72 Suburbs in Search of a City: Anthony Davis to Los Angeles Lakers

Bongorific

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How is that a source out of LA though? Unless he’s banging with Rich Paul or Maverick this sounds like he foresaw the whole entertainment thing. Kudos to him for that.
He also had Kyrie and Durant in Brooklyn a couple months ago when most thought NYK. Can’t remember if he mentioned a possible source or just wild speculation.
 

nighthob

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I had them in Brooklyn a couple of months ago, thanks to my super secret source...
 

HomeRunBaker

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Lakers sign Troy Daniels. This is a fantastic vet min signing for them and a perfect "Eddie House-type" fit with LeBron and AD even without Kawhi.
 

cheech13

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Troy Daniels and Jared Dudley are the exact type of players they should have signed last summer and didn't because... reasons? Maybe Magic was the problem after all as this summer has gone much more smoothly under the direction of Pelinka.
 

HomeRunBaker

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Troy Daniels and Jared Dudley are the exact type of players they should have signed last summer and didn't because... reasons? Maybe Magic was the problem after all as this summer has gone much more smoothly under the direction of Pelinka.
You're kidding, right? Anyone paying attention recognizes that the Lakers needed all those one-year deals to match Anthony Davis' salary who they wanted to have in tow by the trade deadline. The Lakers goal was to build their team at the deadline with Davis and not over the summer without him.
 

bowiac

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He also had Kyrie and Durant in Brooklyn a couple months ago when most thought NYK. Can’t remember if he mentioned a possible source or just wild speculation.
He also had Kyrie and Durant on the Knicks. He has also had AD on the Celtics, Lillard on the Lakers, Westbrook on the Lakers, George on the Lakers, etc...

He has some sources I'm sure, but he also just speculates a lot, and probably intentionally does not make clear which is which.
 

HomeRunBaker

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The Warriors rescinded Quinn Cook's Qualifying Offer making him an Unrestricted FA. I can't imagine a better fit for him than the Lakers.
 

cheech13

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Everyone had LeBron going to LA as his post Cleveland move
Bill Simmons was definitely the first. When he and KOC dropped that nugget during the 2017 Finals it seemed so out of left field that my initial thought was he was just throwing garbage at the wall to draw attention to the Ringer. He was waaay out in front on Lebron in LA.
 
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Kenny F'ing Powers

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Everytime this thread gets a new post, I die a little.

Enough of the super friends schtick. Stay in Toronto, Kawhi.
 

wade boggs chicken dinner

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Bill Simmons was definitely the first. When he and KOC dropped that nugget during the 2017 Finals it seemed so out of left field that my initial thought was he was just throwing garbage at the wall to draw attention to the Ringer. He was waaay out in front on Lebron in LA.
Multiple guys were talking about it then. KOC had a podcast withSimmons that discussed the topic and Rose also talked about it. https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.theringer.com/platform/amp/2017/6/8/16076966/2017-nba-finals-lebron-james-cleveland-cavaliers-los-angeles-lakers-clippers-25e353094845
 

OurF'ingCity

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cheech13

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No, that piece isn't by Woj. But it does quote from Woj's podcast, which doesn't mention KOC or Simmons at all.
My bad. The post in question made it seem like the link was about Woj. I should have read it more closely. Anyways, I still haven't seen evidence that anyone had Lebron to the Lakers before Simmons/KOC.
 

DrewDawg

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My bad. The post in question made it seem like the link was about Woj. I should have read it more closely. Anyways, I still haven't seen evidence that anyone had Lebron to the Lakers before Simmons/KOC.
I mean, maybe. But some of that struck me as similar to "The Yankees will sign Harper and Machado when they're free agents."
 

wade boggs chicken dinner

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My bad. The post in question made it seem like the link was about Woj. I should have read it more closely. Anyways, I still haven't seen evidence that anyone had Lebron to the Lakers before Simmons/KOC.
well first of all you said "waaay" before and there are multiple sources in June 2017. but it does go back further: apparently SAS was talking about the possibility in 2016. See https://www.google.com/amp/s/www.silverscreenandroll.com/platform/amp/2016/6/22/12005250/la-lakers-free-agency-rumors-lebron-james-denies

LBJ's interest inLA (and his wife's too) wasn't a secret.
 

