Boston’s taxing pursuit of Juan Soto is over. (Mets)
- Thread starter RedOctober3829
- Start date
This is an ownership that gets booed out of the building at public appearances, has wasted a tremendous amout of good will from the fanbase and is coming off a rough run of seasons. They are human and can be influenced like anyone else. Doesn't mean they will act on the emotion, we shall see.
All I can tell you is while it wouldn't appear that using this Mick guy would be the most effecitve way to apply pressure or engage a fanbase, the results of his messages is undeniable and the Red Sox are a main topic at dinner tables all over New England.
How many Thanksgiving suppers did you have yesterday?
Can you travel like Santa Claus?
The biggest problem I see with this is what of Soto really wants to play for a specific team (we don't know who but for reference sake lets say it's NOT the Mets).. He gets the offer he's "happy" with but then Boros goes to the Mets and they go $50mil over. The only way he gets to play for the team he wants is to stop taking offers right?
If he gets the offer he wants from the team he wants, he can accept it. Boras isn't going to keep him in the dark on an offer or do an end run around him. If he gets that offer and then lets his agent go to the Mets for more $, it's because getting that bag is worth more than the choice of team.
As much shit as Boras gets he’s not strictly religious towards the highest offer wins. Tek is a good example.
If Soto wants to play for a specific team, Boras keeps the market churning to get the highest possible offers from those involved and then Soto picks where he wants to go. If his favored team offers less, he has to make a decision to take less. If the Mets or someone else comes in far over the top, maybe Soto changes his mind. Regardless, I think Boras works his process to get those best final offers and turns things over to Soto to decide. I don't think there is any reason for him to stop taking offers.
Of course I'm hoping that all the Boston rumors leaking are all about trying to get the highest possible offer from the Yankees and that Soto wants to stay a Yankee. But who knows.
Correct me if my memory is again failing me but didn't Boros tell Dice K to go back to Japan because the Sawx offer wasn't good enough and Dice said "No way"!
No. Boras was threatening to do so before any offers were exchanged, but it was never a realistic threat. Too many obstacles at the time for Dice-K to return to his old team, IIRC.
Thank you for that. My memories failing but you just brought up that going back to the LIONS was outa the question. Those brain cells kicked in.
If he comes to the Red Sox I want credit, as I suggested it to them in my season ticket holder survey…in a particularly forceful manner. I‘m certain they were influenced by it…
Boras works for his clients. Tek's directive was basically, "get the most money you can... from the Red Sox". I'm sure Soto has given him a similar directive of "get the most money that you can" and it may include one or more teams as a caveat.
How many times has Scott not gone for every last dollar. I would expect no less.
Which makes sense wby the sox relied heavily on them for the original recruitment pitch
I was wondering if you or someone else here could explain to me how the Dodgers are or are not gaining a competitive advantage over other teams with this "deferred" load of bullshit they are pulling with contracts.
Does it benefit them in any way/enable them to sign players to massive contracts with no financial punishment?
Just curious as I don't understand the whole "luxury tax" or whatever it's called scenario?
Because anyone can do it?
You don’t think the Dodgers are the only MLB team allowed to offer deferred contracts, right?
The funny thing about that is they agreed to pay him the $29m million deferred instead of the $5m owed on the assumption that the 10% returns they were getting from Bernie Madoff's ponzi scheme were real and perpetual.
Is any other fanbase getting these social media rumors/ trolling about their offers to Soto, or is it just Boston?
If we do sign Soto to 50/yr, and with Devers at 31/yr, they are positioned to be able to afford this because of their young core. But as we saw with the 2014 core, that window could close quickly once that core gets into final arb/free agency, so 5-6 years.
To extend that window, one would want to lock in the rookies for more than 6 years, say 8 years.
On that premise, who says yes to 8/$120?
(a) Campbell
(b) Anthony
(c) Mayer
and of the special category 2+ year guys,
(d) Casas
(e) Duran
(f) Abreu (assuming not traded immediately)
To extend that window, one would want to lock in the rookies for more than 6 years, say 8 years.
On that premise, who says yes to 8/$120?
