2020 Tompa Bay: Tom Tom Club

54thMA

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Take the current roster, subtract the 20-25m in payroll from it they'd have had to lose to keep Brady instead of Cam, look at what the current roster is doing this year with covid and injuries on both sides of the line, no chance they'd be 5-1, highly unlikely they'd even be 4-2
Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't there close to 15 million counting against the cap in Brady money regardless of whether he's here or not?

I guess they'd be screwed if they had kept him...........seeing him perform at a high level elsewhere stings.
 

scottyno

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Correct me if I'm wrong, but isn't there close to 15 million counting against the cap in Brady money regardless of whether he's here or not?

I guess they'd be screwed if they had kept him...........seeing him perform at a high level elsewhere stings.
You're right I forgot that part, so it's actually only about 10-15m in cap space they'd have to cut off the current roster, I still don't know how they to do that and still field a top team, since we basically already know what the offense with Brady would look like because they couldn't afford any upgrades, and the defense would be much worse than last year.
 

54thMA

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You're right I forgot that part, so it's actually only about 10-15m in cap space they'd have to cut off the current roster, I still don't know how they to do that and still field a top team, since we basically already know what the offense with Brady would look like because they couldn't afford any upgrades, and the defense would be much worse than last year.
To your point; they would not be able to field a top team, even worse than what is out there now.

Brady is in a better place, I wouldn't want to see him running for his life every week/getting upset seeing little to no talent around him.

He gave me as a fan 19 tremendous years, let the man go out hopefully on top.
 
Jan 30, 2017
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To your point; they would not be able to field a top team, even worse than what is out there now.

Brady is in a better place, I wouldn't want to see him running for his life every week/getting upset seeing little to no talent around him.

He gave me as a fan 19 tremendous years, let the man go out hopefully on top.
Stop being so rational. Really harshing my buzz over here.
 

NomarsFool

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I thought it was a $13 million cap hit. So, the net cost of Brady @25 (if that what it would have cost, could have been more) would have been another $12 million.

But, I think you get there with letting Thuney go. I don't think they'd have had to gut the team.

That said, I'm glad Brady isn't here trying to throw to Gunnar next week. If you are the Bills, how do you not just staple two guys to Byrd and call it a day?
 

BigJimEd

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I thought it was a $13 million cap hit. So, the net cost of Brady @25 (if that what it would have cost, could have been more) would have been another $12 million
Yes and no, I think.
Brady would want the 25+ million on top of that $13M.
They likely would have structured it to push some of the cap hit in future years but that would mean they would be tight against cap next couple years.
 

Marciano490

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I like winning too but I doubt I’d move a sex offender in with my wife and kids.
 

Van Everyman

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Brown didn't look like he was much of a factor either way last night TBH. I was expecting more forcing him the ball but that didn't seem to happen.

Brady has had some really wildly inconsistent moments this season. At times he looks great, others he looks completely washed up ... and often within the same game or even half.

But it's important not to take too much away from this game. He's generally looked exactly the same as the last two seasons, with possibly a better deep ball -- and until last night's train wreck had been steadily improving his chemistry with Evans and Godwin, with Gronk coming off three straight games with a TD for the first time since 2016 (a fact that surprised me given that Gronk went on IR that year). Also, his two worst games have been against NOLA -- who seem to have his number for whatever reason.

My anecdotal takeaway is that the inconsistency a combination of A) New system/coach/culture, B) New players, C) Continued aging D) COVID/No preseason -- but it does seem to be a slog for him.
 

Kliq

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I only saw the second half when the game was out of hand, but the problems appeared to me that the offensive line couldn't block enough for the designed offensive system that Arians wanted to run. It seemed like all the Bucs receivers were running deep routes, so Brady had to take seven-step drops, and the line couldn't block for that long, which led to a lot of sacks and inaccurate throws. Brady could have probably gotten the ball out quicker; but I trust that Brady can go through his reads quickly. This again reflects poorly on Arians.
 

BigSoxFan

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I only saw the second half when the game was out of hand, but the problems appeared to me that the offensive line couldn't block enough for the designed offensive system that Arians wanted to run. It seemed like all the Bucs receivers were running deep routes, so Brady had to take seven-step drops, and the line couldn't block for that long, which led to a lot of sacks and inaccurate throws. Brady could have probably gotten the ball out quicker; but I trust that Brady can go through his reads quickly. This again reflects poorly on Arians.
Repeatedly picking on your GOAT QB in public seems like a bold strategy, Cotton...