HomeRunBaker

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The purist in me wants to see Kawhi in Toronto not to prevent a "Big 3" in LA but to not be forced to watch watered down versions of Kawhi, LeBron, and AD on the same floor with the ball only in the hands of one of them. I'd prefer, as an NBA fan, to see the Lakers with Danny Green, and MaMo as secondary offensive players (along with Iggy who I feel will be there regardless) rather than watching Kawhi and LeBron take turns being complementary players.
 

Tony C

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Not sure about that. What's unique about AD, Kawhi, and LeBron is that they're superstars who are very good passers and very into team-oriented basketball. I agree with you that Kryie and LeBron taking turns playing ISO ball was boring, and while not as bad in Miami there was a bit of that with Bosh/Wade, too. Leaving aside rooting, I think it'll be fascinating to see LeBron and AD playing off of each other and if Kawhi joins, all the more so.
 

TripleOT

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If Kawhi goes to the Lakers, they will win the championship. The two best power wings playing together with the best (or second) best big is going to be exceedingly difficult to beat. Kawhi just dispatched the dynastic, but crippled, Warriors playing with a few competent NBA players and a bunch of role players. Load the rest of the roster up with ring chasers who can shoot even a little bit, and they're all set. Once this team is in the playoffs, they'll have crazy iso options to get buckets when needed.
 

DannyDarwinism

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Not sure about that. What's unique about AD, Kawhi, and LeBron is that they're superstars who are very good passers and very into team-oriented basketball.
I don’t think that Kawhi or AD particularly stand out as passers, as far as superstars go, and I certainly don’t think that being a very good passer is unique to being a superstars. In fact, I’d say it’s very nearly a requirement for consideration.

Kawhi has worked his way into becoming a decent passer, but if you look at s of the assist rates of guys generally considered superstars, those two will be pretty close to the bottom. Out of the 15 All NBA players this year, only Gobert would be lower. Including last three years would bring in Aldridge (though he’s very close to AD) and DeAndre Jordan.
 

lovegtm

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I don’t think that Kawhi or AD particularly stand out as passers, as far as superstars go, and I certainly don’t think that being a very good passer is unique to being a superstars. In fact, I’d say it’s very nearly a requirement for consideration.

Kawhi has worked his way into becoming a decent passer, but if you look at s of the assist rates of guys generally considered superstars, those two will be pretty close to the bottom. Out of the 15 All NBA players this year, only Gobert would be lower. Including last three years would bring in Aldridge (though he’s very close to AD) and DeAndre Jordan.
Yeah, Kawhi is a very mechanical passer, and it’s taken him awhile to learn it. Slightly off-topic, but this is one reason I’m higher than most on Brown, because he think he has a similar ability to robotically learn skills that other players use intuition for.
 

Sam Ray Not

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Yeah, I'd argue Kawhi's one of the worst / least willing passers ever to claim the title of "Best Player in the NBA" (to the extent that he has claimed it). He's several notches below guys like KD, Kobe and Pierce in that regard, let alone the LeBron / Manu / MJ / Bird / Magic echelon. He had stretches in this years playoffs where he was at least a willing passer and ball rotator, and other stretches (v. Philly in particular) where he was just a straight up ballhog. But I don't think anyone would ever confuse him for a "very good passer" in terms of creativity, court vision, unselfishness, etc. 3-4 assists per 36 on > 30 usage is meh at best.

That said, I don't think that's too much of an issue when/if your other forward is LeBron.
 

Kenny F'ing Powers

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When the Lakers are involved, all courtesy goes out the window. All three of these guys have shown health issues. I hope limbs are lying on the court at the end of games. Fuck em.
 

ElUno20

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Where are the capologists on the board? Saw a tweet the lakers need him to commit tomorrow or their offer goes down. That true?
 

wade boggs chicken dinner

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Where are the capologists on the board? Saw a tweet the lakers need him to commit tomorrow or their offer goes down. That true?
Not a capologist but believe this is true. W/r/t to Davis trade, Lakers are sending out in salary: Ball (8.7), Ingram (7.3), Hart (2), Deandre Hunter (7) =25M. Anthony Davis costs 27M. (Note: figures are from comment here: https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/comments/c9afdh/im_seeing_a_lot_of_people_say_that_after_july_6th/) . If LAL trades for AD before using cap space to sign KL, then the extra 2M that Davis costs eats up 2M in cap space. Whereas if they spend it all first - i.e., sign KL - then AD doesn't cost them cap space (as they'll already be over the cap.

