Bradley: Deal with It.

thestardawg

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I hesitate to post this, but Here's an interesting conversation a friend had at the TB series last weekend.  My friend was sitting next to the players wives and was chatting with Mookie Betts and JBJ's significant others.  JBJ's wife/girlfriend mentioned that the bat he had been using throughout his hot streak had been stolen after his 4-4 game.  I know it sounds ridiculous, but knowing how ridiculously superstitious ballplayers are, maybe this was a small piece that now has started to snowball. 
 
Or you know, he's slumping. 
 

Al Zarilla

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The Gray Eagle said:
Bradley is 1 for his last 17, with 8 Ks. It's going to be interesting to see how long this little slump lasts, how deep it gets, and how he handles it. If it's just a typical little bump in the road that doesn't last long and he bounces back strong soon, that would be tremendously encouraging.
 
Also interesting, his home/road split for this season is 1.196 OPS at home, .670 on the road. 12 doubles at Fenway, only 2 on the road. Obviously small samples, with only 91 PAs at home and 90 on the road.
 
Not sure if i missed it being posted already, but here is BriMac's in-depth piece on Bradley's adjustments.
Now a worse home/road split, but, in August, he was 11 for 39 in road games (.282) including a double, two triples and two home runs, so he did seem to be coming out of it on the road. You think about things like does he not sleep well in a strange bed, is he afraid of flying like another Jackie (Jensen), what else? Probably SSS, home vs. road and he's in a slump right now.
 

Al Zarilla

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thestardawg said:
I hesitate to post this, but Here's an interesting conversation a friend had at the TB series last weekend.  My friend was sitting next to the players wives and was chatting with Mookie Betts and JBJ's significant others.  JBJ's wife/girlfriend mentioned that the bat he had been using throughout his hot streak had been stolen after his 4-4 game.  I know it sounds ridiculous, but knowing how ridiculously superstitious ballplayers are, maybe this was a small piece that now has started to snowball. 
 
Or you know, he's slumping. 
Of course, he could just as easily have broken that bat. Actually, more easily.
 

mt8thsw9th

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thestardawg said:
I hesitate to post this, but Here's an interesting conversation a friend had at the TB series last weekend.  My friend was sitting next to the players wives and was chatting with Mookie Betts and JBJ's significant others.  JBJ's wife/girlfriend mentioned that the bat he had been using throughout his hot streak had been stolen after his 4-4 game.  I know it sounds ridiculous, but knowing how ridiculously superstitious ballplayers are, maybe this was a small piece that now has started to snowball. 
 
Started tonight 0-2, 2 Ks. Someone help him find Wonderboy.
 

Al Zarilla

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mt8thsw9th said:
 
Started tonight 0-2, 2 Ks. Someone help him find Wonderboy.
Did someone here say he should start going to left field? That's what a lot of hitters do, let the ball get deeper, take some swing out and go opposite field. I'm sure it's not that simple, but sounds like it's getting to him, trying to break his bat tonight.
 

BestGameEvah

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thestardawg said:
I hesitate to post this, but Here's an interesting conversation a friend had at the TB series last weekend.  My friend was sitting next to the players wives and was chatting with Mookie Betts and JBJ's significant others.  JBJ's wife/girlfriend mentioned that the bat he had been using throughout his hot streak had been stolen after his 4-4 game.  I know it sounds ridiculous, but knowing how ridiculously superstitious ballplayers are, maybe this was a small piece that now has started to snowball. 
 
Or you know, he's slumping. 
One thing that Bradley has always maintained, is his confidence in himself, even when he was sounding quite stubborn.
So is he confident? Or is it just his wife who is looking toolbar the downturn on a bat.  Seriously? It is ridiculous and she should zip it.
Last night Henry Owens could not find his glove as the players were taking the field.  He ran into the locker room, grabbed his back up glove and went out and had a game for himself! 
 

Otis Foster

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Bradley now 1 for his last 24, with a pretty horrifying 8 whiffs in his last 12 at-bats. 
 
 
Add 3 more last night (5 AB).
 
Has someone (Sprowl?) charted out the pitch location of his last 100 ABs to see if pitchers have discovered a new hole or if JBJ just isn't making contact on pitches he previously hit?
 

