#DFG: Canceling the Noise

[BroodsSexton]

So many frustrating angles to this, as a Patriots fan.   And, like Spygate, the more you bring in the myriad contradicting evidence as to why NE shouldn't be punished, the more crazy you sound, because the media is peddling the simple, satisfying, answer of: They cheated again!

Totally hear you. I had to try to explain the situation over breakfast to my 9 year old son (who reads the papers every morning),with my wife -- who is unabashedly not a football fan -- trying to use this as a lesson in doing the right thing, playing honestly, and coming clean when you screw up or get caught. "It's a little bit more complicated than that" led, ultimately, to a cessation on football-related discussions for peace in the marriage. Lol.

And I have to say, this is the aspect of the NFL's non-handling of this that bothers me. I can take the carnival. But this does have an impact on kids. The league wants Brady out there pitching integrity of the game and himself as a role model, but some legitimate leadership and management from the League is also part of the game's integrity.

 

[Buck Showalter]

What a circus.
 
When this story initially broke earlier in the week; if you told me that Friday morning's Today Show on NBC would open with Savannah Guthrie (!!!) reporting about this topic as the LEAD STORY (!!!) in the United States of America......
 
I'd have laughed in your face.
 
Just win......they hate the Patriots to begin with.....may as well make everyone's head explode with another Lombardi Trophy in our grasp.

 

[nolasoxfan]

I wonder what Pete Carroll is saying to Seattle actually.

 
For Seattle’s sake, Pete better be preaching a lot of “the most dangerous animal is a cornered animal,” because I believe a cornered, angry animal is coming their way.

 

[genoasalami]

So...everyone from Belichick to Brady to ball boy to the Valet guy all deny any knowlrdge or involvement ....then what?

 

[BroodsSexton]

So...everyone from Belichick to Brady to ball boy to the Valet guy all deny any knowlrdge or involvement ....then what?

Then you go back to your hole and play the next game, dude.

 

[ivanvamp]

You know what's really amazing about all this, when you actually stop and think about it?  Pretty much everybody - including most people who have posted here (myself included) - started drawing conclusions pretty early on in this process, based on tweets and vague, conflicting reports that used "league sources" or whatever, "testimony" from current or former NFL players, etc.  But the amount of demonstrably known FACTS about this case you can count on one hand.  
 
In some respects, I think this is actually the dark side of the twitterverse coming into sharp focus.  Everyone wants to get SOMETHING out there - a piece of "information", an opinion, whatever.  And everyone is wired in.  And something that would normally take a real investigative reporter a long time to sort through and confirm has just blown up out of control.
 
It's actually a pretty sad statement on our society and on the field of journalism.

 

[nolasoxfan]

So...everyone from Belichick to Brady to ball boy to the Valet guy all deny any knowlrdge or involvement ....then what?

 
Profit.

 

[BigJimEd]

I'm sure Seattle isn't took happy about this. Not if it extends into next week. They are going to be pissed that all the attention is on this and not on them trying for back to back.


I agree with a lot of that article from Leitch. I, and others, have wondered why the NFL had let this fester. Some think it's because if the ratings. I'm not buying it. I dint think the ratings will be affected much and it will more negative long term impact than positive if anything.
I think the NFL league office is frozen. They didn't want to dismiss it too early Monday for fear it would come back to haunt them later like Rice.
So they waited. Now as the uproar builds in the media while others in the have wonder what the guys I'd about, they aren't sure how to get out off it.


The fact that it's Belichick, who Goodell reportedly hates, twisting in the wind is an added bonus.

 

[mannydelcarwreck]

Brunnel will be distraught when he discovers there is no real proof....he may even get back on the devils grass to cope.

 

[DJnVa]

The only thing that unites everyone in the corner of Goodell after the mishandling of Ray Rice? A Pats cheating scandal. It's mana from heaven from them.

