72 Suburbs in Search of a City: Anthony Davis to Los Angeles Lakers

BigMike

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Are people bagging on Griffin? He killed it with this deal. It’s basically the deadline deal plus the Nets deal. You can’t do better.
Haven't seen anyone who doesn't praise the deal from the NO POV. Great value, but it will be interesting to see what he does from here, because he has a lot of ammunition, but not really convinced the group makes a ton of sense as a unit moving forward. So I expect he makes 1 or two moves by July 1
 

BigMike

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https://twitter.com/TimBontemps/status/1140085647543193601

likely 2 uprotected picks right around when LeBron is retiring with 2 unprotected swaps mixed in. That's a lot of draft upside if things go sideways
Will in theory be great timing for NOP as they start to come right about the time Zion should be ready to enter his prime years, So really great for NO to be able to potentially wither add young talent of make a key deal to make them a championship contender at that time.

Still though if the Laker are able to win one or two in the next 4 years then it is well worth it
 

Jimbodandy

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Will in theory be great timing for NOP as they start to come right about the time Zion should be ready to enter his prime years, So really great for NO to be able to potentially wither add young talent of make a key deal to make them a championship contender at that time.

Still though if the Laker are able to win one or two in the next 4 years then it is well worth it
If Ainge gave all of that up, I'd have thrown up tonight's dinner. Ball, Ingram, and Hart are the Nick Pintos of this trade.

Sweet mother of God.
 

Sprowl

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Asking for a friend: Is what the Celtics could get at 4 going to be an improvement on what they'd trade to get the pick?
Plenty of observers (like @nighthob and Max Carlin) put the draft as rich in role players, but flattening out dramatically after picks 1-3. Ainge has chosen pretty well in the middle of the round, and I'm thinking that this is a draft where volume rather than draft order counts. This is not a draft in which to trade up, although it may be a draft to trade out of. Ainge is pretty good at kicking excess resources down the road, as the Clippers' #20 pick shows.

He was essentially bidding against himself.
Ainge's dogged, if fruitless, pursuit of Davis probably helped Griffin squeeze a few extra swaps out of the Lakers, but

This was very obviously always happening. The player wanted LA, he got it.
This. His agent was just carrying out his client's instructions, and the Celtics are merely collateral damage. I'm glad the Irving-Davis-Klutch psychodrama won't be poisoning the Celtics' locker room next year.

I am completely at peace with this. Thank God we can close the book on Kyrie Irving in Boston.
Irving gave the Celtics two impressive years, but he doesn't lead, he doesn't play hurt, and he does hog the ball. He has trouble carrying out team-wide defensive schemes, and he didn't click with the coach or his teammates. Time to move on.

The Magic seal of approval officially makes this a bad trade for the Lakers.

Thanks Earv!
Magic gives Pelinka the kiss of death, or maybe (since Pelinka isn't an NBA A-lister) it's just the hug of death.
 

luckiestman

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I like Ingram and Lonzo. Ingram is only 21. I like them even more now that they don’t play for that disgusting organization. Lonzo, Ingram , and 4 for a guy that is leaving anyway is not bad. Then toss in all the rest of the coins. It’s fine.
 

BigSoxFan

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Will in theory be great timing for NOP as they start to come right about the time Zion should be ready to enter his prime years, So really great for NO to be able to potentially wither add young talent of make a key deal to make them a championship contender at that time.

Still though if the Laker are able to win one or two in the next 4 years then it is well worth it
Or Zion will just force his way to LA like every other damn star player.
 

Jimbodandy

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I like Ingram and Lonzo. Ingram is only 21. I like them even more now that they don’t play for that disgusting organization. Lonzo, Ingram , and 4 for a guy that is leaving anyway is not bad. Then toss in all the rest of the coins. It’s fine.
Did you see the enormous pile of picks, almost all unprotected and many years out? The players are the coins here.
 

nighthob

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Or Zion will just force his way to LA like every other damn star player.
That will be in the post-draft pick era. It would be hilarious if the Pelicants pick up three lottery picks from the Lakers and trade Zion there for even more.
 

nighthob

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Plenty of observers (like @nighthob and Max Carlin) put the draft as rich in role players, but flattening out dramatically after picks 1-3. Ainge has chosen pretty well in the middle of the round, and I'm thinking that this is a draft where volume rather than draft order counts. This is not a draft in which to trade up, although it may be a draft to trade out of. Ainge is pretty good at kicking excess resources down the road, as the Clippers' #20 pick shows.
I mean the fact is that one of the guys that has actual star potential will likely be there when they pick. So they could conceivably walk out of this draft with a future all star. And I do agree that they likely convert 20 or 22 into a future pick.
 

djbayko

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This also severely handicaps the Lakers' ability to use draft picks as trade bait to add depth the next few years...until 2026. Who's going to trade for unprotected swaps?
 

