If that's the case then it looks like Don might of let the wrong Goalie go imo.
I just dont see this franchise paying a goalie 9 or 10 million a year. Hell do they even have the cap space for a contract like that??
2024 Bruins Off Season News - Everyone Else But the Center
- Thread starter TSC
- Start date
I just dont see this franchise paying a goalie 9 or 10 million a year. Hell do they even have the cap space for a contract like that??
Cap sites have them at about $8.6. Some maneuvering would have to be done to fit him in but they could probably figure out a way to do it without having to trade someone.
I don’t understand why you don’t think the Bruins would pay a goalie $9 or $10 million per year when they paid Rask $7 million per year 10 years ago with a much lower cap ceiling.
They have $8.6 million in cap space but that includes Brown, Brazeau and Lettieri. 2 of those players (or all 3) will be demoted so that's about $1.6 million which takes them to $10.2.
I don't think Swayman ends up getting $10 million, I think it lands in $8.5-$9.5 million anyways.
I don't think Swayman ends up getting $10 million, I think it lands in $8.5-$9.5 million anyways.
Isn't the better question why they decided to take back a not cheap goalie in the Ullmark deal when they have the youngster in the ranks and very well should have known this was coming down the pipe?
I don't have the numbers in front of me and I'm not at a computer, but isn't the salary that came back more than those 3 guys mentioned above combine?
I don't have the numbers in front of me and I'm not at a computer, but isn't the salary that came back more than those 3 guys mentioned above combine?
They wanted a first round pick. I wouldn’t have done that deal either, but there were a couple of guys that they appear to have been targeting in the first round, so they made the deal. I would’ve taken a lesser pick and kept the cap space, but I can see the rationale if they really thought they could get a future top 6 center in that group.
https://www.sportsnet.ca/nhl/article/32-thoughts-where-remaining-rfas-stand-as-training-camps-near/
I like Swayman but his camp is a bit insufferable through this. The Bruins were horrible in arbitration! (but we filed) and I want to be a Bruins for a long time! (but I want to set the market for my peers).
I'm not saying he should just bend and take a below market deal or anything but the constant leaks and woe-is-me stuff from the Swayman side is getting obnoxious.
I take a little issue with the framing of point 6 where teams should move mountains to avoid arbitration. Yeah, Swayman has said he didn't like the process and the Bruins said mean things making their case. However, everyone is conveniently leaving out the part where it was player elected arbitration. Yeah, the Bruins could've offered more money last year or whatever to avoid it but it takes 2 to tango and Swayman could've handled it like he did this year and decline arbitration.
I like Swayman but his camp is a bit insufferable through this. The Bruins were horrible in arbitration! (but we filed) and I want to be a Bruins for a long time! (but I want to set the market for my peers).
I'm not saying he should just bend and take a below market deal or anything but the constant leaks and woe-is-me stuff from the Swayman side is getting obnoxious.
Is there any indication that anything in that article is from Swayman’s camp? Reads like a guy shooting from the hip on what’s taking so long, and possibly square peg round holing it.
Friedman has been pretty consistant in noting Swayman's lingering resentment about how arbitration went.
I'd also note that the rumored deal the bruins offered at like 6m a year is pretty insulting given where the market for #1 goalies is.
I kind of agree with Freidman that going to arb with a guy you consider a cornerstone is dumb (Sway does deserve blame though as cshea noted, it takes 2 to tango)...as is low balling him.
I'd also note that the rumored deal the bruins offered at like 6m a year is pretty insulting given where the market for #1 goalies is.
I kind of agree with Freidman that going to arb with a guy you consider a cornerstone is dumb (Sway does deserve blame though as cshea noted, it takes 2 to tango)...as is low balling him.
I have no doubt that there’s lingering resentment. That’s just quite a bit different than continued leaks about lingering resentment, is all.
Last edited:
Yeah, I get Swayman feels resentment. I guess I just feel like it's important context to note that it was player elected arbitration that led to the hearing. We have no idea how the negotiations actually went between the two sides. It is certainly possible, if not likely, the Bruins were low balling given they were in a cap cruch but we really don't know how far apart they really were.
In general I think the problem with the negotiation this time around is all the stats say he's #1 except for games played. Which isn't his fault, but also creates some uncertainty and the Bruins are trying to leverage it. Personally, I'd give them the Vasilevsky contract and be done with it.
He's been quoted in a few articles recently and has done a few podcast hits, including one where he says he needs to do what's best for his peers. Ryan Whitney on Chichlets reported the Bruins offer was 4x$6 million a few weeks ago. That almost certainly came from Swayman, I don't see any scenario where the team would be leaking what the public would think is a lowball offer like that.
