Ime Udoka suspended for the 22-23 seaso

Shelterdog

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Trying to figure out the source is just too hard here--too many people know pieces of the story and there are a lot of conflicting motives here. In the next couple of days there will be a fairly breathless reported stories, mostly anonymously sourced, telling the story from the C's management perspective emphasizing whatever he did that was supposedly bad other than the affair, and there will be an Imi story saying that it's all about a personal lapse in judgment but it never affected anything professional. [I have no idea what's true in the case but that's that the stories will say] The most interesting story will be a "player's story" which will be basically a press release from Tatum and Brown's agents and that one is a little unpredictable because it could be anywhere from "very upset to see their beloved coach leave and makes them think about whether boston is the place to be long term" to "dissappoitned in Udoka for making a mistake that hurts their season but committed to having a great season with the new coach"
 

wade boggs chicken dinner

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I tend to think they'll say nothing about his future as well, though there is some reason they might (for the players to hear perception-wise) want to say he will be back/could be back.

Do you imagine Stevens is primary speaker, with Wyc there as well? Could be Wyc as speaker with Brad there, or less likely Zarren (who is the GC). But he may be on-stage, as may be whoever their outside employment counsel is.

Given rumors, probably not helpful for Pagliuca to be there and my recollection is he generally is not.
This is high profile enough I'd advise them to have Wyc speak but I guess Wyc could delegate if he doesn't want to be there (or can't be there). If I had to bet, I'd put a super small wager on Wyc but who knows?

Zarren as GC will be up there but won't say anything substantive.

Again, who does the first leak look better for? Ime, or any other party in the matter?
Obviously we'll never know but if I know that I'm facing discipline for harassment, I'm not leaking anything. One other possibility is that a player caught wind of it and leaked it without knowing all of the facts.
 

Ale Xander

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If the harassment angle is true, this changes things 180 degrees. My apologies to Wyc, Gotham, and PBS and my respect to Dejesus.
 

radsoxfan

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Beyond fine. He’ll be at the top of the free agent food chain next summer unless something else blows up with this. Udoka doesn’t even realize it today but he probably just got a pay raise with his next contract.
You may be right right though we still don’t know the details.

A text saying “hey are you free tonight?” after they broke it off would look pretty different than something much more aggressive on the other end of the spectrum.

Unless this woman and her husband are seeking attention, I kind of doubt the harassment was entirely benign. If it’s bad and everyone around the league knows it, it’ll take awhile to recover from.

This isn’t some past allegation, this is while head coach for the Celtics. Huge difference.
 

Cellar-Door

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Trying to figure out the source is just too hard here--too many people know pieces of the story and there are a lot of conflicting motives here. In the next couple of days there will be a fairly breathless reported stories, mostly anonymously sourced, telling the story from the C's management perspective emphasizing whatever he did that was supposedly bad other than the affair, and there will be an Imi story saying that it's all about a personal lapse in judgment but it never affected anything professional. [I have no idea what's true in the case but that's that the stories will say] The most interesting story will be a "player's story" which will be basically a press release from Tatum and Brown's agents and that one is a little unpredictable because it could be anywhere from "very upset to see their beloved coach leave and makes them think about whether boston is the place to be long term" to "dissappoitned in Udoka for making a mistake that hurts their season but committed to having a great season with the new coach"
My guess is that you're probably wrong on the organization. If they were gonna run him out and list everything bad they'd have done it. They're playing a middle road to leave open the door for him, while also avoiding trashing a guy that the players like. I think the organization's hope is that they have this PC, don't talk about it again, the woman involved doesn't sue (maybe a cash settlement and an NDA to ensure it), Ime appologizes for a lapse (while leaking to somewhat minimize it) and then they go forward, and re-assess in a few months whether both sides think it makes sense for Ime to come back.

My guess is that long term nobody involved, Ime, the Team, the woman involved, wants to air out all the details in public. It's not a good look for any of them, so after some initial jockeying for how the story plays out, all of them want it to eventually go away.
 

mcpickl

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I responded to both those in my prior post, hence the commment about slowing down. They need to be managing for perception as well as for the truth (which they presumably know) not just the latter because they aren't going to share the full truth.

I do not expect them to figure out and message to every rumor out there. I do expect (and indeed, would be shocked if they are not) monitoring what's out there in media, discussions, etc. to figure out how they should be communicating at 11. We know for a fact the Red Sox would monitor this message board in assessing reactions to trades, etc....I don't think it is remotely surprising to suggest teams do this to understand perception (not to discern facts)
Man, I sure hope the Cetics organization doesn't have the rabbit ears of the Red Sox organization and are scrolling through fan message boards.

That would be a bummer. I'd hope Brad Stevens and his group are better than that. I believe they are,

No, again to repeat...there is no requirement that Ime's situation was announced as "suspended a year for consensual sexual relationship" There were other ways they could have announced it and positioned it. Those are what I am talking about.

