Game Thread Apr 11-13 - Where games won't take 19 innings to finish

Status
Not open for further replies.

teddykgb

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 16, 2005
11,025
Chelmsford, MA
One more and it's a drubbing. City in freefall. A rudderless ship. A team of egotists.
Don't agree with this at all. It's just a lazy analysis. They've gotten old all over the pitch at the same time. YaYa has run this fixture for three years but he can't even make a mark today. Zabaleta is way off the player he was, etc. This was coming but it's more of a talent problem right now, they're just not that good
 

swiftaw

Member
SoSH Member
Jan 31, 2009
3,434
I bet City wished they had a cashed in on Yaya last summer when there were rumors of a big bid by Barca/PSG.  They'll get a much smaller fee this summer.  
 

fletcherpost

sosh's feckin' poet laureate
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
Jul 15, 2005
12,139
Glasgow, Scotland
teddykgb said:
Don't agree with this at all. It's just a lazy analysis. They've gotten old all over the pitch at the same time. YaYa has run this fixture for three years but he can't even make a mark today. Zabaleta is way off the player he was, etc. This was coming but it's more of a talent problem right now, they're just not that good
 
You're perhaps raw, but it was not analysis more a series of made up newpaper subheadings. If you want analysis it'll be in the City thread. It is their fourth loss in six league matches though. And where the fuck are they going as a team?
 

Dummy Hoy

Angry Pissbum
SoSH Member
Jul 22, 2006
8,232
Falmouth
Zomp said:
Who's the best player in the Premier League? Its you Juan Juan Juan Its you Juan Juan
 

Too bad your manager didn't realize it until he was forced to because of injuries.

 

Edit: Well deserved win today though, even if City were shite.
 

blueguitar322

Member
SoSH Member
Sep 20, 2005
1,104
City's midfield was completely overrun despite reverting to a 4-2-3-1 to match numbers there. Toure and Fernandinho were completely anonymous and Milner - whose tenacity is typically a strong point - had no success pressing United's defense and didn't offer much of anything else.

Credit to Jones and Smalling, they were solid all game and United controlled the ball really well. It's easy to discredit long passes as a lower-tier tactic reserved for the Stokes of the world, but United have integrated them really well and they have been giving opponents fits for several months.
 

Zomp

Moderator
Moderator
SoSH Member
Aug 28, 2006
13,942
The Slums of Shaolin
blueguitar322 said:
Credit to Jones and Smalling, they were solid all game and United controlled the ball really well. It's easy to discredit long passes as a lower-tier tactic reserved for the Stokes of the world, but United have integrated them really well and they have been giving opponents fits for several months.
 
When you have one of, if not the best players in the world at positioning and bring the ball down it would be crazy to not use him.  Fellaini has been a man possessed in the second half of the season.  What a remarkable turnaround.  
 

Morgan's Magic Snowplow

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 2, 2006
22,345
Philadelphia
City looked like a team full of guys in their late 20s and early 30s who've been playing 3000+ minutes for too many years.

It's a nightmare matchup because one of the drivers of United's resurgence is that their entire five man midfield consists of guys with relatively fresh legs who have played very limited minutes this year, which is a product of them riding pine earlier and United not being in Europe. Van Gaal deserved tons of credit for finding a set of players and tactics that have been remarkably effective. But a big part of the reason they can overrun midfield and be first to Fellaini's knockdowns is that they have just been fresher than most teams. And that goes double for a squad like City.
 
Just to add some actual numbers to this point.  These are just total minutes played entering today at club level in the 14-15 season but its actually more extreme than this because the only player in United's midfield who has played substantial minutes at international level this year is Fellaini whereas everybody but Navas is a pretty active international for City and Yaya's usage was through the roof with the ACON qualifiers and tournament.
 
Carrick 1655
Herrera 1599
Fellaini 1744
Young 1767
Mata 1965
 
Silva 2743
Yaya 2747 (plus over 1200 more minutes in internationals since last September, which is an insane number)
Fernandinho 2496
Milner 2339
Navas 2777
 
In addition to being old, Yaya entered this match having played about 2400 more minutes of competitive football this year than Herrera.  That's like 26 full games!  Guess who is going to be first to every ball?
 

Morgan's Magic Snowplow

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 2, 2006
22,345
Philadelphia
For shits and giggles, here are the respective current numbers for Liverpool, another team United ran over in midfield:
 
Henderson 4019 (!)
Allen 2079
Coutinho 3361
Sterling 3884
Moreno 3031
 

Zomp

Moderator
Moderator
SoSH Member
Aug 28, 2006
13,942
The Slums of Shaolin
Carrick, Young, and Herrerra also had injuries early in the year that kept them out an extended period of time.
 
