And so he's the one who looks like an idiot because they all failed to do their jobs. "Don't leave me hanging, guys! Or, well, lying down."
Grant “Corner Office” Williams
- Thread starter NomarsFool
- Start date
I thought that it was a hilarious mixture of celebrations. Tatum just walked out, Wanamaker fell over, a bunch of screaming and vulgarity.
Not to mention a fairly contested look compared to most of his 3s this season, probably as much surprised he even pulled the trigger there.
I'd expect him to be ok from 3 going forwad. I'm guessing the 0 for was in his head a little bit.
Both the eye test wrt his stroke and his college FT% suggest he’ll be an average to plus shooter. Agree that the streak got weird and probably affected him.
Grant is 82.6% from the FT line as a rookie. He will be a plus shooter from three, but probably not this season with the 0-25 start. He's so fundamentally strong and such a hard worker that it will be a shock that he doesn't become good from three.
Not surprisingly, since he's on a top team, Grant is second among his draft class in plus minus, at +4.3. Romeo, in a few games, is first at +7.8. No other draftee is over +1.5. Even with the benefit of hindsight, Grant was a great pick, and I'd still take him over anyone drafted after him.
With so much scoring talent on the roster, the Cs will need a low cost, lunch pail big who will gladly do all the little things a team needs to win big games. Having a Smart and a Williams in a rotation is huge.
Not surprisingly, since he's on a top team, Grant is second among his draft class in plus minus, at +4.3. Romeo, in a few games, is first at +7.8. No other draftee is over +1.5. Even with the benefit of hindsight, Grant was a great pick, and I'd still take him over anyone drafted after him.
With so much scoring talent on the roster, the Cs will need a low cost, lunch pail big who will gladly do all the little things a team needs to win big games. Having a Smart and a Williams in a rotation is huge.
Your Smart/Grant comment makes me wonder if
Smart, JB, JT, Grant, TL would be the best homegrown team in the NBA. Healthy GS might be better but depends how they come back from injury
Jokic, Murray, Harris, Morris, Beasley, Hernangomez, Porter Jr
Nuggets would be in the running
Many of the good teams don't even have five draftees.
The Bucks have GF, DiVincenzo, Ilyasova, and DJ Wilson, and would have to throw assistant coach Vin Baker out there.
The Sixers have Embiid, Simmons, Korkmaz, Thybulle, and Zaire Smith, and that line up is probably better.
Denver has a lot of homegrown talent: Joker, Harris, Murray, Beasley, Monte Morris, Michael Porter.
Kemba, Gord and Kanter are the only 3 guys on the 17 player roster who have played for other NBA teams. Homegrown squad fersure.
I like that little move of counting Euro league players as homegrown. I support this Celtics propaganda.
I mean we drafted Poirier, but if excluding him feels better fine, it doesn't change the argument given where he is on the depth chart (ie rock bottom)
This has slipped my notice, thanks. I was a fan of Theis's contributions already, but this season he has taken another leap on D, and if I squint my eyes I can see Theis really thriving in the rim-running role reserved every preseason in my mind for Noel.
Nice article on Grant’s growth, his limitations, and how they use him on defense:
There’s some good clips to of him defending pick and roll handlers after a switch.
https://theathletic.com/1534334/2020/01/15/grant-williams/
There’s some good clips to of him defending pick and roll handlers after a switch.
i agree, but would add an apparent intelligence on the court that other elite strong players (Semi) may lack.
Not to insult Semi, who makes ok decisions , but rather to say Williams shows early signs of making really smart ones.
Grant Williams gets his third start, in Orlando, and does a good all around job - 9/4/3/2/1 in 23 minutes with 3/4 from long distance. leading the team in the dreaded plus/minus at +17. Hopefully he can get more consistent. On a team with four 20+ point scorers, this kind of lunch pail play, white hitting threes at a high rate, is exactly what is needed.
After starting the season 0-25 from three, he's at 43.7% since then, 14-32, and is up to 24.6% overall. That shows the mental toughness this rookie possesses after a historically disastrous start from three.
After starting the season 0-25 from three, he's at 43.7% since then, 14-32, and is up to 24.6% overall. That shows the mental toughness this rookie possesses after a historically disastrous start from three.
I'm very very optimistic about his 3-ball long term, just because the shot looks good, and he was a very good FT shooter in college. It's a big deal for his potential if he turns that into a threat, just because of how the Celtics like to use their 5--there are a lot of openings if the big sags anticipating the DHO.
What do we think his current 3-ball threat is? Given the 0-25 is likley some jitters and self-pressure placed on him. Is his true talent in the 35-40% range on low volume?
Considering that being a plus shooter from three will be the biggest factor in whether he's every going to be more than a back of the rotation journeyman, and considering his shooting form, smarts, and work ethic, I'd bet that Grant gets there.
The NBA data is so low sample as to not be that meaningful. More relevant (imo) is the eye-test + FT data: he shot FTs around 80% in college, and his stroke looks comfortable at NBA 3-point range. Those guys tend to be fine.
I know @bowiac has done a lot of work with weighting past performance to project future shooting over time, but my guess is that Grant just doesn't have enough NBA data to add much beyond what we knew at draft and Summer League time.