 

[Valek123]

I find the King article concerning. If what he is writing means the following then it doesn't look good:
-all balls tested with a gauge pre-game and found to be properly inflated
-at halftime only pats balls found to be deflated
-pats balls replaced with backup pats balls that were tested and passed inspection
-pats balls and colts balls used in second half tested after game and found to be properly inflated

In that case, if we accept the above as true, that means the only reasonable explanation is that someone deflated the footballs. I don't think the odds of a rogue ball boy are high and I don't think Goddell will even need more proof at that point. He'll drop the hammer on the Pats.

 
IF all 48 balls were tested by the same gauge, or pressure tested at ALL.
 
Here's my problem with this whole story... 11 footballs were reduced by 2psi, from all media accounts EXACTLY 2psi.  Imagine you are the "deflator" you have a needle and while others are around are going to reduce the pressure in these 11 balls exactly 2psi, consistently 11 times.  Seems insane frankly...  I'm more and more in the line of thought that those 11 were not tested OR were tested with a defective gauge, then actually tested or tested with a good gauge and found to be deflated.
So much BS in this story, if the Ref's didn't do their job you know damn well they will bury it as this would likely be a career ender.  If a ball boy did this, he should be hired by a government firm as that individual is leak-proof so far with apparently the entire world more focused on ball pressure than things that actually matter.

 

[Comfortably Lomb]

 
Will Leitch says the same thing:
 

 
At least there are a few voices of reason publishing things. Too bad almost no one pushing this is interested in listening.
 
Anyone, at this point, who doesn't think there is a strong anti-Patriots bias in the sports media is willfully blind. This is a witch hunt.

 

[Burt Reynoldz]

Based upon what is generally understood about the personalities that make up the Seahawks, I can more or less guarantee that not a single one of them is walking around expecting anything less than an absolute onslaught from the Patriots.  I'd be surprised if guys like Earl Thomas have stopped studying since the minute the game ended.
 
Edit:  This was in response to the post above about what Pete Carroll is telling his team, but the quote function isn't working for me for some reason. 

 

[dcmissle]

 
For Seattles sake, Pete better be preaching a lot of the most dangerous animal is a cornered animal, because I believe a cornered, angry animal is coming their way.

Pete is happy. All the repeat stuff has gone away. Just play your game.

 

[DJnVa]

More from Vegas Sharks:
 



Sharks of Vegas @SharksOfVegas · 18m18 minutes ago


If you think BB "threw Brady under the bus" watch his press conference again. He played you.
0 replies2 retweets2 favorites

 Reply
 Retweet2
 Favorite2

More










Sharks of Vegas @SharksOfVegas · 1h1 hour ago


At this point, the NFL is delaying action in hopes of more information. They can't punish the Patriots with current info. #LetsEAT
0 replies32 retweets38 favorites

 Reply
 Retweet32
 Favorite38

More












Sharks of Vegas @SharksOfVegas · 10h10 hours ago


NFL is not saying the balls were not tampered with, just that there is very little evidence against the Patriots.

 

[ivanvamp]

By the way, in Seattle you have a coach who was involved in one of the biggest scandals in NCAA history (and that's saying something).  He had his 2004 national championship stripped because of the scandal.  You have a team in Seattle littered with PED suspensions during his tenure (see:  http://www.nj.com/super-bowl/index.ssf/2014/01/super_bowl_2014_pete_carroll_addresses_drug_suspensions_with_seahawks.html).  They have a guy who comes off as perhaps the biggest punk in the league in Richard Sherman (who, actually, I kind of like, but mine is not the general view of him).
 
And yet, this team will be the "good guys" in the upcoming Super Bowl, at least according to the general public.  
 
It's astonishing.  

 

[RIrooter09]

Bob Ryan on sports radio down here in Miami. "People don't hate BB because he's successful, they hate him because he's a word that begins with a D and ends with a K." He went on to moan about BB's behavior during the Q&A portion of the press conference yesterday and called him a "blankhole".

 

[Omar's Wacky Neighbor]

You know what's really amazing about all this, when you actually stop and think about it?  Pretty much everybody - including most people who have posted here (myself included) - started drawing conclusions pretty early on in this process, based on tweets and vague, conflicting reports that used "league sources" or whatever, "testimony" from current or former NFL players, etc.  But the amount of demonstrably known FACTS about this case you can count on one hand.  
 
