Grade the Red Sox trade deadline

How would you grade the additions of Schwarber, Austin Davis and and Hansen Robles?

  • A (Pumped! They killed it)

    Votes: 4 0.9%
  • B (Pretty happy. Did what they had to do)

    Votes: 122 27.8%
  • C (Eh. No First baseman? No SP?!)

    Votes: 199 45.3%
  • D (Really unimpressed)

    Votes: 104 23.7%
  • F (Should almost get fired)

    Votes: 10 2.3%

  • Total voters
    439

cournoyer

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Where do you stand? I went C. I like Schwarber but in my eyes that true first baseman just felt crucial! I know where they came from (an absolute insane market today) but felt like Chaim left something on the table.
 

OurF'ingCity

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C. Passing grade. Didn’t do anything crazy, didn’t do anything amazing. I do think people are somewhat underestimating just how much Schwarber will improve our offense though. Pitching is still an issue, obviously and now the Sox just kind of have to hope for some regression to the mean from EdRo and others.
 

Minneapolis Millers

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C grade. I like acquiring Schwarber’s bat. He’s going to help. But we don’t have a good first baseman. Schwarber is a lousy OF; there’s no reason to think he can effectively play first. Passably? Maybe, but even that’s a tallish order. And I don’t think it was expecting too much to get a pitcher who would crack our top 8 - a top 4 starter or reliever. Didn’t have to be Scherzer or Berrios or Kimbrel. Just someone you could confidently see as an upgrade. I don’t think Davis or Robles clears that relatively low bar. So overall, I’m mildly disappointed.

But seriously, we have Houck and Sale to work into the staff, plus Duran and a possibly rejuvenated Franchy. And we’re still in first. Plenty of cause to be optimistic….
 
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cournoyer

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I like acquiring Schwarber’s bat. He’s going to help. But we don’t have a good first baseman. And I don’t think it was expecting too much to get a pitcher who crack our top 8 - a top 4 starter or reliever. Didn’t have to be Scherzer or Berrios. Just someone you could confidently see as an upgrade. I don’t think Davis or Robles clears that relatively low bar. So overall, I’m mildly disappointed.

But seriously, we have Houck and Sale to work into the staff, plus Duran and a possibly rejuvenated Franchy. And we’re still in first. Plenty of cause to be optimistic….
I'm optimistic about the pitching staff, despite their trend downwards. I think Sale/Houck/Eovaldi is super solid and the rotation as a whole is going to improve. I'm questioning not getting a first baseman though. Can't imagine it was impossible even at a reasonable price.
 

DisgruntledSoxFan77

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D. Biggest needs were pitching and first base. Went out and traded for 2 junk pitchers and a guy who has never played first but maybe kinda he will now. Yay.
 

World's Fair

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Apr 24, 2008
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D.

I know this year is a surprise success and we are ahead of schedule and all that stuff, but the fact is we're in this position now. You never know how things are going to go next year or the year after. There's a really strong argument that the seasons you are in this kind of position at the break, you have a responsibility to go for it. And I just think not getting any help for the rotation (though I do acknowledge they really might feel Houck and Sale are the upgrade they'll need) but most especially at first base is a really bad job by management.

What about Carlos Santana? Even he would have been a significant upgrade? I get paying the price for Bryant or Rizzo, sort of, but I don't get not acquiring a first baseman of any kind when it is such an OBVIOUS problem for the team. So yeah, a D. And I makes me really worried about Bloom as the GM here.
 

twibnotes

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D.

I know this year is a surprise success and we are ahead of schedule and all that stuff, but the fact is we're in this position now. You never know how things are going to go next year or the year after. There's a really strong argument that the seasons you are in this kind of position at the break, you have a responsibility to go for it. And I just think not getting any help for the rotation (though I do acknowledge they really might feel Houck and Sale are the upgrade they'll need) but most especially at first base is a really bad job by management.

What about Carlos Santana? Even he would have been a significant upgrade? I get paying the price for Bryant or Rizzo, sort of, but I don't get not acquiring a first baseman of any kind when it is such an OBVIOUS problem for the team. So yeah, a D. And I makes me really worried about Bloom as the GM here.
I get being disappointed but given the success of Bloom’s short tenure, it seems way over the top to be doubting the guy bc of these trades
 

DisgruntledSoxFan77

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What about Carlos Santana? Even he would have been a significant upgrade? I get paying the price for Bryant or Rizzo, sort of, but I don't get not acquiring a first baseman of any kind when it is such an OBVIOUS problem for the team. So yeah, a D. And I makes me really worried about Bloom as the GM here.
They inquired, he wasn’t available
 

World's Fair

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Apr 24, 2008
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I get being disappointed but given the success of Bloom’s short tenure, it seems way over the top to be doubting the guy bc of these trades
I don't want to get too far in the weeds, but it does make me worried he cares more about being the kind of GM that seems smart and hoards assets than actually tries to...you know...win. I know a lot of people here are probably down on Dave Debrowski for the way he left our farm system in shambles but I'm not at all. Because he got us a championship. That's literally all that matters in this sport. Did you win the World Series. And I'm worried Bloom would rather win the "Having multiple prospects in Baseball America's top 100" championship than the real one.
 

