Game 3- Panthers @ Bruins

kenneycb

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No. He puts his hands up in a defensive position as many guys do every shift when they’re going to get hit. There’s nothing unnatural about the position when bracing for a check. He thought Marchand was going to hit more in the middle than the left shoulder. Slow everything down to 1/4 speed and everything looks intentional. I could see the argument it’s a tad reckless. I don’t believe it but that seems more plausible than the sucker punch theory.
 

Myt1

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Normal momentum and his stick is facing downward. The only way it ends up facing the ceiling there, which it does, is with a punching motion. He also changes his height
Does this help?
View: https://twitter.com/to_do_82/status/1789132733098201457?s=46&t=11SXTvIYT-tl8b6e7iEUVQ


Now I guess we argue intent.

Momentum seems out the door, because his right hand ends up in front of his left shoulder.
My bet is that he won’t even get a hearing. Playoffs and Marchand as the target.
 

Myt1

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No. He puts his hands up in a defensive position as many guys do every shift when they’re going to get hit. There’s nothing unnatural about the position when bracing for a check.
He’s literally pushing it forward horizontally before contact, and it makes contact with Marchand’s head, but contrarians gotta contrarian, I guess.
 

kenneycb

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He’s literally pushing it forward horizontally before contact, and it makes contact with Marchand’s head, but contrarians gotta contrarian, I guess.
My momentum argument is off looking at it more closely. I edited my post but still am hard pressed to think it’s intentional namely from how difficult it is to make that intentional based on personal experience and having hit and been hit at high speeds. My best guess is most haven’t had the same personal experience. I hate playing that card but I feel it’s appropriate here. My best guess is Bennett’s bracing for the hit in his chest and Marchand hits him in an unexpected spot that caused his body to do unexpected things. He looks at the ref because he knows he punched Marchand but that doesn’t make it intentional. Guys look at refs all the time when they do something unintentional that may be a penalty like tripping. I don’t view that as anything outside of a “shit I hope I don’t get a penalty because I probably could get one” look.

Not sure why you love calling out me being a contrarian recently outside of you being an ass but sure. Everything in game threads is a penalty or missed call and has been for several years so I feel comfortable with “boy cried wolf” as my going in position.
 

Myt1

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My momentum argument is off looking at it more closely. I edited my post but still am hard pressed to think it’s intentional namely from how difficult it is to make that intentional based on personal experience and having hit and been hit at high speeds. My best guess is most haven’t had the same personal experience. I hate playing that card but I feel it’s appropriate here. My best guess is Bennett’s bracing for the hit in his chest and Marchand hits him in an unexpected spot that caused his body to do unexpected things. He looks at the ref because he knows he punched Marchand but that doesn’t make it intentional. Guys look at refs all the time when they do something unintentional that may be a penalty like tripping. I don’t view that as anything outside of a “shit I hope I don’t get a penalty because I probably could get one” look.

Not sure why you love calling out me being a contrarian recently outside of you being an ass but sure. Everything in game threads is a penalty or missed call and has been for several years so I feel comfortable with “boy cried wolf” as my going in position.
That’s exactly my point, though. You could just not have a “going in position,” in recognition that reality is not inversely related to the majority position on the board. You’re not a bad dude, but it’s fucking weird, and that’s what leads you to do things like make completely contradictory arguments on the same subject, depending on the target, or doing what you’re doing here: completely abandoning the reasoning that you were so convinced was correct, yet miraculously coming to exactly the same conclusion on new reasoning anyway. :)

You’re a really smart guy. You don’t need the intellectual shortcut of starting out with a position dictated by what others are saying. Just evaluate what happens on its own. I’m not trying to be an ass by pointing that out.

As for what happened, these guys have pretty amazing body control and I think he knew exactly what he was doing and hid it reasonably well, to the point of plausible deniability. I’ve thrown pretty much exactly that punch in other sports contexts. That doesn’t make me 100% convinced that’s what happened, but I think it’s more likely than not.
 

j44thor

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Agree with Kenney, Bennet is bracing for impact bringing his arm down tight to his body, does make contact with Marchand's head but that is an unintended result of the hit that Marchand is initiating. If you are trying to punch someone that is not how you would do it. I don't see anything questionable on the play. If we are going to start breaking down every check at 1/4 speed I'm sure there are plenty that would look like something they aren't. Zaprudering hockey checks is going to lead to a lot of noise.
 

Myt1

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Agree with Kenney, Bennet is bracing for impact bringing his arm down tight to his body, does make contact with Marchand's head but that is an unintended result of the hit that Marchand is initiating. If you are trying to punch someone that is not how you would do it. I don't see anything questionable on the play. If we are going to start breaking down every check at 1/4 speed I'm sure there are plenty that would look like something they aren't. Zaprudering hockey checks is going to lead to a lot of noise.
I mean, if you’re going to ignore the fact that his right arm is going forward horizontally and not elbows down, tight to the bodyprior to the actual contact, sure, he’s just bracing. :eyeroll:

He’s trying to explode into him and give him a little extra with the extension. It happens deliberately in hits regularly.

