'24-'25 Bruins Regular Season

[The Mort Report]

Is sit Swayman for a week+ and make him go work with goalie Bob.

I really wish they'd do this, if only to let him clear his head. There is a reason why most goalies are usually a little mental, you always have to be locked in. You have no control over when you see action or for how long, so you have to be mentally ready all the time. No matter how much he tried to emulate camp, it's not the same. I wonder if he's basically feeling like he never really got to set his feet, he just signed the deal and the season started

 

[Cotillion]

You must be new around here

I thought this was tiresome in the Pats subforum. It's even more exhausting here.

 

[Dummy Hoy]

I thought this was tiresome in the Pats subforum. It's even more exhausting here.

The constant negativity or my line?

 

[changer591]

The constant negativity or my line?

I would guess specific individuals and their constant and tiresome negativity...at least that's how I feel in the baseball, football, and hockey forums.

 

[Smiling Joe Hesketh]

Swayman got the win tonight and allowed only one goal, and faced only 11 shots.

No snark: this might be the best way to get him untracked, by severely limiting the shots he shots, if at all possible. If it really is a confidence issue, then getting a few "easy" games under his belt might be just the ticket.

 

[katnado]

Swayman got the win tonight and allowed only one goal, and faced only 11 shots.

No snark: this might be the best way to get him untracked, by severely limiting the shots he shots, if at all possible. If it really is a confidence issue, then getting a few "easy" games under his belt might be just the ticket.

Honestly they have to do it this way, agreed. Limiting the shots on goal and making it so he doesn't actually have to do anything like tonight is probably the only way to help him regain his confidence. He's failed over and over when he's had to carry the team this year. More games like tonight can only help the kid.

 

[cshea]

19-13-4 at the Christmas break. Pretty firmly in the playoff structure. 3rd in the Atlantic by points but in reality they are WC1 right now since Tampa is 2 points back with 4 games in hand. The Bruins are in the mix with the teams above in the Atlantic too though. 2 points behind Toronto and 4 behind Florida. Their playoff cushion is 5 points over Pittsburgh, even in games played.

The underlyings are looking much better. At 5x5 their xGF% is up to 52.14%, 8th in the league. It's largely driven by a top 5 defense across the board. They are allowing the 5th fewest (tied with New Jersey) xGA/60 at 5x5. Basically any category defensively they are top 5/6. Scoring chances against, high danger chances against, shots agains, etc. The offense is below average. They are 21st in xGF/60, 21st in scoring chances/60 and 17th in high danger chances/60. The power play is better than conversion rate implies. They are generating the 7th most high danger chances and xGF/60 on the power play. They are generating quality chances just fine, but aren't finishing, shooting 8.72% shooting percentage which is 2nd worst in the league. Talent is certainly part of the issue on that front but they should get some positive regression at some point.

The new guys seems to be settling in a bit. Lindholm has 5 points in his last 5 games. The original play was to just play him with Pasta but that never materialized and now he seems to be building some nice chemistry with Marchand. Zadorov has been active, maintained his defensive toughness without going to the penalty box. Only 1 minor the past 9 games.

The big issue now is the Pastrnak injury. I'm not sure where the goals will come from if he's out of the lineup for an extended period of time. He hasn't been scoring much himself, at least by his standards, but he's been a driver and generating a large chunk of their offense. The Bruins have 91 goals on the year and Pasta's been on the ice for 41 of them, factoring in 35 of the 41 goals. Sacco didn't have any update last night after the game so we won't know anything until Friday. Brazeau also went down the tunnel late in the game after blocking a shot. They've got 1 game to burn with McLaughlin before he loses his waiver exemption so they can plug him in on Friday. Might need another body too. I was also kind of wondering if the shift of Coyle to wing was in anticipation of bringin Poitras back up. Would seem to open a center spot for Poitras. Kick Freddy back to LW, Wahlstrom to the bench. The Pasta injury may change that plan though.

 

[BaseballJones]

Bruins have gone 11-5 since firing Montgomery. I don't know that he was the problem (they had two pretty awesome regular seasons with him before this year; obviously playoffs have been massive failures) but it sure doesn't look like it has hurt making the coaching change.

Are they doing anything different on the ice (besides, uh, playing better) since the coaching change? I'm not knowledgeable enough to know.

 

[joe dokes]

Bruins have gone 11-5 since firing Montgomery. I don't know that he was the problem (they had two pretty awesome regular seasons with him before this year; obviously playoffs have been massive failures) but it sure doesn't look like it has hurt making the coaching change.

Are they doing anything different on the ice (besides, uh, playing better) since the coaching change? I'm not knowledgeable enough to know.