I, sadly, watched the entire game and the OL was definitely the big problem, especially the tackles. It reminded me of the 2015 AFCCG against Denver when Miller was basically in Brady's lap after every snap. The Bucs didn't really do anything to counter. I would have used Fournette more in the passing game, which they didn't really do until garbage. In fact, I don't think Fournette even got a touch until like the 2nd or 3rd quarter. They abandoned the run far too quickly. If the OL can hold up, and it has for most of the year, Brady will eventually be picking opponents apart.
 

luckiestman

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Did Arians not want Brady? Is he a glory hound that likes reclamation projects and is worried Brady is going to get more credit if Tampa is successful?
 

BigSoxFan

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He had 6 targets, same as Godwin, Gronkowski, and Fournette. No one had more.

Doesn’t invalidate what Arians said, but still.
Evans didn't see his first target until the end of the 2nd quarter when it was already 31-0 Saints. Guessing Evans may have been open in some of those earlier drives before things completely unraveled.
 

Kliq

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Repeatedly picking on your GOAT QB in public seems like a bold strategy, Cotton...

I, sadly, watched the entire game and the OL was definitely the big problem, especially the tackles. It reminded me of the 2015 AFCCG against Denver when Miller was basically in Brady's lap after every snap. The Bucs didn't really do anything to counter. I would have used Fournette more in the passing game, which they didn't really do until garbage. In fact, I don't think Fournette even got a touch until like the 2nd or 3rd quarter. They abandoned the run far too quickly. If the OL can hold up, and it has for most of the year, Brady will eventually be picking opponents apart.
There was one sequence of plays where Trey Hendrickson sacked Brady, but a New Orleans' defender was called for holding, so Tampa got a first down. On the next play, Hendrickson sacked Brady again. On the following play, Hendrickson sacked Brady a "third" time.
 

DJnVa

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Evans didn't see his first target until the end of the 2nd quarter when it was already 31-0 Saints. Guessing Evans may have been open in some of those earlier drives before things completely unraveled.
Brady was likely being overwhelmed by multiple LB and DLs though.
 

BusRaker

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I couldn't believe they stuck to that game plan knowing Payton was throwing the house at him every down.

I think that Josh would have switched up to a healthy dose of James White and hopefully good receiver downfield blocking
 

Harry Hooper

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Looks like Arians has Evans on his fantasy team too...
Evans might be open, but if your QB is too often having to duck or spin away from defenders in the pocket he is going to be unable to get the ball out
 

Seels

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Arians isn't a good coach. He's never been a good coach. He's good at getting short term wins out of low expectation teams. He's bad at anything beyond that, bad at game day management, bad at beating good teams, and bad at anything that isn't effectively being a worse version of what Pete Carroll is. It's a joke he won either CotY award, especially 2014.

This team is perfectly constructed to get 12 wins or so, go to the NFC divisional or even conference, and then lose because Arians is just incapable of preparing for a coach that is even slightly better, like Payton.
 

Ed Hillel

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Evans probably whined and Arians thought this was the best way to handle it. Might have spoken to Brady about it beforehand, too.
 

Bergs

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Brady did a very long interview with Dax Shepard back on September 10, and it's absolutely fascinating. He sounds much more unguarded and relaxed than usual. If you have the time I'd highly recommend a listen.

Just now got around to listening to this. Very cool..."I majored in fuckin' football, man!"...how any Patriots fan can be as jaded against this guy as some are is just mind-boggling to me.
 

soxhop411

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The league office was not aware of the alleged Hollywood Oaks incident before Brown was reinstated from his suspension this season and signed with the Buccaneers, a source told ESPN's Jenna Laine.
Ok. So then suspend him again if AB Was not truthful and you were really “unaware”
 

soxhop411

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I will be interested in seeing how the NFL handles this given it’s the same two players as last year with the only difference being they are now members of the TB org and not the Patriots.


I wouldn’t be shocked to have them sweep this under the rug because a good TB team is good for the NFL (where as owners hated seeing a good Patriots team)
 

djbayko

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I will be interested in seeing how the NFL handles this given it’s the same two players as last year with the only difference being they are now members of the TB org and not the Patriots.


I wouldn’t be shocked to have them sweep this under the rug because a good TB team is good for the NFL (where as owners hated seeing a good Patriots team)
The situations aren't really comparable, are they? I don't think a lack of action by the NFL in this case - which appears to be a civil matter that has been worked out between the parties - necessarily means anything.