I mean, “If you’re trying to punch someone, that’s not how you’d do it”? I think that’s exactly how you’d do it, in that particular context, but I’m open to hearing how differently you’d punch someone in that situation.

You’re also complaining about using slow motion? Literally the thing that we is enshrined into the rules to use in sports to try to figure out what actually happened on the play, that might otherwise be too fast to catch? That’s . . . odd. I’m not saying that it’s an easy call to make in real time. But I think it’s a lot easier after the fact, all things considered.
 
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catomatic

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His expectant 180 back toward center ice screams consciousness of guilt to me. Which implies intent to injure. And, seems he succeeded, to boot.

Does Dafoomie ever do montages of uncalled infractions committed against Bruins players. I’d give my eye teeth for one covering, oh, the last decade, or so.
 

Myt1

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His expectant 180 back toward center ice screams consciousness of guilt to me. Which implies intent to injure. And, seems he succeeded, to boot.
I think he knew what he was doing, but got lucky in the particular outcome. Just think it’s weird for people to suggest that a pretty plainly unnatural motion that just so happened to land right on the button of a hated opponent in a chippy, physical series, by a team known to take such liberties, in the first period a game after several game misconducts, was surely just babe in the woods clean play dumb luck.
 

Haunted

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There is zero chance the league reviews any of this. The refs didn’t call it live and the bruins didn’t publicly complain.

Fuck Florida hockey. And this garbage league.
 

Ed Hillel

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My momentum argument is off looking at it more closely. I edited my post but still am hard pressed to think it’s intentional namely from how difficult it is to make that intentional based on personal experience and having hit and been hit at high speeds. My best guess is most haven’t had the same personal experience. I hate playing that card but I feel it’s appropriate here. My best guess is Bennett’s bracing for the hit in his chest and Marchand hits him in an unexpected spot that caused his body to do unexpected things. He looks at the ref because he knows he punched Marchand but that doesn’t make it intentional. Guys look at refs all the time when they do something unintentional that may be a penalty like tripping. I don’t view that as anything outside of a “shit I hope I don’t get a penalty because I probably could get one” look.

Not sure why you love calling out me being a contrarian recently outside of you being an ass but sure. Everything in game threads is a penalty or missed call and has been for several years so I feel comfortable with “boy cried wolf” as my going in position.
Bracing is the best argument, and I understand where you’re coming from, but I still think he saw him and lined him up. He could have easily braced for impact with just his left shoulder and staying low. Or, he could have dropped his stick, if he was turning his hand over. You can’t be throwing your stick up in the air like that and leveling your hand/stick with someone’s head.
 

Salem's Lot

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Bennett absolutely knew what he was doing, and the league won’t do anything. They were probably cheering at the league office that someone took out Marchand.
 

RIFan

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My first several impressions was that it was just a bad result for Marchand. For the most part Bennett looks like he is bracing and delivering a reverse hit. The camera angle from behind the goal shows him loading up the right hand and throwing a punch. League won’t even look at it never mind do anything about it.
View: https://twitter.com/BR_OpenIce/status/1789072721155899672?ref_src=twsrc%5Etfw%7Ctwcamp%5Etweetembed%7Ctwterm%5E1789072721155899672%7Ctwgr%5E46293a32856fab2b63a783dc4d676f65f789d91d%7Ctwcon%5Es1_c10&ref_url=https%3A%2F%2Fwww.barstoolsports.com%2Fblog%2F3513520%2Fheres-a-closer-look-at-the-sneaky-sucker-punch-that-panthers-lunatic-sam-bennett-delivered-to-bruins-captain-brad-marchand-eventually-knocking-him-out-of-last-nights-game-three
 

j44thor

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My bigger issue with the play, as Panger calls out, is the lack of icing. He wasn't close to the redline and somehow FL didn't get called for icing.
 

Myt1

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I mean, he literally turns to the official and starts to throw up his hand in a “Who, me?” immediately before he realizes that he got away with it.
 

kenneycb

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That’s exactly my point, though. You could just not have a “going in position,” in recognition that reality is not inversely related to the majority position on the board. You’re not a bad dude, but it’s fucking weird, and that’s what leads you to do things like make completely contradictory arguments on the same subject, depending on the target, or doing what you’re doing here: completely abandoning the reasoning that you were so convinced was correct, yet miraculously coming to exactly the same conclusion on new reasoning anyway. :)

You’re a really smart guy. You don’t need the intellectual shortcut of starting out with a position dictated by what others are saying. Just evaluate what happens on its own. I’m not trying to be an ass by pointing that out.

As for what happened, these guys have pretty amazing body control and I think he knew exactly what he was doing and hid it reasonably well, to the point of plausible deniability. I’ve thrown pretty much exactly that punch in other sports contexts. That doesn’t make me 100% convinced that’s what happened, but I think it’s more likely than not.
Dude I watched the play at full speed once and made an initial judgment that it was a hockey play. Saying completely convinced is a bit much. I can change my mind and don’t have to go to the other side of the boat. To the rest, I disagree and I’m not alone in my conclusion but I’ve already sorry more time on this on a Saturday than I care so whatrver.
 