I cant really drill into the Xs and Os, but its always seemed to me that hockey players are unique among pro athletes in the way they feel responsible when a coach they like gets canned. Part of their recent W-L success could be that they had a collective "oh shit" moment and are competing harder in the 1 on 1s that have to be won.

 

[cshea]

They are better defensively. They went from average to very good/elite after the change. They are still below average/bad offensively but at least they have something they do well now. They weren't doing anything well under Monty.

 

[Over Guapo Grande]

So it is like making a goalie change when you go down 3-0 in the 2nd. The goals aren't necessarily on the 'tender, but it shakes thinks up a bit.

 

[FelixMantilla]

Low scoring wouldn't be an issue if Swayman weren't pulling a mean Vinne Riendeau impersonation. He's literally been the worst goalie in the entire league.

I'm so disgusted with him. He got his money and then has peaced out. I can't possibly see how the org can continue to run him out there as the number 1. If it were possible I'd bench his ass or send him to Providence, but I know that's not know the league works. At the very least I'd start giving Korpisalo 60% of the starts until Swayman either his his shit together or gets so bad he gets relegated to the press box. They can't keep rolling him out there.

 

[doctorogres]

Bruins have gone 11-5 since firing Montgomery. I don't know that he was the problem (they had two pretty awesome regular seasons with him before this year; obviously playoffs have been massive failures) but it sure doesn't look like it has hurt making the coaching change.

Are they doing anything different on the ice (besides, uh, playing better) since the coaching change? I'm not knowledgeable enough to know.

My fiancée is all-in on the Bruins this year after she started watching the playoffs with me last year, just hooked on hockey. So we've been watching all the games and she's a VERY thorough researcher when she's interested in something. I keep telling her how funny it is that she chose such a frustrating season to get into the Bruins, but hey I have someone to watch with.

Anyway, we watch a lot of X's and O's videos. If you listen to Sacco at all, especially when he was just starting, two words keep coming up with regard to defense: "details" and "layers".

Details is kind of a catch-all for a lot of things, but on defense the noticeable one is their stick placement. They've gotten very, very good at using their sticks to protect the slot and break up dangerous passes. The most recent games are great examples of this, where they prevent anything going through the middle of the ice. Even when the other team has a long possession in our zone, the only lanes open are passes around the periphery and they inevitably have to settle for a low-percentage shot.

Layers is about forward help on the transition, and the way handoffs happen into our hybrid D-zone structure. Essentially, this comes down to forward help. In the neutral zone, you'll see our wingers force the puck into the boards and battle to try and get the puck going the other way. Someone said to just watch Geekie in the neutral zone and that's honestly a pretty good shorthand.

If they get it through the neutral zone, the Bruins D-men are way less than willing to give up a free entry. Under Sacco, they step up and challenge at the blue line to force a reset, or a dump, or just keep it on the perimeter. This is because a forward (usually the C) comes back and picks up the free man, establishing a "second layer."

Under Montgomery, challenging the blue line wasn't happening consistently. For example, here's a 5v5 transition goal we gave up vs. Dallas.

View: https://youtu.be/zTPTgfgOD94?si=nHaqOo9tpLrtWN9x&t=202


The forwards are late coming back off a lost puck battle and you can see the D pair sorting out what to do about the 3v2.



Wotherspoon is going to take the open man coming up the right side. If a huffing Koepke (or Beecher, who slips) is more with this play, Peeke can step up and challenge the puck at the blue line knowing his forward will drop back behind him to pick up #27. Instead, he has to give up to the blue line to keep everything in front of him for an easy Dallas entry. The forwards are behind the play and we give up a pass to the slot that leads to a goal because we don't have time to set up.

Contrast that with this play vs. Washington:

View: https://youtu.be/p5KybIHTTRU?si=f5zJXw7Dsyk7WL-9&t=183


Even with the stretch pass, Zadorov can step up and challenge the puck carrier as he enters the zone because Zacha is in position to wrap behind and take the open man. They're forced to the outside and settle for a nothing shot to get an O-zone faceoff.

From that same game, here's a Dallas PP entry:

View: https://youtu.be/zTPTgfgOD94?si=BYlPUdm1S-Y60Lm_&t=329


McAvoy should be stepping up to challenge the puck with a forward dropping behind with Zacha coming around behind him to protect the pass and help. Hampus should then pick up the puck when it gets low, but he can't do that because Koepke is pretty much out of the play. So they give up a pretty easy cross to Duchene for effectively a back-door goal.



I'm not a coach or anything, so I can't say for sure if that's more on Zacha or Koepke... maybe Zacha was supposed to let Hampus rotate while Koepke swoops in behind. But, essentially, Koepke is where McAvoy should be if he challenges.

