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Demarcus Lawrence to the Seahawks
Demarcus Lawrence to the Seahawks
Free agency thread
- Thread starter Saints Rest
- Start date
Thanks
From skimming around different pages it looks like most peoples' numbers are incomplete (which is understandable) as they wait for the details of different contracts to become public
When I think about the teams that might be in on the Cam Robinson bidding, I come up with:
- Cleveland
- New York Jets
- Chicago
- Minnesota
- New York Giants
- Seattle
Even taking that into account, it feels like we should be able to out-bid other teams if it came down to that.
And, based on nothing, I'd guess once Cam is resolved we'll find out quickly about Tyron Smith and the best remaining guards, like Becton, Jenkins, and Schref
Wonder shoe needs to drop for Cam to get resolved.... (?)
Sadly, I think you can add Kansas City Chiefs to that list. Especially if Mahomes & Jones are possibly restructuring.
Maybe, but the spent the bulk of that restructure already ( no possibly about it, got done before 4pm to make sure they were cap compliant, then all the deals in principle have started going through eating up that space created). I kind of doubt they plan to be in on Robinson and Moore, they picked Moore.
https://bsky.app/profile/fantasynflnews.bsky.social/post/3lk7jy3u53c2o
Jon Jones is moving on, signing a deal with WAS
Jon Jones is moving on, signing a deal with WAS
View: https://twitter.com/LosTalksPats/status/1899618853250081065?s=19
LT Cam Robinson has a “spotty reputation” and the #Patriots are worried about his motivation wavering if they were to pay him, per @AlbertBreer.
Breer says New England is not being “cheap” — it sounds like they would simply prefer to sign Robinson to an incentive-based deal.
LT Cam Robinson has a “spotty reputation” and the #Patriots are worried about his motivation wavering if they were to pay him, per @AlbertBreer.
Breer says New England is not being “cheap” — it sounds like they would simply prefer to sign Robinson to an incentive-based deal.
I know during these free agency periods across all leagues there are strategic leaks by GMs and agents and others. But this is the first I've heard about a team leaking "spotty reputation" about a player they are pursuing; seems like such a characterization is likely to convince the player to sign elsewhere.
Or get the public off their backs?
Fwiw, I'm pretty convinced Cam is not the answer. Id prefer Becton and drafting the best full arm lengthed LT option on draft day
Public expectation management and virtue signalling aside, I have no problem with them being slow to sign a guy they suspect might not be optimally motivated to keep our meal ticket on his feet because he's already made bank.
Based on the available options, I’d probably just roll with Lowe or, if Carter and Hunter are off the board, trade down and take Campbell.
One takeaway from the last few days.... seems like the league is a lot lower on Cam Robinson than the analysts.
Bedard had him worse than Lowe. If they can improve 4 OL positions they can probably cover up the LT position.
I think he's better than Lowe. BUT... I'm also not that down on Lowe, he isn't good, but he's not the disaster people make him out to be if you stick him in a good line where you can help him. If they added Jenkins or Becton or similar at LG.... I'd feel alright that without the flaming disasters at LG and RT Lowe could get by as a low end starter. I trust Josh to find ways to help with backs and TEs and playcalling. Maybe do some of what they tried at times on the right and stick Wallace as a 6th OL.
Also, Lowe is better in pass sets... It's funny I was looking at PFF, and Lowe, Dan Moore and Cam Robinson all graded out in their model as almost exactly the same in PBLK grade, it was run game that raised the other two up.
chargers have been my prediction. Family stays in the same house. Very little upheaval.
That said, may be awkward AF.
Absolutely, Chargers make a ton of sense. Would give Kupp the chance to play meaningful football for a 2024 playoff team, be able to contribute as a role player on a team with an already solid offense instead of being forced to play more than he’s able to anymore, and then from a personal perspective he and his wife have three kids, have lived in LA for a decade, and live in Oregon in the summer. Between growing up in Washington, going to Eastern Washington, and playing for the Rams, it looks like Kupp's entire life has been on the West Coast.
Still, athletes make decisions for all kinds of reasons. And at this stage in his career, Kupp probably only has a few seasons left, so it's not like he's making a 5+ year commitment to move somewhere.
