Blake Griffin traded to Detroit

chilidawg

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Griffin to Detroit gives them a lineup heavy on bigs and point guards and light on wings. NO has been trying that with more talent and they're barely over .500. Just not seeing how this really works for Detroit.
 

ElUno20

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If the goal is to truly tank, they better move Lou and DJ. Because with the players they got back, if they keep those guys, they'll easily make the playoffs in the garbage ass 5-9 west.
 

nighthob

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If the goal is to truly tank, they better move Lou and DJ. Because with the players they got back, if they keep those guys, they'll easily make the playoffs in the garbage ass 5-9 west.
Well I do think that they hope to move Jordan and staple another salary to him in an attempt to bring in LeBron. I’ll be rooting for them to succeed on that front if only to see Lakers’ fans faces when their big free agent signing this summer turns out to be Avery Bradley.
 

wade boggs chicken dinner

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Oh, so I was correct? Suck it haterz!!!!!!11!!1

WINNER WINNER CHICKEN DINNER
Someone call? :)

Blake deals make sense to me. LAC signed Blake and they trued to put a playoff contender around him but everyone got hurt.

SVG runs one of the only mediocre teams that really wants to make the playoffs.

Wonder if Blake is really on board with this. Interesting that LAC is trying to make room for two max players by jettisoning one. Still, SVG is going to try to win so long as he is running the franchise.
 

benhogan

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Someone call? :)

Blake deals make sense to me. LAC signed Blake and they trued to put a playoff contender around him but everyone got hurt.

SVG runs one of the only mediocre teams that really wants to make the playoffs.

Wonder if Blake is really on board with this. Interesting that LAC is trying to make room for two max players by jettisoning one. Still, SVG is going to try to win so long as he is running the franchise.
Listening to Jeff wax poetic about Stan making a valiant effort to win the East will be comical. After Stan gets fired for the mess he created the narrative will be changed to Blake was brought in to put fans in their new arena and we never expected Blake to be injured for 50% of the time.
 
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nighthob

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Not every team dreams of winning a title. Sometimes they just want to be competitive. Detroit was the Island of Misfit Toys, and they still are to a degree. But Griffin gives them a real shot at fielding a competitive team for the first time since their six year run in the aughts. For a team like the Pistons that’s probably enough for now.
 

nighthob

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Looking at this from the Clippers perspective, if they can’t move Gallinari, I guess they could always look to make LBJ a sign & trade with Gallinari and Harris going the other way which would give them the cap space to sign George.
 

Eddie Jurak

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Someone call? :)

Blake deals make sense to me. LAC signed Blake and they trued to put a playoff contender around him but everyone got hurt.

SVG runs one of the only mediocre teams that really wants to make the playoffs.

Wonder if Blake is really on board with this. Interesting that LAC is trying to make room for two max players by jettisoning one. Still, SVG is going to try to win so long as he is running the franchise.
Not every team dreams of winning a title. Sometimes they just want to be competitive. Detroit was the Island of Misfit Toys, and they still are to a degree. But Griffin gives them a real shot at fielding a competitive team for the first time since their six year run in the aughts. For a team like the Pistons that’s probably enough for now.
I see this as a clear win for the Clippers. They get a pick, a good player who fits their team and is younger and healthier than Blake, and a former Doc Celtic (err... nm) in exchange for unloading a talented albatross.

SVG gets a shot at the playoffs for the next year or two, assuming Blake lasts that long before turning into a high priced pumpkin.

This will go down as yet another reason why embattled coach/GMs (a bad idea to begin with) should just be fired.
 

HomeRunBaker

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If the goal is to truly tank, they better move Lou and DJ. Because with the players they got back, if they keep those guys, they'll easily make the playoffs in the garbage ass 5-9 west.
The Blake trade seems obvious that the next moves are some combination of DJ, Gallo and Lou to make a run at LeBron, no? He's got a great relationship/respect for Doc and Bronnie is surely going somewhere this summer. Why not the Clips?

The Pistons also created a $7m trade exception by making this deal.
 