In some respects, I think this is actually the dark side of the twitterverse coming into sharp focus.  Everyone wants to get SOMETHING out there - a piece of "information", an opinion, whatever.  And everyone is wired in.  And something that would normally take a real investigative reporter a long time to sort through and confirm has just blown up out of control.
 
It's actually a pretty sad statement on our society and on the field of journalism.

You must have missed the poll on the first day, where we all agreed that all posts in the thread would be [IF]-understood

 

[( . ) ( . ) and (_!_)]

I'm curious how often during the pre-game inspection Refs find balls that are not within the right range of air pressure?  Surely there is a ref or recently retired ref that can be asked.  Is it a common thing for Refs to have to give an extra pump of air or to take a bit out?  Mostly I'm just curious, but seems like something someone would want to ask, if nothing else to better understand the process and how through the balls are actually checked pre-game.

 

[jimbobim]

O Brunell is going on MFB with Fauria in an hour. I hope they shred him to bits and ask him if he would really be throwing a world class hissy fit if say it were the jags ..... 

 

[Ferm Sheller]

I like Richard Sherman, ivanamp.  Don't get me wrong, he's the biggest trash talker going, but there's nothing wrong with that.  He uses it to his advantage on the field, and wisely so.  He seems like a decent enough guy off the field.  if he was a Patriot, we'd all love him.

 

[Comfortably Lomb]

By the way, in Seattle you have a coach who was involved in one of the biggest scandals in NCAA history (and that's saying something).  He had his 2004 national championship stripped because of the scandal.  You have a team in Seattle littered with PED suspensions during his tenure (see:  http://www.nj.com/super-bowl/index.ssf/2014/01/super_bowl_2014_pete_carroll_addresses_drug_suspensions_with_seahawks.html).  They have a guy who comes off as perhaps the biggest punk in the league in Richard Sherman (who, actually, I kind of like, but mine is not the general view of him).
 
And yet, this team will be the "good guys" in the upcoming Super Bowl, at least according to the general public.  
 
It's astonishing.  

 
It's not astonishing. It's all about tearing down BB and the Pats.
 
Straight up: the real story here is how screwed up the sports media is. Collectively, they are a joke.

 

[Burt Reynoldz]

Weirdly, the guy who got nailed the hardest for PED/drug use is now playing for the Patriots.  The rest aren't even on the Seahawks, and almost none were key contributors to last year's title.

 

[GregHarris]

Yeah the crickets we are hearing from the refs/retired refs is interesting.  I doubt the balls are measured more than just a hand test.

 

[TheoShmeo]

Bob Ryan on sports radio down here in Miami. "People don't hate BB because he's successful, they hate him because he's a word that begins with a D and ends with a K." He went on to moan about BB's behavior during the Q&A portion of the press conference yesterday and called him a "blankhole".

Bob Ryan is a great writer.  He's also one of the most sanctimonious figures in the media who regularly tells us how to be fans.  His views on BB's press conference couldn't be less compelling.

 

[H78]

You know what's really amazing about all this, when you actually stop and think about it?  Pretty much everybody - including most people who have posted here (myself included) - started drawing conclusions pretty early on in this process, based on tweets and vague, conflicting reports that used "league sources" or whatever, "testimony" from current or former NFL players, etc.  But the amount of demonstrably known FACTS about this case you can count on one hand.  
 
In some respects, I think this is actually the dark side of the twitterverse coming into sharp focus.  Everyone wants to get SOMETHING out there - a piece of "information", an opinion, whatever.  And everyone is wired in.  And something that would normally take a real investigative reporter a long time to sort through and confirm has just blown up out of control.
 
It's actually a pretty sad statement on our society and on the field of journalism.

 
This is completely spot on. I've had the same exact thought.
 
This is such a cranky old man 'get off my lawn' thing to say, but Twitter has turned the entire civilized world into in bunch of Chatty Cathys. I don't think that's how it was originally intended to be used but that's absolutely what's come to fruition. It's manipulated to feed whatever agenda people want to believe, for better or worse.
 