I don't really disagree with anything Swayman has said. He should be paid like a #1 and is under no obligation to take any sort of discount. The 4x$6 million was laugable. I'm just getting the feeling that he's engaging in a bit of public negotiations.
View: https://twitter.com/_tyanderson/status/1836151640254291976?s=46&t=AKDUTt9TbZHQw0JxXORGGA
Swayman extension? (Please).
Swayman extension? (Please).
Agree with this, 7 or even 8 per would be perfectly fine. Interesting in the coming news.
Greg Hill show saying Swayman extension will be announced today.
This guy saying it’s 8x8.5.
View: https://twitter.com/realrobreinhart/status/1836202831314878577?s=61&t=raANCFlJsZ0oGUu31YKdSA
This guy saying it’s 8x8.5.
View: https://twitter.com/realrobreinhart/status/1836202831314878577?s=61&t=raANCFlJsZ0oGUu31YKdSA
No clue who that Rob Reinhart guy is, apparently a Herald reporter?
FWIW, Ty walked his "Bruins news coming soon" tweet back saying he had3 sources yesterday saying it was close or at the end game stages but then got a "status quo" trying to confirm. He does say the Bruins under Sweeney don't leak and deny when he asks for confirmation. He said he had the Bergeron retirement the day before the official announcement last year but they vehemently denied it.
View: https://twitter.com/_TyAnderson/status/1836282221482721713
FWIW, Ty walked his "Bruins news coming soon" tweet back saying he had3 sources yesterday saying it was close or at the end game stages but then got a "status quo" trying to confirm. He does say the Bruins under Sweeney don't leak and deny when he asks for confirmation. He said he had the Bergeron retirement the day before the official announcement last year but they vehemently denied it.
View: https://twitter.com/_TyAnderson/status/1836282221482721713
Honestly if the 8 x 8.5 is actually correct that's pretty much what I expected. It's basically the Hellebuyck deal. Which is about where he should come in. It's not an overpay and includes a buyout of 2 RFA years. He's not worth anything more than that and that should be the highest Boston goes.
Looks like a Swayman extension announcement isn't coming that soon.
View: https://twitter.com/_TyAnderson/status/1836435073647714432
View: https://twitter.com/_TyAnderson/status/1836435073647714432
During Sweeney’s presser, he said that he wasn’t too worried, that they’d have it done by DECEMBER 1.
Seemed to me to be a completely deadpan joke, but who the fuck knows at this point? Also dropped a “Excited about the players we have in camp and ready to move forward.”
Seemed to me to be a completely deadpan joke, but who the fuck knows at this point? Also dropped a “Excited about the players we have in camp and ready to move forward.”
Yeah, it's alarming he referenced December 1. I don't think it was a joke or deadpan. That's the deadline they have to sign Swayman by or Swayman becomes ineligible to play this year. Acknowledging it seems a bit scary to me, but maybe I'm reading too much into it.
He also was clearly frustrated with the media and the reporting on the situation, specifically calling Biz and Spittin' Chichlets out. Dropped a "bullshit" and all called Chiclets "Spittin' on Yourself."
I interpreted his comments as they are further apart than we think.
I don’t think they’re anywhere close. When Ullmark got traded it gave Swayman some leverage and his agent is using that. Hopefully the goaltending plays well in October and Swayman starts getting antsy and tells the agent to make a deal. Right now, it looks like he’s just trying to set the market vs getting his client signed.
I’m so confused. So it’s not done at 8x8.5? Premature reporting? Wtf is going on?!
I don’t blame Jeremy for not reporting, injuries can happen at any time.
wtf are the Bruins doing? Get this done.
I don’t blame Jeremy for not reporting, injuries can happen at any time.
wtf are the Bruins doing? Get this done.
I think the agent is shooting higher than that and the team is shooting lower. That 8 years $8.5 million is probably the middle number, but both sides are apparently going to leverage until someone has to make a deal.
It seems like the Ullmark deal was a bit premature given the amount of negotiating happening now but it will be interesting to see when the contract gets signed and what the value is and term too.
I agree with this. I think 8.5 is fair, especially when you consider a length of 8 years. It’s almost certainly more than the Bruins want to pay, and a little less than he wants, which makes it perfect in the world of negotiating.
Get it done. Sooner the better, for all parties.
Why wouldn’t Swayman’s agent hold out for $10 though? It takes both sides to get it done, and he can bet that the goalie situation will be such a train wreck in October that Sweeney will pay it. Of course it could go the other way as well, that’s the gamble that they seem like they want to take, and that’s their right.
Is $8.5 on the table? Because reporting is that $6M for 8 years was the offer in the table, and Fluto is predicting a bridge of 4 at $7M.