Contrast that with this PP entry from the Washington game:

View: https://youtu.be/p5KybIHTTRU?si=nJmizNcQvSK-8LOT&t=52


Here, Peeke can step up to challenge the puck carrier and Wotherspoon can pick up the play low. Zacha's in pretty much the same place to defend the pass (which makes me think he was correct v. Dallas). The difference is Elias is on the other side of the ice to swap in for Wotherspoon.



Washington is unable to develop down low and settles for a pretty routine shot from the faceoff circle.

Now, this is not really a different system than Monty's. But maybe the message to the forwards has changed from "win your O zone battles" to "get back to help first and foremost." Or maybe the newer faces have a better understanding of how the responsibilities shift as the play develops. And a huge caveat that I'm not a coach, am just pulling from the highlights of games I remember, and my hockey experience is squirts and a season of intramural in college. We did win, though.

Would love to learn more if anyone's more knowledgeable!

 

[cshea]

My fiancée is all-in on the Bruins this year after she started watching the playoffs with me last year, just hooked on hockey. So we've been watching all the games and she's a VERY thorough researcher when she's interested in something. I keep telling her how funny it is that she chose such a frustrating season to get into the Bruins, but hey I have someone to watch with.

Anyway, we watch a lot of X's and O's videos. If you listen to Sacco at all, especially when he was just starting, two words keep coming up with regard to defense: "details" and "layers".

Details is kind of a catch-all for a lot of things, but on defense the noticeable one is their stick placement. They've gotten very, very good at using their sticks to protect the slot and break up dangerous passes. The most recent games are great examples of this, where they prevent anything going through the middle of the ice. Even when the other team has a long possession in our zone, the only lanes open are passes around the periphery and they inevitably have to settle for a low-percentage shot.

Layers is about forward help on the transition, and the way handoffs happen into our hybrid D-zone structure. Essentially, this comes down to forward help. In the neutral zone, you'll see our wingers force the puck into the boards and battle to try and get the puck going the other way. Someone said to just watch Geekie in the neutral zone and that's honestly a pretty good shorthand.

If they get it through the neutral zone, the Bruins D-men are way less than willing to give up a free entry. Under Sacco, they step up and challenge at the blue line to force a reset, or a dump, or just keep it on the perimeter. This is because a forward (usually the C) comes back and picks up the free man, establishing a "second layer."

Under Montgomery, challenging the blue line wasn't happening consistently. For example, here's a 5v5 transition goal we gave up vs. Dallas.

View: https://youtu.be/zTPTgfgOD94?si=nHaqOo9tpLrtWN9x&t=202


The forwards are late coming back off a lost puck battle and you can see the D pair sorting out what to do about the 3v2.

View attachment 93756

Wotherspoon is going to take the open man coming up the right side. If a huffing Koepke (or Beecher, who slips) is more with this play, Peeke can step up and challenge the puck at the blue line knowing his forward will drop back behind him to pick up #27. Instead, he has to give up to the blue line to keep everything in front of him for an easy Dallas entry. The forwards are behind the play and we give up a pass to the slot that leads to a goal because we don't have time to set up.

Contrast that with this play vs. Washington:

View: https://youtu.be/p5KybIHTTRU?si=f5zJXw7Dsyk7WL-9&t=183


Even with the stretch pass, Zadorov can step up and challenge the puck carrier as he enters the zone because Zacha is in position to wrap behind and take the open man. They're forced to the outside and settle for a nothing shot to get an O-zone faceoff.

From that same game, here's a Dallas PP entry:

View: https://youtu.be/zTPTgfgOD94?si=BYlPUdm1S-Y60Lm_&t=329


McAvoy should be stepping up to challenge the puck with a forward dropping behind with Zacha coming around behind him to protect the pass and help. Hampus should then pick up the puck when it gets low, but he can't do that because Koepke is pretty much out of the play. So they give up a pretty easy cross to Duchene for effectively a back-door goal.

View attachment 93758

I'm not a coach or anything, so I can't say for sure if that's more on Zacha or Koepke... maybe Zacha was supposed to let Hampus rotate while Koepke swoops in behind. But, essentially, Koepke is where McAvoy should be if he challenges.

Contrast that with this PP entry from the Washington game:

View: https://youtu.be/p5KybIHTTRU?si=nJmizNcQvSK-8LOT&t=52


Here, Peeke can step up to challenge the puck carrier and Wotherspoon can pick up the play low. Zacha's in pretty much the same place to defend the pass (which makes me think he was correct v. Dallas). The difference is Elias is on the other side of the ice to swap in for Wotherspoon.

View attachment 93759

Washington is unable to develop down low and settles for a pretty routine shot from the faceoff circle.

Now, this is not really a different system than Monty's. But maybe the message to the forwards has changed from "win your O zone battles" to "get back to help first and foremost." Or maybe the newer faces have a better understanding of how the responsibilities shift as the play develops. And a huge caveat that I'm not a coach, am just pulling from the highlights of games I remember, and my hockey experience is squirts and a season of intramural in college. We did win, though.