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Interesting
It might the team showing their hand to other teams and saying "give the guy a bunch of guaranteed money at your own peril". If other teams also decide the rumors are true, Marrone knows what he's talking about, and even a team with huge amounts of money and desperate for an LT like New England is gun shy.... well, they might make their deals all incentive-laden, too.
And then, if we end up with the largest of the incentive-laden deals, we get the best of both worlds
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Another thought about the Cam Robinson news drop: if he really has those kind of motivation issues, then he almost certainly isn't a long-term Vrabel guy.
In which case nothing about signing him should preclude the team from drafting / looking for a better-fit options at LT
In which case nothing about signing him should preclude the team from drafting / looking for a better-fit options at LT
Because all it takes is one team who really wants one player who's there at four, and the Patriots will get an offer. Doesn't mean they'll do the deal, doesn't mean they don't also want the guy there at four. Will it happen? Who knows. Can it happen? Sure.
It’s been a ton of high character guys so far, so if he will clash with the culture, I’m more than OK passing on him.
I take your point, but it does seem like a lot of people these days - here, on sports talk radio, other boards - take as a given that, "Hey, if Carter/Hunter aren't there, we'll just trade down..." I think there's a decent chance - and I hope I'm wrong - that no one will want to. Yes, I acknowledge, it only takes one team wanting one guy, but: which player are they trading up for?
I don’t know. Isn’t it more likely that someone will want to trade for the #4 but just not actually give up what we’d like? It’s hard to believe NO ONE will trade up. They just won’t trade as much.
Sorry I don't buy this rationale at all. Unless this leak was someone going off the reservation, the most rational (perhaps only rational) explanation is prepping the fan base for not bringing in the lone LT left standing on the free agent market despite an abundance of cap space.
If you're are the Pats and you have this assessment of Robinson, you do offer him an inventive laden deal. But if you think you can still sign him - YOU DO NOT PUBLICLY LEAK THAT HE IS LAZY and that he will just go through the motions once he gets the bag. That is not the path to winning friends and influencing people. That's PR damage control.
I struggle to believe any marginally competent organization is going to set aside its own evaluation of a player based on the leak of one competitor's assessment - especially a competitor whose front office acumen leaves a lot to be desired of late.
I think the idea is they’d LIKE to trade down rather than select an available player. The issue is what one or more teams will offer, which we cannot know. And to that point, it’s a bit unreasonable to expect people to sketch out a bunch of scenarios without knowing anything about these teams’ draft boards.
Certainly possible no one will at whatever price the Pats deem worth moving down. But I think the logic is not crazy-- there's a decent chance one of the two elite talents (Hunter, Carter) is sitting there at 4 thanks to the QB-needy teams up top. Normally if you're sitting in the 5-10 range, moving up to get one of two consensus elite players in a draft is prohibitively expensive; multiple picks, future firsts, etc. This year, it probably costs your 2nd rounder, maybe less.
It certainly might not be a match-- most of those teams have multiple needs, so giving up even one premium to move up still may not make sense. But I could see Jax or LV seeing Hunter sitting within reach and deciding it's worth it (and the Pats deciding it's worth moving down to still get Graham/Membou while adding a pick).
Oh, I apologize, I wasn't clear and I was making assumptions. To be clear, if Hunter or Carter is available at #4, I'd be stunned (and depressed) if the Patriots didn't take (EDIT) him. I meant, and should have said, "Who is trading up to #4...if Hunter/Carter are not available?"
Hunh?
This line of thinking makes no sense to me. Which doesn't mean that I'm right. But neither I nor the bourbon understand this.
Let's take as a scenario:
- In reality, Cam Robinson has motivation issues and is some risk to go Mark Blount (if you're forgive the reference) on whichever team gives him a lot of guaranteed money
- The Patriots have accurately perceived this
- The Patriots don't know if other teams fully perceive this, perhaps in part because while other teams have heard rumors they're going on second- and third-hand information
- The Patriots correctly understand that they are perceived as knowing more about Cam's character, because Marrone, and other teams that have nobody on staff with first-hand experience with Cam will pay attention to their signals
- The Patriots preferred outcome is to sign Cam to an incentive-laden deal, slightly above other teams' incentive-laden offers
- They fear that other teams will offer more guaranteed money, and Cam (in Mark Blount fashion) will take the guaranteed money
The Pats don't need to "win friends and influence people". They have an incentive to get Cam to Foxborough on their terms. Which he will do if he has no better offers. If he comes, Vrabel et al will try to motivate/coach him so as to get the most out of him. If they fail, he'll be gone.
