Celtics vs Heat ECF Redux Discussion Thread

[Cellar-Door]

I thought the usage of Tatum was really weird too. He had been having a solid offensive game, particularly getting to the line, and then was on the bench for the first 4 minutes of the 4th and then when he came out he wasn't touching the ball. Feels like he should be leading the team in FGA every game unless they are running away with things or Brown is going supernova (which he wasn't). Especially with how he had been playing the last 5 quarters.

I agree two bigs is not needed, especially when Rob isn't playing great on D, and more Grant and DWhite would be better. Feels like they overthought things in general.

The 4 minutes early in the 4th is something Joe did last series and it worked really well as it let him go the rest of the way, but then when he came in, guys didn't make an effort to find him, and he didn't demand the ball like he needs to.

I think Joe should consider going back to White in the starting lineup, and go to Grant for 15 minutes or so (no Pritchard).Mostly though he needs guys (particularly Brown and Brogdon) to play with discipline and stay on their shooters... if Jimmy gets 40 he gets 40, you can't let him get 25-30 AND get wide open 3s for Strus and Martin. On offense we were okay, but need to go to more Tatum PnR actions, particularly when Zeller is out there, he should be getting attacked every possession by the best driver on the court with him.

 

[timelysarcasm]

I don't know why some of the press has been "Miami steals game 1". They didn't steal it, in any way, in my opinion. They beat the Celtics. This wasn't some weird game where they got lucky and came up with the win in the end. They embarrassed the Celtics in the 3rd and fully deserved the win. Yes, the C's shot themselves in the foot in their attempt to get it close at the end - but that's it. It was just getting it close.

That’s pretty much the verbiage they always use when a road team takes game 1.

 

[Saints Rest]

The 4 minutes early in the 4th is something Joe did last series and it worked really well as it let him go the rest of the way, but then when he came in, guys didn't make an effort to find him, and he didn't demand the ball like he needs to.

I think Joe should consider going back to White in the starting lineup, and go to Grant for 15 minutes or so (no Pritchard).Mostly though he needs guys (particularly Brown and Brogdon) to play with discipline and stay on their shooters... if Jimmy gets 40 he gets 40, you can't let him get 25-30 AND get wide open 3s for Strus and Martin. On offense we were okay, but need to go to more Tatum PnR actions, particularly when Zeller is out there, he should be getting attacked every possession by the best driver on the court with him.

What I think I saw in the first half was an effort by the Celtics D to deny the pass to the shooters out on the perimeter and let whoever was on Butler and Bam take it one-on-one. This was especially effective when they could get those guys to pick up their dribble. But in the second half, everyone was sagging and doubling onto those two which led to a lot of wide open 3s.

 

[wade boggs chicken dinner]

I don’t understand what’s happened with Rob. He seems physically pretty good. He’s gone from being the best defender in the league for half a season to whatever this is.

To my eyes, TL has lost a little of bit of mobility - particularly laterally - which means he's not as switchable as he was last year. Hopefully this is something he'll get back with a normal offseason work on his knee.

It's almost like Joe reluctantly started out with TL/Al, but really wanted to play 3 guard sets, going as far as playing Pritchard 12 minutes? But then CJM turns around and only plays White 21 minutes? Some odd rotation decisions.

The Mazzulla Defamation League can save it, last night was on the players, but it isn't very hard to see Miami's HC advantage over Boston (which isn't shocking)

I'm not a big coach basher for any reason but I was baffled by PP's appearance. My first thought was that Marcus was hurt for some reason (also saw him go to the locker room) but that doesn't seem to be the case. I'm sure the Cs had some research/statistics to show why PP should play but I'd love to see them as I"m not sure what PP has to offer that White or Hauser can't.

But whatever the reason, seemed like Butler was happy when he saw PP on the floor.

 

[Auger34]

Brogdon will never get the press for it, because it's easier to find other scapegoats who are more enticing, but Jesus Fucking Christ, he is SO BAD on the defensive end. It's getting hard to watch, and when they get Butler on him, on ball, off ball, doesn't matter, he gets chewed up and spit out, leaving the rest of our defense scrambling around to rotate.

I’ve been beating this drum (heavy in the playoffs especially in game threads, to the point @lars10 may have locked me).

Hes absolutely terrible. On ball I think he’s bad (maybe only kind of bad?), off ball he is a train wreck. The dude watches the ball constantly.