Would love to learn more if anyone's more knowledgeable!

This was a great, insightful post. Didn't want it to go unrecognized.

 

[Dummy Hoy]

My fiancée is all-in on the Bruins this year after she started watching the playoffs with me last year, just hooked on hockey. So we've been watching all the games and she's a VERY thorough researcher when she's interested in something. I keep telling her how funny it is that she chose such a frustrating season to get into the Bruins, but hey I have someone to watch with.

Anyway, we watch a lot of X's and O's videos. If you listen to Sacco at all, especially when he was just starting, two words keep coming up with regard to defense: "details" and "layers".

Details is kind of a catch-all for a lot of things, but on defense the noticeable one is their stick placement. They've gotten very, very good at using their sticks to protect the slot and break up dangerous passes. The most recent games are great examples of this, where they prevent anything going through the middle of the ice. Even when the other team has a long possession in our zone, the only lanes open are passes around the periphery and they inevitably have to settle for a low-percentage shot.

Layers is about forward help on the transition, and the way handoffs happen into our hybrid D-zone structure. Essentially, this comes down to forward help. In the neutral zone, you'll see our wingers force the puck into the boards and battle to try and get the puck going the other way. Someone said to just watch Geekie in the neutral zone and that's honestly a pretty good shorthand.

If they get it through the neutral zone, the Bruins D-men are way less than willing to give up a free entry. Under Sacco, they step up and challenge at the blue line to force a reset, or a dump, or just keep it on the perimeter. This is because a forward (usually the C) comes back and picks up the free man, establishing a "second layer."

Under Montgomery, challenging the blue line wasn't happening consistently. For example, here's a 5v5 transition goal we gave up vs. Dallas.

View: https://youtu.be/zTPTgfgOD94?si=nHaqOo9tpLrtWN9x&t=202


The forwards are late coming back off a lost puck battle and you can see the D pair sorting out what to do about the 3v2.

View attachment 93756

Wotherspoon is going to take the open man coming up the right side. If a huffing Koepke (or Beecher, who slips) is more with this play, Peeke can step up and challenge the puck at the blue line knowing his forward will drop back behind him to pick up #27. Instead, he has to give up to the blue line to keep everything in front of him for an easy Dallas entry. The forwards are behind the play and we give up a pass to the slot that leads to a goal because we don't have time to set up.

Contrast that with this play vs. Washington:

View: https://youtu.be/p5KybIHTTRU?si=f5zJXw7Dsyk7WL-9&t=183


Even with the stretch pass, Zadorov can step up and challenge the puck carrier as he enters the zone because Zacha is in position to wrap behind and take the open man. They're forced to the outside and settle for a nothing shot to get an O-zone faceoff.

From that same game, here's a Dallas PP entry:

View: https://youtu.be/zTPTgfgOD94?si=BYlPUdm1S-Y60Lm_&t=329


McAvoy should be stepping up to challenge the puck with a forward dropping behind with Zacha coming around behind him to protect the pass and help. Hampus should then pick up the puck when it gets low, but he can't do that because Koepke is pretty much out of the play. So they give up a pretty easy cross to Duchene for effectively a back-door goal.

View attachment 93758

I'm not a coach or anything, so I can't say for sure if that's more on Zacha or Koepke... maybe Zacha was supposed to let Hampus rotate while Koepke swoops in behind. But, essentially, Koepke is where McAvoy should be if he challenges.

Contrast that with this PP entry from the Washington game:

View: https://youtu.be/p5KybIHTTRU?si=nJmizNcQvSK-8LOT&t=52


Here, Peeke can step up to challenge the puck carrier and Wotherspoon can pick up the play low. Zacha's in pretty much the same place to defend the pass (which makes me think he was correct v. Dallas). The difference is Elias is on the other side of the ice to swap in for Wotherspoon.

View attachment 93759

Washington is unable to develop down low and settles for a pretty routine shot from the faceoff circle.

Now, this is not really a different system than Monty's. But maybe the message to the forwards has changed from "win your O zone battles" to "get back to help first and foremost." Or maybe the newer faces have a better understanding of how the responsibilities shift as the play develops. And a huge caveat that I'm not a coach, am just pulling from the highlights of games I remember, and my hockey experience is squirts and a season of intramural in college. We did win, though.

Would love to learn more if anyone's more knowledgeable!

Agree 100%, nice effort on this post, thank you.

I've never really heard the term 'layers' used in transition play, rather I usually hear it (and use it myself) when considering the DZ structure.



Here's an example from a fairly standard Box+1 zone defense- the idea is that that player with the puck must get through multiple layers of defender before getting to the next. Once a player gets beat the other players rotate to make sure the man on the puck always has backing. Of course that same premise can be applied to NZ structure as well, and you give a good example of that on the poor ZE defense v. Dallas.