ElUno20

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The Blake trade seems obvious that the next moves are some combination of DJ, Gallo and Lou to make a run at LeBron, no? He's got a great relationship/respect for Doc and Bronnie is surely going somewhere this summer. Why not the Clips?

The Pistons also created a $7m trade exception by making this deal.
Yeah they're going to make a run but Lebron is going to the Lakers.

Dumping Gallo would be a dream
 

tbb345

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The Blake trade seems obvious that the next moves are some combination of DJ, Gallo and Lou to make a run at LeBron, no? He's got a great relationship/respect for Doc and Bronnie is surely going somewhere this summer. Why not the Clips?

The Pistons also created a $7m trade exception by making this deal.
Is that still the case? With how the CP3 thing has gone down, I find it hard to believe any Banana Boat member would want to play for Doc
 

mauf

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Yeah they're going to make a run but Lebron is going to the Lakers.
Why do you think that?

I know it’s the conventional wisdom, but if LBJ’s desire is to throttle back a bit during the 82-game grind and then compete for a title in the spring for the next few years, I don’t see how a gutted Lakers roster (Randle, Lopez, and others need to go to create cap room for LBJ and PG13) will enable him to do that. The Clips are basically in the same boat.

That said, none of the other teams in a position to offer a max contract (Dallas, Chicago, maybe Indiana) have a materially better situation, so if LBJ insists on earning what he’s entitled to receive, he’s going to be choosing from among sub-optimal situations.
 

JCizzle

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Why do you think that?

I know it’s the conventional wisdom, but if LBJ’s desire is to throttle back a bit during the 82-game grind and then compete for a title in the spring for the next few years, I don’t see how a gutted Lakers roster (Randle, Lopez, and others need to go to create cap room for LBJ and PG13) will enable him to do that. The Clips are basically in the same boat.

That said, none of the other teams in a position to offer a max contract (Dallas, Chicago, maybe Indiana) have a materially better situation, so if LBJ insists on earning what he’s entitled to receive, he’s going to be choosing from among sub-optimal situations.
Houston seems to be the best bet in that regard (assuming Morey works his usual cap magic). LBJ could probably sit until the playoffs.
 

wade boggs chicken dinner

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That said, none of the other teams in a position to offer a max contract (Dallas, Chicago, maybe Indiana) have a materially better situation, so if LBJ insists on earning what he’s entitled to receive, he’s going to be choosing from among sub-optimal situations.
PHI has a much better situation if he's so inclined to go there.
 

Bleedred

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Houston seems to be the best bet in that regard (assuming Morey works his usual cap magic). LBJ could probably sit until the playoffs.
Is it insane to think that LBJ could agree to take a below market contract to go to the team of his choice so that they don't have to get too crazy creative with the cap? At this point, he's gotta be worth close to $500 Million so why not take a below market deal and go to Golden State, Houston, OKC, whatever.
 

ElUno20

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Is it insane to think that LBJ could agree to take a below market contract to go to the team of his choice so that they don't have to get too crazy creative with the cap? At this point, he's gotta be worth close to $500 Million so why not take a below market deal and go to Golden State, Houston, OKC, whatever.
Exactly. I don't see Lebron coming to the clippers because he's not going somewhere that isn't even decent on paper. He has options to go to places much closer to a title.
 

bowiac

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Is it insane to think that LBJ could agree to take a below market contract to go to the team of his choice so that they don't have to get too crazy creative with the cap? At this point, he's gotta be worth close to $500 Million so why not take a below market deal and go to Golden State, Houston, OKC, whatever.
It's hard to be sure, but from what Windhorst and others have reported, LeBron is done taking discounts (after taking some with Miami).

Getting LeBron onto Houston is possible if Cleveland is willing to play ball. LeBron needs to opt in, then the Rockets can trade something like Ryan Anderson and Eric Gordon, along with a couple of first rounders for him. Anderson's contract is probably dead weight, but Gordon may have trade value left at his salary. It's not a great package for Cleveland, but it's better than nothing, and they don't really have much leverage here if LeBron says he's gonna just walk.
 

moly99

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This feels like a deal where it's likely that we look back in three years and go "both teams lost."
I agree. The Clippers are terribly positioned for a rebuild, and the Pistons don't have enough talent to really compete.
 

mauf

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PHI has a much better situation if he's so inclined to go there.
Besides renouncing Covington, what other moves would Philly need to make to give the max to LeBron?