If you assume (I think wrongly) that they had to announce it the way the first leak read, then sure...that's better framing for Ime than the later Shams article. But I don't see any reason at all to assume that is the case. And thus, that he must have been the leaker.

Here's the statement of the Timberwolves when they fired Rosas:

"Today the Minnesota Timberwovles parted ways with President of Basketball Operations Gersson Rosas. As an organization, we remain committed to building a winning team that our fans and city can be proud of.”

Are we sure Ime wouldn't today be better off if that were the first we heard about all this? Of course there would be questions (as there were about Rosas) and likely other stuff would come out. I can imagine the team thought better to soften the ground; can also see why they might not have wanted the leak.
I'm sure Ime wouldn't today be better off if that were the first we heard about all this, yes.

Because, again, lots of people will believe the first story they hear. The first story was more favorable to him, it being a consensual affair, than even the vague Celtics statement would be. Because that one leaves open more possibilities that are worse than a consensual affair. Like, for example, a consensual affair that has escalated to harassment.
 

mcpickl

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Apart from all of the other reasons the head coach can't have relationships with staff, how awful must it have been to be a woman working for or around the Celtics yesterday.

It's already an unforgiving and male dominated industry that takes tremendous ability and courage for women to succeed in, and then you compound that with an internet witch-hunt that name and picture drops a whole bunch of women who did nothing but happen to work for the team while the head coach had an affair.

What bullshit.
Agreed.

The shit they have to go through by doing nothing wrong.

It sucks.
 

Shaky Walton

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I would be quite surprised about the future part. Better not to say anything at all about that. There still may be further details which they don't know about. It would seem unnecessary to make any promised of future employment.
They will not say anything about the future other than it will be dealt with in the future and they have nothing additional on that now.
 

mcpickl

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Obviously we'll never know but if I know that I'm facing discipline for harassment, I'm not leaking anything. One other possibility is that a player caught wind of it and leaked it without knowing all of the facts.
But, in the first leak he wasn't facing discipline for harassment.

That's the whole point.

He knows he's going to get disciplined. He knows the story is going to come out since the players have already been told, he's obviously already been told. So if you can get a softer story leaked beforehand, that can only help your cause in the court of public opinion.
 

Leather

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Right. Players want their coach to be 100% committed, but it should be fairly obvious for the players that covering for an affair takes a lot of effort that could have been spent with their mind on the team.
I think it's more that these are grownups who should (and most of whom probably do) realize that their coach was involved in something shitty...something incredibly hurtful and humiliating to a coworker that had the potential to de-rail the entire organization at any time...and that maybe him putting his dick above the organization and team is something that warrants a serious dressing-down.

This idea that "all players care about it what happens on the court because their lifestyle as a bunch of sex-crazed maniacs makes this not a big deal to them" seems pretty demeaning. Soft bigotry of low expectations type of shit. Either that or it's just posters using them as a proxy to safely say "I don't think fucking a co-worker's wife, at work, is really a big deal."
 

Cellar-Door

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So a law firm was brought in to conduct an investigation, they delivered their report on Wednesday.
Leaks obviously came once the report was distributed
 

Rusty13

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No further details provided. Maybe the right decision for privacy reasons, but this just means the leaks will continue and the bad faith attacks from people in the media and on Twitter will continue indefinitely.
 

tbb345

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They are pissed about the leaks.
They should be. Brought on so much unneeded attention and caused female staff members to be unfairly harassed.

The leaker and Shams/Woj (who don’t seem to have much integrity or care other than who’s “first”) have to wear that
 

wade boggs chicken dinner

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But, in the first leak he wasn't facing discipline for harassment.

That's the whole point.

He knows he's going to get disciplined. He knows the story is going to come out since the players have already been told, he's obviously already been told. So if you can get a softer story leaked beforehand, that can only help your cause in the court of public opinion.
Maybe you are correct but having the "softer story" leaked followed by the harassment allegations didn't actually help Ime and by contrast may have brought the harassment allegations into a more harsh light while everyone backtracked on their initial takes.

I don't know about you, but I'd never leak something damaging if I knew there were more damaging facts at play. YMMV.

I don't think the leaks came from Ime or the FO.
 

Shelterdog

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I think it's more that these are grownups who should (and most of whom probably do) realize that their coach was involved in something shitty...something incredibly hurtful and humiliating to a coworker that had the potential to de-rail the entire organization at any time...and that maybe him putting his dick above the organization and team is something that warrants a serious dressing-down.

This idea that "all players care about it what happens on the court because their lifestyle as a bunch of sex-crazed maniacs makes this not a big deal to them" seems pretty demeaning. Soft bigotry of low expectations type of shit. Either that or it's just posters using them as a proxy to safely say "I don't think fucking a co-worker's wife, at work, is really a big deal."
Without knowing the full story it's pretty easy to see a player saying coach made a mistake, should be punished even, but a whole season for having a workplace affair? That's Sprewell/Artest territory.