So my guess is we find out KL's decision before July 6.
 

djbayko

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Not a capologist but believe this is true. W/r/t to Davis trade, Lakers are sending out in salary: Ball (8.7), Ingram (7.3), Hart (2), Deandre Hunter (7) =25M. Anthony Davis costs 27M. (Note: figures are from comment here: https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/comments/c9afdh/im_seeing_a_lot_of_people_say_that_after_july_6th/) . If LAL trades for AD before using cap space to sign KL, then the extra 2M that Davis costs eats up 2M in cap space. Whereas if they spend it all first - i.e., sign KL - then AD doesn't cost them cap space (as they'll already be over the cap.

So my guess is we find out KL's decision before July 6.
Someone should probably tell Pelinka about this.

I kid, I kid.
 

OurF'ingCity

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Not a capologist but believe this is true. W/r/t to Davis trade, Lakers are sending out in salary: Ball (8.7), Ingram (7.3), Hart (2), Deandre Hunter (7) =25M. Anthony Davis costs 27M. (Note: figures are from comment here: https://www.reddit.com/r/nba/comments/c9afdh/im_seeing_a_lot_of_people_say_that_after_july_6th/) . If LAL trades for AD before using cap space to sign KL, then the extra 2M that Davis costs eats up 2M in cap space. Whereas if they spend it all first - i.e., sign KL - then AD doesn't cost them cap space (as they'll already be over the cap.

So my guess is we find out KL's decision before July 6.
Probably, although we saw Davis waive his trade kicker and Kyrie/Durant take less than max so that the Nets could sign DeAndre Jordan of all people, so I suspect if Kawhi was dead-set on the Lakers and they came to him and said "look for cap reasons we're going to have to pay you $2m less than the max," I have a feeling that wouldn't end up being a major issue.
 

wade boggs chicken dinner

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Probably, although we saw Davis waive his trade kicker and Kyrie/Durant take less than max so that the Nets could sign DeAndre Jordan of all people, so I suspect if Kawhi was dead-set on the Lakers and they came to him and said "look for cap reasons we're going to have to pay you $2m less than the max," I have a feeling that wouldn't end up being a major issue.
You may be correct but it is like $10MM over 4 years factoring in raises if KL wants 4 year max.

After all, "Board Man wanna get paid."
 

djbayko

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You may be correct but it is like $10MM over 4 years factoring in raises if KL wants 4 year max.

After all, "Board Man wanna get paid."
Also, unlike the trade kicker, we aren’t talking about the Lakers not having the money. It’s there if Kawhi wants it. He just needs to make his mind up in a week’s time whereas everyone else decided in a day or two. It will be interesting to see what happens.
 
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Mystic Merlin

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A short term max deal plus the 10 plus year vet supermax with TOR (about 50m annually) is a lot of money to turn down. There’s not really been a lot of mainstream media focus on that angle. The financial disparity between what he can get over the next 7 years with LAL v TOR is pretty massive.
 

Tony C

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As well, I think part of the pitch is they re-locate to L.A. from New Orleans or Toronto and the increase in endorsement /other media money is significant. Specifically in re Kawhi, I read somewhere or another his shoe company is big in the negotiations (in favor of the Lakers, obviously) for that reason.
 

wade boggs chicken dinner

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MM, what's the amount over the 7 years?
I've seen suggestions that it would be something like $70MM dollars but I can't do the math because I'm not sure what LAL could offer him once the initial 4/$140MM contract expires. It also depends on what the salary cap number would be in 2021. If it's $118MM, as this article - https://sports.yahoo.com/kawhi-leonard-toronto-raptors-contract-options-163149675.html - suggests, then I believe the supermax at 35% would lead to a first year salary of $41.3MM and a five-year guaranteed package of approximately $242MM assuming 8% raises. So over 7 years, that would be $311MM. I don't think that would be $70MM more but it would be $40MM- $50MM more.

However, if the salary cap is higher and KL can get 5/$250MM or even 5/$260MM, then I could see the amount getting closer to $70MM.

BTW, as for taxes, here's a Forbes piece on some of the tax implications if KL signs in TOR: https://www.forbes.com/sites/seanpackard/2019/07/02/11-4-million-reasons-kawhi-leonard-will-not-sign-with-toronto/#487158d11d8d
 

The Big Red Kahuna

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By my calculations (rough), he can make more in Toronto over next 7 years, even adjusted for taxes (assuming they structure 15% of it as signing bonus, which would allow for 15% tax rate work-around on that amount).