Obviously, they have a legit second star (Embiid) and a promising young guy (Simmons), but I was under the impression they’d have to gut everything else (Redick, Saric, McConnell, etc.) — which they should obviously do in a heartbeat if they can land LeBron, but it doesn’t seem to solve for his desire to play somewhere where he doesn’t have to carry the load night after night.
 

mauf

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This feels like a deal where it's likely that we look back in three years and go "both teams lost."
I don’t see any way the deal can be bad for both teams. If Griffin declines enough for the deal to be bad for the Pistons, then the Clippers win by shedding his contract — they won’t land LeBeon, but Ballmer won’t fail to find worthy max talent to take his money to play in LA.
 

cheech13

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Is it insane to think that LBJ could agree to take a below market contract to go to the team of his choice so that they don't have to get too crazy creative with the cap? At this point, he's gotta be worth close to $500 Million so why not take a below market deal and go to Golden State, Houston, OKC, whatever.
Things can obviously change but Rich Paul has said that Lebron will not take a discount on his next contract. This was similar to the position they took in 2014 as well when they wouldn't even consider pitches from teams that had anything less than a full max spot available.
 

moly99

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I don’t see any way the deal can be bad for both teams. If Griffin declines enough for the deal to be bad for the Pistons, then the Clippers win by shedding his contract — they won’t land LeBeon, but Ballmer won’t fail to find worthy max talent to take his money to play in LA.
You are looking at it from the perspective who wins the trade, which is not important. The issue is whether the trade helps the two teams improve.

If Blake is hurt in Detroit, that doesn't actually help the Clippers beyond providing some schadenfreude. The Clippers could tank more effectively if they gut the rest of the team around Blake. Letting him take 25+ shots per game and chase the season scoring title would be a more effective way for the Clippers to tank for the next four seasons while still keeping their fans interested than trading Blake for what will probably end up being the 12th pick in the draft.

EDIT: This assumes that the Clippers don't know that they are getting LeBron. Obviously it is worth dumping Griffin's contract if LeBron's agency asked the Clips to do it.
 
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mikeot

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As a side note.... I don't want Avery back. He's really declined defensively, and he hurts the "Switch everything" strategy by just being too small at the 2. Having big guys at the 2 has been huge this year. Also his shot abandoned him. There are better options for bench 2 out there (Reke, Lou Will) given that what we need is a guy to get his own shot on the bench (and not be Marcus Morris)
This: loved AB when he was here, but things have surely changed.
 

nighthob

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I don’t see any way the deal can be bad for both teams. If Griffin declines enough for the deal to be bad for the Pistons, then the Clippers win by shedding his contract — they won’t land LeBeon, but Ballmer won’t fail to find worthy max talent to take his money to play in LA.
They might land LeBron because I suspect that Rich Paul might have more faith in Jerry West than in the Lakers' management.

Besides renouncing Covington, what other moves would Philly need to make to give the max to LeBron?

Obviously, they have a legit second star (Embiid) and a promising young guy (Simmons), but I was under the impression they’d have to gut everything else (Redick, Saric, McConnell, etc.) — which they should obviously do in a heartbeat if they can land LeBron, but it doesn’t seem to solve for his desire to play somewhere where he doesn’t have to carry the load night after night.
They've already extended Covington, but that's OK because his salary next year would form the basis of a sign & trade. They already have so many kids that they need to lose some of them anyway. And if you're adding LeBron you don't need Covington and Saric.
 

HomeRunBaker

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This: loved AB when he was here, but things have surely changed.
What changed about Avery aside from the system? He is still a very good spot-up shooter, he didn't forget how to defend overnight, and his rebounding has gone from 6.1 to 2.4 due to Drummond's presence which always affects his teammates rebounding numbers. Ex: Morris' per36 is up to 7.9 from 5.1 the last two seasons next to Drummond.

