Former Raiders WR Ruggs charged in fatal crash, released from Las Vegas Raiders

fairlee76

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Driving drunk is reckless and stupid. Driving 156mph under any circumstances is reckless and stupid. So we're in agreement up to there. Now, driving 87, sober, on the highway...
Is how we get to the trailhead faster here in the mountain west! It is dictated by traffic and weather, but 87 MPH in rural CO/WY/MT is not a scary fast speed.

The few folks saying "he made A mistake" are missing a lot of mistakes. Got hammered, did not call a free ride home, got behind the wheel, drove way too fast, and rear-ended/killed someone.
 

Deathofthebambino

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Driving drunk is reckless and stupid. Driving 156mph under any circumstances is reckless and stupid. So we're in agreement up to there. Now, driving 87, sober, on the highway...
Yeah, umm, 87 is like normal left lane traffic around here in regular moving-along traffic. I drive fast, admittedly too fast at times, but never when drinking and never when there are other cars (I'm not a weaver) around. But if I come up to someone in the left lane doing 75, and they move over, I'll goose it a bit to give them time to move back left before they reach the car in front of them, out of courtesy. My car will go from 80-110 faster than most cars will go from 0-30, but then I'll get back down to a cruising speed of around 90. The type of car makes a big difference. Some of the cars I had in my 20's were more like Flintstone mobiles, and probably would have fallen apart at 90mph, even if they could have gotten to that speed before I got where I was going, but newer, high performance cars at 90mph feel like 50mph in a lot of cars. Control, steering, etc. are all non-issues at that speed.

If it's late and nobody is around, I'll open it up on a large highway, but never above 120 and only for a few seconds, moreso out of fear that there will be a cop around the next corner.
 

SeoulSoxFan

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Driving drunk is reckless and stupid. Driving 156mph under any circumstances is reckless and stupid. So we're in agreement up to there. Now, driving 87, sober, on the highway...
When we were living in Austin, we often took highway 130 heading down to San Antonio. It's speed limit is 85mph, highest in the States:

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Texas_State_Highway_130

The limit is much less here, of course. Now, this particular stretch of highway out to Yeongjong Island is wider than the 130 and has almost no traffic. Still, I think I average about 100kph (~62mph) pretty much every time out on this road.

Today, I felt fairly safe until 125kph (~78mph). My heart was racing at 140kph (~87mph) before slowing down to 100kph again. I can't grasp what it might be like to be going faster than say, 180kph (~112mph) nevermind over 200kph (~124mph).

Edit: all of this is to reiterate that doing 156mph (~250kph) is batf*ckingsh*tinsane.
 
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E5 Yaz

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Yeah, umm, 87 is like normal left lane traffic around here in regular moving-along traffic. I drive fast, admittedly too fast at times, but never when drinking and never when there are other cars (I'm not a weaver) around. But if I come up to someone in the left lane doing 75, and they move over, I'll goose it a bit to give them time to move back left before they reach the car in front of them, out of courtesy. My car will go from 80-110 faster than most cars will go from 0-30, but then I'll get back down to a cruising speed of around 90. The type of car makes a big difference. Some of the cars I had in my 20's were more like Flintstone mobiles, and probably would have fallen apart at 90mph, even if they could have gotten to that speed before I got where I was going, but newer, high performance cars at 90mph feel like 50mph in a lot of cars. Control, steering, etc. are all non-issues at that speed.

