iPhone 8

bohous

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So if I'm reading that right, there is only 1 iPhone 8 model that is sized between the 7 and 7 plus? If so, right on!
The downside is that camera bump is really chunky. Also disappointed to see they are sticking with lightning connector. No big surprise but there have been rumors they might go USB-C but that ship really sailed when they dumped the headphone jack. That dock in the video, which is essentially a usb-c to lightning adapter, really drives home the point of how dumb it it to continue with a proprietary charger.
 

jayhoz

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So if I'm reading that right, there is only 1 iPhone 8 model that is sized between the 7 and 7 plus? If so, right on!
The downside is that camera bump is really chunky. Also disappointed to see they are sticking with lightning connector. No big surprise but there have been rumors they might go USB-C but that ship really sailed when they dumped the headphone jack. That dock in the video, which is essentially a usb-c to lightning adapter, really drives home the point of how dumb it it to continue with a proprietary charger.
USB-C can carry audio, video, etc without issue. The reason for the proprietary charger is that Apple receives a royalty on each and every 3rd party lightning connector sold. Huge revenue stream.
 

IpswichSox

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Wish it was fractionally thicker to allow for a flush camera that also would presumably allow for a larger battery, too.

But overall I can't wait. I bypassed buying the 7, and my 6s is showing signs of built-in obsolescence, so I'm ready for an upgrade.
 

bohous

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USB-C can carry audio, video, etc without issue. The reason for the proprietary charger is that Apple receives a royalty on each and every 3rd party lightning connector sold. Huge revenue stream.
Exactly, that's why its so frustrating. At last they could justify the benefit of their proprietary connectors in previous generations. Now its just a cash grab. Samsung and every other phone had proprietary chargers at one point and they all seem to be doing ok.
 

jayhoz

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Every time that Jony Ive thinks about how the 8 won't lie flat on a table top I bet he throws up a little bit in his mouth.
 

VORP Speed

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The 7 doesn't lie flat on a table with no case on it. The camera protrudes from the back, but it's flush with the opening of the Apple case. I imagine the 8 will be the same.
 

Nick Kaufman

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Two thoughts:

- I don't think the world needs a new iphone model every year anymore.

- Fuck thinness; it's a dick measuring contest for nerds at this point. I have an SE. I never wished it was thinner.
 

IpswichSox

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Anyone following news reports about the iPhone 8 potentially removing Touch ID capability in favor of facial recognition (see here and here)? I'm wondering how that would impact non-Apple apps that use Touch ID, like banking, credit cards, travel, etc. Would those seamlessly migrate over to facial recognition in time for the expected fall roll out of the new phone and new iOS?

Some stories indicate that facial recognition captures many more data points than Touch ID, making it a more secure method of accessing sensitive apps or info. But has Touch ID ever been discovered to lack appropriate security? I guess if the home button is going away, as has also been rumored, then that's the real motivation for moving to facial recognition and dumping Touch ID.
 

The_Powa_of_Seiji_Ozawa

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Anyone following news reports about the iPhone 8 potentially removing Touch ID capability in favor of facial recognition (see here and here)? I'm wondering how that would impact non-Apple apps that use Touch ID, like banking, credit cards, travel, etc. Would those seamlessly migrate over to facial recognition in time for the expected fall roll out of the new phone and new iOS?

Some stories indicate that facial recognition captures many more data points than Touch ID, making it a more secure method of accessing sensitive apps or info. But has Touch ID ever been discovered to lack appropriate security? I guess if the home button is going away, as has also been rumored, then that's the real motivation for moving to facial recognition and dumping Touch ID.
When TouchID came out, testers made it a point to show that the bio-metric part of the touch tech prevented a dead person's finger from working to unlock the phone. Wouldn't facial recognition theoretically work on a corpse?
 

cgori

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When TouchID came out, testers made it a point to show that the bio-metric part of the touch tech prevented a dead person's finger from working to unlock the phone. Wouldn't facial recognition theoretically work on a corpse?
The sensors are reportedly infrared, so presumably there is some thermal sensing going on. I suppose you could hear a corpse up to 98.6 degrees...
 

jk333

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Is there not a demand for the camera lens to optically zoom? Professional camera lenses internally zoom, I'm surprised Apple hasn't taken this concept and reproduced it on a micro level.

Is the problem price or reproducing this on an extremely small scale? (The iPhone lens is only about 4mm)
 

Lowrielicious

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Is there not a demand for the camera lens to optically zoom? Professional camera lenses internally zoom, I'm surprised Apple hasn't taken this concept and reproduced it on a micro level.