 

[kfoss99]

I’ve been beating this drum (heavy in the playoffs especially in game threads, to the point @lars10 may have locked me).

Hes absolutely terrible. On ball I think he’s bad (maybe only kind of bad?), off ball he is a train wreck. The dude watches the ball constantly.

There was a play where he helped off Strus (I think) in the corner to double Pritchard's assignment, like, 4 feet away. Strus barried the corner three. It was really stupid.

In general, the defense in the first half was pretty good. Let Butler and Bam take as many mid-range shots as the please. Just make sure you don't leave three point shooters open.

 

[bigq]

The third quarter was a mess for the Celtics. One factor that contributed to the lopsided score for the quarter was getting killed on the boards. In the 3rd Miami collected 13 rebounds including 4 offensive boards to just 5 (all defensive) for the Celtics. Three of Miami's offensive rebounds led to relatively quick put backs.

In every other quarter the Celtics had the edge in rebounds. I'm not certain if the 3rd was where the Celtics played the most minutes with the 3 guard line up. It is surprising to me that Boston got outworked on the boards in the 3rd when Tatum played the full 12 minutes while Rob and Al got 8 minutes each.

 

[8slim]

The lack of any third quarter TOs made me chuckle. A couple hours earlier my son had a high school lacrosse game. His team was leading 5-4 at halftime, then got blitzed in the first few minutes of the 3rd quarter. Five minutes in and they were losing 9-5. His coach called a TO, and the team settled down. Ended up winning the game 11-10.

I don't know if there's data to show that calling TOs really "work" to stem runs. But I'm pretty sure they don't hurt. Obviously they didn't lose because of it -- that's on the players -- but it's almost as if Mazzula is now actively not calling TOs to make some kind of weird point. To whom, I have no idea.

 

[Cellar-Door]

I do think the "if only timeout" thing is undercut a bit by them getting worked after the timeout too (TV timeout) when it was tied.

 

[lovegtm]

I do think the "if only timeout" thing is undercut a bit by them getting worked after the timeout too (TV timeout) when it was tied.

Yup, they got a timeout at 78-78, and proceeded to get completely rekt afterwards. The whole TO thing is getting really stupid.

 

[NomarsFool]

Basketball is a game of runs, and I think it is really easy to get a little lost and bewildered and I think calling a TO to let people catch their breath, discuss a bit what is going wrong, and (hopefully) make adjustments is useful in my personal experience and seems to be the conventional wisdom of like 99% of basketball coaches out there. It's fine to be a contrarian, at times, and I get it more with the idea during the regular season to try and train the players to get used to playing through stuff. But, at this point it just looks like stubborness.

 

[bigq]

I don't know if there's data to show that calling TOs really "work" to stem runs.

I think @InstaFace did a data dive on this earlier this season and if I recall correctly the data he turned up was inconclusive.

 

[dhellers]

What I noticed in the 3rd quarter run was how flat/tenative everyone was.

I think of Malcolm Gladwell's thesis on choking:
".. differences between "implicit" and "explicit" learning... Under conditions of stress... the explicit system sometimes takes over. ...
choking is about thinking too much. Panic is about thinking too little. Choking is about loss of instinct... loss of fluidity, of touch."

Would better use of TOs help players unmuck their brains? To get out of a "return to simplicity" mindset, with its over focus and slowness"?

To get them to a mental place where they use their huge reservoir of deep learning to react quickly and effectively ; rather than passively or with simple minded aggresion?

https://www.newyorker.com/magazine/2000/08/21/the-art-of-failure (paywalled)

 

[Curt S Loew]

I don't know why some of the press has been "Miami steals game 1". They didn't steal it, in any way, in my opinion.

I think the take is more that the Celtics were favored and by most accounts the better team going into the series. But I wholly agree with your assessment.

 

[lars10]

I think the take is more that the Celtics were favored and by most accounts the better team going into the series. But I wholly agree with your assessment.

The Celtics we’re up by 9 at half.. it’s not like Miami dominated the entire game.

Edit;: and if Tatum didn’t turn the ball over three times in a row more or less the game would have been a lot closer at the end as well.

 

[lovegtm]

Everyone wanted them to take a TO at 71-68.

They got a TO at 78-78.

They then proceeded to play horribly.

They did the thing everyone wanted, and it didn't work, and people are acting like they didn't do it.