Not sure Hellebuyck is a good comp. Hellebuyck was 30 with ~
450 NHL games under his belt when he signed his extension. He was also approaching unrestricted free agency. Swayman is restricted, 25, and has less than half the games played.
Vasilevsky is close-ish. He signed 8x$9.5 million at age 26 as a restricted free agent. That deal was signed in 2020 when the cap was $81.5 million, so Vasilevskiy got 11.6% of the cap. The 2024 NHL cap is $88 million, so an equivalent deal would be in the neighborhood or 8x$10.2 million.
Swayman’s #’s are comparable to Vasilevskiy through Vasilevsky’s first 4 years prior to his extension. They have an identical save percentage. The problem in the negotiation is Vasilevsky did it over 100+ more games played. Swayman wants to be paid like a top end #1, which everything except for games played says he is. The Bruins are a bit leery of paying top of the market for a guy who has yet to be a true #1 in terms of games played.
Except the Bruins just need to get "good enough" play out of their existing net minders for the first 7 weeks of the season. That's not a given, obviously, but it's not uncommon for average-ish goalies to have a nice run for a few weeks. 25 games and only 1 back-to-back, so it's not out of the question that the Bruins try to get by, as the team would hold all the leverage come December 1st.
Vasilevskiy had also won a Vezina in his age 24 season and finished 3rd in his age 23 season. Swayman hasn't come close to that yet.
I agree their statistics are similar however outside of games played. Vasilevskiy was considered one of the top 5 goalies in the league when he signed his extension. (I am remembering that correctly right?) Is Swayman top 5 in the league right now? I'd argue he's close, but it's still don't think he's worth 10 million a year.
I used the Hellebuyck contract because I think it's a solid middle ground. More than Boston allegedly offered, but less than the 10 million he wants. A solid bridge. Also pays him like a top 3 goalie in the league.
This is my thought as well, I’m not convinced they are at or even near $8.5. I did pull up the video of the press conference as I wanted to watch it myself. The comment about December 1 was not a deadpan joke. It seems they are far apart and he, at least to me, could see this playing out that far.
Unfortunate. Hopefully this doesn’t get them in a hole to start the season. They already committed to him. Pay the man his money.
Yeah, I listened to more later, and had previously just heard a little out of context.
The shit about Korpisalo working with Goalie Bob just like Ullmark at the beginning was sobering, and might give us some insight into why that trade actually went down like it did—maybe the plan was to play hardball with Swayman all along.
If they said 6 and he said 10, 8.5 would track. I have little patience for those who walk away from negotiations instead of countering at least once. They are unserious about making a deal.
I think Swayman could always come down on years to 3 or 4 and go for 8.5, but the Bruins have to be willing to dance too.
If they are the ones insisting on 8 years and not near the top of the range but at the lower end, then Swayman has every right to balk at it. As in 10 years that 6,7,8 will be very low on the salary cap percentage.
So it's hard for anyone to sit here and say who is wrong or right cause we don't know the dynamics of the negotiation at all. The longer the Bruins want to lock up Swayman, the higher they have to pay as the salary will have a higher potential for being an underpay.
If they are the ones insisting on 8 years and not near the top of the range but at the lower end, then Swayman has every right to balk at it. As in 10 years that 6,7,8 will be very low on the salary cap percentage.
So it's hard for anyone to sit here and say who is wrong or right cause we don't know the dynamics of the negotiation at all. The longer the Bruins want to lock up Swayman, the higher they have to pay as the salary will have a higher potential for being an underpay.
There's zero evidence that the Bruins have walked away from negotiations without countering. Bruins front office has never leaked anything with Neely/Sweeney in charge, so most the "reports" seem like reporters and their sources speculating. The "no returned calls for 3 weeks" was obviously BS, and Sweeney was right to call that report out as such.
At the same time, it's not always as simple as just saying "OK, you want 10, we want 6, so let's do 8.5 and call it a day", as for all we know Swayman's side may have been signaling that they were not going to be flexible, and in which case the Bruins would be negotiating against themselves, which is never productive. Also, the Bruins have leverage here due to Swayman's RFA status, and so it's not at all surprising the Sweeney is using that leverage while also doing his best to ensure the team has the optimal salary cap position in future seasons.
At the same time, it's not always as simple as just saying "OK, you want 10, we want 6, so let's do 8.5 and call it a day", as for all we know Swayman's side may have been signaling that they were not going to be flexible, and in which case the Bruins would be negotiating against themselves, which is never productive. Also, the Bruins have leverage here due to Swayman's RFA status, and so it's not at all surprising the Sweeney is using that leverage while also doing his best to ensure the team has the optimal salary cap position in future seasons.