BoredViewer

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The ABs I've seen, he is making some terrible choices about which pitches to swing at. He also appears to have a hole in the barrel of his bat.
 

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I agree he needs to get back to a bit more level swing and focus on contact. Swing seems long and his timing is off. His command of zone is fine (a couple of the whiffs were looking at balls clearly out of the zone) and his BB rate has actually been up since the slump started (SSS of course).
 

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nothumb said:
I agree he needs to get back to a bit more level swing and focus on contact. Swing seems long and his timing is off. His command of zone is fine (a couple of the whiffs were looking at balls clearly out of the zone) and his BB rate has actually been up since the slump started (SSS of course).
Not that I'm *super* worried about JBJ (although I note how quiet the "now we can trade Betts for an ace, because Bradley's back!"* crowd has gotten...), but (making very hand-wavy arguments about pitches being independently distributed), BB% should conceivably marginally increase as K% goes up because it's a sign the batter is working (or getting worked) into deeper counts.

But, like others have said, anecdotally, not a terrible time to go into a slump, especially if you want him to contribute in 2016.

*The less extreme argument here was the crowd that demanded Betts be moved off CF because JBJ was going to be the 2016 CF. Again, this late in the season, and given the fact that Betts has played RF before, it seems fine they are rotating the OF around, but hopefully they aren't already locking down an OF of Castillo, JBJ, Betts (L-to-R). While that could be the alignment, it's a little early to assume it's the case.
 

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czar said:
Not that I'm *super* worried about JBJ (although I note how quiet the "now we can trade Betts for an ace, because Bradley's back!"* crowd has gotten...), but (making very hand-wavy arguments about pitches being independently distributed), BB% should conceivably marginally increase as K% goes up because it's a sign the batter is working (or getting worked) into deeper counts.

But, like others have said, anecdotally, not a terrible time to go into a slump, especially if you want him to contribute in 2016.

*The less extreme argument here was the crowd that demanded Betts be moved off CF because JBJ was going to be the 2016 CF. Again, this late in the season, and given the fact that Betts has played RF before, it seems fine they are rotating the OF around, but hopefully they aren't already locking down an OF of Castillo, JBJ, Betts (L-to-R). While that could be the alignment, it's a little early to assume it's the case.
Trying to think of what times are not terrible to go into a slump. If, heaven forbid, he doesn't pull out of it by the end of this season, he has 5 months or so to worry about it. That would be bad. Would he opt for the Arizona Instructional League? During a world series years ago, a priest in Brooklyn said "It's far too hot for a homily. Keep the Commandments and say a prayer for Gil Hodges." Is it that time for JBJ?
 

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Otis Foster said:
 
Add 3 more last night (5 AB).
 
Has someone (Sprowl?) charted out the pitch location of his last 100 ABs to see if pitchers have discovered a new hole or if JBJ just isn't making contact on pitches he previously hit?
 
Well, when you look at location in August and then September, one thing does kind of jump out:
 
 

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Otis Foster said:
 
Has someone (Sprowl?) charted out the pitch location of his last 100 ABs to see if pitchers have discovered a new hole or if JBJ just isn't making contact on pitches he previously hit?
 
I mapped out the location of the fastballs he's seen before, during, and after his breakout month (Jackie Bradley Jr Needs to Make a Readjustment).  Early in the year -- high and inside; now -- low and outside.  
 

threecy

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Interesting...that can be a weakness when having a high kick at the start of the swing, not being able to get good wood on those low and away pitches.
 

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threecy said:
Interesting...that can be a weakness when having a high kick at the start of the swing, not being able to get good wood on those low and away pitches.
 
The leg kick's not really a problem, as long as he shortens up so he can get some part of the bat on those pitches at all.
 
What Bradley needs to accept (and what Xander has worked on all year), is that by making the adjustment and cutting down his swing, he can dink some of those crummy low-and-outside pitches into the opposite field and cut down his recent ridiculous strikeout rate. Or even better, he can use such a swing to foul those off until the pitcher makes a mistake he can drive. 
 
He's clearly frustrated, so hopefully he's ready to make another adjustment. The good news is, this August he proved he can hit quality MLB pitching with good power, so it's no longer an indictment on his viability as an MLB hitter to start working on pure contact skills.
 