What you demonstrated I'd simply call responsible backchecking, but I'm no expert. You'd think that would be presumed at the NHL level but you gave some good instances of it not. That opening goal v. Dallas is a good example of poor backchecking, watch 19 go into glide mode and not pick up the 4th guy with a stride or two. No excuse for that.

The PPG against is another example of just poor decision making...I didn't love 18 cutting to the other side, but he was the second 'layer' in that case (really nice job by the Dallas D to beat the first layer (45) with the quick D-D passes; had him turning both ways) and team instruction may be for that next layer in the 1-1-2 to force the puck outside, which he did. Two mistakes then occur- 73 can't step up on that puck in a harmless position (on the wall, at the BL, feet still) unless he's POSITIVE 18 is going to pick up the net drive. Too aggressive. Now, 18 did indeed stick his head up his ass and not pick that guy up and maybe that's where all of the blame should lie, but I still didn't love 73 there. Two players making mistakes on details (as you highlighted).

Where I think you may be correct is that Sacco may be emphasizing defense on zone entries and zone exits as a priority, and if you're going to instruct your D to be hyper aggressive about it, then the forwards MUST prioritize backchecking hard to support. And it does seem to be working.

The other point you're correct on is that we don't know exactly what the coaches are instructing, so applying blame in some of the situations may be a bit unfair.

 

[Smiling Joe Hesketh]

This was a great, insightful post. Didn't want it to go unrecognized.

Seconded. Fantastic read.

 

[John Marzano Olympic Hero]

Seconded. Fantastic read.

Thirded. Great post.

 

[TSC]

Thank god we got some nerds in here. I thought BBtL and the main forum were the only ones who had them.

 

[NJ_Sox_Fan]

Lysell called up

 

[Gammon_Clark]

Playing tonight??

 

[Salem's Lot]

Playing tonight??

Looks like he’s playing with Frederic & Brazeau on the 3rd line.

 

[Smiling Joe Hesketh]

18 save shutout tonight for Swayman. Limiting the shots he sees is a winning strategy. Keep those sticks in the passing lanes, boys, it’s working.

 

[joe dokes]

From the Glob (as many had surmised):

After undergoing three offseason surgeries, Brad Marchand said following a workout at TD Garden prior to the Christmas break that he does not expect to regain 100 percent efficiency this season. “I don’t think I’ll get back there ‘til next year,” said the captain. “You never catch up after you miss a summer of training — to make up for three or four months of training, it’s just not going to happen in the season.” Nonetheless, Marchand was on fire with a 10-game scoring streak (7-6–13) as he left for the break, tracking what could be his second 30-goal season since 2018-19. “I was in a lot more pain at the start of the [season] than I [expected]

https://www.bostonglobe.com/2024/12/28/sports/alex-ovechkin-nhl-goal-record/

 

[cshea]

Lysell was sent back to Providence yesterday. Definitely was a reward promotion with his family in town for the holiday's.

 

[Dummy Hoy]

Cut the Airing of Grievances.

 

[doctorogres]

Thank god we got some nerds in here. I thought BBtL and the main forum were the only ones who had them.

Thanks. I’m mostly a main forum guy but watching every game this year has made me look into things a little more deeply.

 

[joe dokes]

I'm seeing basically the same team as last year, with the one glaring and hobbling difference being that the goaltending is not making up for defensive errors, which every team makes from time to time. Whether it was a mistake in the d-zone or a bad giveaway at the offensive blue line, it seemed like there were dozens of "oh shit.....Swayman really saved that guy's ass that time." It's just not happening this year. Mistakes (which, again, every team makes) are turning into goals at a very high rate. This goes beyond how badly Swayman might be playing overall. The 18 skaters just aren't collectively *that* good; so if the goaltending isn't significantly above average, the team wont be either.

 

[Smiling Joe Hesketh]

I've been very hard on Swayman all year but last night wasn't even entirely on him. Not much doing on the goals he let up. As others have pointed out, his saves on high danger chances are way down, so as Dokes said Swayman is not bailing their asses out this year like he did last.

It's increasingly looking like a year where they don't do much of anything. We haven't really had one of those in a while.

 

[The Mort Report]

I was listening to a pod with Evan and Haggs yesterday, and they gave an idea I hadn't thought about and I think it might be a great lever to pull. Haggs said that after the Oilers game the team asked if there was anyone specific the media wanted to talk to, and they all said leadership. Coyle was the first one out there, then Freddy and Brad, but Pasta and Charlie never came out. They floated the idea of changing the As, at least one to Coyle. Those two are playing uninspired, lazy hockey, and maybe taking those distinctions away from them might light a fire(I can't believe that has to be a thing for these guys).