Red(s)HawksFan

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I get being disappointed but given the success of Bloom’s short tenure, it seems way over the top to be doubting the guy bc of these trades
Particularly when citing a guy Bloom should have pursued that by all reports wasn't available. Bloom wasn't able to wrest Ohtani from the Angels either. He could have upgraded the pitching staff AND the lineup. Bloom should be fired for that.
 

Red(s)HawksFan

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I don't want to get too far in the weeds, but it does make me worried he cares more about being the kind of GM that seems smart and hoards assets than actually tries to...you know...win. I know a lot of people here are probably down on Dave Debrowski for the way he left our farm system in shambles but I'm not at all. Because he got us a championship. That's literally all that matters in this sport. Did you win the World Series. And I'm worried Bloom would rather win the "Having multiple prospects in Baseball America's top 100" championship than the real one.
You have to have a farm system to strip in order to do what Dombrowski did. As much work as Bloom has done to rebuild, it's no where near what Dombrowski had to work with.
 

OurF'ingCity

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I don't want to get too far in the weeds, but it does make me worried he cares more about being the kind of GM that seems smart and hoards assets than actually tries to...you know...win. I know a lot of people here are probably down on Dave Debrowski for the way he left our farm system in shambles but I'm not at all. Because he got us a championship. That's literally all that matters in this sport. Did you win the World Series. And I'm worried Bloom would rather win the "Having multiple prospects in Baseball America's top 100" championship than the real one.
Bloom doesn’t want to win and we have the second best record in the AL. Just imagine how awesome they’d be if he actually cared about winning!
 

Hank Scorpio

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I voted D. Schwarber’s bat will help, eventually, when he isn’t hurt. But we’re going to be stuck with Dalbec/Franchy for the duration it seems.
A passable bullpen arm, or a starter would have been nice, but the two guys we added just have me scratching my head.

Not adding a first baseman was borderline malpractice.
 

World's Fair

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Apr 24, 2008
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Bloom doesn’t want to win and we have the second best record in the AL. Just imagine how awesome they’d be if he actually cared about winning!
Whatever. I know I'm a little over-the-top. But I honestly can't believe you guys are happy about the first base position on this team.
 

Red(s)HawksFan

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Whatever. I know I'm a little over-the-top. But I honestly can't believe you guys are happy about the first base position on this team.
Who is saying they're happy? One can be dissatisfied with the 1B situation and not think Chaim Bloom is doing a terrible job.
 

cornwalls@6

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Whatever. I know I'm a little over-the-top. But I honestly can't believe you guys are happy about the first base position on this team.
The roster is better today than it was yesterday at this time. Schwarber upgrades them offensively, and provides depth and some versatility when he's back. We're all probably too hung up on position. The pen has a couple more pieces to play around with, and possibly provide more depth. This market rapidly developed into a sellers advantage, and this club is not yet in the best position to capitalize on that. Taken as a whole, I voted B.
 

sean1562

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It is good to see that we have 18 games left against the Orioles, Tigers, Rangers, and Twins. 6 against the Indians who arent exactly a dominant team either.
 

beautokyo

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Jun 5, 2008
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I voted "B" as well. I'm not a metrics guy but I still feel that 1b splits will only get better just like management does. Wanted KS at the draft table and now have him. Can't pick on Chavis anymore as he's had more than enough chances to do "something". Sale and Houch will "hopefully" get the job done. There's no guarantees in this game. I'm content.
 

OCD SS

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Cross posting from the other thread, I actually like the grading options in this one better:

I get why Chaim did what he did, but man this deadline has a wiff of 2011 around it.

Realistically, with Devers now out, I think they had a chance to top SF for Bryant, who would realistically be able to cover 3B with Devers out and then slide over to 1B easier than Schwarber, who has basically no experience there.