If it's late and nobody is around, I'll open it up on a large highway, but never above 120 and only for a few seconds, moreso out of fear that there will be a cop around the next corner.
This post and your (new?) tagline gave me a chuckle
 

E5 Yaz

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Well sure. But when I learned to drive, going 56 on the highway was illegal so I blame the government for how desensitized I am...
No worries ... you should see my framed collection of tags ripped off pillows and mattresses
 

Lose Remerswaal

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Yeah, umm, 87 is like normal left lane traffic around here in regular moving-along traffic. I drive fast, admittedly too fast at times, but never when drinking and never when there are other cars (I'm not a weaver) around. But if I come up to someone in the left lane doing 75, and they move over, I'll goose it a bit to give them time to move back left before they reach the car in front of them, out of courtesy. My car will go from 80-110 faster than most cars will go from 0-30, but then I'll get back down to a cruising speed of around 90. The type of car makes a big difference. Some of the cars I had in my 20's were more like Flintstone mobiles, and probably would have fallen apart at 90mph, even if they could have gotten to that speed before I got where I was going, but newer, high performance cars at 90mph feel like 50mph in a lot of cars. Control, steering, etc. are all non-issues at that speed.

If it's late and nobody is around, I'll open it up on a large highway, but never above 120 and only for a few seconds, moreso out of fear that there will be a cop around the next corner.
Route 128 northbound at 4:30-5PM from Randolph towards Route 9 is at least 80 in the left lane, sometimes 85. Just about every night. Even past the trooper parked on the side of the road at exit 33
 

barbed wire Bob

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Here in Utah speed limit on interstate 15 and interstate 80 is *80* for large rural stretches. It’s not unusual at all.
This map from Wikipedia should help out. . Fwiw, the Montana highway patrol won‘t stop you unless you are going at least 5 mph over the posted speed limit. I usually set the cruise control to 85 when travelling on the interstate and have been passed occasionally. In California it seems like the speed limits are routinely ignored on the freeways. I will regularly cruise at 80-85 mph on the 405 or on the toll roads and have never been stopped once. I have also been passed when going at those speeds.
46135
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Speed_limits_in_the_United_States
 

SeoulSoxFan

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We're discussing how fast is going 70, 80, 85, etc. & on highways no less.

Ruggs was doing a 156 on a city street, to bring the focus back on topic. That's twice or more than the highest speed limits for most States.

Prosecutor's said to be "fired up" (terrible choice of words) about seeking justice for the victim. It could be as high as 46 years behind bars:

View: https://youtu.be/n9IiXwi-KPo
 

Vegas Sox Fan

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The first thing I thought of when I heard where this happened was that there are SEVERAL stoplights along this stretch of road. To reach 156 he most likely ran at least one red light and possibly several.
 

scottyno

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I don’t know what’s weird as I said how ridiculous it still was. I was only informing those who didn’t know but kept hearing “city street” that this was a 3-lane Highway and not Boylston, that’s all.
There's a red light like every mile on that street, it's not exactly a highway
 

LogansDad

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That poor woman, and her dog, and her family. I wish I had more to say about it, but this whole thing is just heartbreaking.

So many lives ruined, because of one stupid, stupid action.
 

BaseballJones

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We're discussing how fast is going 70, 80, 85, etc. & on highways no less.

Ruggs was doing a 156 on a city street, to bring the focus back on topic. That's twice or more than the highest speed limits for most States.

Prosecutor's said to be "fired up" (terrible choice of words) about seeking justice for the victim. It could be as high as 46 years behind bars:

View: https://youtu.be/n9IiXwi-KPo
Exactly. I think a lot of us have hit 90 on the highway. That’s fast but even at that speed I’ve been passed.

But 156 on a city street? That’s absolutely insane on every level. It’s literally begging for death or some other catastrophe.
 

djbayko

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This map from Wikipedia should help out. . Fwiw, the Montana highway patrol won‘t stop you unless you are going at least 5 mph over the posted speed limit. I usually set the cruise control to 85 when travelling on the interstate and have been passed occasionally. In California it seems like the speed limits are routinely ignored on the freeways. I will regularly cruise at 80-85 mph on the 405 or on the toll roads and have never been stopped once. I have also been passed when going at those speeds.
View attachment 46135
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Speed_limits_in_the_United_States
Yeah, I've found that cops around Los Angeles won't even blink at 85 even though it's way over the speed limit. Of course, I'm also white.
 

voidfunkt

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I regularly hit 80-85 on The Pike. State Police don’t really seem to care too much around here unless you are being reckless doing it (e.g weaving). I personally do not feel comfortable going above 90 tho. Traffic density in eastern and central MA also dictates how fast you can really go. I can hit 90 for a few min then have to go back down to 75 for 15 or 20 min.