I'm assuming there's more bad conduct that we don't know about so obviously depending on what he did players might find the suspension more or less fair.
 

Cellar-Door

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Maybe you are correct but having the "softer story" leaked followed by the harassment allegations didn't actually help Ime and by contrast may have brought the harassment allegations into a more harsh light while everyone backtracked on their initial takes.

I don't know about you, but I'd never leak something damaging if I knew there were more damaging facts at play. YMMV.

I don't think the leaks came from Ime or the FO.
I think the harrassment would leak either way, now he had Stephen A on TV twice raging like a madman that it was bullshit that he was suspended for a consensual relationship and that it was because he's Black. A lot of people will never think any different short of video evidence.
 

Rusty13

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I think the harrassment would leak either way, now he had Stephen A on TV twice raging like a madman that it was bullshit that he was suspended for a consensual relationship and that it was because he's Black. A lot of people will never think any different short of video evidence.
Yup. And SAS was doubling down on this today, despite Sham's updated report.
 

Ed Hillel

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Celtics really didn't have any choice here, it seems. We don't know the extent of what happened, but if they hired a third party come in and investigate and now they are doing this, clearly the report was not great. In the end, despite Steven A's racism rants, they are probably PROTECTING Ime by doing this as they have. Similar to as I believe Belichick did with Butler in 2017.
 

HomeRunBaker

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Celtics really didn't have any choice here. We don't know the extent of what happened, but if they hired a third party come in and investigate and now they are doing this, clearly the report was not great. In the end, despite Steven A's racism rants, they are probably PROTECTING Ime by doing this as they have.
“There were a couple of violations……at least.”
- Wyc

So much untold here.
So much untold here.
 

benhogan

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Yup. And SAS was doubling down on this today, despite Sham's updated report.
that sucks, but expected

29 other teams/fans want the Celtics (preseason NBA favorites) to trip up and the media just wants clicks

running out the Boston/racism trope is low-hanging fruit for the haters & clicks for the talking heads, expect more of it
 

Gash Prex

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Normally I don't care about personal drama - but Ime's judgment is pretty terrible. He knew this was going to come out in July, never told Nia - who moved to Boston 2 weeks ago to be with him. Is he living in a different reality?? Shows a lack of remorse and understanding of the seriousness of this issue.

Sources connected to the team and the couple tell TMZ ... Nia had moved to Boston with Kez, her 10-year-old son with Ime, just 2 weeks ago, and the couple was house hunting.
https://www.tmz.com/2022/09/23/celtics-coach-ime-udoka-nia-long-blindside-affair-moved-family-boston/

The Celtics had a law firm investigate this - I'm not sure what else you all want other than to be angry about the Celtics chances at a title - and blaming anybody but Ime is ridiculous.
 

radsoxfan

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Seems pretty obvious from that press conference this was a harassment situation not simply a consensual relationship. Whether or not that's fair or accurate, who knows. But that is 100% how they are treating this.

Not a lot of details but Wyc said the investigation took "some twists and turns", so clearly there are layers here. Obviously the investigation was started after they knew about at least one relationship, so that wouldn't be one of the "twists and turns".
 
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Brad looked pissed and tired, and while in line with Wyc, not exactly on the same wavelength. And he better be right on Mazzula being a model citizen because otherwise that’s a very easy one to second guess.
 

Mooch

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Steven A is a fucking moron. When the full story comes out, I guarantee he won't be held accountable for pouring gasoline on this fire.
 

Leather

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The second it ends, ESPN calls the relationship "consensual." Jesus.
They are going to look incredibly stupid when it (probably) comes out that there was something even worse about this that we don't know yet. Like someone's job was threatened to keep quiet type of thing.
 

Ed Hillel

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They are going to look incredibly stupid when it (probably) comes out that there was something even worse about this that we don't know yet. Like someone's job was threatened to keep quiet type of thing.
Are the Celtics hiring a law firm to determine if two employees are engaged in a consensual relationship?
 
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riboflav

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Imagine having to be a female employee who works for ESPN and having the most recognizable face go on air and imply that the woman skated here without knowing even close to all the facts.
 

radsoxfan

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They are going to look incredibly stupid when it (probably) comes out that there was something even worse about this that we don't know yet. Like someone's job was threatened to keep quiet type of thing.
Clearly the law firm uncovered something much worse than has been reported specifically.

Wonder if we will be getting a drug or alcohol rehab stint in Ime's future....
 

Ed Hillel

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Imagine having to be a female employee who works for ESPN and having the most recognizable face go on air and imply that the woman skated here without knowing even close to all the facts.
Molly seemed just as mad as Steven A.

Though maybe it was just her discomfort in general.
 

Vinho Tinto

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Imagine having to be a female employee who works for ESPN and having the most recognizable face go on air and imply that the woman skated here without knowing even close to all the facts.
His on air partner has already stated that the coverage of this story leaves her feeling uncomfortable. His response is to ignore her and double down.