Journalism as anyone over the age of about 25 once knew it is completely and unequivocally dead.

 

[Leather]

I'm curious how often during the pre-game inspection Refs find balls that are not within the right range of air pressure?  Surely there is a ref or recently retired ref that can be asked.  Is it a common thing for Refs to have to give an extra pump of air or to take a bit out?  Mostly I'm just curious, but seems like something someone would want to ask, if nothing else to better understand the process and how through the balls are actually checked pre-game.

 
Two potential problems with this:
 
1) Ex refs are probably still collecting benefits, and don't want to rock the boat vis a vis their union; and
2) It's quite possible ex refs would just say "We did them almost always by hand, and just did some manual pumping to get them to the right feel if one felt flat."   
 
I would bet on both being true, personally.  You think a guy who does this for 10 years (high school, college, etc...) thinks he still needs to use a hand gauge to tell if a ball "feels right"?  Come the fuck on.  That type of consistent, humble, methodology doesn't exist outside of science labs and comic books.

 

[DennyDoyle'sBoil]

I tead King's report as saying the NFL is convinced of tampering, but it's between a rock and a hard place because it can't suspend anyone for its biggest event, so it's just going to ride it out and then bring the hammer down in the offseason.

 

[jimbobim]

I'm curious how often during the pre-game inspection Refs find balls that are not within the right range of air pressure?  Surely there is a ref or recently retired ref that can be asked.  Is it a common thing for Refs to have to give an extra pump of air or to take a bit out?  Mostly I'm just curious, but seems like something someone would want to ask, if nothing else to better understand the process and how through the balls are actually checked pre-game.

 
This there are many different small players(personnel) that one would think if you are journalist getting paid one could find. Unless as I suspect the NFL has issued a gag order on all info other than their annoymous leaks which just leaves the mort report info and a frothing mob who hates the patriots .... 

 

[Burt Reynoldz]

Honest question - do people really think that if this story was coming from the other side, i.e. if the underinflated balls belonged to the Seahawks, that the media fire storm wouldn't be as bad? It's not about some grudge against the Patriots, it's about a semi-stupid "controversy" which can be exploited for mass ratings during the biggest sports-media event of the year.  Since it happened to the Pats, it's getting tied in to Spygate, etc.  If it happened to the Seahawks, it would get tied in to Pete Carroll at USC. 

 

[Ed Hillel]

Weirdly, the guy who got nailed the hardest for PED/drug use is now playing for the Patriots.  The rest aren't even on the Seahawks, and almost none were key contributors to last year's title.

Wasn't it just weed with him?

 

[amarshal2]

 
IF all 48 balls were tested by the same gauge, or pressure tested at ALL.
 

That is EXACTLY what Peter King is saying. That IF is becoming increasing less likely, particularly if the NFL was tipped off beforehand.

Right now the Pats need Frank Underwood to get some leverage on a ball boy.

 

[jsinger121]

Honest question - do people really think that if this story was coming from the other side, i.e. if the underinflated balls belonged to the Seahawks, that the media fire storm wouldn't be as bad? It's not about some grudge against the Patriots, it's about a semi-stupid "controversy" which can be exploited for mass ratings during the biggest sports-media event of the year.  Since it happened to the Pats, it's getting tied in to Spygate, etc.  If it happened to the Seahawks, it would get tied in to Pete Carroll at USC. 

 
It wouldn't get a fraction of the media coverage. It would be a blip on the radar.

 

[Ed Hillel]

Honest question - do people really think that if this story was coming from the other side, i.e. if the underinflated balls belonged to the Seahawks, that the media fire storm wouldn't be as bad? It's not about some grudge against the Patriots, it's about a semi-stupid "controversy" which can be exploited for mass ratings during the biggest sports-media event of the year.  Since it happened to the Pats, it's getting tied in to Spygate, etc.  If it happened to the Seahawks, it would get tied in to Pete Carroll at USC. 