I think the 4 year contract that Fluto estimated is about right. Fluto guessed an AAV of $7 million. No idea if that is correct, there aren't many comparables which is why we're in this predicament in the first place. The guys who have gotten max deals at high AAV at around his age have all had much more game experience than Swayman. The guys with Swayman's experience get less.
The compromise on both sides may be on term. It seems the Bruins don't want to go to the high AAV that would come with a max deal. The middle ground might be a lower AAV on a 4-year deal. The Bruins get the lower AAV, buy 2 years of free agency. Swayman would be able to hit the UFA market again at 29 in a rising cap environment and if all goes according to plan be in line for a monster max extension. Seems like both sides compromise a bit. The Bruins save AAV in the short term but take on the risk of either seeing him walk in 4 years or pony up more $ in the long run to retain him. Swayman gives up the long term security but would still bank ~$28-30 million guaranteed.
The compromise on both sides may be on term. It seems the Bruins don't want to go to the high AAV that would come with a max deal. The middle ground might be a lower AAV on a 4-year deal. The Bruins get the lower AAV, buy 2 years of free agency. Swayman would be able to hit the UFA market again at 29 in a rising cap environment and if all goes according to plan be in line for a monster max extension. Seems like both sides compromise a bit. The Bruins save AAV in the short term but take on the risk of either seeing him walk in 4 years or pony up more $ in the long run to retain him. Swayman gives up the long term security but would still bank ~$28-30 million guaranteed.
What would the arbitration award have been for this season if it had gone the same as last offseason? What is a normal raise for RFAs?
Last year Swayman was awarded 3.45M after playing his first three years on the ELC. Little info I was unaware of:
Sweeney could have opted to have that 3.45M as the salary for this year also. Of course if he’d done so, Swayman camp would have been upset and it would have given Sweeney less leverage with only 1 year of RFA left next offseason.
Last year Swayman was awarded 3.45M after playing his first three years on the ELC. Little info I was unaware of:
Sweeney could have opted to have that 3.45M as the salary for this year also. Of course if he’d done so, Swayman camp would have been upset and it would have given Sweeney less leverage with only 1 year of RFA left next offseason.
Kind of hard to pin point what an arb award would've looked like. It is not common that players actually reach the hearing, particularly high profile players like Swayman.
The way arbitration works in the NHL is whichever side elects arbitration, the other side gets to choose the term. So last year, Swayman elected for arbitration and the Bruins chose a 1-year deal. Then each side submits their number. Last year the Bruins argued for $2 million, Swayman argued at $4.8 million. The arbitor hears each side and then determines the salary and can award anything, it's not $2 million or $4.8 million. Generally speaking, the arbitors just split the difference which is what happened last year. The award was $3.475 million.
The way arbitration works in the NHL is whichever side elects arbitration, the other side gets to choose the term. So last year, Swayman elected for arbitration and the Bruins chose a 1-year deal. Then each side submits their number. Last year the Bruins argued for $2 million, Swayman argued at $4.8 million. The arbitor hears each side and then determines the salary and can award anything, it's not $2 million or $4.8 million. Generally speaking, the arbitors just split the difference which is what happened last year. The award was $3.475 million.
Commence tea leave reading. The Bruins brought another goalie into camp on a PTO.
View: https://twitter.com/NHLBruins/status/1836790959775846719
View: https://twitter.com/NHLBruins/status/1836790959775846719
To me it is far less about playing hardball with Swayman and more about finding a goalie they can help improve and get value out of (a la Ully). Although I'm sure having a backup plan in case negotiations were challenging was a major factor too.
Korpisalo is 29 and his GSAA has been negative in 6 out of his 8 years in the league. He's awful, he's not likely going to improve much at his age, and if the Bruins really think they can play hardball with Swayman because they have Korpisalo, they're in for an extremely rude awakening.
It's bad enough he took his corpse in return for Ullmark. But actually thinking he could be the starter if Swayman hold out? Madness.
It's bad enough he took his corpse in return for Ullmark. But actually thinking he could be the starter if Swayman hold out? Madness.
Me and you don't end up on entirely the same level very often around here these days, but on this one I absolutely agree with you.
I'm seriously getting Steve Shields/Jeff Hackett vibes from this mess. I hate being old enough that I witnessed those two clowns in our goal, and hate that I'm young enough to still remember the experience.
I don’t think there is much of a chance of Korpisalo being the starter. Either Swayman signs, or a better goalie than Korpisalo comes back as part of it when they trade him.
I don’t think he’s getting traded unless he demands it. Even then, the team might say no, we have your rights for two more years.