2021-22 76ers thread: Going for it all

terrynever

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Would either side consider a Westbrook for Simmons deal?
That’s a wet dream for Ben. Not sure I have ever seen Russ’s name mentioned in Simmons scenarios before. We should all hope there is no way the Lakers can acquire Simmons because of his obvious fit in LA.
 

ElUno20

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That’s a wet dream for Ben. Not sure I have ever seen Russ’s name mentioned in Simmons scenarios before. We should all hope there is no way the Lakers can acquire Simmons because of his obvious fit in LA.
Not even Morey is that stupid
 

terrynever

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76ers beat the Warriors last night with strong team defense and a lot of missed threes by the visitors. No reason to pay attention to this team until they trade you know who. They are 15-12 and playing hard every night despite a league-high 27 games lost to Covid, 9 by Embiid. Losing what’s his name didn’t kill them but this is a mediocre team right now, still fun to watch. The coach keeps them hustling.
 

128

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76ers beat the Warriors last night with strong team defense and a lot of missed threes by the visitors. No reason to pay attention to this team until they trade you know who. They are 15-12 and playing hard every night despite a league-high 27 games lost to Covid, 9 by Embiid. Losing what’s his name didn’t kill them but this is a mediocre team right now, still fun to watch. The coach keeps them hustling.
It must be nice to follow a team that plays hard every night and whose coach keeps them hustling.
 

terrynever

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It must be nice to follow a team that plays hard every night and whose coach keeps them hustling.
Yes, I like watching this team. Lots of interesting players, most of them flawed, but good guys who share the ball and usually get back on defense. Not always.
 

terrynever

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Ben Simmons was a great defensive weapon for Philly. His size gave Philly mismatches all over the court. 76ers were a more physical team with Ben in the backcourt, crashing boards. But for all of that, it is so much easier to watch Maxey in Ben’s place. There is balance and symmetry in what Philly does on offense. They move the ball, shoot it fairly well, and Doc makes sure they play defense. They won’t win it all, of course. They never do. But this team is worth watching.
 

128

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Ben Simmons was a great defensive weapon for Philly. His size gave Philly mismatches all over the court. 76ers were a more physical team with Ben in the backcourt, crashing boards. But for all of that, it is so much easier to watch Maxey in Ben’s place. There is balance and symmetry in what Philly does on offense. They move the ball, shoot it fairly well, and Doc makes sure they play defense. They won’t win it all, of course. They never do. But this team is worth watching.
I'm not so sure the Sixers couldn't be at least a Finals team if they got 70 cents on the dollar for Simmons. Right now they're getting literally nothing from that slot and still piling up wins. If the Nets are full strength, they probably win the East, but an injury or two can change things in a hurry.
 

terrynever

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I'm not so sure the Sixers couldn't be at least a Finals team if they got 70 cents on the dollar for Simmons. Right now they're getting literally nothing from that slot and still piling up wins. If the Nets are full strength, they probably win the East, but an injury or two can change things in a hurry.
The Athletic wrote how John Collins might be a good fit. He’s unhappy in Atlanta.
 

Euclis20

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Is Collins the exact same player as Tobias Harris? Or is there more upside there? I guess there's more value there just in the fact that he's 5 years younger and only making about 2/3 as much.
 

benhogan

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Is Collins the exact same player as Tobias Harris? Or is there more upside there? I guess there's more value there just in the fact that he's 5 years younger and only making about 2/3 as much.
wouldn't it be Simmons for Collins+?

Atlanta needs perimeter defense, Tobias Harris is just a better/shinier version of BogBog and Gallinari

maybe I misread your post, are you questioning why would the 76ers want to add John Collins if they already have Tobias Harris?
 
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terrynever

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wouldn't it be Simmons for Collins+?

Atlanta needs perimeter defense, Tobias Harris is just a better/shinier version of BogBog and Gallinari

maybe I misread your post, are you questioning why would the 76ers want to add John Collins if they already have Tobias Harris?
The Athletic writer suggested that Morey has already gone off the rails with Atlanta by expanding the deal to include both Harris and Simmons. Nobody really knows what Morey is thinking. Embiid said last night that the current roster is fine by him. Morey may have paid him extra to say that. Philly fan base is happy with this team, too. We know they are maybe a Top 8 team without Ben but Ben is dead to most everyone in Philly. About half the team supported Ben in September but after three months of Ben just showing up at the practice facility to work out, he seems to have lost the half that defended him at first.
 

Cesar Crespo

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wouldn't it be Simmons for Collins+?