 

[Curt S Loew]

The Celtics we’re up by 9 at half.. it’s not like Miami dominated the entire game.

Oh, sure. I didn't mean to convey they did. I just think the media was referring to the series as a whole and most people had The Celtics taking this game.

 

[8slim]

I think @InstaFace did a data dive on this earlier this season and if I recall correctly the data he turned up was inconclusive.

I'm sure. It seems incredibly noisy, so I'm not at all surprised. That being said, I seriously doubt calling a TO hurts.

 

[lovegtm]

I'm sure. It seems incredibly noisy, so I'm not at all surprised. That being said, I seriously doubt calling a TO hurts.

As has now been said a million times, they got a TO soon after most people wanted it, and it didn't help.

 

[CoffeeNerdness]

Is this a legal play by Adebayo? Looks borderline at best to me.

https://www.nba.com/stats/events?CFID=&CFPARAMS=&GameEventID=511&GameID=0042200301&Season=2022-23&flag=1&title=Jump Ball Williams III vs. Adebayo: Tip to Butler

 

[Auger34]

There was a play in, I believe, the 4th quarter when Caleb Martin absolutely trucked Derrick White on a “screen”. Whoever he was setting the “screen for” drained the corner 3 too. That play stands out in my mind as an egregiously bad call

 

[bakahump]

Its like this team (for the last 4 or 5 years) goes in at half and does Quaaludes. They then spend the 3rd qtr messing up completely......and either win it or lose it with a furious 4th qtr.

 

[CoffeeNerdness]

As has now been said a million times, they got a TO soon after most people wanted it, and it didn't help.

Out of the TO, they got a great look for Tatum (miss), a fantastic Tatum block, Butler steals the lob to TL- hat tip to Butler though the service could have been better, then a nice mid-range jumper from JB followed by a few lame turnovers and Miami going white hot in the closing minutes. So in the immediate minute following the TO they actually played fine. They hung with 5-6 pts. until 2:46 until the end of the quarter when Miami was able to stretch the lead to 12 pts.

In the first half after Boston TOs: Brodgon three, Tatum layup, Tatum 2/2 from the line.

 

[InstaFace]

I think @InstaFace did a data dive on this earlier this season and if I recall correctly the data he turned up was inconclusive.

yeah the only two studies that had any merit to their design basically showed that there was no discernible effect.

 

[JakeRae]

Who would Grant take minutes from? In earlier season matchups, TimeLord wasn't even dressed but you still need minutes from him now.

Do we see TimeLord take 15-17 minutes and Al and Grant handle the bulk of the minutes?

Game 2 of the season saw minutes distributed as:

• AL - 34 minutes
• Grant - 25 minutes
• Vonleh - 15 minutes

First game of a back to back in late November/early December saw this:

• AL - 33 minutes
• Grant - 31 minutes
• Kornet - 15 minutes

Second game of the back to back saw:

• AL - 34 minutes
• Grant - 33 minutes
• Kornet - 10 minutes

Final matchup of the season, second game of a back to back in late January therefore no Al, saw this:

• Grant - 36 minutes
• TimeLord - 31 minutes
• Kornet - 13 minutes
• Blake - 4 minutes

Pritchard.

Outside of elimination games we’ve been playing 8 deep with about 10 mpg to the 8th man. Grant or Hauser should get those minutes. If Grant excels in those minutes, it’s possible he could also steal some minutes from Timelord, who struggled with defensive discipline in Game 1. I’m not going so far as to say he should do so at this point, but it’s a possibility that Mazzulla would be much better able to feel out if he put an 8th man on the court whose best case scenario is contributing positively rather than not hurting us too badly.

I also think I agree with those who think we should revert to our regular starting 5. Timelord is less effective in a series where the focus on defense is staying home on shooters versus the Philly series where there were several guys we only needed to stay close enough on to make passable contests and close outs because they didn’t really want those shots even if though they had the talent to make them.

I think we were doubling Butler way too much and it wasn’t working. He has great recognition of both when he can use the help defender to get himself to the line and of advantages he can pass out of. The best way to defend the Heat is to make Butler do it himself. That doesn’t mean never doubling, especially when it’s coming from a defender who is already in the lane area, but it means we need to be very disciplined because aside from Butler, Bam, and to a lesser extent Lowry, everyone else on Miami is primarily looking to launch threes.