150mph is another ballpark tho. Not only are driver reaction speeds and stakes higher but then throw in other drivers on the road not expecting that kind of speed and yea recipe for disaster not to mention drunk, and possibly distracted. Oh yea and a city street.
 

Mueller's Twin Grannies

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If NFL players are really worried about their late night activities being reported back by the car service, there are two simple solutions, one easier to accomplish in the immediate:

1. Don't do stupid shit late at night, or at any time really, if there is even a 0.00000000000000001% chance it could go sideways. Every player should have a sponsor who can open up their mobile banking app every time they are about to do anything questionable, as a reminder of what is at stake (since money is usually paramount).

2. Contract the service through the NFLPA so ownership is not involved and can't ever find out. If someone breaches the NDA, then ruin the person's life as an example. And if it is through the NFLPA, then De Smith and his crew need to figure out how to convince the same people that they are trying to protect on the field that they are also trying to keep them safe off of it. If you trust the NFLPA to get you paid, you should be able to trust them to get you home safely.

The second makes the most sense long-term but the first would be a complimentary philosophy.

It would go a long way to avoid something like this ever happening again.
 

Marciano490

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All the anecdotal driving fast stories - I imagine there’s an exponential difference between 80-100 and every 10 mph past 100. I don’t think 156 is just twice 80 (ok, 78 you pedants) and more than 12 shots is twice 6 shots. Past a certain point it’s just fucking terrifying and stressful and I cannot imagine going that speed even alone on a race track.
 

Cotillion

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All the anecdotal driving fast stories - I imagine there’s an exponential difference between 80-100 and every 10 mph past 100. I don’t think 156 is just twice 80 (ok, 78 you pedants) and more than 12 shots is twice 6 shots. Past a certain point it’s just fucking terrifying and stressful and I cannot imagine going that speed even alone on a race track.
There’s a reason race car drivers lose a decent amount of water weight during a race. It’s not just the warmth of the nomex suit. It’s also the stress the body is under. It’s mentally and physically taxing.
 

glennhoffmania

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This map from Wikipedia should help out. . Fwiw, the Montana highway patrol won‘t stop you unless you are going at least 5 mph over the posted speed limit. I usually set the cruise control to 85 when travelling on the interstate and have been passed occasionally. In California it seems like the speed limits are routinely ignored on the freeways. I will regularly cruise at 80-85 mph on the 405 or on the toll roads and have never been stopped once. I have also been passed when going at those speeds.
View attachment 46135
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Speed_limits_in_the_United_States
That's wild. I've never seen a speed limit sign over 70. Now I know why.
 

djbayko

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All the anecdotal driving fast stories - I imagine there’s an exponential difference between 80-100 and every 10 mph past 100. I don’t think 156 is just twice 80 (ok, 78 you pedants) and more than 12 shots is twice 6 shots. Past a certain point it’s just fucking terrifying and stressful and I cannot imagine going that speed even alone on a race track.
I've only seen people agree with your concept. I think the recent tangent of high speed comfort levels was merely kicked off by someone saying that 87 was scary. I agree that speeds above 100 get insane very quickly.
 