Its interesting though.  If those players aren't injured, then yes they aren't as fresh.  But maybe then they don't drop some of the points that they in the late first half of the season?  At the end of the season, I don't think freshness will be THE main factor of United's success.  Giving up on having 2 strikers out on the field will be, IMO.
 

Morgan's Magic Snowplow

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 2, 2006
22,345
Philadelphia
Zomp said:
Carrick, Young, and Herrerra also had injuries early in the year that kept them out an extended period of time.
 
Its interesting though.  If those players aren't injured, then yes they aren't as fresh.  But maybe then they don't drop some of the points that they in the late first half of the season?  At the end of the season, I don't think freshness will be THE main factor of United's success.  Giving up on having 2 strikers out on the field will be, IMO.
 
I agree that the biggest change has been the tactics and team selection and Van Gaal deserves all the credit for finally figuring out a really effective formula.  But I think the freshness of the players is part of what has made those tactics work.  And that the change goes a lot beyond playing with only one striker.
 
IMO, it makes United's summer that much more interesting.  They're on a pretty great run right now, including convincing wins against their two biggest rivals.  Should the plan be to stick with this kind of lineup and tactics, maybe buying a few upgrades (a better winger to replace Young, an elite CB) but basically staying with the same plan, including Fellaini/Rooney in the 9/10 roles?  Or do they change things up significantly?  Its kind of a puzzle because Fellaini has been such a critical player for them and one wonders whether they could play the same way without him.  And, of course, there is the question of where (if anywhere) Di Maria fits into the equation.
 

Zomp

Moderator
Moderator
SoSH Member
Aug 28, 2006
13,942
The Slums of Shaolin
The flip side of that is Liverpool just don't have the financial advantages that United do, so they will be able to strengthen their squad for a European campaign (hopefully) and have one big enough for a squad rotation.
 

Zomp

Moderator
Moderator
SoSH Member
Aug 28, 2006
13,942
The Slums of Shaolin
Morgan's Magic Snowplow said:
IMO, it makes United's summer that much more interesting.  They're on a pretty great run right now, including convincing wins against their two biggest rivals.  Should the plan be to stick with this kind of lineup and tactics, maybe buying a few upgrades (a better winger to replace Young, an elite CB) but basically staying with the same plan, including Fellaini/Rooney in the 9/10 roles?  Or do they change things up significantly?  Its kind of a puzzle because Fellaini has been such a critical player for them and one wonders whether they could play the same way without him.  And, of course, there is the question of where (if anywhere) Di Maria fits into the equation.
 
I don't think they change that significantly in that the shape of the team should be the same, a 4-3-3.  It all hinges on Di Maria, I think.  If LVG thinks getting Di Maria fresh at the start of the season will improve his play, then I think you replace Young with Di Maria.  If not, then maybe you sell Di Maria to PSG and see what Depay can do.
 
I'd expect a right back (Clyne, Coleman), a centerback, maybe a midfielder (Carrick is getting up there), and a winger.
 

Dummy Hoy

Angry Pissbum
SoSH Member
Jul 22, 2006
8,232
Falmouth
I alluded to it earlier, but I'm more or less a believer in the theory that LVG lucked into finding the right combinations after several players got injured. I think a genius would have figured out how to use the guy that was one of Europe's best players last season rather than falling back upon the out of favor signing of his predecessor. All in all LVG has obviously been good, but I think if there hadn't been some of the injuries he'd still be trying to jam square blocks into round holes.

I've always been a big Fellaini fan despite his limitations. I think is is very effective in two roles- first as a target man (as Zomp alluded to earlier) and also as a DM in front of the back line who can mark up and disrupt the other team's midfield. You saw that today with Toure- everyone is noting how invisible he was, but part of that stemmed from the fact that Sideshow Bob was in his pocket from the get go. Credit to Van Gaal for putting that into place and helping nullify the man who had torn United part the last few seasons. (Obviously Yaya's form played a part too.)
 

SoxFanInCali

has the rich, deep voice of a god
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
Jun 3, 2005
15,568
California. Duh.
Ha, Sissoko didn't even wait for the ref to pull out the card, he just started walking off.
 
He's really lucky it wasn't a straight red, but there was no way it wasn't at least a second yellow.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.