Myt1

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Dude I watched the play at full speed once and made an initial judgment that it was a hockey play. Saying completely convinced is a bit much. I can change my mind and don’t have to go to the other side of the boat. To the rest, I disagree and I’m not alone in my conclusion but I’ve already sorry more time on this on a Saturday than I care so whatrver.
I mean, it’s not like this is the only time you ever came into a conversation half-baked to show how reasonable you were relative to all the people crying wolf. Your cognitive bias is to buck the trend. It’s your function at this point. I just think it’s a really weird one.
 

ColdSoxPack

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I didn't see the punch with the right hand until I watched the replay. You can see Marchy's head snap back. It is the same thing Bennett did to Knies. But it's Marchand.
 

Myt1

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I usually watch games on slight delay after I get my kids to bed. Started this one before, and my youngest stopped brushing her teeth and responded to my “He punched him in the fucking head!” with “That’s not being nice to the other team!” She’s deeply disturbed by injustice.
 
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grimshaw

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I think he knew what he was doing, but got lucky in the particular outcome. Just think it’s weird for people to suggest that a pretty plainly unnatural motion that just so happened to land right on the button of a hated opponent in a chippy, physical series, by a team known to take such liberties, in the first period a game after several game misconducts, was surely just babe in the woods clean play dumb luck.
This is exactly my take, and I'm never one to complain about refs or dirty hits. He and Marchand are both highly skilled at making stuff like that look natural.
 

kenneycb

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I mean, it’s not like this is the only time you ever came into a conversation half-baked to show how reasonable you were relative to all the people crying wolf. Your cognitive bias is to buck the trend. It’s your function at this point. I just think it’s a really weird one.
Would you prefer I say I’m not wrong and double down or go the half baked route? It’s the function I choose to engage on in SoSH. Your fascination with this and need to call it out as frequently as you do is weird as well. Appreciate the constructive criticism (I think?).
 

Myt1

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Would you prefer I say I’m not wrong and double down or go the half baked route? It’s the function I choose to engage on in SoSH. Your fascination with this and need to call it out as frequently as you do is weird as well. Appreciate the constructive criticism (I think?).
There’s another angle now, and the guy has a history of doing the same thing. Do you still think it was unintentional?
 

Salem's Lot

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Maroon, but he's not invested enough.
I got a feeling that’s he’s saying the right things in the room, but thinking to himself, these bunch of cowards aren’t worth the effort. Maybe when they’re getting blown out again on Sunday, someone will finally get angry.
 

Ferm Sheller

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I got a feeling that’s he’s saying the right things in the room, but thinking to himself, these bunch of cowards aren’t worth the effort. Maybe when they’re getting blown out again on Sunday, someone will finally get angry.
He's just collecting a check until next year. I'd sit him for just about anyone. Gentle giant.
 

The Napkin

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Seriously, they’re probably losing this series anyway. Someone should take him and not give a shit about a suspension. Doubt anyone on this squad has the balls honestly.
I was hoping Forbort would make himself useful and do it. The suspension would have just been a bonus
 

Kenny F'ing Powers

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It's hard because I have no problem with someone hitting back during a check. Marchand came in, was most likely not going to break up the play, and tried getting a little shoulder in after the puck was gone. It's a hockey play, but it's annoying. Bennett countering and putting Marchand on his ass is perfectly cool.

But goddamn does that punch look intentional. I assume he was trying to deliver a little eyewatering jab to the nose - a, "cut the shit chipping me late" warning - but it definitely came in hard. He could have bodied him up, still made Marchand take a bump, and got his point across without resorting to the cheap shot shit.

Still, Marchand likes to aggravate at every opportunity. This is a perfect example of it. People trying to take small liberties on him is just part of the Marchand experience.
 

Salem's Lot

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It's hard because I have no problem with someone hitting back during a check. Marchand came in, was most likely not going to break up the play, and tried getting a little shoulder in after the puck was gone. It's a hockey play, but it's annoying. Bennett countering and putting Marchand on his ass is perfectly cool.

But goddamn does that punch look intentional. I assume he was trying to deliver a little eyewatering jab to the nose - a, "cut the shit chipping me late" warning - but it definitely came in hard. He could have bodied him up, still made Marchand take a bump, and got his point across without resorting to the cheap shot shit.

Still, Marchand likes to aggravate at every opportunity. This is a perfect example of it. People trying to take small liberties on him is just part of the Marchand experience.
I’m more pissed at the Bruins lack of response after they saw it between periods. Especially the coach. Somebody should have been tapped on the shoulder to respond.
 

Dewey's 'stache

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When it happened I couldn’t understand how Marchand was so laid out by a moderate level check/hit. After seeing this, it is clear there was a punch. Additionally, the force of the punch is increased by the speed that Bennet is skating so this was a powerful shot to the chin/cheek/head.
Fuck Bennet, fuck the “yeah but Marchand response” and semi fuck Montgomery’s response , perhaps he’s not wanting to blow it up in the press too much before the game, but he doesn't come off in a way that meets the moment appropriately imo.
As someone posted above. We are likely losing this series anyway (without Marchand that possibility increases) so I have no problem if someone takes out some street justice on Bennet in game four.

Happy Mother Fucker’s day Mr Bennet