Atlanta needs perimeter defense, Tobias Harris is just a better/shinier version of BogBog and Gallinari

maybe I misread your post, are you questioning why would the 76ers want to add John Collins if they already have Tobias Harris?
He's asking why the 76ers would want Tobias Harris when they already have Tobias Harris.

Personally, I don't think they are that similar but I'm not sure an Embiid/Harris/Collins lineup is that great of a fit.
 

benhogan

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He's asking why the 76ers would want Tobias Harris when they already have Tobias Harris.

Personally, I don't think they are that similar but I'm not sure an Embiid/Harris/Collins lineup is that great of a fit.
I've always liked Collins. He's a solid Corner3 shooter which is nice to pair with Embiid. Plus JC could back up Embiid which avoids playing Drummond too many minutes. Andre looks to have been setting up shop at Pat's and going for extra cheese whiz.
 

Cesar Crespo

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I've always liked Collins. He's a solid Corner3 shooter which is nice to pair with Embiid. Plus JC could back up Embiid which avoids playing Drummond too many minutes. Andre looks to have been setting up shop at Pat's and going for extra cheese whiz.
I like Collins and think he's a good paring with Embiid too. Harris would be the issue. Mostly due to defense.
 

Euclis20

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He's asking why the 76ers would want Tobias Harris when they already have Tobias Harris.

Personally, I don't think they are that similar but I'm not sure an Embiid/Harris/Collins lineup is that great of a fit.
The similarities are fairly general - I see them both as big wings who are moderately efficient high volume scorers, average at best defensively and don't really make anyone around them better. Both really solid players, though Harris is tragically overpaid ($36M for a 29 year old who has never and likely will never make an all-star team is insane). Collins would be a better fit than Harris (just based on age and lower salary), but I don't see that it's much of a change. As part of something else, sure.
 

terrynever

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I've always liked Collins. He's a solid Corner3 shooter which is nice to pair with Embiid. Plus JC could back up Embiid which avoids playing Drummond too many minutes. Andre looks to have been setting up shop at Pat's and going for extra cheese whiz.
Drummond has been great as a 15-minute backup to Embiid. He rebounds, passes, blocks shots. A big step up from Dwight Howard. He made the second unit better.
 

benhogan

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Drummond has been great as a 15-minute backup to Embiid. He rebounds, passes, blocks shots. A big step up from Dwight Howard. He made the second unit better.
You know better than me but I could see AD getting lit up in PnR in the playoffs games. He looked bulky
Doc has to be careful with Embiid minutes, so their backup BIG will play important minutes

Slow BIGz that can't shoot get hunted on both sides of the floor.
 

terrynever

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I may be overlooking Drummond’s bulk and how it plays in the playoffs. Brand probably chose Drummond. I am totally irrational about this team because of the effort they give almost every game. Seeing Drummond grab 23 rebounds in 31 minutes during a win over Sacramento in late November won me over. No Embiid and they were on a tough west coast swing. Drummond is a man in that league. He plays defense and blocks shots, too. A good backup center.
 

terrynever

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I’m going to miss these running 76ers. Last game before Harden, Philly routs Cleveland 103-93. Embiid netted 40 points, 14 rebounds, 10 assists. He is running like a young colt. Best shape he’s been in, ever. Thybulle made 6 of Philly’s 12 steals. Everyone who,played, contributed. This will change when Harden takes over. Maybe for the better?

Embiid hit 4 of 5 treys tonight.

Next two days off but Doc will be holding busy practices with Harden testing his hammy. If all goes well, the new guy will play against Boston on Tuesday night.
 

terrynever

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Hope James Harden plays on Tuesday night against Boston but the 76ers looked pretty good last night while thumping Cleveland without him. Boston’s another story. Best team in the East lately.
 

Euclis20

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Hope James Harden plays on Tuesday night against Boston but the 76ers looked pretty good last night while thumping Cleveland without him. Boston’s another story. Best team in the East lately.
They've looked good and I'd love to think so, but their schedule has been the softest of soft lately. 21 games so far in 2022, just 5 of which were against teams over .500. Friday's win over Denver was their first against a +.500 team that wasn't severely shorthanded (they beat Chicago missing LaVine and Ball, they beat Miami missing Lowry and Butler, and they beat the G league Nets) over that stretch. You can get pretty far in the regular season beating teams you're supposed to beat and it helps that the Celtics are healthy for what feels like the first time since 2017, but Philly will be their toughest matchup since...the last time they played Philly. We'll see.
 

terrynever

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They've looked good and I'd love to think so, but their schedule has been the softest of soft lately. 21 games so far in 2022, just 5 of which were against teams over .500. Friday's win over Denver was their first against a +.500 team that wasn't severely shorthanded (they beat Chicago missing LaVine and Ball, they beat Miami missing Lowry and Butler, and they beat the G league Nets) over that stretch. You can get pretty far in the regular season beating teams you're supposed to beat and it helps that the Celtics are healthy for what feels like the first time since 2017, but Philly will be their toughest matchup since...the last time they played Philly. We'll see.
Lots of good teams, including Philly, have recorded wins over short handed opponents this season. With so many trades last week, the real test is which teams can get it together by April. Every contender also needs to get healthy and stay healthy. Have we ever seen an Eastern Conference with seven teams capable of winning everything?
 