Seahawks probably, but a loser franchise nobody would give a shit. Every single ESPN guy admitted as much yesterday.

 

[Comfortably Lomb]

Bob Ryan on sports radio down here in Miami. "People don't hate BB because he's successful, they hate him because he's a word that begins with a D and ends with a K." He went on to moan about BB's behavior during the Q&A portion of the press conference yesterday and called him a "blankhole".

 
This is what it is: a bunch of wannabe journalists who think covering sports is some kind of higher calling are pissed when a guy making 20-100 times their salary won't give them the quotes that make churning out their articles easy. The only difference between an asshole and a good coach for these guys is working the press room.

 

[yecul]

In the court of public opinion the future outcome of this is irrelevant. That has all been decided. All Pats fans can hope for is limited punishment. The NFL will do something, but whether it's just a fine or also includes suspension/loss of picks is of concern. Again though, the facts are out of scope for both those things -- public opinion and the NFL's action. Neither needs more than the accusation and the desire to quell emotions, respectively.
 
BB is a dick and an asshole so he doesn't get leeway and gets undue attention. What can you do?

 

[ivanvamp]

I'm curious how often during the pre-game inspection Refs find balls that are not within the right range of air pressure?  Surely there is a ref or recently retired ref that can be asked.  Is it a common thing for Refs to have to give an extra pump of air or to take a bit out?  Mostly I'm just curious, but seems like something someone would want to ask, if nothing else to better understand the process and how through the balls are actually checked pre-game.

 
I guarantee you that when Belichick said that he's learned more and talked more about game football preparation and measurement over the last few days than over 40 years prior, he's telling the truth.  And why would that be the case?  BECAUSE NOBODY FREAKING CARES ABOUT THIS!  Not the refs.  Not the NFL.  Not the teams.  
 
If Aaron Rodgers admits to trying to slip overinflated footballs past the refs, hoping they don't find out, do you REALLY think he cares if Brady's footballs are a little *under* inflated?  
 
The QBs all know that they each want the footballs the way they want them, that feel best to them.  Their livelihood depends on it.  So they understand this full well.  The receivers want their QBs throwing as good a pass as they can.  The NFL, which wants more offense, catered to Peyton and Tom and allowed the teams to prepare their footballs as they desired.  There is NO WAY the league has ever had refs check the psi of the balls during or after the game.  Ever.  
 
The players, the teams, the league, the refs:  NONE OF THEM GIVE A CRAP about the psi of the footballs.  
 
If they did, when the freaking Carolina Panthers were caught on television tampering with the balls during a game, the league simply told them to stop.  No investigation.  No punishment.  No witch hunt.  Nothing.  When Aaron Rodgers says he deliberately tries to slip overinflated balls past the ref, the NFL doesn't do anything about it.  Zip.  
 
Why?
 
BECAUSE NOBODY F****** CARES!!!
 
Until now.
 
And why do they care NOW?
 
Because it's the Patriots, that's why.
 
This is the stupidest thing I've ever seen become a "scandal".

 

[Ed Hillel]

 
It wouldn't get a fraction of the media coverage. It would be a blip on the radar.

How's that Browns texting scandal going? I must have missed it on GMA.

 

[twibnotes]

Just saw the video of Brunell crying.  Something's not right there.  Loved ones should intervene. 

The time for that intervention has passed

 

[Burt Reynoldz]

With Browner it started with PEDs (well, Adderall) and then the following year it was supposedly weed (I think, I can't recall if it ever actually came out what he tested positive for).

 

[loshjott]

Honest question - do people really think that if this story was coming from the other side, i.e. if the underinflated balls belonged to the Seahawks, that the media fire storm wouldn't be as bad? It's not about some grudge against the Patriots, it's about a semi-stupid "controversy" which can be exploited for mass ratings during the biggest sports-media event of the year.  Since it happened to the Pats, it's getting tied in to Spygate, etc.  If it happened to the Seahawks, it would get tied in to Pete Carroll at USC. 

 
I agree it would be bad because of the reason you mention, though maybe not as bad.   But if it were any other "unsullied" coach or franchise it would be much, much less.