SMU_Sox

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To answer your question @Shelterdog

I don’t usually go off-topic but since you asked I am not a practicing attorney. I did a joint grad degree and am in technology and insights. I help peddle salty snacks and sugary beverages. Law school ended up being a total waste of time and money for me - originally I thought I was going into distressed debt but found a passion for analytics. I don’t plan on going the professional writer route because I suck at writing and I like to do the stuff I do for SOSH and a certain slack channel because it’s my home away from home. Also I don’t think the money would be close.
Ruggs was a guy I loved in the draft. He was my WR2 in that draft behind Lamb but ahead of Jeudy. All indications were that he was a good person and a guy who would do anything the team asked. I had high hopes for Ruggs - he was one of my guys. He was blossoming into a good pro, close to 70 yards per game receiving. I think if he does his time and it is only 2-6/7 years he will get a second chance. Does he or will he deserve it? Mixed feelings there. On the one hand he destroyed a life. On the other he’s 22 and young people can make tragically bad decisions. He might have been special but we will probably never know. Heartbroken for the families.
 

Devizier

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All the anecdotal driving fast stories - I imagine there’s an exponential* difference between 80-100 and every 10 mph past 100.
Quadratic (m * v squared).

I know there are other factors at play, but that’s where you start. I “love” how the NFL has been so educational re: physics since DFG.
 

j44thor

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Ruggs was a guy I loved in the draft. He was my WR2 in that draft behind Lamb but ahead of Jeudy. All indications were that he was a good person and a guy who would do anything the team asked. I had high hopes for Ruggs - he was one of my guys. He was blossoming into a good pro, close to 70 yards per game receiving. I think if he does his time and it is only 2-6/7 years he will get a second chance. Does he or will he deserve it? Mixed feelings there. On the one hand he destroyed a life. On the other he’s 22 and young people can make tragically bad decisions. He might have been special but we will probably never know. Heartbroken for the families.
For me the third most tragic outcome from this is the fact Ruggs didn't end up with a career ending injury. Playing in the NFL is a privilege not a right. He should absolutely have lost that privilege after he chose to drive not only 3X the speed limit but doing so while being 2X the legal limit for BAC. He wasn't doing 80 on the highway and blew a 1.0 because he had a couple drinks at a friends house. He was on another planet as far as culpability is concerned. I'm honestly shocked they didn't find anything else in his system besides alcohol. I drank and drove more than I should have during my college days 25 or so years ago but one thing I never did was speed because I never wanted to give a cop an easy excuse to pull me over.
 

Deathofthebambino

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I watched it, and am kind of glad I did. Frankly, that video should be shown to every high school kid, and kid entering professional sports, so they know what can happen and how quickly their life and the lives of others can be destroyed in an instant by stupid, reckless decisions.
 

Captaincoop

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For me the third most tragic outcome from this is the fact Ruggs didn't end up with a career ending injury. Playing in the NFL is a privilege not a right. He should absolutely have lost that privilege after he chose to drive not only 3X the speed limit but doing so while being 2X the legal limit for BAC. He wasn't doing 80 on the highway and blew a 1.0 because he had a couple drinks at a friends house. He was on another planet as far as culpability is concerned. I'm honestly shocked they didn't find anything else in his system besides alcohol. I drank and drove more than I should have during my college days 25 or so years ago but one thing I never did was speed because I never wanted to give a cop an easy excuse to pull me over.
I know you didn't mean to do it this way, but it's weird to read you want this young guy to suffer retribution beyond whatever the criminal justice system gives him for driving drunk and killing someone, in the same post that you talk about your own drunk driving.

edit: and by the way, I don't say that to defend Ruggs in any way. What he did was reckless and stupid and cost someone their life.
 

j44thor

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I know you didn't mean to do it this way, but it's weird to read you want this young guy to suffer retribution beyond whatever the criminal justice system gives him for driving drunk and killing someone, in the same post that you talk about your own drunk driving.

edit: and by the way, I don't say that to defend Ruggs in any way. What he did was reckless and stupid and cost someone their life.
Nope I wish he broke his leg or ankle to the point there was zero chance he would ever play in the NFL again because we all know the criminal justice system is not equal and someone with his means has a much higher chance of a lighter sentence than average joe working at ABC corp. I'm all for him carrying on a normal life after he serves his time but not as an NFL player.
I'm not happy with the decisions I made 20yrs ago but those are in the past well before things like Uber were a thing and my small town didn't have taxis available.
 