It does devalue the A a bit this season but they need to start thinking outside of the box at this point if they aren't willing to make internal roster changes

 

[Salem's Lot]

I was listening to a pod with Evan and Haggs yesterday, and they gave an idea I hadn't thought about and I think it might be a great lever to pull. Haggs said that after the Oilers game the team asked if there was anyone specific the media wanted to talk to, and they all said leadership. Coyle was the first one out there, then Freddy and Brad, but Pasta and Charlie never came out. They floated the idea of changing the As, at least one to Coyle. Those two are playing uninspired, lazy hockey, and maybe taking those distinctions away from them might light a fire(I can't believe that has to be a thing for these guys).

It does devalue the A a bit this season but they need to start thinking outside of the box at this point if they aren't willing to make internal roster changes

Coyle hasn’t done anything all year either. I personally couldn’t care less who talks to media dip shits like Haggs. Coyle is one of the first guys they should look to move if they actually commit to selling at the deadline.

That’s classic Boston media tripe. This team has very little talent, so let’s go after the only guys that have talent because they don’t want to talk to us.

 

[The Mort Report]

Coyle hasn’t done anything all year either. I personally couldn’t care less who talks to media dip shits like Haggs. Coyle is one of the first guys they should look to move if they actually commit to selling at the deadline.

That’s classic Boston media tripe. This team has very little talent, so let’s go after the only guys that have talent because they don’t want to talk to us.

So you're saying the guys wearing the As should avoid the media after a loss that bad? It's terrible leadership on their part, you wear that letter to take responsibility. They don't. Coyle was at least willing to come out and face questions. I don't care if they give it to someone else, but if you're wearing an A you need to show leadership, and they are not leading on or off the ice(at least publicly)

 

[TSC]

So you're saying the guys wearing the As should avoid the media after a loss that bad? It's terrible leadership on their part, you wear that letter to take responsibility. They don't. Coyle was at least willing to come out and face questions. I don't care if they give it to someone else, but if you're wearing an A you need to show leadership, and they are not leading on or off the ice(at least publicly)

Answering the idiot media is quite literally the last metric Bruins leadership should be looking at when deciding who wears the C or an A.

I guarantee you no one who actually plays looks at someone who is good at answering questions from fucking Haggs and thinks “yea, that’s Captain material right there.”

 

[cshea]

It’s all window dressing. They aren’t talented and there is no button to push with the coach, captains, etc. that’ll fix that.

 

[NYCSox]

It’s all window dressing. They aren’t talented and there is no button to push with the coach, captains, etc. that’ll fix that.

Yup. You just can't win with only a couple of top six caliber forwards.

 

[amfox1]

I was listening to a pod with Evan and Haggs yesterday, and they gave an idea I hadn't thought about and I think it might be a great lever to pull. Haggs said that after the Oilers game the team asked if there was anyone specific the media wanted to talk to, and they all said leadership. Coyle was the first one out there, then Freddy and Brad, but Pasta and Charlie never came out. They floated the idea of changing the As, at least one to Coyle. Those two are playing uninspired, lazy hockey, and maybe taking those distinctions away from them might light a fire(I can't believe that has to be a thing for these guys).

It does devalue the A a bit this season but they need to start thinking outside of the box at this point if they aren't willing to make internal roster changes

Do you believe that the interim coach stripping two current, long-signed players of the A and giving it to another current player helps the locker room? That, somehow, the act of publicly embarrassing your two biggest stars will magically get the team and those players to play better? I think not (see Rangers, New York). Sacco is going to lose his job at the end of the year, not Pastrnak and McAvoy (unless you are advocating for blowing up the team and trading those two players at the deadline).

Sounds like an idea from someone who has never participated in a team (Haggs and Evan, not you).

 

[j44thor]

Not to pour salt in the wound but the Athletic team prospect rankings have B's 30th but would have been 32nd if Poitras was still with the big club.
They really need to embrace a re-build. I'd consider trading anyone not named Pasta/McAvoy at this point.
https://www.nytimes.com/athletic/5929601/2025/01/10/bruins-nhl-prospects-rankings-2025/

 

[cshea]

Do you believe that the interim coach stripping two current, long-signed players of the A and giving it to another current player helps the locker room? That, somehow, the act of publicly embarrassing your two biggest stars will magically get the team and those players to play better? I think not (see Rangers, New York). Sacco is going to lose his job at the end of the year, not Pastrnak and McAvoy (unless you are advocating for blowing up the team and trading those two players at the deadline).

Sounds like an idea from someone who has never participated in a team (Haggs and Evan, not you).

Not to mention you're basically firing two guys, promoting two others to replace them and asking everyone involved, including the other 19 players, to work together.