Is the problem price or reproducing this on an extremely small scale? (The iPhone lens is only about 4mm)
Iphone 7 does have optical zoom, although only 2x and only in the plus model.
 

IpswichSox

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A Bloomberg story today says, among other things, that there will be a home button but it will be virtual. So that would theoretically allow for secure apps to open as they have through Touch ID if they don't migrate to the new facial recognition.

ImageUploadedBySons of Sam Horn1503590457.566922.jpg
 

Blacken

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Facial recognition is a bad idea. Touch ID might be the smartest thing they've done in a long time.

I've been sorely considering moving to an iPhone when the 8 comes out, but I'm not going to put up with that kind of regression from my Xperia Z5.
 

OfTheCarmen

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Maybe it's just me, but I think Touch ID and Facial recognition are terrible ideas from a security standpoint. Previously, if someone was gonna steal my phone I would think they'd just grab my phone and take off.

Now, I'd be concerned they'd want to kick my ass and then use my finger or face to unlock my phone and potentially get into any number of secure apps. I've got an iPhone but I certainly dont use Touch ID for anything I actually care about securing.
 

NortheasternPJ

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Maybe it's just me, but I think Touch ID and Facial recognition are terrible ideas from a security standpoint. Previously, if someone was gonna steal my phone I would think they'd just grab my phone and take off.

Now, I'd be concerned they'd want to kick my ass and then use my finger or face to unlock my phone and potentially get into any number of secure apps. I've got an iPhone but I certainly dont use Touch ID for anything I actually care about securing.
Using TouchID enables far better security than not having it. Prior to TouchID everyone had 4 digit passwords, which are easy to crack. With TouchID, I can have a 8-12 character (not just numbers) passcode and still use my phone as i'd like. I wouldn't have the same complexity password on my iPhone as I do now without TouchID. Plus if you reboot the phone, you still need a passcode or you get TouchID wrong too many times.

You're 1000x more likely to lose your device or have it stolen and your password cracked than someone taking your phone, physical assaulting you and attempting to get the correct finger on the reader, then hope it doesn't go to sleep and lock itself back out again.

I'm out on facial recognition unless it's easier to use than TouchID, which I find very unlikely.
 

cgori

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Using TouchID enables far better security than not having it. Prior to TouchID everyone had 4 digit passwords, which are easy to crack. With TouchID, I can have a 8-12 character (not just numbers) passcode and still use my phone as i'd like. I wouldn't have the same complexity password on my iPhone as I do now without TouchID. Plus if you reboot the phone, you still need a passcode or you get TouchID wrong too many times.

You're 1000x more likely to lose your device or have it stolen and your password cracked than someone taking your phone, physical assaulting you and attempting to get the correct finger on the reader, then hope it doesn't go to sleep and lock itself back out again.

I'm out on facial recognition unless it's easier to use than TouchID, which I find very unlikely.
TouchID as implemented by apple is highly secure, NPJ captures most of the goodness above. It also isolates the security to an independent device (not the main processors running iOS) with a very limited communication path between the two. It makes your secrets / data much harder to hack via an app or other remote attack.

My old boss thought a good feature to add would be a "kill switch" finger print or series of finger prints. If you swipe your ring or pinky finger (or maybe ring followed by pinky - let it be user defined) then nothing works until some remote reset happens - or maybe the phone unlocks for 2 min then self-bricks (to let you get away in the case of coercion), or maybe it just bricks the phone immediately. My boss was a very good cryptographer but also thought a lot about human factors of security.
 

NortheasternPJ

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You mean a kill switch like this?

Apple is adding an easy way to quickly disable Touch ID in iOS 11. A new setting, designed to automate emergency services calls, lets iPhone users tap the power button quickly five times to call 911. This doesn’t automatically dial the emergency services by default, but it brings up the option to and also temporarily disables Touch ID until you enter a passcode. Twitter users discovered the new option in the iOS 11 public beta, and The Verge has verified it works as intended.
https://www.theverge.com/2017/8/17/16161758/ios-11-touch-id-disable-emergency-services-lock
 

cgori

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Kind of. The best is if it is silent / hard to detect in an actual coercion situation. But that's a start.
 

mt8thsw9th

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Not sure how facial recognition works for those of us with glasses.
You don't think the facial recognition people haven't figured this out yet? It's doing things like measuring the distance between your pupils, so as long as you're not wearing sunglasses with a fake nose, it'll work.
 

wilked

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You don't think the facial recognition people haven't figured this out yet? It's doing things like measuring the distance between your pupils, so as long as you're not wearing sunglasses with a fake nose, it'll work.
But what about those of us who wear hats?
 

jayhoz

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Who's ready to pay a grand for a new phone?
 

canderson

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Who's ready to pay a grand for a new phone?
No kidding. But you know it'll sell out and be a "must have" as Apple is really damn good at creating demand by lowering production.
 