BigMike

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Or Zion will just force his way to LA like every other damn star player.
And he might in 8 years, but those unprotected picks will give NOP 2-3 years where Zion will still be there, and they will have a chance to add a superstar around him and make a championship run
 

Sprowl

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https://twitter.com/TimBontemps/status/1140085647543193601
"The Pelicans will get the following picks from the Lakers, league sources tell ESPN:

No. 4 pick in 2019
Top-8 protected in 2021, becomes unprotected in ‘22
Unprotected swap in ‘23
Unprotected first in ‘24
Unprotected swap in ‘25
Tremendous haul for David Griffin & the Pelicans."

Mother of God!
Griffin took the Ainge-King swap and got Pelinka to ante up.

Rich Paul probably considers that by the time New Orleans gets to cash in, he and LeBron will both have retired, and not only the Mother of God, but the Messiah Himself, will have shown up to cancel all future drafts.
 

cheech13

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If you were GM of the Celtics would you have traded Jaylen, Smart, Timelord, the Memphis pick and 14, 20 and 22 this year, because I’d argue the Lakers gave up more than that for AD. Griffin absolutely killed it in this deal.
 

Captaincoop

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If you were GM of the Celtics would you have traded Jaylen, Smart, Timelord, the Memphis pick and 14, 20 and 22 this year, because I’d argue the Lakers gave up more than that for AD. Griffin absolutely killed it in this deal.
I would give that up in half a second if I knew Davis was re-signing with me.

The problem is that it wasn't happening in Boston.
 

DeJesus Built My Hotrod

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https://twitter.com/TimBontemps/status/1140085647543193601
"The Pelicans will get the following picks from the Lakers, league sources tell ESPN:

No. 4 pick in 2019
Top-8 protected in 2021, becomes unprotected in ‘22
Unprotected swap in ‘23
Unprotected first in ‘24
Unprotected swap in ‘25
Tremendous haul for David Griffin & the Pelicans."

Mother of God!
The Lakers are going all in for the next few seasons. Its not a completely crazy gamble but the stakes are pretty damn huge.
 

Ale Xander

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The swaps may end up better than the picks or the players.

So happy that Danny didn't give up a package equivalent.
But wish NO's trading partner was a different team.

Go Nugs
Go Blazers
Go Thunder
Go Sacto
Go Rockets even
 

Cellar-Door

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Clarification on the pics from Tania Ganguli

https://twitter.com/taniaganguli/status/1140123632103903233

A clarification on the haul of draft picks heading the Pelicans' way. The 2021 pick goes to New Orleans if it's in the top eight, if not they'll get an unprotected first in 2022. Swap in 2023. Unprotected first in 2024, with a right to defer to 2025.

So the 2021 is reverse protected outside top 8 (I assumed that was what Bontemps meant anyway), there is only a swap in 2023, but the 2024 unprotected 1st is an option.... they can decline to take it and instead take the 2025 1st (which is a very cool way of doing it)
 

djbayko

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Clarification on the pics from Tania Ganguli

https://twitter.com/taniaganguli/status/1140123632103903233

A clarification on the haul of draft picks heading the Pelicans' way. The 2021 pick goes to New Orleans if it's in the top eight, if not they'll get an unprotected first in 2022. Swap in 2023. Unprotected first in 2024, with a right to defer to 2025.

So the 2021 is reverse protected outside top 8 (I assumed that was what Bontemps meant anyway), there is only a swap in 2023, but the 2024 unprotected 1st is an option.... they can decline to take it and instead take the 2025 1st (which is a very cool way of doing it)
So the 2021 pick is better in that it's protected against 9+, not top 8 protected. But the 2025 swap doesn't really exist. That could work out bettor or worse for NO depending on how things play out.
 

Soxfan in Fla

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To me the players Griffin got are a pu pu platter of meh. They all have various warts. Where he won in a major way was all the picks. On the back end of things that could end up being a great haul.
 

lovegtm

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To me the players Griffin got are a pu pu platter of meh. They all have various warts. Where he won in a major way was all the picks. On the back end of things that could end up being a great haul.
It lines up well with Zion’s timeline too—the assets start rolling in just as he’s hitting his prime.
 

Devizier

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He did as well as you can do in a lousy situation. I wouldn't say he killed it. He got a bag of nickels for his dollar.
Well, that’s how it looked for the Celtics in the Pierce/Garnett trade too. Davis is younger but shit happens. Securing a ton of future draft assets is always good.
 

lovegtm

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He did as well as you can do in a lousy situation. I wouldn't say he killed it. He got a bag of nickels for his dollar.
He utterly killed it, especially with the new lottery odds. No one in the league has been willing to trade anywhere near that many unprotected 1sts or swaps since the Billy King trade. Even when Dallas put one in recently, it was firmly in Luka/Kristaps’ window.