 

[Salem's Lot]

As they sit this morning, they are technically still in a playoff position, but that’s due to playing more games than everyone behind them. In points percentage they are 11th out of 15th in the East.

The most concerning thing to me is that the effort has been there pretty much every night since Sacco took over, so there’s no magic button that a coach or the leadership group can push, they just don’t have enough top of the roster caliber NHL players. We all saw this coming with the team (rightfully at the time) going all in trying to win the cup in the last few years of Bergeron, and now it’s coming home to roost.

There is really no quick fixes to this, I think they just have to ride it out, sell what they can at the deadline for futures, and spend the last month of the season getting a good look at Poitras, Lysell, and Merkulov.

 

[tims4wins]

As they sit this morning, they are technically still in a playoff position, but that’s due to playing more games than everyone behind them. In points percentage they are 11th out of 15th in the East.

I wonder how far they'd have to fall for a true wakeup call. I'm not sure that if they finish 1-2 points out of playoff position they'd truly get the message. If they don't make the playoffs, I kinda want them to finish 15th.

 

[Salem's Lot]

I wonder how far they'd have to fall for a true wakeup call. I'm not sure that if they finish 1-2 points out of playoff position they'd truly get the message. If they don't make the playoffs, I kinda want them to finish 15th.

I mean you always want the best pick possible if you don’t make the playoffs. I fear that Neely would just chalk this up to a bad season because of the goalie holdout, or the bad training camp, or some injuries that we can speculate on but don’t really know the extent of, and they’ll try to patch holes like they did this summer instead of really taking a hard look at the roster.

The wild card in all of this is if anything changes from the ownership level if Jeremy Jacobs dies.

 

[joe dokes]

The most concerning thing to me is that the effort has been there pretty much every night since Sacco took over, so there’s no magic button that a coach or the leadership group can push, they just don’t have enough top of the roster caliber NHL players.

I think this is right. Im ready to cut bait on some of the 2.5 line players (good enough for 3rd, not quite for top6) who will have value to better teams who need to round out their roster.

Coyle, for example comes to mind. But that would take some serious mirror-looking by the FO, as they would likely (and perhaps accurately in the moment) be seen as "giving up when theyre in the playoffs," though as the points %%% goes, thats not really true.

 

[John Marzano Olympic Hero]

I'm mostly a lurker in this forum, but I think what Hags was getting at about McAvoy and Pasta not talking to the press isn't for the writers to get their cliched quotes, it's more about accountability. McAvoy and Pasta wear the A and part of their job is to take responsibility when things are going sideways. Because if they don't then a teammate has to step up and do it (in this case Coyle).

If it's done enough (shirking of duties) then maybe the feeling around the locker room is that McAvoy and Pasta don't want to do the bullshit work that comes with being a captain and the other guys have to pick up the slack. Personally, I don't give a shit, who cares what they say to the press. It's not like either one of them are going to come out blistering their teammates, but in sports (especially hockey) where there's a set expectation of what it means to be a captain or an alternate that's been drilled in their heads since they were kids, it might rub some the wrong way.

I am definitely not down with stripping the A from either's sweaters, that's not what I'm saying. And I'm sure this is just a little thing, but I don't think it's about getting quotes for the fourth estate.

 

[TSC]

I'm mostly a lurker in this forum, but I think what Hags was getting at about McAvoy and Pasta not talking to the press isn't for the writers to get their cliched quotes, it's more about accountability. McAvoy and Pasta wear the A and part of their job is to take responsibility when things are going sideways. Because if they don't then a teammate has to step up and do it (in this case Coyle).

If it's done enough (shirking of duties) then maybe the feeling around the locker room is that McAvoy and Pasta don't want to do the bullshit work that comes with being a captain and the other guys have to pick up the slack. Personally, I don't give a shit, who cares what they say to the press. It's not like either one of them are going to come out blistering their teammates, but in sports (especially hockey) where there's a set expectation of what it means to be a captain or an alternate that's been drilled in their heads since they were kids, it might rub some the wrong way.

I am definitely not down with stripping the A from either's sweaters, that's not what I'm saying. And I'm sure this is just a little thing, but I don't think it's about getting quotes for the fourth estate.

But who decided that "accountability" is only done via the media?

I doubt a single guy in the lockerroom cares who goes and talks to the media. Accountability is something that happens teammate to teammate, and players to coaches. To think that a player not answering bullshit gotcha questions from the likes of Haggs or KPD means they aren't accountable gives the press a role in the process they don't deserve.

If players started questioning McAvoy or Pastas leadership publicly, or to the coaches, that's one thing. But we've never heard anything of the sort.

 

[cshea]

I haven't gone back all the way but Pasta did media after the Rangers, Maple Leafs and Islanders games. McAvoy spoke before the Edmonton game and after practice yesterday and did media after the Capitals game. The two are pretty regularly out in front of the media. The mom's were coming in, maybe they had dinner plans with their mom's or something after the Edmonton game, who knows.