To put some stats on that, these playoffs Love is taking 83% of his shots from three, Vincent is at 61%, Strus is at 69%, Martin is at 58%, and Robinson is at 84%. Even Lowry is 48%. We need to force those guys to put the ball on the floor and create or force Butler and Bam to go it alone. The Heat won’t shoot 50+% going forward, but that group can easily sustain ~40% shooting if we give them open looks.

 

[Just a bit outside]

There was a play in, I believe, the 4th quarter when Caleb Martin absolutely trucked Derrick White on a “screen”. Whoever he was setting the “screen for” drained the corner 3 too. That play stands out in my mind as an egregiously bad call

That was on a Butler three and it was awful. White seems to have some difficulty on d in the playoffs. The refs seem to let more bullyball go on offense and he gets overpowered.

 

[the moops]

That was on a Butler three and it was awful. White seems to have some difficulty on d in the playoffs. The refs seem to let more bullyball go on offense and he gets overpowered.

Looks like it was in the 3rd, not the 4th.

it's not a terrible call. White needs to fight through this https://www.nba.com/stats/events?CFID=&CFPARAMS=&GameEventID=469&GameID=0042200301&Season=2022-23&flag=1&title=Butler 3PT Jump Shot (27 PTS) (Martin 2 AST)

 

[the moops]

Also, what the hell is the weird thing Caleb Martin does with his right leg on every jump shot?

https://www.nba.com/stats/events?CFID=&CFPARAMS=&GameEventID=473&GameID=0042200301&Season=2022-23&flag=1&title=Martin 25' 3PT Jump Shot (10 PTS) (Butler 5 AST)

 

[Just a bit outside]

Looks like it was in the 3rd, not the 4th.

it's not a terrible call. White needs to fight through this https://www.nba.com/stats/events?CFID=&CFPARAMS=&GameEventID=469&GameID=0042200301&Season=2022-23&flag=1&title=Butler 3PT Jump Shot (27 PTS) (Martin 2 AST)

I think both things can be true. Martin walked in his path which is a foul and White could fight more.

 

[Cellar-Door]

Looks like it was in the 3rd, not the 4th.

it's not a terrible call. White needs to fight through this https://www.nba.com/stats/events?CFID=&CFPARAMS=&GameEventID=469&GameID=0042200301&Season=2022-23&flag=1&title=Butler 3PT Jump Shot (27 PTS) (Martin 2 AST)

It's definitely a terrible call, he sets a pick without ever setting his feet and keeps right on going. White is correct to fall down too, because Butler is already in his shooting motion and you're not getting to him once the contact occurs, so it's about maximizing chance of a call at that point. Now maybe instead of going down there he should pretend to try and go sideline side of him so Martin continuing to move is more obvious, but that should be an easy offensive foul call by the ref, it's textbook.

 

[Auger34]

Looks like it was in the 3rd, not the 4th.

it's not a terrible call. White needs to fight through this https://www.nba.com/stats/events?CFID=&CFPARAMS=&GameEventID=469&GameID=0042200301&Season=2022-23&flag=1&title=Butler 3PT Jump Shot (27 PTS) (Martin 2 AST)

I don’t mean to pile on but that’s 100% a foul. Like that’s a textbook moving screen. I don’t even think White had anything to fight through because he sets it out of nowhere and throws his shoulder into him.

 

[8slim]

As has now been said a million times, they got a TO soon after most people wanted it, and it didn't help.

In the 3rd quarter? I must have missed it.

 

[PedroKsBambino]

Smart: "We get tired of doing the little things sometimes".

Cool.

a few years ago I’d have said this may reflect coaching that isn’t pushing hard enough. But we’ve seen three coaches with this core and same results. Coaching matters, and Joe made mistakes last night. But the core issue is the players and focus, not coaching.

 

[ManicCompression]

Not sure if this was posted, but: View: https://twitter.com/CoupNBA/status/1659057365742673921?cxt=HHwWgoCzscr4k4YuAAAA


Couper Moorhead: Game 1 against the Bucks was one of the best shotmaking games in recent league postseason history. This one might end up rivaling that one once the numbers come in.