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As of this writing, if I've added correctly (and I hadn't), he is 1 for his last 29 with 17K and 5BB.

Update: he made another out in his last AB. Now 1-30.
 

Al Zarilla

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nattysez said:
As of this writing, if I've added correctly (and I hadn't), he is 1 for his last 29 with 17K and 5BB.  
Must be getting a bit maddening for Red Sox management. How do plan for a guy like this? Certainly not a problem this year, but do you plan on him as a starter next year, hoping he gets to some acceptable semblance of consistency (somewhere in the low-mid .700s OPS)? Then he comes out 1 for 29? Do you bring in a 4th OFer type, Curt Young or Garrardo Parra type in the offseason to shadow him and plug in in place of him if he fails? What an enigma.
 

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Al Zarilla said:
Must be getting a bit maddening for Red Sox management. How do plan for a guy like this? Certainly not a problem this year, but do you plan on him as a starter next year, hoping he gets to some acceptable semblance of consistency (somewhere in the low-mid .700s OPS)? Then he comes out 1 for 29? Do you bring in a 4th OFer type, Curt Young or Garrardo Parra type in the offseason to shadow him and plug in in place of him if he fails? What an enigma.
 
How rare do you think 1-29 skids actually are? Miguel Cabrera came into today 2 for his last 23. JBJ's hot streak wasn't sustainable, and neither is this. Baseball season are filled with ups and downs like this.
 

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Snodgrass'Muff said:
 
How rare do you think 1-29 skids actually are? Miguel Cabrera came into today 2 for his last 23. JBJ's hot streak wasn't sustainable, and neither is this. Baseball season are filled with ups and downs like this.
 
One of these is not like the other.
 
Cabrera has a long established record of success; therefore, there's no reason to think that such a slump is anything more than a blip.
 
JBJ, meanwhile, has one sustained stretch of success, surrounded by not much else to speak of as a major league hitter. Concern on the part of management and/or the fan base is warranted until he shows he can rebound. He doesn't have to (and can't) hit at the insane pace he was at in August ... but he's not even hitting at the .250 hitter that many here suggested they'd be happy with on a regular basis. It's not like BABIP has forsaken him during this stretch; he's swinging and missing at a disturbing rate.
 

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E5 Yaz said:
 
One of these is not like the other.
 
Cabrera has a long established record of success; therefore, there's no reason to think that such a slump is anything more than a blip.
 
JBJ, meanwhile, has one sustained stretch of success, surrounded by not much else to speak of as a major league hitter. Concern on the part of management and/or the fan base is warranted until he shows he can rebound. He doesn't have to (and can't) hit at the insane pace he was at in August ... but he's not even hitting at the .250 hitter that many here suggested they'd be happy with on a regular basis. It's not like BABIP has forsaken him during this stretch; he's swinging and missing at a disturbing rate.
Of course they're not alike.

One was arguably 2014's best hitter, while the other was pretty convincingly 2014's worst.

That Bradley needs to adjust his swing and cut down on his strikeout rate, to deal with a new pitchers' strategy for pounding him low and away, shouldn't be in question. What was in question until August's definitive answer, was whether he could ever hit MLB pitching at all, on a week-over-week basis.

But there's no disputing that every hitter slumps. The best and the worst. Bradley looks to be a markedly streaky hitter, but at the end of the season, perhaps he'll be that .250 hitter you mention.
 

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E5 Yaz said:
 
One of these is not like the other.
 
Cabrera has a long established record of success; therefore, there's no reason to think that such a slump is anything more than a blip.
 
Fair point, as long as we acknowledge that in this case the proper alternative to optimism isn't pessimism but agnosticism. Bradley doesn't have a "long established record" of anything; he has one awful year-and-change, plus one streaky but overall outstanding year. Therefore, there's no reason to think Bradley's slump is anything in particular. It could be a blip, or it could be pitchers finding a new weakness to exploit that he'll now have to readjust to, or it could be his fundamental suck reasserting itself after a freak good month. My money's on B, but it's too soon to tell. 
 

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Savin Hillbilly said:
 
Fair point, as long as we acknowledge that in this case the proper alternative to optimism isn't pessimism but agnosticism. Bradley doesn't have a "long established record" of anything; he has one awful year-and-change, plus one streaky but overall outstanding year. 
 
