentially just becomes a forward vote in the end. Putting AD at forward gets him an award he may not get at all, because at Center, he's probably screwed with Joker/Embiid/Sabonis.

So we bump AD down to forward, move Luka up to forward, and move Tatum down to guard. Would love to see his other choices, who he left off completely, etc.
 

RorschachsMask

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It can't be that, because he has to know that Tatum will get the majority of his votes at forward, so he'll be listed as a forward no matter what when the awards come out. That guard vote essentially just becomes a forward vote in the end. Putting AD at forward gets him an award he may not get at all, because at Center, he's probably screwed with Joker/Embiid/Sabonis.

So we bump AD down to forward, move Luka up to forward, and move Tatum down to guard. Would love to see his other choices, who he left off completely, etc.
View: https://docs.google.com/spreadsheets/u/3/d/1KMzwRcilLDej0BWl7eYE_OYC9Tx9olI_Ptn-nHjKfpQ/htmlview#
 

Euclis20

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Davis at forward is more defensible than Tatum at guard. Davis has always wanted to be a forward, and if being a center is more about role (closest guy to the basket) rather than size (biggest guy on the court), Davis can try to make a case. Tatum is 6'8 and averages 9 rebounds a game and takes a quarter of his shots at the rim (and nearly half of them in the paint), what on earth makes him a guard? The fact that he shoots a ton of 3s?
 

DGreenwood

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It's a fucking joke. Luka at fucking forward, but we have to campaign to get Jaylen as a Forward?

Tatum at guard, Davis at forward?

Broussard has AD at Forward, Luka at Forward and Tatum at Guard. That's the type of shit that should disqualify someone from having a vote in the future. Either they aren't watching the games, have no idea what's going on or they are actively trying to screw someone or prop someone else up.
He has Embiid at forward, not AD. Unless I"m missing something.

Edit: Not that that is any better.
 

benhogan

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Broussard helped Jaylen Brown a lot by naming 5 Forwards: Giannis, Tatum, Brown, Bron, Randle
4 centers: Jokic, Embiid, AD, Sabonis
6 Guards: Mitchell, Doncic, SGA, Fox, Curry, Morant,

Broussard's ALL-NBA team:

First team

Center: Jokic
Forward: Giannis / Embiid
Guard: Mitchell / Tatum

Second team
Center: AD
Forward: Brown / Doncic
Guard: SGA / Fox

Third team
Center: Sabonis
Forward: Bron / Randle
Guard: Curry / Morant

https://foxsportsradio.iheart.com/content/2023-04-10-rob-parker-calls-out-chris-broussard-for-cop-out-all-nba-team-selection/
 

tbb345

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I’m amazed at who they let vote on this stuff.

Chris Broussard? Mike Greenberg? Kendrick Perkins? Come on
 

lovegtm

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The more I think about it the 65-game/minute/positionless voting requirement next season not only will get superstars to potentially play a bit more BUT keep these morons in the media in line.
I've been saying this for awhile. All-NBA became load-bearing for players and franchises, but lots of writers can't be fucked to vote it responsibly, so control must be exerted.

Positionless and 65-games solves most macro issues, and from there can do the micro-optimization of weeding out the more egregiously bad voters over time.
 

InstaFace

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Do we think the players themselves would do a better job voting? Coaches and execs? I can see an argument.

It's not like other leagues who let the media vote for important stuff have gotten it precisely right either. The NFL is a mixed bag (HOF seems to do well), MLB is a bit of a disaster, and I don't know the NHL well enough to be able to say (plus they have a dozen awards). Media voting is likely going to be a fraught endeavor.
 

HomeRunBaker

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Davis at forward is more defensible than Tatum at guard. Davis has always wanted to be a forward, and if being a center is more about role (closest guy to the basket) rather than size (biggest guy on the court), Davis can try to make a case. Tatum is 6'8 and averages 9 rebounds a game and takes a quarter of his shots at the rim (and nearly half of them in the paint), what on earth makes him a guard? The fact that he shoots a ton of 3s?
Maybe that Tatum acts as a guard on the offensive end as a perimeter ballhandler/shot creator I guess. It’s a stretch to call him a guard when Smart and White clearly occupy those two designations. Same goes for Davis….you can’t call him a forward when the Lakers start two small forwards next to him, like who would you consider their center?
 

Cellar-Door

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I've been saying this for awhile. All-NBA became load-bearing for players and franchises, but lots of writers can't be fucked to vote it responsibly, so control must be exerted.

Positionless and 65-games solves most macro issues, and from there can do the micro-optimization of weeding out the more egregiously bad voters over time.
Honestly I think the REASON some of these guys fuck around with positions as much as they can under the rules is that it's load-bearing and they really want to get the best 15 guys in those spots if they can.
Changing to positionless will get rid of the conundrum of "do I pick the best guys and chance that positions mess it up, or do I drop a guy I think deserves it because he's a "guard" wing not a "forward" wing, or a "center" big and not a "forward" big... given that if there are really positions anymore it's:
1. PG/Ballhandler
2. Wings
3. Bigs

Do we think the players themselves would do a better job voting? Coaches and execs? I can see an argument.

It's not like other leagues who let the media vote for important stuff have gotten it precisely right either. The NFL is a mixed bag (HOF seems to do well), MLB is a bit of a disaster, and I don't know the NHL well enough to be able to say (plus they have a dozen awards). Media voting is likely going to be a fraught endeavor.
Coaches and Execs have a huge conflict, also usually not good at this.
Players are AWFUL at this stuff. They don't take it seriously, they vote for their buddies or the guy whose handles they like.

The system is fine, media generally do a good job as an aggregate, and most (not Kendrick Perkins) put a lot of time effort and thought into it. The problem is the rules were set up decades ago and the game is wildly different.
 

lovegtm

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Maybe that Tatum acts as a guard on the offensive end as a perimeter ballhandler/shot creator I guess. It’s a stretch to call him a guard when Smart and White clearly occupy those two designations. Same goes for Davis….you can’t call him a forward when the Lakers start two small forwards next to him, like who would you consider their center?
Exactly--I think low-information voters watch Celtics national TV games, see Tatum dribbling it up, and think of him as a guard.

Whereas JB initiates a lot less, has the "two way wing" label, and pattern-matches more against guys like Kawhi and PG to voters.

Because of this, I actually don't think Jaylen will have a hard time getting F votes as opposed to G ones.
 

lovegtm

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Honestly I think the REASON some of these guys fuck around with positions as much as they can under the rules is that it's load-bearing and they really want to get the best 15 guys in those spots if they can.
Changing to positionless will get rid of the conundrum of "do I pick the best guys and chance that positions mess it up, or do I drop a guy I think deserves it because he's a "guard" wing not a "forward" wing, or a "center" big and not a "forward" big... given that if there are really positions anymore it's:
1. PG/Ballhandler
2. Wings
3. Bigs
That's a good point, and removing the need to fuck around with positions will help a lot at the macro level.
 

benhogan

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We've seen 5 voters full All-NBA teams and Jaylen Brown has been named 2nd Team Forward 3X and 3rd Team Forward 2x

The Jaylen Brown, FORWARD campaign, was well orchestrated by someone (agent or team?) since these nitwits in the media can't figure out what position AD and Luka play
 

lovegtm

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We've seen 5 voters full All-NBA teams and Jaylen Brown has been named 2nd Team Forward 3X and 3rd Team Forward 2x

The Jaylen Brown, FORWARD campaign, was well orchestrated by someone (agent or team?) since these nitwits in the media can't figure out what position AD and Luka play
Also I think JB's style and role "feel" more forward-ish.