Healthy and in shape, if I'm correctly reading between the lines of the coverage of his rehab. Not that he was "out of shape" in the usual way of fattening up on HoHo's and beer, but that he simply wasn't strong enough to withstand the rigors of it all. In the brief WooSox game action I saw last week, he *looks* a bit bigger than what I recall from April.
Couldn’t he do that in Boston? Do we really need to see more of Romy and Valdez?
It's nice to see him getting some reps with Story. The infield defense is noticeably better with them.
There was a grounder in the middle innings that looked totally routine, but the final hop was an in between, kind of weird bounce, and he played it flawlessly.
Sale hasn't been healthy since 2018 (and even then there were warning signs). Again, 35 year old pitchers just don't return to Cy Young form after missing the majority or all of the previous 5 seasons. What Sale did this past season was unpredictable, remarkable, and unprecedented. However, any assessment of the trade should also take into account the likelihood of Sale's health going forward. Missing the playoff games is not a good sign. At the very least it is a continuation of a pattern of him breaking down near the end of the season, which has been going on a lot longer than 5 years.
Yes and no. Chris Sale is frustrating because he’s unreliable. And his unreliability is predictable, you know he’s going to break down at the end of the season when you need him most. It happened every year that he was here and you’re just waiting for that other shoe to drop.
Meanwhile, we used to be able to afford to hire movers. Good metaphor.
Oh I totally get it. But he still likely would have gotten the Sox at least INTO the playoffs this season. Maybe they would have been similar to the Orioles (or Braves) and just been bumped. But it would have made the last two months of the season more exciting and again..... you just get in. Yes, it would have been nice to have had an Eovaldi '18 and Price '18 to be the playoff 1 and 2 and I'm not sure (unlikely) if a completely maxed out innings Houck and Bello could have done that but I would have liked to have seen.
Sale was fantastic in 2024. It was, arguably, his best season ever because, unlike 2017, he was able to pitch well late into the season. But he still broke down, predictably I’d say considering the above. And I remain surprised teams haven’t given him more forced rest during the regular season.
Interesting. This kinda plays into a weird "hope" that Sale's early injury last season meant he could come back and be strong post ASB and into the playoffs last year... which again, is why I don't fault Bloom for basically standing pat last year. A "rested" Sale returning. Whitlock. Story. Houck. That everyone BUT Sale pooped their collective pantaloons is why they fell apart (oh and interestingly the offense suddenly couldn't score, along with the bullpen falling apart- the first I will continue to blame on Cora, the latter for roster construction/bullpen overuse on Bloom.
Sale may have helped the Braves reach the postseason, but in part due to his absence they won as many postseason games as the Red Sox did.
Sale made 29 starts. That's fewer than 3 Sox starters. *That* is an overlooked part of parting with him. No more "ok, not-Sale people, maybe you'll be starting or maybe you wont be....or maybe you'll start a few games and then maybe you wont......depends on Sale....maybe it will be Monday, or maybe Wednesday...." The predictable unpredictability didn't just affect the major league rotation; it affects roster management.
It’s certainly possible Sale didn’t want to rest at all during the season but I’d argue it was likely more about the Braves having a ton of injuries forcing them to fight for their playoffs life that forced them to roll the dice and hope he stayed healthy.
Bingo.
He made 29 starts. That means he *was* skipped 3 or 4 times.
Also if he wasn't hurt he still wouldn't have been available for the 2 games they just lost because he would have pitched game 162
He was only skipped on his final start (one of the double header games on Monday). Otherwise there were some extra rest days mixed in, but he took his turn every time.
....which he was only able to do because the Sox shut him down for much of August.
They did give him plenty of starts with one day or more of extra rest. So I’d argue that’s better than just shutting him down for two weeks and then ramping him back up. And to be fair to Sale, he apparently was feeling great and ready to start in ths division series, unfortunately the Braves couldn’t get there. And that sucks for Sale to not get any playoff starts in his Cy Young season
I mean Sale pitched the same amount of innings as Houck, pitched 15 more innings than Bello and 5 less innings than Crawford in 4 less starts. The innings is the relevant number here. There simply is no such thing as ‘safe’ bets for starting pitchers. I‘d bet against all 3 of those pitchers making 30 starts again next year and odds are at least one will miss significant time with an injury.
Part of the reason Atlanta didn't get to the division series is that Sale was unavailable due to an injury.
It was unfortunate irony for Atlanta that they got him with the idea that he was *not* the anchor of the rotation. But he ended up being that, so his loss helped crater them.
I've been beating the drum for years that he's not a guy that can ever be depended on, which means his perceived value is massively overinflated versus his actual value.
I don't disagree with you at all..... and I wouldn't count on him being healthy next season as he was this season, even figuring in his disappearance during crunch time.... but WHO is a "dependable" starter?
I think this explains the recent hire of an expert in pitching mechanics. The goal is to see beyond something other than luck, though who knows if that is possible.
It's been the Grail for over a decade. I remember talking to a Dodgers FO guy when I was in college and he told me that was the #1 thing they were trying to figure out. That would've been 15 years ago, and we're not really any closer.
Remember when it was all about the "Inverted W"? I don't think there's been anything even close to conclusive about that...
Wasn't the "inverted W" poster child Mark Prior? Not a great case, as it turns out. He was done as a major leaguer before he turned 26. Though he kept trying in the minors through 2013, including a forgettable (as in, I'd completely forgotten it happened) stint with Pawtucket in 2012.
Verlander had a remarkable run but even he broke down eventually (though is probably age as much as anything). And including Chapman as some bastion of durability when he throws 60 innings a year by design seems faulty. Plus he's spent time on the injured list at various times in his career (7 non-COVID IL stints in 13 seasons), including for "shoulder/rotator cuff inflammation" in 2017 and "elbow inflammation" in 2021.I came across this guy looking into slow motion mechanics. Not sure how fresh or on the ball he is, but he seems to feel that a "flat" arm, as opposed to an "up" arm just before planting the foot, is a technique many modern pitchers are taught as a way to increase velocity, but that also increases the risk of injury.
The Difference
The difference between...
1. Dominant and durable pitchers...
- Of the past...
- Nolan Ryan
- Tom Seaver
- Mariano Rivera
- Greg Maddux
- Of the present...
- Justin Verlander
- Aroldis Chapman
2. Modern, hard-throwing, but far more injury-prone pitchers like...
...isn't complicated.
- Matt Harvey
- Joel Zumaya
- Mark Prior
It can be seen with the naked eye.
In the pictures above, notice how, at Foot Plant, Justin Verlander's pitching arm is UP while Matt Harvey's pitching arm is FLAT.