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dirtynine

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No kidding. But you know it'll sell out and be a "must have" as Apple is really damn good at creating demand by lowering production.
It may not be intentionally throttled; the X phone in particular may be using materials or new production techniques that yield lower amounts. I believe OLED alone is causing them trouble at scale. The ramped-up demand may be a happy outcome, though.
 

NortheasternPJ

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No kidding. But you know it'll sell out and be a "must have" as Apple is really damn good at creating demand by lowering production.
Do you really believe that Apple lowers production intentionally at these launches? The scale they're trying to sell stuff at is enormous. Killing their stock price due to limited sales due to limited production isn't their game.
 

Domer

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Who's ready to pay a grand for a new phone?
The Note8 starts at $930 so Apple's price point isn't totally out of whack, but I wouldn't spend that much sight unseen. The iPhone displays since "retina" have all been outstanding and I don't see much room for improvement, but if OLED looks as good as hyped, I might take the plunge.
 

Oil Can Dan

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The question to me is more like "who's ready to spend a grand on a thing that you'll use all-day every-day, until you want a newer one and then you'll sell this one for around $700?".

When I look at it like that, I'm probably in.
 

canderson

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Do you really believe that Apple lowers production intentionally at these launches? The scale they're trying to sell stuff at is enormous. Killing their stock price due to limited sales due to limited production isn't their game.
Honestly, in a way yes. I think they never produce what they know they can sell immediately as long as it comes relatively soon (IE not the NES Classic deal). I don't see any issue with it though.
 

canderson

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The iPhone X looks cool I guess. The camera upgrades are pretty incredible. Starts at $999 so not insanely out of the realm. I won't upgrade to it from my 6S because it's massive (5.8") but it'll sell well.

The 8 is, aside from the wireless charging, a boring SE style update. Which is fine but it's not setting anything on fire.
 

AlNipper49

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The question to me is more like "who's ready to spend a grand on a thing that you'll use all-day every-day, until you want a newer one and then you'll sell this one for around $700?".

When I look at it like that, I'm probably in.
That's why I always buy new models. A few years ago I was spending shitloads of money on computer gear. Now I do 70% of everything via my phone
 

DukeSox

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The iPhone X looks cool I guess. The camera upgrades are pretty incredible. Starts at $999 so not insanely out of the realm. I won't upgrade to it from my 6S because it's massive (5.8") but it'll sell well.
No, the display is 5.8" on the X, it's 4.7" on the 6S, but the HEIGHT/WIDTH of the two are very close:

X: 5.65x2.79"

6S: 5.44x2.64"

The screen size is because there is no button. But the phone itself isn't' that much bigger.
 

canderson

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No, the display is 5.8" on the X, it's 4.7" on the 6S, but the HEIGHT/WIDTH of the two are very close:

X: 5.65x2.79"

6S: 5.44x2.64"

The screen size is because there is no button. But the phone itself isn't' that much bigger.
Thanks for that correction - I must've misread a sizing chart I saw.
 

jayhoz

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No, the display is 5.8" on the X, it's 4.7" on the 6S, but the HEIGHT/WIDTH of the two are very close:

X: 5.65x2.79"

6S: 5.44x2.64"

The screen size is because there is no button. But the phone itself isn't' that much bigger.
The focus, of late, on removing huge ugly bezels has been refreshing. My LG G3 from 2014 was great in this regard. I wish the Pixel 2 was going bezel-less, but the leaks say otherwise.
 

NortheasternPJ

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I missed the announcement. Looks like no Touch ID on the X.

Did they give any hint how Face ID would work with sunglasses? I'm out on the X if I can't use it outside without taking off glasses to look at it.
 

Oil Can Dan

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I was watching for that too. They did not specifically address sunglasses, but they did throw in "glasses" when pointing out what would work.

My sense is no sunglasses allowed for entry.
 

NortheasternPJ

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I was watching for that too. They did not specifically address sunglasses, but they did throw in "glasses" when pointing out what would work.

My sense is no sunglasses allowed for entry.
I'm destined for the iPhone 8 then which is what I expected going in. If the X had TouchID I'd be for that immediately. (Aka oct 27)
 

Marciano490

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Wait, so what if you're passed out and someone hold your iPhone X up to your face? Does it just unlock?