Edit: I missed the throwing the bicycle at a guard bit. That is dicier than a mere wrecked camera.
 

m0ckduck

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Did Arians not want Brady? Is he a glory hound that likes reclamation projects and is worried Brady is going to get more credit if Tampa is successful?
I always assume that he’s trying to do the Bellichek thing, where you improve team culture by demonstrating that not even the star QB is above reubke... but that he’s doing it in a weirdly public, hamfisted way. That’s the only way I can make sense of how conspicuous some of his comments seem, and how there are no reports of Brady being bothered by them.
 

Van Everyman

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I continue to think something is off with Brady and this team. The topline stats don’t really tell the story – they’re scoring points and winning games and he’s putting up a lot of yards and TDs. But they seem to consistently have trouble getting into a rhythm, with a lot of their points coming in bunches after long stretches of futility. Meanwhile, Brady has continued the somewhat joyless disposition he displayed last year.

Maybe it’s a culture thing where Arians just holds players to a different standard than Brady is used to. Or, maybe it’s a Frankenstein offensive fit thing, where they are mashing up Arians’ scheme with plays Brady took from McDaniels. Either way it’s a little weird.
 

BigSoxFan

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I continue to think something is off with Brady and this team. The topline stats don’t really tell the story – they’re scoring points and winning games and he’s putting up a lot of yards and TDs. But they seem to consistently have trouble getting into a rhythm, with a lot of their points coming in bunches after long stretches of futility. Meanwhile, Brady has continued the somewhat joyless disposition he displayed last year.

Maybe it’s a culture thing where Arians just holds players to a different standard than Brady is used to. Or, maybe it’s a Frankenstein offensive fit thing, where they are mashing up Arians’ scheme with plays Brady took from McDaniels. Either way it’s a little weird.
They’re definitely a very volatile team. Tons of talent but a shaky head coach and now they have the AB ticking time bomb. Their performance against the Saints was about as bad of a game you’ll see from a “good” team. Coming up are 2 home games against the Rams and Chiefs. My hunch is they’ll look good against one of them and then trash in the other.
 

Van Everyman

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JokersWildJIMED

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Last year the problem was that Brady had no weapons. Given, by far, the best weapons in the league, the problem this year is evidently coaching. Perhaps, the problem may just partially be a 43 year old QB who does not want to get hit and has no accuracy on mid to long term passes, with difficulty throwing the quick outs.

I do agree that TB would improve with Reid or McVay calling / designing the plays, but pretty much every QB in the league would also improve.
 

BaseballJones

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Newton: 26-40 (65.0%), 365 yds, 1 td, 0 int, 2 sacks, -16 yds, 102.6 rating
Brady: 26-48 (54.2%), 216 yds, 2 td, 2 int, 1 sack, -7 yds, 62.5 rating

-ducks-
 

Van Everyman

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Yes, tho I would suspect they probably have a better record with Brady than Cam. Don't get me wrong: I'm hate-watching most of these Tampa games, hoping that Brady does ok but they lose every game, hence justifying my annoyance that he left. And I'm not quite as bearish on Cam as others. That said, I think his execution in key moments for the NEP would likely have flipped a number of these close losses into the win column.

Would he have gotten us into the position to win those games in the first place? Would he have trusted guys like Meyers and Byrd? Unclear. And I have little doubt that he would have continued to sulk the way he did the last few years. But with McDaniels' playbook and Bill's DYJ ethos player discipline at his back, I feel pretty comfortable saying Brady's methodical approach to two minute drills in New England would have won at least a few of those games.

As many predicted, Arians and Brady is just not a good fit right now. Maybe it gets better, maybe it doesn't. But as a lot of people were concerned about, Brady's strengths and Arians' are not particularly compatible. And they've both been around long enough and had enough of their own respective success to raise concerns that they never will be. Hence why I wonder whether Brady's next move will be to try to entice Josh to come to TB.
 

Super Nomario

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The Tampa offense is weird. Brady's deep ball has been terrible the last couple weeks (after being good early in the year). The run game is boom-or-bust. They don't really have YAC guys so the short passes go nowhere. And it seems like they don't have an intermediate passing game at all. That's where Brady should be eating, but instead it's like everything is a deep bomb attempt or a two-yard pass. Definitely not clicking. On the other hand, they are 7-4 so it's not a disaster or anything.

EDIT: re Orlovsky's post above, some folks on Twitter are double-checking and finding a lot more motion than what he was saying.

It's also worth noting re: last night that the Rams have arguably the best defense in football this year. That DL is stacked and the Bucs were missing Marpet again.
 
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BaseballJones

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No RAC guys? Their two touchdown passes were on plays where the receiver caught a short pass and fought like hell to gain the extra yards necessary to get into the end zone.