Like I said, I think it's all window dressing. What does McAvoy and Pasta saying "we sucked, gotta be beter" after the Edmonton game really change?

 

[Smiling Joe Hesketh]

There's also this insidious idea that talking to the media is in fact accountability at all. There's no accountability to be had with the media; the only accountability that matters is that with one's teammates and the organization.

The team is struggling badly and I get that Hags smells blood, but there's not leadership in talking to a stiff like Hags. That's all bread and circus.

 

[TSC]

There's also this insidious idea that talking to the media is in fact accountability at all. There's no accountability to be had with the media; the only accountability that matters is that with one's teammates and the organization.

The team is struggling badly and I get that Hags smells blood, but there's not leadership in talking to a stiff like Hags. That's all bread and circus.

Have me pinked, do ya?

 

[Smiling Joe Hesketh]

Always.

 

[cshea]

I think I put this in the Sweeney/Neely thread but this is how I would approach the rest of the year.

First thing I'd do is call up Lysell and Merkulov. Lysell plays in the top 6. Merkulov centers the 3rd line. They are both 2+ years into their AHL careers, I don't know what more there is for them to learn at that level. Bring them up and let them sink or swim, at least you'd know what you've got in them prior to the offseason. I'd probably bring Poitras up as well but he's younger and much earlier in his development so I can buy a "needs to work on things" argument. I'm not calling these guys up to save the season, it's to see what they've got and if they're potential pieces for next year and beyond. They'd have to waive at least 1 player to bring up Lysell/Merkulov so see you later Wahlstrom or McLaughlin. Both if Poitras comes up too.

Open for business on the trade market. I don't think they have much to offer but obviously Freddy would be a candidate to trade. Get what you can. Maybe Geekie too. You aren't really clearing money off next years cap but you'd be adding a few futures. I wouldn't push to trade him but I'd go to Marchand and leave the decision to him. Do you want to go or stay? I assume he'll want to stay but if he's open to a move then explore it.

The defense is fine, the goaltending will be fine. They need to completely overhaul and import forwards who can score.

 

[John Marzano Olympic Hero]

But who decided that "accountability" is only done via the media?

I doubt a single guy in the lockerroom cares who goes and talks to the media. Accountability is something that happens teammate to teammate, and players to coaches. To think that a player not answering bullshit gotcha questions from the likes of Haggs or KPD means they aren't accountable gives the press a role in the process they don't deserve.

If players started questioning McAvoy or Pastas leadership publicly, or to the coaches, that's one thing. But we've never heard anything of the sort.

I'm not saying that accountability is ONLY done via the media. I was actually pretty explicit not to say that. But part of the job of the alternate captain is to act as a mouthpiece for the team, no? Part of that is by discussing what's wrong with the team with the media because someone has to do it--it shouldn't always be Marchand. And if it's not done by the guys whose job description (unwritten, of course) is to do that, it falls to someone on the team.

I think that you're right. For most players if there was a perfect world, it would be to play hockey, get paid lots and not have to deal with the bullshit of the media and fans. But ultimately they have to.

Where the accountability issue comes from (at least to me) ISN'T from answering questions from Fluto or KPD or Hags, it's by doing your job -- even the parts that are obviously bullshit and ones that you don't want to do. Otherwise that job gets passed down to someone else in the locker room. Someone, who probably dislikes it as much as Pasta and McAvoy do but they do it because that's what the team is asking him to do.

Also, I'm not arguing that sad Pasta and McAvoy is just going to turn the season around and they'll be hoisting the Cup in June. That's not what I was responding to. What I was responding to was MortReport's post asking where P&M were after the game and TSC saying that the media is bullshit (or however you put it). My point is that yes, talking to the media is undoubtedly bullshit. But as two veterans of the team, two players that have the A, unfortunately it's a part of their job. And if they don't do it, someone else will and when people don't see others doing their job, they begin to slack off from their jobs*.

* Do I think that one night of not answering KPD's witty bon mots is what's going to lead to a Bruins collapse? Of course not, but avalanches start with a snowball and by the time the wheels come flying off (to conflate two cliches) there's a lot of reasons (both conscious and unconscious). This could be one of them.

 

[joe dokes]

I don't know what more there is for them to learn at that level. Bring them up and let them sink or swim, at least you'd know what you've got in them prior to the offseason.

Thats the approach they're taking with Lohrei. And games like last night are part of the ride. It just seems ingrained in the FO's thinking that a defenseman with offensive promise who needs work on defense is a preferable risk to a forward with offensive promise who needs work defensively. That does not make a lot of sense to me, especially on an offensively challenged team.