I suspect this deadline would feel a little better if Scwharber wasn't injured and could actually play right away...
 

chief1

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Aug 10, 2012
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Only addition of any value is
1) injured and not even available for another 2 weeks ( at the cost of the 8th rated prospect), which makes him a 6 week rental.
2) Is an experiment at the position they are desperate to upgrade
3) Not entirely sure of this point, but if true is the final nail in the coffin. His acquisition put them over luxury tax.
Grade= F
 

YTF

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Cross posting from the other thread, I actually like the grading options in this one better:

I get why Chaim did what he did, but man this deadline has a wiff of 2011 around it.

Realistically, with Devers now out, I think they had a chance to top SF for Bryant, who would realistically be able to cover 3B with Devers out and then slide over to 1B easier than Schwarber, who has basically no experience there.

I suspect this deadline would feel a little better if Scwharber wasn't injured and could actually play right away...
Bryant would have been a good get for the reasons you mentioned. He also pretty much would have made Gonzalez expendable. Arroyo and Schwarber rotating between the flexibility of this roster (Santana gone and Dalbec only here if Cora goes four man bench) would have left a couple of dependable bats on the bench no matter who was in the starting lineup. I trust that Bloom did what he could given the parameters that he was working in.
 

Devizier

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Really was hoping for some rotation depth (nothing splashy, but another Perez level guy to bump Richards) and a replacement-level first baseman. They didn’t get that but they also got Schwarber, who qualitatively is better than what I was hoping for. C+ or B- for me.
 

YTF

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Cross posting from the other thread, I actually like the grading options in this one better:

I get why Chaim did what he did, but man this deadline has a wiff of 2011 around it.

Realistically, with Devers now out, I think they had a chance to top SF for Bryant, who would realistically be able to cover 3B with Devers out and then slide over to 1B easier than Schwarber, who has basically no experience there.

I suspect this deadline would feel a little better if Scwharber wasn't injured and could actually play right away...
Bryant would have been a good get for the reasons you mentioned. He also pretty much would have made Gonzalez expendable. Arroyo and Schwarber rotating between the flexibility of this roster (Santana gone and Dalbec only here if Cora goes four man bench) would have left a couple of dependable bats on the bench no matter who was in the starting lineup. I trust that Bloom did what he could given the parameters that he was working in.
 

Red(s)HawksFan

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Only addition of any value is
1) injured and not even available for another 2 weeks ( at the cost of the 8th rated prospect), which makes him a 6 week rental.
2) Is an experiment at the position they are desperate to upgrade
3) Not entirely sure of this point, but if true is the final nail in the coffin. His acquisition put them over luxury tax.
Grade= F
It did not. Nor will the two pitchers they got today (Robles came with cash).
 

WheresDewey

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Nov 18, 2007
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I voted C but almost went B. It all hinges on Schwarber. If he comes off the IL soon and can play passable 1B, he's a fantastic addition at a tiny cost. If not (and if the pitching implodes), my grade would change to a D.

I remain optimistic, but it's hard as a survivor of 1978.
 

chief1

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Aug 10, 2012
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After seeing what Sweeney, Brad and Chaim have done in the last few weeks, it is time to start giving BB some respect as a GM. He is far and away the best GM in this town.
Just my thoughts.
 

jaytftwofive

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Jan 20, 2013
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Trading Chavis for a pitcher with an ERA of 21.00 for part of last season and a a career ERA between 5 and 6??? And signing another reliever with a career ERA near 5.00.???(4.91) D for those deals. B for signing Schwarber. And C- to D for not trying to get a starting pitcher. Even a mediocre somewhat half decent one like Alex Cobb. Rays look better 2nd half, hate to admit it. At least the Rays didn't get Kris Bryant. I voted C.
 

RoDaddy

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D. And as well as he's done otherwise, can we hold off on the "In Chaim we trust" until he's been here at least 3 years?
 

NYCSox

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Not getting a SP or at least a good BP arm is a big negative. I get that maybe the SP acquisition cost was too high but I don't see how they couldn't at least get a guy like Iglesias for the pen.
 

pk1627

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I’m worried about our starters, but I guess the brain trust is not. I’m pretty stoked about adding Schwarber. I think he kicks butt and hopes he sticks around. I think Cora will find a 1B platoon (he did in 18 and dumped Hanley). I think the plan is a good one - This isn’t the year to GFIN, as much as every fiber in me wanted it.

B-
 

Apisith

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B

They got a big lefty bat which was important. The rotation will have to make do with Sale. We have to get ERod right, somehow.

The other major key was not going over the limit. This puts us in play for big FAs this winter.
 

grimshaw

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C+ for me, and I'm a huge Chaim fan. I just think it's a huge risk bringing in a guy with a hammy injury. If he's healthy by mid August, then fine, but the impact for the stretch run is already lessened either way because of his time missed. It would be nice to have him for all these Rays games.