Later tweet: Suffice to say...the numbers do indeed rival Bucks Game 1

Miami made a ton of shots that we shouldn't expect them to make going forward. Yes, Tatum and Brown puking all over themselves in crunch time was concerning, as were the turnovers in general, but I have to believe that the Heat's performance is not sustainable over 7 games. I think the two-big lineup has got to go, and we should get more minutes to White/Brogdon/Grant with Rob limited to 20 minutes or so a night. That will open up spacing on offense and our defense will be better able to switch on their small lineups when Bam is the only big.

Not the game 1 we wanted, but it feels much less like a structural issue against a better team and more like the Heat were just, ahem, hotter shooters compared to baseline expectations. It's going to be a long, frustrating series, and the Cs just showed they can win one of those.

 

[NomarsFool]

Gabe Vincent 3-5
Duncan Robinson 0-2
Kevin Love 2-3
Jimmy Butler 2-4
Kyle Lowry 3-5
Caleb Martin 3-7
Max Strus 3-5

Other than Duncan Robinson, that's some amazing 3P shooting.

 

[8slim]

I think a marketing campaign of "Boston Celtics Basketball: Hoping for Unsustainable" is pretty damn catchy.

 

[BigSoxFan]

a few years ago I’d have said this may reflect coaching that isn’t pushing hard enough. But we’ve seen three coaches with this core and same results. Coaching matters, and Joe made mistakes last night. But the core issue is the players and focus, not coaching.

Yup. Joe clearly has some improvement to make but nothing matters if the core of this team doesn't change how it operates. Game 7 against Philly shows what they're capable of. Game 1 last night also shows what they're capable of. The variance is maddening. We're talking about a team that has been on the doorstep of a title for 5 years and, yet, doesn't seem to want to play the way they know is required to get there. Championship windows can't be wasted. They go away too fast.

 

[8slim]

Yup. Joe clearly has some improvement to make but nothing matters if the core of this team doesn't change how it operates. Game 7 against Philly shows what they're capable of. Game 1 last night also shows what they're capable of. The variance is maddening. We're talking about a team that has been on the doorstep of a title for 5 years and, yet, doesn't seem to want to play the way they know is required to get there. Championship windows can't be wasted. They go away too fast.

Baseball Jones and I discussed last week whether these Cs will be like the 80s Bucks or the 80s Pistons. Seems like we only have a season or two left to know for sure.

 

[kieckeredinthehead]

46 points is the most Miami has scored in a quarter all year. They’d scored 40 or more four times previously.

 

[Cellar-Door]

In the 3rd quarter? I must have missed it.

https://www.espn.com/nba/playbyplay/_/gameId/401547671

At 6:28 with the score tied 78-78.

It's an interesting game log to look at, basically it was a 9 point lead missed 3, made 3, missed 3, made 3 took it to 3, but the looks for BOS were good. Now that's the spot maybe you take a TO..... Joe chose not to.

Smart draws a foul, but only goes 1 of 2 from the line, made 2, missed 3. down to 1 but again good looks. Smart blocks Strus but it bounces right back to him for an easy putback, tough luck but decent D.
Tatum smokes a layup, but we get an offensive board and draw a foul. Joe subs in Brogdon for Al.
We make a 3, they make a 2, we miss, Tatum gets called for goaltending, both sides trade some misses, Marcus makes a 3, Jimmy putback and 1.... timeout.

So really from the point where people wanted Joe to take a timeout until the one he knew he was getting... nothing really changed much, bunch of back and forth, and MIA came out of it +2 (with a FT on the way). Then a bunch of trading 2s for 3s and it expands to 9.

 

[BigSoxFan]

Baseball Jones and I discussed last week whether these Cs will be like the 80s Bucks or the 80s Pistons. Seems like we only have a season or two left to know for sure.

It's easy to look at the Jays' age and assume a title will eventually come, and maybe it will, but you just never know year to year. The Jay's can certainly be the foundation for a title for several more years. But you need more than that. Horford is almost done. TL could be done at any time. Smart is a thick body who won't age too well. Brogdon is already a big defensive issue. Injuries can happen at any time and ruin seasons. We saw that with KG.

There should be a "hair on fire" sense of urgency this year and there just isn't. And that's the frustrating part for me. But, obviously, still time to survive this but need a win tomorrow as step one. You simply cannot get down 3-1 to this Heat team. I have zero confidence in our ability to rattle off 3 straight against a well-coached team like this with an assassin in Butler.

 

[Auger34]

I think Joe could make some adjustments before Game 2 to lean more into defense.