Jakarta

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The skeptic in me thinks he’s ducking the ASG after Lebron and KD laughed at him. And at the cost of missing important games against the Celtics and Bucks.
 

radsoxfan

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The skeptic in me thinks he’s ducking the ASG after Lebron and KD laughed at him. And at the cost of missing important games against the Celtics and Bucks.
Sixers finally get a new max player to replace Simmons and he also immediately refuses to play. Lotta money being spent on nothing so far.

Maybe this roster spot is cursed.
 

wade boggs chicken dinner

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Cellar-Door

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James Harden didn't file the paperwork to opt-in for 22-23 before the deadline, but he can still do it over the summer. Just makes returning next year more of a handshake agreement with Morey. Since he's Mr. Reliable, I'm sure the Sixers have nothing to worry about if they flame out in the first round.

https://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/265850/James-Harden-Didnt-File-Paperwork-In-Time-For-22-23-Opt-In-With-76ers
He'll take the 5/270 of picking up the option in June, with the team promising to extend in August, then if he's unhappy next February he'll start making less and less effort
 

ManicCompression

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He'll take the 5/270 of picking up the option in June, with the team promising to extend in August, then if he's unhappy next February he'll start making less and less effort
Yeah, likely, just funny that it was reported at the deadline, "Oh, Harden already opted-in, and that's big for the Sixers! They have him under contract for another season!" and no, he neglected to give them even that much peace of mind. And with him, it's impossible to know whether it's intentional so that he can have more leverage over the team or whether it was an oversight because he doesn't have an agent.
 

Sam Ray Not

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I'm sure the Sixers have nothing to worry about if they flame out in the first round.
And given how brutal and bunched up the East is, that's probably about a 50-50 proposition. Maybe worse than that, with Embiid + Harden lucky to get in 20 games before the playoffs with which to develop any synergy together.

Too bad Morey had to throw in Seth and Drummond (who both killed it last night v. Sacramento) in a deal that imho would have been a pretty even trade straight up once you factor in Harden's advanced age and health.

Next season might look better, assuming Harden (a) doesn't bolt; (b) works on his body; and (c) has a full offseason to integrate and synergize with JoJo and the others in a new system (he's never been a "plug and play" guy, at least not since OKC). But I'm not seeing it even a little bit this season.
 

HomeRunBaker

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Yeah, likely, just funny that it was reported at the deadline, "Oh, Harden already opted-in, and that's big for the Sixers! They have him under contract for another season!" and no, he neglected to give them even that much peace of mind. And with him, it's impossible to know whether it's intentional so that he can have more leverage over the team or whether it was an oversight because he doesn't have an agent.
With the NBPA having so much control I cannot imagine that Harden is allowed to act on his own behalf without legal representation. Is this bolded confirmed? I would be beyond shocked if Harden is working on his own here.
 

EvilEmpire

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I think Harden is going to be quite satisfied playing in Philly and happy with the situation.

Another star to share the burden, some good young players that are probably going to get better, and an experienced coach to help keep the nonsense down.

Brooklyn should have worked out better, but Kyrie is a cancer.
 

HowBoutDemSox

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With the NBPA having so much control I cannot imagine that Harden is allowed to act on his own behalf without legal representation. Is this bolded confirmed? I would be beyond shocked if Harden is working on his own here.
From a recent, pre-trade Woj article:
Harden hasn't had an agent in several years, but he does have a business manager, Lorenzo McCloud. When Harden wanted out of Houston before the 2020 season, he commissioned agents Jason Ranne and Chafie Fields at Wasserman to work with the Houston Rockets and rival teams to facilitate a trade. They played a key role in getting Harden to the Nets, and then the working relationship ended in March 2021, sources said.

Once again, sources told ESPN, Harden and his manager have been searching for an agent with whom to partner and navigate the situation -- whether that's free agency, a trade to leave the Nets after the season, staying on a new deal or even a trade before Thursday's deadline.