Cesar Crespo

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Nope I wish he broke his leg or ankle to the point there was zero chance he would ever play in the NFL again because we all know the criminal justice system is not equal and someone with his means has a much higher chance of a lighter sentence than average joe working at ABC corp. I'm all for him carrying on a normal life after he serves his time but not as an NFL player.
I'm not happy with the decisions I made 20yrs ago but those are in the past well before things like Uber were a thing and my small town didn't have taxis available.
In this particular case, doesn't his celebrity status hurt him? They will use him as a deterrent.
 

joe dokes

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I've only seen people agree with your concept. I think the recent tangent of high speed comfort levels was merely kicked off by someone saying that 87 was scary. I agree that speeds above 100 get insane very quickly.
Neither most of us, nor most of our cars, have the ability to maintain control for very long at 100 or more.
 

cgori

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I've only seen people agree with your concept. I think the recent tangent of high speed comfort levels was merely kicked off by someone saying that 87 was scary. I agree that speeds above 100 get insane very quickly.
I've driven 155 (on a race track - I used to do this a lot), at the end of a long straightaway, for a second or two, before braking like crazy to make the next turn at like 80-90mph. That kind of speed is VERY SCARY. You need to work hard to get up to 155 too, like you are accelerating full-throttle for 15-20 seconds in a very powerful car and feeling that g force the entire time. You are very aware of it as it's happening.

I've also done 150 mph (240 kph) on the autobahn in Germany, in a VW. I didn't like it, the car got all wishy-washy and felt weird. It was much happier going 135 (220kph) so that was what I settled on for the unrestricted sections of the drive - I was going from Munich to Berlin which is a half-day drive. Lesser-known fact in Germany is that much of the autobahn does have speed limits, as you get closer to towns/cities the speeds go down, and then when you get out in the open it goes up and up until you pass the unrestricted sign again. You have to pay very careful attention, and the unrestricted sections have pavement that is race-track smooth.

I can't imagine doing 155 on any street in the US, just nope.
 

Eck'sSneakyCheese

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I've driven 155 (on a race track - I used to do this a lot), at the end of a long straightaway, for a second or two, before braking like crazy to make the next turn at like 80-90mph. That kind of speed is VERY SCARY. You need to work hard to get up to 155 too, like you are accelerating full-throttle for 15-20 seconds in a very powerful car and feeling that g force the entire time. You are very aware of it as it's happening.

I've also done 150 mph (240 kph) on the autobahn in Germany, in a VW. I didn't like it, the car got all wishy-washy and felt weird. It was much happier going 135 (220kph) so that was what I settled on for the unrestricted sections of the drive - I was going from Munich to Berlin which is a half-day drive. Lesser-known fact in Germany is that much of the autobahn does have speed limits, as you get closer to towns/cities the speeds go down, and then when you get out in the open it goes up and up until you pass the unrestricted sign again. You have to pay very careful attention, and the unrestricted sections have pavement that is race-track smooth.

I can't imagine doing 155 on any street in the US, just nope.
The C8 is a little bit of a different animal as some have mentioned. It can get to 150 in under 10 seconds. With the way that cars built I can easily see how an inebriated person could let it get out of hand before even realizing what the hell is going on.
 

lexrageorge

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I've driven 155 (on a race track - I used to do this a lot), at the end of a long straightaway, for a second or two, before braking like crazy to make the next turn at like 80-90mph. That kind of speed is VERY SCARY. You need to work hard to get up to 155 too, like you are accelerating full-throttle for 15-20 seconds in a very powerful car and feeling that g force the entire time. You are very aware of it as it's happening.