I just wonder if they could have stretched a bit more for Rizzo or Bryant. I'm fine with them laying off starters. 1 and 1/3 years of Berrios was too expensive.
 
Jul 21, 2005
16
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The Sox desperately need a left handed hitting 1B and another quality RP. They failed in securing either so I’d give Sox mgt an Incomplete grade.

I understand the need to build farm system depth to create a contending team. However, besides Casas and Houck(Mayer can’t be traded) which other Sox prospects do you feel are untouchable to secure Rizzo or another starting 1B, and one of the half dozen closers traded at the deadline? I’d like to see your stats that support your list of these other additional untouchable Sox prospects.

I personally think the Red Sox inaction at the deadline may be more due to other teams not valuing the other Sox prospects, rather than Bloom having a longer list of untouchables.
 

cantor44

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I’m worried about our starters, but I guess the brain trust is not. I’m pretty stoked about adding Schwarber. I think he kicks butt and hopes he sticks around. I think Cora will find a 1B platoon (he did in 18 and dumped Hanley). I think the plan is a good one - This isn’t the year to GFIN, as much as every fiber in me wanted it.

B-
There is every reason TO GFIN this year and trade for reinforcements (in first place, high percentage to make post season, all-star central core will begin breaking up after the season and then more radically after 2022, relatively healthy, and with clear clear weaknesses). No better set of justifying circumstances than those.

There is no reason NOT go GFIN, EXCEPT ... they don't have enough depth in the system to have competed for the blue chip players being moved.

There will be major turn over after 2022. I suspect the Sox will contend in 2022 health provided, but after that we may be seeing the beginning of a more robust generational rebuild. With the window closing for this superb core (JD opt out 2021, X opt out 2022, Sale opt out 2022, Eovaldi, Vazquez, Hernandez FA 2022), Sox may be at THE END of this era rather than at the beginning of the next one (roughly speaking, I know there's more overlap than that in these things).

The Red Sox will not spend their way through the upcoming transition (they will spend some of course, but clearly want to build from the farm and the farm is no where near what it was under Cherington. It won't be ready with an X, Mookie, Devers, in two years ....(Casas may be the only one ...) .. so, there may be some real rebuilding of ML roster starting 2023. And that will require patience.

This is all to say: if not this year, when? Maybe next year, but you can never assume health. And if not next, could be a little while. So, good year to GFIN.

I think the better framing might be: This is precisely the kind of year to GFIN, but the Sox organization is just not deep enough to make that happen ....
 

BringBackMo

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Jul 15, 2005
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I voted B but would have chosen A if it were framed differently.

There really are two different questions: Did Bloom maximize this team’s chances to win this year, and did Bloom increase this team’s chances to win multiple times across multiple years. The answer to the first is decidedly “No.” The answer to the second is decidedly “Yes.”

I believe in his plan, because I see it being used effectively in LA by his former mentor, and I believe in his ability to execute it. I’m very impressed with how he handled this trade deadline, and at the same time wish that I could wave my magic wand and provide the terrific 2021 Red Sox team he’s built with a seasoned 1B masher, a mid-rotation starter, and proven bullpen arms. Unfortunately, there was no way to do that while adhering to the organizational plan.
 

Humphrey

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At least two people mentioned Schwarber's health- I voted for C but I'm worried he'll take forever to get in the lineup and/or Devers has a health problem too.
 

Humphrey

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After seeing what Sweeney, Brad and Chaim have done in the last few weeks, it is time to start giving BB some respect as a GM. He is far and away the best GM in this town.
Just my thoughts.
Not according to Globe resident genius Ben Volin. Some of the GMs he ranks ahead of BB are complete jokes, as is Ben himself.
 

HPJoker

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Nov 15, 2011
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What future is Chaim building towards? What prospect currently in the system outside of Marcelo Mayer is a potential impact player? I mean, Casas is cool but is he what you'd call an all-star caliber impact prospect? I wouldn't from his reports. What's the road to this team contending in 2023 without blowing past the luxury tax? Why are we blowing the rest of Xander and Devers time with the team building to a window that's not going to be open for several more years? They lucked into being better than their projections in the first half and have lucked into beating their pythag and BaseRuns and the response to getting this gift was to trade for an injured corner outfielder and try him at 1B, a couple of rando relievers (I don't know anything about Austin Davis but it's not like the Pirates are some paradigm of pitching development and the Sox seem to be good at identifying these guys, but he's 28 so how can I project him to be some significant add? I can't imagine a use for Hansel Robles and having the Twins PAY HIS SALARY DOWN is an embarrassment,) and to put their trust in MARTÍN PÉREZ and NICK PIVETTA for a playoff run. That sucks!