(a) Campbell
(b) Anthony
(c) Mayer
and of the special category 2+ year guys,
(d) Casas
(e) Duran
(f) Abreu (assuming not traded immediately)
Last edited:
Well, if they are pretty inexpensive for the next six years then aren't we essentially paying them $120 for two years? Or more realistically, after arbitration, etc. $100 for 2 years?
I think you have to get a couple "free" years out of them first, and then see who you want to invest in.
I saw some random Mets-related tweets, including one claiming Carlos Baerga said it's a done deal at $700M
I think you’re discounting how “cheap” arbitration years can be for good players. Soto has made $80M while Mookie made $60 (and if I’m reading b-ref right wasn’t even a super2). Not saying Anthony/Campbell will be as good as those two (but we can dream), but even a more realistic possible comp for them in George Springer made $50 in his first 6 years and that was 10 years ago.
Duran is a different beast. He's older and they can go year to year with him until he's 31 I believe. With him especially, that's probably the safer bet unless you can buy out a single year of Free agency now.
So if we were to say they'll make $60 million in 6 years we'd be paying them 60 for the next two. That's putting a lot of stock in these guys.
Sorry for the derailment , but it does tie into having Soto for 13 years but potentially only a 5 year window.
Your point is true in theory except you will never get them for 2/$60. At that point you’re buying 10 more years, including overpaying for post 30 years at end.
it’s a close call because you could be locking up the next age 22 to 30 Xander (good) or the next Benitendi (bad). But with contracts for great players now at 500 million, the insurance may be worth it, especially if you spread the risk among three or four guys.
If I offered you to have the top 3 plus Casas for 8 years 500 or 600 would you as a package?
Your point is true in theory except you will never get them for 2/$60. At that point you’re buying 10 more years, including overpaying for post 30 years at end.
it’s a close call because you could be locking up the next age 22 to 30 Xander (good) or the next Benitendi (bad). But with contracts for great players now at 500 million, the insurance may be worth it, especially if you spread the risk among three or four guys.
If I offered you to have the top 3 plus Casas for 8 years 500 or 600 would you as a package?
Last edited:
The most similar hitters through age 25 for Soto are Harper, Frank Robinson, Griffey and Trout, Andruw Jones is the worst name on the rest of the list. Harper is a great comp, and I imagine that midway through the deal he would probably shift to a less taxing position.
I'm only posting this because the guy's track record seems really solid View: https://twitter.com/hesser_tom/status/1862625525589573683
edit: look at his timeline, when he posts it seems to happen
edit: look at his timeline, when he posts it seems to happen
And as it turned out, they were right! As the Federal court rushed to their protection and allowed the Wilpons to steal another $160 million from the victims fund even though they’d actually profited from Madoff’s Ponzi scheme.
I think the Dodgers have a competitive advantage in being on the hook for that money later. A lot of teams might not have the financial stability to stomach owing $68million a year from 2034-43, for past performance. They will also have to pay an entire roster's worth of guys to play in 2034 and beyond. So yes, anyone can do it, but I'd guess a lot of teams would be pretty uncomfortable. Any owner thinking of selling someday would be wary of this.
FYI the LT hit for deferred money isn't deferred. LA pays $46m a year for the playing portion of the deal (2024-33), rather than $70mx10, because MLB uses present-day valuation to calculate the tax hit, and those deferred payments make the contract worth $460m in 2024 dollars.
Deferrals have been around forever but usually pay most up front. Even Bobby Bonilla's famous deferrals were just $1m, compared to $5m a year when he was playing. Nobody ever did this much backloading before, probably because players wanted their money now. Ohtani is unique because he makes so much in endorsements back home, he doesn't need his salary anytime soon.
You could make a lineup to fit both, but given that it would require eating some of Yoshida’s $$ in addition to $$ for Teoscar, and the $$ they apparently want to spend on pitching, I’d say that at some point budget restrictions come into play.
could be and like I said I only posted bc the guy's track record is good. Did the same thing with Gerrit Cole, an Eagles guard retiring, Joe Girardi managing in Philly and a Bryce Harper signingEh ... she's just going to grad school
Yeah, an either/or proposition makes sense re: Soto & Teoscar. Even then, they're probably moving off Yoshida and likely Abreu or Casas. Free up the DH slot for a rotation of position players and start with Anthony and/or Campbell in Boston at the start of the season.