Overall outstanding year? Nope ... he has one overall outstanding month or so. Until he can show that that month wasn't an aberration, pessimism is warranted. 
 

Buzzkill Pauley

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E5 Yaz said:
 
Overall outstanding year? Nope ... he has one overall outstanding month or so. Until he can show that that month wasn't an aberration, pessimism is warranted. 
I'm sorry, but that's just stupid talk. Of course August was an aberration. His batting split was 1.163 OPS for the month. If it's not an aberration, and with his defense, the Sox have the #1 best player in baseball...he's better than Trout.

They don't though, because Bradley isn't. August was always going to be an aberration; how much of an aberration it was is the key remaining question.

But still, Bradley's got a 2015 batting line of .263/.347/.532 (.879) with more than half his hits going for extra bases. His AAA line was .853 OPS, and for much of that time, he was the only legit hitter for the PawSox. You can't hold him responsible for Ben and John burying him in Pawtucket so that the corpses of Shane Victoino, Daniel Craig, and Daniel Nava could all get their at-bats until the trade deadline passed.

So no matter what happens these last two weeks, it's been an overall outstanding season for Bradley. He hit very well at AAA and then also answered the questions from 2014 about whether he could ever hit MLB pitching. And even better, it should be readily obvious what exactly he will need to prepare for in the offseason: hitting the low-and-away pitch.

Not sure what more you could want from him, realistically.
 

Plympton91

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The  potential problem is that it seems like every adjustment he makes opens up another hole that can be exploited to such a degree that it renders him worse than useless at the plate for weeks on end.  And, we don't know whether he can adjust to this one, or if the adjustment will allow him to retain the power that he had shown.
 
I think you're overestimating how much the hot 5 weeks tell us about Jackie Bradley's long-term ability to hit major league pitching.  Posters on a site named after Sam Horn should understand that.   What this latest slump proves is that if this team is serious about not finishing last again next year, Jackie Bradley should enter 2016 as one of several legitimate options competing for the two open starting outfield jobs and a backup role in spring training.  The only player on this team who they should be planning on starting in the outfield next opening day is Betts.
 

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Plympton91 said:
I think you're overestimating how much the hot 5 weeks tell us about Jackie Bradley's long-term ability to hit major league pitching.  Posters on a site named after Sam Horn should understand that.   
 
You mean the guy with the 119 career OPS+? Or are you referring to some other Sam Horn who actually couldn't hit major-league pitching? 
 
There are a lot of ways in which I am hoping JBJ's career is unlike Horn's, but overall offensive success is not one of them.
 

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Plympton91 said:
The  potential problem is that it seems like every adjustment he makes opens up another hole that can be exploited to such a degree that it renders him worse than useless at the plate for weeks on end.  And, we don't know whether he can adjust to this one, or if the adjustment will allow him to retain the power that he had shown.
 
I think you're overestimating how much the hot 5 weeks tell us about Jackie Bradley's long-term ability to hit major league pitching.  Posters on a site named after Sam Horn should understand that.   What this latest slump proves is that if this team is serious about not finishing last again next year, Jackie Bradley should enter 2016 as one of several legitimate options competing for the two open starting outfield jobs and a backup role in spring training.  The only player on this team who they should be planning on starting in the outfield next opening day is Betts.
This is a pretty extreme position, considering the fact that Bradley's got a secind-half split of .968 OPS, and Castillo's got a second-half split of .770, and neither of them got consistent playing time in the first half.

Bradley doesn't have to "retain the power" he showed in August to be a productive and, dare I say, championship-level player. Because August was always a mirage, and was always going to be a mirage. Still, Bogaert's success with his new approach suggests Chili can also teach Bradley to shorten up his swing and cut his strikeout numbers, even if that saps his power. Whether he proves an apt pupil is up to him, but he's proven that he's able to hit at least mistake pitches at the MLB level, both consistently and with power.

So unless you have a good idea how the team should shed the $61MM owed to Sandoval, Ramirez, and Porcello next season, you may have to just accept that the Sox have little choice but to play their three better-than-average and currently-under-contract-outfielders next season.

Or, I guess you could just be a nattering nabob for another year.
 