I've also done 150 mph (240 kph) on the autobahn in Germany, in a VW. I didn't like it, the car got all wishy-washy and felt weird. It was much happier going 135 (220kph) so that was what I settled on for the unrestricted sections of the drive - I was going from Munich to Berlin which is a half-day drive. Lesser-known fact in Germany is that much of the autobahn does have speed limits, as you get closer to towns/cities the speeds go down, and then when you get out in the open it goes up and up until you pass the unrestricted sign again. You have to pay very careful attention, and the unrestricted sections have pavement that is race-track smooth.

I can't imagine doing 155 on any street in the US, just nope.
Driven once on the autobahn, and was a passenger on a couple of occasions as well. It is a very different experience from a city street in Las Vegas, no matter how wide the street. It is also very different experience than any US interstate. What Ruggs did was not simply a momentary lapse in judgment.

P.S.: I topped out at 124 mph (200 kph), partly due to the fact that I was only on short stretch and I soon came across some active road repairs. Another secret to the autobahn: it is maintained to a degree far greater than the highways here.
 

cgori

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The C8 is a little bit of a different animal as some have mentioned. It can get to 150 in under 10 seconds. With the way that cars built I can easily see how an inebriated person could let it get out of hand before even realizing what the hell is going on.
Yes, the racetrack car I was referring to was a fully prepared 911 turbo: racing slick tires, racing suspension and partial roll cage. The acceleration in going from 100 to 150 in that thing is very serious and very real.

The C8 is probably quicker but not by much, just because it's 10-15 years newer and things have gotten a lot faster. You would be very aware of it. Though as you point out, he's inebriated (2x the limit) so maybe not. Impossible for me to imagine going that fast in that state.
 

Eck'sSneakyCheese

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Yes, the racetrack car I was referring to was a fully prepared 911 turbo: racing slick tires, racing suspension and partial roll cage. The acceleration in going from 100 to 150 in that thing is very serious and very real.

The C8 is probably quicker but not by much, just because it's 10-15 years newer and things have gotten a lot faster. You would be very aware of it. Though as you point out, he's inebriated (2x the limit) so maybe not. Impossible for me to imagine going that fast in that state.
Oh I totally get it a 911 is a rowdy car but that thing had a lot more of a visceral response when accelerating. Especially track prepped. Probably about two seconds slower in the 1/4 which is kind of a lot. Not trying to argue though. This is a devastating tragedy that happened because somebody was able to afford a car he couldn't handle. You should legitimately need a special license to drive some of these production cars nowadays.
 

johnmd20

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Oh I totally get it a 911 is a rowdy car but that thing had a lot more of a visceral response when accelerating. Especially track prepped. Probably about two seconds slower in the 1/4 which is kind of a lot. Not trying to argue though. This is a devastating tragedy that happened because somebody was able to afford a car he couldn't handle. You should legitimately need a special license to drive some of these production cars nowadays.
I have an Audi RS7. If you do jam the gas, the G force is ridiculous. The entire car rises. And it can get to 60 in under 3.5 seconds. And driving that car on the highway at 80-90 is like a cruising speed, no drag or noise or rattling. It's just smooth.

Fast cars are fast. If you slam the gas, you're going to fly. And die. I don't think Ruggs couldn't handle the car. I think he was drunk and very, very stupid.
 

Eck'sSneakyCheese

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I have an Audi RS7. If you do jam the gas, the G force is ridiculous. The entire car rises. And it can get to 60 in under 3.5 seconds. And driving that car on the highway at 80-90 is like a cruising speed, no drag or noise or rattling. It's just smooth.

Fast cars are fast. If you slam the gas, you're going to fly. And die. I don't think Ruggs couldn't handle the car. I think he was drunk and very, very stupid.
That’s fair. I assumed a 20 something year old kid with more money than he knows what do with can’t handle a high end car. Could be so but it was definitely more the alcohol in his system. All he had to do was get a ride… just sad