*Grant Williams 3pt cherry-pick update*
started 0-25 from 3, first 20 games
since 12/9, over his last 28 games, he has gone 17-42 (40.5%)
Still want Danny to add a bigger wing that can shoot the 3 consistently. If you pair any one of Bertans, Bjelica, Markief Morris with Granite, then GW becomes very appealing as the Celtics 3rd rotational center.
started 0-25 from 3, first 20 games
since 12/9, over his last 28 games, he has gone 17-42 (40.5%)
Still want Danny to add a bigger wing that can shoot the 3 consistently. If you pair any one of Bertans, Bjelica, Markief Morris with Granite, then GW becomes very appealing as the Celtics 3rd rotational center.
I want all of the Grant Williams shares I can buy. He's Marcus Smart 2.0 as far as I'm concerned*
*meaning he's going to do all the little things needed to WIN. Love his attitude.
*meaning he's going to do all the little things needed to WIN. Love his attitude.
Well, the good news is that I imagine the Celtics see him the same way, and he also occupies the same space as Smart in terms of being more useful to the Cs than to other teams. So I imagine he'll be around for awhile, unless his shooting improves a ton--Grant Williams with a shot would get paid hard in RFA.
He's been really playing well lately. The combination of really knocking down the 3s at a good clip, some defensive stops, but I also feel like his rebounding has improved a lot.
I'm actually feeling like the Celtics bench isn't all that terrible. The way that Wannamaker has been draining those catch and shoot 3s lately is very encouraging. I'd still like him to stop trying to go coast to coach, but aside from that - he's been playing well. Our starting 5, plus Smart, Wannamaker, Kanter, and GW is a pretty good top 9 for the playoffs. Plus you have Semi if you want some extra defensive beef in certain situations.
I'm actually feeling like the Celtics bench isn't all that terrible. The way that Wannamaker has been draining those catch and shoot 3s lately is very encouraging. I'd still like him to stop trying to go coast to coach, but aside from that - he's been playing well. Our starting 5, plus Smart, Wannamaker, Kanter, and GW is a pretty good top 9 for the playoffs. Plus you have Semi if you want some extra defensive beef in certain situations.
It always seems to me that Wanamaker is quite good at pushing it on the break and finishing, so I'm surprised at how often I hear the above. He shoots 66% at the rim, which is better than the regulars outside of Brown, Theis and Hayward (77%!). His turnover rate is high, maybe that's what you're seeing.
Made a video of Grant's defense against the Hawks, for those interested. For some reason I'm mostly interested in watching the rookies develop on that end right now.
There were two instances where Collins shot over him in the lane (I think is what @NomarsFool was referring to in another thread), but they both looked like strong contests and ~40%ish shots.
There were two instances where Collins shot over him in the lane (I think is what @NomarsFool was referring to in another thread), but they both looked like strong contests and ~40%ish shots.
Awesome stuff, thanks.
He is so sound. A couple of slow reads and being quicked once by Huerter amidst what seemed like 50 proper reads and challenges. He's pointing out to other guys where to be. Strong challenges not just with his Granite physique but smarts.
He seems to progress game to game.
Yeah, I didn’t know going in that he’d look so good, but when you see it all in one eyegulp it’s impressive.
Interested to see how he looks against the much better guards of OKC.
Agreed, good stuff from lovegtm (the Tatum of the MBPC?
)You can see Granite communicating well on D. GW's vertical defense, shot-blocking/altered-shots, and his help defense are much better than Semi. IMO he has eclipsed Semi (and his on-ball beef) and should get those minutes. Grant has been learning/applying at a high rate, which CBS has noted in post-game pressers.
My too early/Celtics' healthy playoff rotation:
Positions 1-4 (192mpg): Kemba, Hayward, Tatum, Brown, Smart all getting ~35mpg (175mpg)
which leaves 17mpg
Center (48mpg): Theis (20mpg), Kanter (20mpg)
which leaves 8mpg
The majority of those spare minutes could be Granites' if he continues with his development.
1. I agree, and this is why I want to see Grant vs OKC
2. This has gone from a weakness of Grant's to a relative strength this season. He is getting very good on switches vs smalls.
Well IIRC, GW stayed in front of Trae Young when we played in ATL the first time this month.
GW's ability to do a credible job in keeping guards in front of him is way more important than the couples of times a game he gets posted up by bigger defenders. It's one of the things people should focus on when they watch the Cs - it really solidifies the bench defense.
There’s probably going to be some minutes for Wannamaker in there, I imagine. My guess is we see about 10 minutes for each of them and around 5 for a few ransoms, some Semi or Green for some specific matchups. I also think Theis is playing more than 20 minutes a gameAgreed, good stuff from lovegtm (the Tatum of the MBPC?
You can see Granite communicating well on D. GW's vertical defense, shot-blocking/altered-shots, and his help defense are much better than Semi. IMO he has eclipsed Semi (and his on-ball beef) and should get those minutes. Grant has been learning/applying at a high rate, which CBS has noted in post-game pressers.
My too early/Celtics' healthy playoff rotation:
Positions 1-4 (192mpg): Kemba, Hayward, Tatum, Brown, Smart all getting ~35mpg (175mpg)
which leaves 17mpg
Center (48mpg): Theis (20mpg), Kanter (20mpg)
which leaves 8mpg
The majority of those spare minutes could be Granites' if he continues with his development.
This story is great. Do we know that Grant Williams' mom is cool? Because she sounds cool.
It's behind The Athletic paywall, but you all should just give that site your money if you aren't already.
It's behind The Athletic paywall, but you all should just give that site your money if you aren't already.
https://theathletic.com/1647749/2020/03/02/how-rick-barnes-fat-camp-prepared-grant-williams-for-the-nba/