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Eddie Jurak said:
And breaks out of his slump tonight, 2-4 with a double and a game tying 9th inning HR. 
 
Showing once again that when a pitcher makes a location mistake, Bradley can make him pay.
 
 

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Eddie Jurak said:
And breaks out of his slump tonight, 2-4 with a double and a game tying 9th inning HR. 
It's funny how results can make things look. First two ABs today, he looked like he was swinging from the you know, and pulling his head. On the home run, swing looked great and his head just looked to naturally move up and away from the plate from the viciousness of the swing. 
 

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Al Zarilla said:
It's funny how results can make things look. First two ABs today, he looked like he was swinging from the you know, and pulling his head. On the home run, swing looked great and his head just looked to naturally move up and away from the plate from the viciousness of the swing. 
To my eyes, that's what he's looked like during most of this slump. His hips seem to be coming open too soon too. Haven't had a chance to compare on video yet. The HR swing, like you said, was totally different.
 

Plympton91

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Good to see him hammer the pitch in the 9th, but the double was just a grounder to second base if the infield is back.

I think the power surge is key. If he's Colby Rasmus at the plate with that defense he's a tremendous asset. I don't know if he can be a good enough Punch and Judy hitter in a world where he goes the Bogaerts route. Xander is still years younger and had better minor league numbers the whole way.
 

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Plympton91 said:
Good to see him hammer the pitch in the 9th, but the double was just a grounder to second base if the infield is back.
 
Or he may have had a different approach if the infield was back.  With the infield in, you just need to focus on hitting the ball hard somewhere.  He did that successfully.
 

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Plympton91 said:
I think the power surge is key. If he's Colby Rasmus at the plate with that defense he's a tremendous asset. I don't know if he can be a good enough Punch and Judy hitter in a world where he goes the Bogaerts route. Xander is still years younger and had better minor league numbers the whole way.
 
OTOH, Xander is defensively just pretty good. I mean, we've all been encouraged by what he's shown this year and I don't want to minimize that, but let's face it: the only way he's ever going to win a Gold Glove is with his bat. He's never going to be the best defensive shortstop in the league, or even one of the top two or three defensive shortstops in the league; the good news is that it looks like he won't be one of the worst, either. He's solid but unexceptional. Granted that CF is not quite as pivotal a position as SS, Jackie is in a whole different class on that front; he doesn't need to be as good a hitter as Xander to be as valuable. 
 
I think Bradley's night was just he needed: two dicey BIP that turned out well, then crushing a fat pitch. He got some gifts and took advantage of them, and helped the team win. We've seen many times that this is how a hitter can get out of a slump: a little luck takes the pressure off and turns the frame of mind in the right direction. Will it work? Who knows--but it can't hurt.
 

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semsox said:
 
Thanks for this. I thought the part about his dominant hand position on the bottom of the bat was interesting. I had never thought about that previously or heard about it, but it makes sense.
If indeed the dominant hand being the lower hand causes the hitter to swing under a lot of balls, that's probably why LHHs crush low pitches more than RHHs. Conversely, I wonder if throw left, bat right hitters like Rickey Henderson and Cody Ross also hit low pitches very well.
 

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Well, the point was that right handed throwers that bat left tend to get under the ball because their dominant hand is on the bottom. Aside from that circumstance (or its oppoisite) the dominant hand is on top.
 

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Al Zarilla said:
If indeed the dominant hand being the lower hand causes the hitter to swing under a lot of balls, that's probably why LHHs crush low pitches more than RHHs. Conversely, I wonder if throw left, bat right hitters like Rickey Henderson and Cody Ross also hit low pitches very well.
 
Man, I wish I had the time to look into this. It'd be interesting. Still, this does not explain that a lefty through and through, like Tizzle, cream low pitches.
 

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While it may work as a general rule, I don't think that "righthanders batting lefty tending to get under the ball" is always the case.  Yaz was a righthander who batted lefty and his former teammates like Fred Lynn have commented that Yaz definitely preferred pitches high in the zone.  That doesn't seem likely if the nature of being a righty batting lefty was getting him to tend to get under the ball.
 