Total gross over 7 years is $308mm (give or take, depending on cap in 2 years) for Toronto... and around $260mm for LAL (assuming a 4yr and then 3yr deal to keep apples somewhat from oranges)

Without the signing bonus work-around, he would make more (net of taxes) with his LAL contract.
 

The Big Red Kahuna

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I've seen suggestions that it would be something like $70MM dollars but I can't do the math because I'm not sure what LAL could offer him once the initial 4/$140MM contract expires. It also depends on what the salary cap number would be in 2021. If it's $118MM, as this article - https://sports.yahoo.com/kawhi-leonard-toronto-raptors-contract-options-163149675.html - suggests, then I believe the supermax at 35% would lead to a first year salary of $41.3MM and a five-year guaranteed package of approximately $242MM assuming 8% raises. So over 7 years, that would be $311MM. I don't think that would be $70MM more but it would be $40MM- $50MM more.

However, if the salary cap is higher and KL can get 5/$250MM or even 5/$260MM, then I could see the amount getting closer to $70MM.

BTW, as for taxes, here's a Forbes piece on some of the tax implications if KL signs in TOR: https://www.forbes.com/sites/seanpackard/2019/07/02/11-4-million-reasons-kawhi-leonard-will-not-sign-with-toronto/#487158d11d8d
and for the counter-tax argument: https://www.theglobeandmail.com/investing/personal-finance/taxes/article-11-million-reasons-for-kawhi-leonard-to-stay-in-toronto/
 

wade boggs chicken dinner

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Better yet, what is the amount over the 7 years after adjusting for Canada's brutal taxes?
From the article posted above, it's not necessarily the brutal Canadian taxes its that CA does not give credit for foreign taxes paid. If KL signs in TOR he would be well advised to buy a house in another state (TX? FL?) and become domiciled there.
 

InstaFace

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wait why couldn't the Lakers offer him a supermax in 2 years if he signs a 2-year deal with them today? He's got 8 years of service as of right now, that would bring him to 10 and make him eligible for the 35% max. Per CBA FAQ, he can't sign it early now because he hasn't been with the same team continuously, but anyone with 10+ years of experience and meeting the Designated Veteran criteria can be offered up to the 35% max, right?
 

djbayko

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djbayko

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By my calculations (rough), he can make more in Toronto over next 7 years, even adjusted for taxes (assuming they structure 15% of it as signing bonus, which would allow for 15% tax rate work-around on that amount).

Total gross over 7 years is $308mm (give or take, depending on cap in 2 years) for Toronto... and around $260mm for LAL (assuming a 4yr and then 3yr deal to keep apples somewhat from oranges)

Without the signing bonus work-around, he would make more (net of taxes) with his LAL contract.
Are your calculations accounting for the fact that only half of the salary would be subject to home town taxes?
 

wade boggs chicken dinner

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E5 Yaz

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O/U on the number of SoSH posters who have "Kawhi stays in Toronto," "Kawhi goes to Lakers," and "Kawhi goes to Clippers" thread ready to go and just awaiting word to hit the Post Thread button has been set at 2.5
 

djbayko

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Okay, I feel dumb. Just realized what MLSE means and that the plane’s home is Toronto. This return trip means nothing. Occam’s Razor says Kawhi was going home after his meeting.
 
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ElUno20

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O/U on the number of SoSH posters who have "Kawhi stays in Toronto," "Kawhi goes to Lakers," and "Kawhi goes to Clippers" thread ready to go and just awaiting word to hit the Post Thread button has been set at 2.5
Id like to cast my vote now as not the clippers. Zero chance. They blew free agency
 

lovegtm

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From the article posted above, it's not necessarily the brutal Canadian taxes its that CA does not give credit for foreign taxes paid. If KL signs in TOR he would be well advised to buy a house in another state (TX? FL?) and become domiciled there.
He likely is already doing this. From what I've read, he gets pretty good investment advice, and already makes a lot of passive real estate income. I doubt his advisors would have let him buy a house in CA without doing something to domicile elsewhere. It's also a lot easier to prove to the CA revenue people that you're not domiciled there when a) you can afford good representation b) you're world-famous for working somewhere else.