 

[ivanvamp]

I like Richard Sherman, ivanamp.  Don't get me wrong, he's the biggest trash talker going, but there's nothing wrong with that.  He uses it to his advantage on the field, and wisely so.  He seems like a decent enough guy off the field.  if he was a Patriot, we'd all love him.

 
I agree.  But I don't think our view is the general consensus out there.  

 

[Comfortably Lomb]

Honest question - do people really think that if this story was coming from the other side, i.e. if the underinflated balls belonged to the Seahawks, that the media fire storm wouldn't be as bad? It's not about some grudge against the Patriots, it's about a semi-stupid "controversy" which can be exploited for mass ratings during the biggest sports-media event of the year.  Since it happened to the Pats, it's getting tied in to Spygate, etc.  If it happened to the Seahawks, it would get tied in to Pete Carroll at USC. 

 
Yes. Seahawks more than a less competitive team but nothing close to this. This is entirely fueled by anti-BB/Pats bias.
 
 

In the court of public opinion the future outcome of this is irrelevant. That has all been decided. All Pats fans can hope for is limited punishment. The NFL will do something, but whether it's just a fine or also includes suspension/loss of picks is of concern. Again though, the facts are out of scope for both those things -- public opinion and the NFL's action. Neither needs more than the accusation and the desire to quell emotions, respectively.
 
BB is a dick and an asshole so he doesn't get leeway and gets undue attention. What can you do?

 
Give him a raise.

 

[Judge Mental13]

Weirdly, the guy who got nailed the hardest for PED/drug use is now playing for the Patriots.  The rest aren't even on the Seahawks, and almost none were key contributors to last year's title.

 
Bruce Irvin plays for the Patriots?

 

[simplyeric]

Patriot Nation turns its lonely eyes to the one doofus who might rise above all others in this hour of desperation.

Help us, Eli Manning. You're our only hope.

 
 
oh fuck.
 
I was going to say "where are the Barcelona Dragons when you need them".
 
 
But, fucking Eli....fuck.

 

[DJnVa]

I tead King's report as saying the NFL is convinced of tampering, but it's between a rock and a hard place because it can't suspend anyone for its biggest event, so it's just going to ride it out and then bring the hammer down in the offseason.

 
This doesn't seem like something where MORE info will come out months from now.
 
If there are MORE people to interview then that just introduces more problems with the chain of custody.

 

[pedroia'sboys]

I tead King's report as saying the NFL is convinced of tampering, but it's between a rock and a hard place because it can't suspend anyone for its biggest event, so it's just going to ride it out and then bring the hammer down in the offseason.

This is what confuses me. Everyone denies there is no evidence.
It's impossible, not every ball was tested 2 psi under.
Balls 1 psi and change can't be taken into account weather other factors impossible to know.
They have nothing, and thats why they haven't said anything yet and are looking like fools.
Goodell butchered the Ray Rice case, and he's butchering this, announce something. You're taking away from your main event. Inept

 

[Kull]

You can't spell "inflated" (footballs & egos) without "NFL". It's also right at the center of "self-inflicted". Worth noting that you also need "IC" (Indy colts) for the latter.

 

[Burt Reynoldz]

There's a persecution complex going on here which is very strange to me.  The Patriots aren't some hated team, at all.  If anything, it's the opposite - Old White Men love fawning over The Patriot Way and the Genius of Belichick and whatnot.  If this happened to the Seahawks, or the 49ers, or the Cowboys, or the Broncos, or whoever, it would be just as big of a story, especially if it happened right before the Super Bowl, where the media cycle has nothing else to do but report on it. 

 

[H78]

I keep trying to see this from the other perspective.
 
"What if the Broncos came in, crushed the Patriots by 38 points, and we found out the next day that Peyton Manning possibly under-inflated footballs to get a better grip?"
 
When I think about it that way, I feel like there would be a part of me that would think Peyton's a loser for looking for any insignificant advantage he could get, but a much, much bigger part of me would think, "He's one of the best ever. PSI is not the reason why. Who cares?"