When Harden considered signing an extension last summer, he handled it the way he had for his past two deals in Houston: Discussing the pros and cons of different contract iterations with the National Basketball Players Association. That's why he didn't want to pay an agent's commission; he was a superstar player who needed no negotiation. He could pick his preferred max contract on a menu the way someone else might choose an HMO plan.
On a quick search I couldn’t find if he hired formal agent representation this time around to facilitate the trade to Philly.
 

HomeRunBaker

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From a recent, pre-trade Woj article:

On a quick search I couldn’t find if he hired formal agent representation this time around to facilitate the trade to Philly.
Yeah that makes some sense. There isn’t a professional league that would allow a player under contract to one team to be arranging trades involving himself or anyone else even if his team consented. This is high level legal stuff for which Harden isn’t certified by the league or NBAPA:
 

ManicCompression

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Yeah that makes some sense. There isn’t a professional league that would allow a player under contract to one team to be arranging trades involving himself or anyone else even if his team consented. This is high level legal stuff for which Harden isn’t certified by the league or NBAPA:
I think I heard it on a Zach Lowe podcast. Harden has not had an agent for some time (Embiid also does not have an agent), but he does have a business manager (who's his friend from back in the day). Harden has asked for help from agents to facilitate these trades (as mentioned in HBDS' article) but they're not in a rush to help because they're not getting paid by him (and who knows if they'd let him negotiate his next max). This is also why Harden got the worst coverage in this whole saga while Ben Simmons and the teams are getting sympathetic reporting from Woj, Shams, Shelburne, et al.
 

radsoxfan

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James Harden didn't file the paperwork to opt-in for 22-23 before the deadline, but he can still do it over the summer. Just makes returning next year more of a handshake agreement with Morey. Since he's Mr. Reliable, I'm sure the Sixers have nothing to worry about if they flame out in the first round.

https://basketball.realgm.com/wiretap/265850/James-Harden-Didnt-File-Paperwork-In-Time-For-22-23-Opt-In-With-76ers
This is still a player option correct? Philly can’t rescind this in the off-season I assume.

Of course they wouldn’t barring some career threading injury….

What’s the point of a mid-season deadline for these situations?
 

PedroKsBambino

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I think I heard it on a Zach Lowe podcast. Harden has not had an agent for some time (Embiid also does not have an agent), but he does have a business manager (who's his friend from back in the day). Harden has asked for help from agents to facilitate these trades (as mentioned in HBDS' article) but they're not in a rush to help because they're not getting paid by him (and who knows if they'd let him negotiate his next max). This is also why Harden got the worst coverage in this whole saga while Ben Simmons and the teams are getting sympathetic reporting from Woj, Shams, Shelburne, et al.
Some players use a lawyer who bills hourly instead of an agent to save on the fees. Of course, even this approach is better than Harden's.....
 

wade boggs chicken dinner

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I think Harden is going to be quite satisfied playing in Philly and happy with the situation.

Another star to share the burden, some good young players that are probably going to get better, and an experienced coach to help keep the nonsense down.

Brooklyn should have worked out better, but Kyrie is a cancer.
The LibertyBallers post I referenced above has a few stories about BRK and Harden. Here's one article, and here's a snippet about Harden:

Harden had seemed off all season — both during games and with his comments after them — and was growing frustrated with the situation in Brooklyn. He wanted everything catered to him the way it was in Houston, especially the offense. Kevin Durant and head coach Steve Nash disagreed. Both wanted the Nets’ offense to feature ball and player movement, and Harden, upon being rebuffed, ducked into his shell at times, according to sources, and even criticized teammates and coaches to NBA insiders sitting courtside at games.
"With James, if you’re not 100 percent on his side, you’re his enemy," a former Rockets staffer said.
As the article notes, Harden has appeared to clash with basically every other star teammate he's had; why is Embiid going to be any different?
 

Cellar-Door

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This is still a player option correct? Philly can’t rescind this in the off-season I assume.

Of course they wouldn’t barring some career threading injury….

What’s the point of a mid-season deadline for these situations?
I believe the issue is that he didn't exercise it before the trade, so he can't exercise it until the end of the season. It's possible he had a different deadline, but I doubt it. So it's not a change to the option window, it's that you can't do certain things after a trade for a period of time. Same reason if you want to sign an extension you either have to sign it before the trade (with limits on raises, years, etc.) or wait 6 months.
 

sezwho

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Some players use a lawyer who bills hourly instead of an agent to save on the fees. Of course, even this approach is better than Harden's.....
I think it’s exactly Hardens approach to pay hourly, unless they engaged for a flat fee.

Seems he had muddled through making hundreds of millions without giving the flat 5 points (or whatever) to an agent.

Interestingly, Jaylen Brown did his first contract without an agent.