IMO, I think Brogdon and Whites minutes should be flipped. Brogdon has way too many lapses and White confidently stepped into a few 3’s last night.

Pritchard shouldn’t play. I would like those 12 minutes to go to Grant and give him a chance to guard Bam. It’s well documented that I am no Grant fan but I think it’s time to dust him off and see if he can recapture what made him a rotation player for however long.

If the offense completely stalls out like it did during Q3 I would play Hauser over PP.

Another easy adjustment…stagger the bad defensive players more effectively. @JakeRae called it out in the game thread but why are Pritchard and Brogdon playing together? Why is Pritchard playing in a 3 guard lineup? Those types of decisions are putting those players in their worst possible situations and asking for the Heat to score. IMO, if you have Brogdon out there he needs to be on the court with 4 other strong defensive players (same with Pritchard)

 

[Auger34]

It's easy to look at the Jays' age and assume a title will eventually come, and maybe it will, but you just never know year to year. The Jay's can certainly be the foundation for a title for several more years. But you need more than that. Horford is almost done. TL could be done at any time. Smart is a thick body who won't age too well. Brogdon is already a big defensive issue. Injuries can happen at any time and ruin seasons. We saw that with KG.

There should be a "hair on fire" sense of urgency this year and there just isn't. And that's the frustrating part for me. But, obviously, still time to survive this but need a win tomorrow as step one. You simply cannot get down 3-1 to this Heat team. I have zero confidence in our ability to rattle off 3 straight against a well-coached team like this with an assassin in Butler.

I think tomorrow is a “hair on fire” effort. To me, The question is in neutral or favorable situations.
IE, if it’s 1-1 do they come out balls to the wall to win another game or is it the same bullshit that we’ve all become sadly accustomed to. If it happens to be 2-1, is this core capable of showing the focus/competitive drive/killer instinct to put their foot on the other teams throat and get it to 3-1?

Honestly, I don’t know. There does seem to be a weird mix of mindlessness and nonchalance from Tatum/Brown and Smart game to game (shit, you could change that to quarter to quarter). It’s a weird team with an extreme amount of variance for stuff that you normally don’t see have variance (BBIQ, staying focused and competitive)

 

[BigSoxFan]

I think tomorrow is a “hair on fire” effort. To me, The question is in neutral or favorable situations.
IE, if it’s 1-1 do they come out balls to the wall to win another game or is it the same bullshit that we’ve all become sadly accustomed to. If it happens to be 2-1, is this core capable of showing the focus/competitive drive/killer instinct to put their foot on the other teams throat and get it to 3-1?

Honestly, I don’t know. There does seem to be a weird mix of mindlessness and nonchalance from Tatum/Brown and Smart game to game (shit, you could change that to quarter to quarter). It’s a weird team with an extreme amount of variance for stuff that you normally don’t see have variance (BBIQ, staying focused and competitive)

Agreed. We are likely to see the "good" Celtics tomorrow and I expect a win. If they don't win, that's the painful lesson they'll have learned from Game 1 because they'll probably be done if they go to Miami down 0-2. But, assuming they win tomorrow, they still won't be feeling the pinch tied 1-1 so I'd expect more uneven efforts in Miami and would gladly take a split. My broader concern is that eventually this stuff catches up with you. Last year, they damn near pulled it off. This year, Miami will take them out before they get to the Finals, if things don't improve.

There is something weird about this team at home. They're 4-4 so far in the playoffs. Everyone loves to reference the 2008 Celtics but that team's issue was road games. They were like 13-1 at home during that run. They protected home court. This team doesn't.

 

[benhogan]

To my eyes, TL has lost a little of bit of mobility - particularly laterally - which means he's not as switchable as he was last year. Hopefully this is something he'll get back with a normal offseason work on his knee.


I'm not a big coach basher for any reason but I was baffled by PP's appearance. My first thought was that Marcus was hurt for some reason (also saw him go to the locker room) but that doesn't seem to be the case. I'm sure the Cs had some research/statistics to show why PP should play but I'd love to see them as I"m not sure what PP has to offer that White or Hauser can't.

But whatever the reason, seemed like Butler was happy when he saw PP on the floor.