To me, the greater risk is to Detroit as the Clippers acquired two good starting players in their 20's (along with Bradley's Bird Rights) while clearing up some space to do other things, including the run at LeBron. The Pistons are building around a traditional 4 and a 5 in the year 2018 while losing two very good perimeter shooters......this seems like a very bad idea.
 

wade boggs chicken dinner

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Besides renouncing Covington, what other moves would Philly need to make to give the max to LeBron?

Obviously, they have a legit second star (Embiid) and a promising young guy (Simmons), but I was under the impression they’d have to gut everything else (Redick, Saric, McConnell, etc.) — which they should obviously do in a heartbeat if they can land LeBron, but it doesn’t seem to solve for his desire to play somewhere where he doesn’t have to carry the load night after night.
The 76ers are currently projected to have $31MM in cap space next year, including $1.6MM cap hits for Holmes and McConnell but that doesn't include cap holds for Reddick, Amir, and Booker. Jerryd Bayless has a $8.575MM contact, so getting rid of him for some non-guaranteed contracts would be an easy way to get LBJ the max. Also, it seems like by 2019-20, the 76ers are going to be capped out so they need to spend their cap space now or not be able to use it (kind of like the Cs were two years ago and last year).

The figures are here: http://www.spotrac.com/nba/philadelphia-76ers/cap/2018/

Note, however, that if Embiid makes the All-NBA team, he has a $5MM kicker, which would mean that his cap hit is $5MM more and that creates a small problem for 76ers. Cite: https://www.chicagosportsbreakingnews.com/2018/01/11/embiid-bonus-could-affect-sixers-cap-space/.
 

mauf

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You are looking at it from the perspective who wins the trade, which is not important. The issue is whether the trade helps the two teams improve.
Not all deals are win-lose, but this one is, because it boils down to a binary issue: will Blake Griffin be worth his contract, or not? The other moving pieces in the deal don’t matter much. I suppose it’s possible that the Clips will sign a superstar and won’t care what happens to Griffin in Detroit, but in all likelihood, this will be a good deal for one team and a bad one for the other based solely on what Griffin does.


Blake is hurt in Detroit, that doesn't actually help the Clippers beyond providing some schadenfreude. The Clippers could tank more effectively if they gut the rest of the team around Blake. Letting him take 25+ shots per game and chase the season scoring title would be a more effective way for the Clippers to tank for the next four seasons while still keeping their fans interested than trading Blake for what will probably end up being the 12th pick in the draft.
There’s not a lot of evidence that multiyear tanking works — the Sixers were unwatchable for years and had decent luck with ping-pong balls, yet even they are far from assured of being a success story. No way Ballmer goes down that road willingly, even if he were somehow assured an outcome no worse than Philly’s.
 

mauf

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The 76ers are currently projected to have $31MM in cap space next year, including $1.6MM cap hits for Holmes and McConnell but that doesn't include cap holds for Reddick, Amir, and Booker. Jerryd Bayless has a $8.575MM contact, so getting rid of him for some non-guaranteed contracts would be an easy way to get LBJ the max. Also, it seems like by 2019-20, the 76ers are going to be capped out so they need to spend their cap space now or not be able to use it (kind of like the Cs were two years ago and last year).

The figures are here: http://www.spotrac.com/nba/philadelphia-76ers/cap/2018/

Note, however, that if Embiid makes the All-NBA team, he has a $5MM kicker, which would mean that his cap hit is $5MM more and that creates a small problem for 76ers. Cite: https://www.chicagosportsbreakingnews.com/2018/01/11/embiid-bonus-could-affect-sixers-cap-space/.
Thanks. Sounds like Philly might be LeBron’s best max-money situation, at least if he’s not willing to go to Indianapolis.
 

wade boggs chicken dinner

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Thanks. Sounds like Philly might be LeBron’s best max-money situation, at least if he’s not willing to go to Indianapolis.
Not that I really want to see it happen but I have to think that LBJ, Simmons, and Embiid with the rest of the 76ers cast would make 76ers world championship favorites.