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Would be nice to see if he can close the season just with a nice steady output instead of highs and lows.  Obviously would also be nice to take highs.  But if he can have a bunch of 1/3 and 1/4 with the occasional XBH and BB added it would feel somehow better than if he crushes the ball for the next 5 games then closes the season with another 9 games where he goes 2/30 with a a few walks.
 

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smastroyin said:
Would be nice to see if he can close the season just with a nice steady output instead of highs and lows.  Obviously would also be nice to take highs.  But if he can have a bunch of 1/3 and 1/4 with the occasional XBH and BB added it would feel somehow better than if he crushes the ball for the next 5 games then closes the season with another 9 games where he goes 2/30 with a a few walks.
 
Relevant factoid: Over three seasons he has now hit in 16 months. In only three of those 16 months has his OPS been between .700 and .900; two of those three were very close to those boundaries, .716 and .871 respectively, and the third (.817) was just a brief, 16-PA stint in 2013. We have yet to see Jackie Bradley Jr., the just pretty decent hitter, for any length of time.
 

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smastroyin said:
Would be nice to see if he can close the season just with a nice steady output instead of highs and lows.  Obviously would also be nice to take highs.  But if he can have a bunch of 1/3 and 1/4 with the occasional XBH and BB added it would feel somehow better than if he crushes the ball for the next 5 games then closes the season with another 9 games where he goes 2/30 with a a few walks.
 
While I think I understand the rationale for this there does seem to be a basic premise that I would disagree with - namely that the Highs are flukes, or , at the very least are more flukey than the Lows.
 
That being said, as a devoted follower of the Minor League section I would check Pawtucket's box score every day. And I don't remember Bradley experiencing any kind of extreme tendency to streaks. 
 
I think he just needs to be left alone to work out problems when they arise - instead of viewing every slump as some kind of career destroying existential crisis.
 
I don't think there's and doubt at all that he will be the starting CF next year (or the OF at least). As has been mentioned a thousand times , all he needs to do is not be terrible offensively to be of value. His MLE's would suggest something in the area of a 270/340/440 as a base going forward. And that would be outstanding.
 
In fact, I would be shocked if DD brings in another regular FA non pitcher. The only possibility that this might change is if he can move Hanley - which seems unlikely. 
 

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BCsMightyJoeYoung said:
 
While I think I understand the rationale for this there does seem to be a basic premise that I would disagree with - namely that the Highs are flukes, or , at the very least are more flukey than the Lows.
 
I didn't read what smas said that way at all. I thought it was more just that it would be good to see some periods where he is holding his own offensively without being either a beast or a black hole--where JBJ's bat is not a story, for better or for worse. Psychologically, I'm guessing that might help him to get over the hump even better than the streaks. He needs to be just a normal, average, everyday major leaguer for a while.
 

Mighty Joe Young

The North remembers
SoSH Member
Sep 14, 2002
8,458
Halifax, Nova Scotia , Canada
Savin Hillbilly said:
 
I didn't read what smas said that way at all. I thought it was more just that it would be good to see some periods where he is holding his own offensively without being either a beast or a black hole--where JBJ's bat is not a story, for better or for worse. Psychologically, I'm guessing that might help him to get over the hump even better than the streaks. He needs to be just a normal, average, everyday major leaguer for a while.
 
Well .. possibly semantics - I think we agree on the bolded (above). 
 

smastroyin

simpering whimperer
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
Jul 31, 2002
20,684
Yes, but his extremes are not normal for major league players.  And while it's fine to think he would be unique, I would guess that if he has a career, it will be slightly more steady than we have seen.  Again, all players have variance, and very often slumps and streaks are back to back.
 
I am one of the bigger JBJ fans on the site which should be apparent from my posting history.
 
Anyway, here are his minor league OPS splits in months he had more than 40 PA, in reverse order:
 
AAA:
7/15:  828
6/15:  824
5/15: 1038
4/15:  804
8/14:  519
8/13:  752
7/13:  792
6/13:  805
5/13:  1240
4/13:  714
 
AA:
8/12:  711
7/12:  834
6/12:  947
 
A+:
6/12:  901
5/12:  1142
4/12:  940
 
So not the extremes we've seen in MLB, other than he seems to love May and of course had the crap month in 2014 while he was down.  His AAA monthly splits look like I would expect from a relatively steady major leaguer.