In 4 games against Miami this season Payton Pritchard did this:
G1 DNP-CD
G2 DNP-CD
G3 DNP-CD
G4 (with Horford, Bown, Smart, and Brogdon out) Celtics lose 98-95 (Boston scores 13pts in Q4)
PP was awful, 42 minutes, 10pts,14FGA. Derrick White played 34 minutes, scored 23pts had more assists & fewer TOs. Maybe there was some foul trouble there, I can't recall.

There is nothing here that screams cut White's minutes to play Payton Pritchard. OR even play PP over Grant Williams or Hauser since PP is a much worse defender than those 3.

This rotation selection was even odder than the Blake Griffin appearance in Round 1.

https://www.espn.com/nba/boxscore/_/gameId/401468869

 

[ifmanis5]

"They just don't learn" is a fair assessment.
View: https://twitter.com/NBCSCeltics/status/1659246352692281362

"They just don't learn & everyone in that locker room deserves blame for it" @ChrisForsberg_ weighs in on the C's brutal Game 1 loss to Miami Read more: https://nbcsports.com/boston/celtics/celtics-have-mostly-themselves-blame-maddening-game-1-loss-heat

 

[Auger34]

In 4 games against Miami this season Payton Pritchard did this:
G1 DNP-CD
G2 DNP-CD
G3 DNP-CD
G4 (with Horford, Bown, Smart, and Brogdon out) Celtics lose 98-95 (Boston scores 13pts in Q4)
PP was awful, 42 minutes, 10pts,14FGA. Derrick White played 34 minutes, scored 23pts had more assists & fewer TOs. Maybe there was some foul trouble there, I can't recall.

There is nothing here that screams cut White's minutes to play Payton Pritchard. OR even play PP over Grant Williams or Hauser since PP is a much worse defender than those 3.

This rotation selection was even odder than the Blake Griffin appearance in Round 1.

https://www.espn.com/nba/boxscore/_/gameId/401468869

YMMV on how smart these guys are or if you even care but on The Lowe Post, Zach Lowe had Chris Herring on. They were both, especially Herring, very critical of Mazzulla. Herring's quote was "All of the Celtics issues are fixable but Mazzulla has to keep his head in the game and make better decisions than randomly putting in Peyton Pritchard to get picked on by Jimmy Butler". They were also both mystified that Grant Williams isn't playing at all

 

[bosockboy]

"They just don't learn" is a fair assessment.
View: https://twitter.com/NBCSCeltics/status/1659246352692281362

"They just don't learn & everyone in that locker room deserves blame for it" @ChrisForsberg_ weighs in on the C's brutal Game 1 loss to Miami Read more: https://nbcsports.com/boston/celtics/celtics-have-mostly-themselves-blame-maddening-game-1-loss-heat

Spot on-and has a vibe of the players influencing the coaching philosophy and decisions.

 

[Cellar-Door]

YMMV on how smart these guys are or if you even care but on The Lowe Post, Zach Lowe had Chris Herring on. They were both, especially Herring, very critical of Mazzulla. Herring's quote was "All of the Celtics issues are fixable but Mazzulla has to keep his head in the game and make better decisions than randomly putting in Peyton Pritchard to get picked on by Jimmy Butler". They were also both mystified that Grant Williams isn't playing at all

To me the second PP stint is far more something to be criticized than the dumb timeout thing. That feels like you tried something it didn't really work, but because it wasn't a disaster you wnet back rather than finding something else

 

[MannyRam]

I think Joe could make some adjustments before Game 2 to lean more into defense.

IMO, I think Brogdon and Whites minutes should be flipped. Brogdon has way too many lapses and White confidently stepped into a few 3’s last night.

Pritchard shouldn’t play. I would like those 12 minutes to go to Grant and give him a chance to guard Bam. It’s well documented that I am no Grant fan but I think it’s time to dust him off and see if he can recapture what made him a rotation player for however long.

If the offense completely stalls out like it did during Q3 I would play Hauser over PP.

Another easy adjustment…stagger the bad defensive players more effectively. @JakeRae called it out in the game thread but why are Pritchard and Brogdon playing together? Why is Pritchard playing in a 3 guard lineup? Those types of decisions are putting those players in their worst possible situations and asking for the Heat to score. IMO, if you have Brogdon out there he needs to be on the court with 4 other strong defensive players (same with Pritchard)

Agree with all of this. Playing Pritchard in this spot yesterday is some kind of strange experiment. White needs more than just 20 mins if this team is going to get to where they want to be.