These Laker picks are coming during LeBron’s decline, AND make it harder for the Lakers to add talent around AD. If anything goes wrong for the Lakers at all, Griffin is in a perfect spot to add top 20 players around Zion with those picks.

In addition, the Pelicans as is won’t be making the playoffs, so he’s going to get one or two more cracks at the lottery. The only way that doesn’t happen is if Ingram or Ball makes a huge leap, which he’d be happy with.

Giving up this many unprotected picks for that phase of LeBron’s career is a godfather offer, and no one was topping it. Hell, if LeBron gets hurt this year, and the team is capped out with no assets, AD could walk, Dwight Howard style.
 

lovegtm

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Also, congrats to Devizier and nighthob for correctly calling the form that the final deal took.
 

Bernie Carbohydrate

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He utterly killed it, especially with the new lottery odds. No one in the league has been willing to trade anywhere near that many unprotected 1sts or swaps since the Billy King trade. Even when Dallas put one in recently, it was firmly in Luka/Kristaps’ window.

These Laker picks are coming during LeBron’s decline, AND make it harder for the Lakers to add talent around AD. If anything goes wrong for the Lakers at all, Griffin is in a perfect spot to add top 20 players around Zion with those picks.

[snip]
Indeed, this is the "LeBron giveth, Lebron taketh away" deal. The Giveth is that even Lebron in decline is an amazing player. But taketh is that he has clearly started on the downslope, and there is pressure not to waste any of his remaining years of effectiveness. So instead of holding on for another year and getting Davis for nothing as a free agent, the Lakers had to pull the trigger and try to go for it next year. Look those picks, though -- I can see the Lakers going through another Late Injured Kobe lottery dip (2013-2016) with Lebron in 2022-2025.

The Pels will likely end up with:

The #4 in this year's draft
Unprotected Laker Pick in 2022 (LeBron is 37)
Pick Swap in 2023 (Lebron is 38, Davis is...gone?)
Unprotected Laker Pick in 2024 (LeBron is 39)
Pick Swap in 2025 (Lebron is 40!)

They got all that for a guy who was going to leave anyway. Kudos to Griffith.
 

snowmanny

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And the Lakers gave that for a player they were apparently going to sign in a year. So they better win it all this year. (I know, you can’t be sure what will happen Paul George blah blah...but still..)
 

Nick Kaufman

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The way I look at the trade is this. Griffin and Pelinka went at the roulette table. Pelinka placed a $25 bet on red. Griffin placed 20 $1 bets on 20 different numbers.

Pelinka' s individual bet is likelier to pay out than any of Griffin's bets. If it hits, it's going to pay out the biggest. But collectively, Griffin's bets are likelier to hit than Pelinka's bet.
 

lovegtm

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The way I look at the trade is this. Griffin and Pelinka went at the roulette table. Pelinka placed a $25 bet on red. Griffin placed 20 $1 bets on 20 different numbers.

Pelinka' s individual bet is likelier to pay out than any of Griffin's bets. If it hits, it's going to pay out the biggest. But collectively, Griffin's bets are likelier to hit than Pelinka's bet.
The massive difference here is that the outcomes of the future picks are highly correlated, both with each other, and with Pelinka’s bet. It’s more like Pelinka is betting on red, and Griffin is betting on Super Black, which pays 2x red, and also makes it impossible for red to hit for another 5 spins.
 

Captaincoop

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Well, that’s how it looked for the Celtics in the Pierce/Garnett trade too. Davis is younger but shit happens. Securing a ton of future draft assets is always good.
This is a top 5-7 player in the league, in his absolute prime. There is no comparison to be had with a deal involving two guys in their mid thirties.

The #4 pick this year is the best asset New Orleans got in this deal. All but one of the other picks are coming while Davis is still under contract after he signs his extension. Basically, you're hoping for an injury to Davis to make those truly valuable.

To be clear - I highly doubt he was going to do any better than this if the Celtics were bullied out of bidding. But I also doubt we're going to look back in 7 years and be wowed with how that draft haul turned out. It would require the Lakers continuing to be the Knicks West for numerous years when it comes to putting players around Davis. They have two mega stars for this year, it's hard to screw that up in this league to the point that you're missing the playoffs.
 
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lexrageorge

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This is a top 5-7 player in the league, in his absolute prime. There is no comparison to be had with a deal involving two guys in their mid thirties.

The #4 pick this year is the best asset New Orleans got in this deal. All but one of the other picks are coming while Davis is still under contract after he signs his extension. Basically, you're hoping for an injury to Davis to make those truly valuable.
Davis will be 31 and 32 during those last 2 seasons of the Pels getting the Lakers picks, and LeBron is likely retired. With the flattened lottery odds, all it takes is one or two off years by the Lakers for the picks to pay off. Valuing those out year picks with any certainty is almost impossible, but the quantity makes them worth something.
 

tbrown_01923

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It is going to be interesting for sure.