If Cam is going to get bent out of shape by being told he's lazy he's not likely to mesh with Vrabel anyway. Since the later seem kinda big on calling a spade a spade and trash-talking people. And if Cam is some precious snowflake who's going to get bent out of shape about some criticism, then good riddance. We don't need a slightly-better version of Lowe who can't take adversity. We saw how a lack of motivation played out with Chuks at LT last year.
You may not have been paying much attention lately, but Vrabel and co. are new to town. Their "acumen" has so far resulted in the team signing the #1 most-desired free agent on the market and a bunch of other defensive starters. He also seems to be legitimately highly-regarded around the league.
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Sorry gotcha, that makes a lot of sense. Pre-FA, I think the rationale would have been that in that case one of the teams looking for QBs might be interested, but with LV getting Geno and the Jets signing Fields, that definitely seems less likely now. Maybe Carolina, but if Sanders is there at 4, they probably figure he'll still be there at 8 (and are probably right).
I'll admit I'll miss the guy. Class act his whole time in Foxborough.
Not his fault he wasn't more talented. All you can control are what you say and do. Tip my hat to him.
Yup. 8 years and rarely missed games. Never flashy but made some nice plays. Good luck to him.
Shanny finally brings in Mac.
2/$7m with $5m guaranteed.
https://bsky.app/profile/rapsheet1.bsky.social/post/3lk7ygzr3kk2n
2/$7m with $5m guaranteed.
https://bsky.app/profile/rapsheet1.bsky.social/post/3lk7ygzr3kk2n
I actually think he'll do decent in that system if he actually gets any playing time. His arm still sucks, but there's an outside chance he has mild success as a backup there.
And Purdy hasn't exactly been able to avoid nagging injuries, so Mac might see some action
Get a QB
Get Carter/hunter if QB's are gone
They're in love with one of Membou/Campbell/Johnson/Graham etc.
Who knows why NFL teams do anything, it's often a bit of a mystery.
Why would you assume they wouldn't?
Well, first, just please see my follow-up post where I clarify that I meant that I don't see why someone would trade up to #4 if Hunter/Carter are already off the board. But setting that aside, from what we continue to read/hear, there aren't blue chippers after those two. Yes, on the QB thing, I guess I can see (and hope for!) that. And, sure, people might "fall in love with" some prospect, (sh)it happens. But this year in particular the CW seems to be that there's really not a ton of difference between 4 or 5 and at least 12. Just seems like a lot of folks around here are biting down hard on "Oh, well, yeah - we'll just trade out." My opinion - and, honestly, I would love to be wrong about this - is that, unless one of Hunter or Carter slips to #4 (in which case the NEP better take him), teams are going to be more willing than usual to wait for a guy to fall to them b/c these guys are all fairly "eh" in a fairly "eh" draft class. Again, I hope I'm wrong. If Hunter/Carter aren't available, I would way rather trade down to 8 or 10 or wherever and take Membou our Jalon Walker or even Tyler Warren.
So even though he's a good player, and the Patriots need good players, it's an "F" because he got paid a ton.
Well...let's say he didn't sign with the Patriots. SOMEONE was going to pay him huge dollars. Like, Carolina. So according to SI's reasoning, he was going to be an "F" pretty much no matter what.
Well...let's say he didn't sign with the Patriots. SOMEONE was going to pay him huge dollars. Like, Carolina. So according to SI's reasoning, he was going to be an "F" pretty much no matter what.
I mean, the mere fact that Christian Wilkins got 4/110 is a good indicator that this is market price for Williams, no?
You obviously need to look at signings in terms of value for money but it’s just lazy analysis to simply compare deals with other players at the position without taking cap escalation into account. The cap has jumped 25% in the last two years. 26m AAV now is like 20-21m AAV in 2023.
It was still an overpay to land the most talented interior DL on the market but really not the egregious one people are making it out to be.
It was still an overpay to land the most talented interior DL on the market but really not the egregious one people are making it out to be.