1. I wonder about Davis and his ability to stay healthy for each fo the full the regular seasons - or said another way this could be a feal where the lakers might be better in the playoffs than the regular season giving more juice to the picks?
2. They need a shooter - desperately
3. Kemba might be the complimentary peice they need, but does he want to play there?
4. Who are the ring chasers...
5. How does that team not "age" signifcantly?
 

queenb

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It’s infuriating that the Lakers get rewarded for drafting poorly at #2 (not one Laker fan is going to miss Ingram nor Ball) while Ainge drafted so well at #3 in the same drafts. It’s like watching some rich kid land a 100K job out of college even though he is an idiot while you busted your ass for years.
I think the picks and pick swaps on the back end are evidence that while the Lakers may have been rewarded with Davis, they were definitely punished for their poor drafting and player development in terms of the overall haul they had to give up. If the Lakers had managed to keep Russell and drafted Tatum over Ball and Jaylen over Ingram (Jaylen is a better fit on a LeBron-led - and in my view on any - contender, thus has more value), they would have been negotiating with the Pelicans from a position of strength. They might not even let LeBron force them to make a trade if it amounts to more than Russell, (imagine they somehow still have) the no. 4 pick, and salaries. They'd just take a run at the West next year and then sign AD outright in 2020. Dream team without a mortgaged future.
 

DannyDarwinism

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It is going to be interesting for sure.

1. I wonder about Davis and his ability to stay healthy for each fo the full the regular seasons - or said another way this could be a feal where the lakers might be better in the playoffs than the regular season giving more juice to the picks?
2. They need a shooter - desperately
3. Kemba might be the complimentary peice they need, but does he want to play there?
4. Who are the ring chasers...
5. How does that team not "age" signifcantly?
Kemba (or Kyrie) would be ideal. Let’s hope that it doesn’t happen. Even so, this team is not looking like a good defensive team, even with AD. He’s obviously very good, but he doesn’t grade out as an elite impact guy on that end like Giannis, Embiid, Gobert or Draymond. And as Sam Ray Not is always eager to point out, Lebron has actually been a negative on defense recently. He has a ton of mileage, and is rightfully concerned with conserving his energy. Less of an issue in the playoffs, but still, wouldn’t surprise me to see this team struggle on defense during the regular season. Lonzo and Hart are good defenders. Which all goes to your 4th point. The supporting cast is going to be critical.
 

chilidawg

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This is a top 5-7 player in the league, in his absolute prime. There is no comparison to be had with a deal involving two guys in their mid thirties.

The #4 pick this year is the best asset New Orleans got in this deal. All but one of the other picks are coming while Davis is still under contract after he signs his extension. Basically, you're hoping for an injury to Davis to make those truly valuable.
We've seen years of NO futility with Davis, including getting the #1 pick this year, enough to know that there's a decent chance those picks turn into something very valuable.
 

128

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For all this talk about the new-look Lakers, the team to beat in the West, IMO, is Denver. The Nuggets got their first taste of playoff pressure this season, and they'll be better for it. Of course, if Kawhi becomes a Clipper, that might change everything.
 

bowiac

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The comparisons to the KG/Pierce trade are off for any number of reasons, but probably most importantly that the KG/Pierce outcome was itself a bizarre anomaly. It's usually not that hard to stay out of the cellar if you have no incentive to tank. It took sort of a perfect storm of a collapse by KG and Pierce, inept management and ownership, and even then a fair amount of bad luck for that trade to work out as it did.

Griffin did a great job here given he was effectively negotiating without any leverage, and this format now looks like the gold standard to me of superstar-trade-demand trades, but it's still a huge longshot to return top value to the Pelicans. LeBron will be gone by the the time the bulk of the picks arrive (and may already finished be as a top player), but in 2025, AD will still be five years younger than KG was when he was traded, and the Lakers mostly have a clean cap going forward. They may not be contenders, but it will take a series of catastrophic mistakes for them to end up picking at the top of the draft. A career debilitating injury to Davis wouldn't even be enough in all likelihood.

That said, I don't see much of a championship contender here. Perhaps the biggest misconception in the NBA is that only your top end guys matter. You can't win with just depth guys, but you pretty much can't win without them either.
 

wade boggs chicken dinner

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The #4 pick this year is the best asset New Orleans got in this deal. All but one of the other picks are coming while Davis is still under contract after he signs his extension. Basically, you're hoping for an injury to Davis to make those truly valuable.
It's funny how much we value potential. No way of knowing but if Ingram were miraculously available for this draft, he'd get picked before #4.

20 year olds are supposed to struggle in the NBA. That doesn't mean they can't end up being top players.