2020 PGA Championship- Harding Park

jcaz

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Anyone know where I can find hole-by-hole scoring statistics? ESPN has a page, but it's not updated. I haven't been able to find them anywhere else.
 

johnmd20

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Anyone know where I can find hole-by-hole scoring statistics? ESPN has a page, but it's not updated. I haven't been able to find them anywhere else.
You mean each player's hole or the overall average of the hole for every golfer?

Because if you want a player's scorecard, go to CBS Sports. Click on leaderboard. On the left of every players name (literally to the left of the player's position in the tourney) is a little up/down arrow, click that and you can see a player's scorecard.
 

Freddy Linn

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Can you be more specific? What do you like about it?
Sorry.

It is a stunning piece of rolling terrain on a peninsula exposed to the elements. Narrow fairways with some blind landing areas in between really interesting cypress tree groupings that force you to work the ball (both ways). Some cool elevation changes around the green complexes.

In my opinion, the worst part of the course is the size and flatness of the greens, but that is understandable given there are 65,000 rounds played annually. With a lot of the pin placements I've seen thus far, many putts just don't move that much.
 

cshea

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Anyone know where I can find hole-by-hole scoring statistics? ESPN has a page, but it's not updated. I haven't been able to find them anywhere else.
PGAChampionship.com leaderboard has shot by shot stats, but it’s pretty slow to update.
 
Sorry.

It is a stunning piece of rolling terrain on a peninsula exposed to the elements. Narrow fairways with some blind landing areas in between really interesting cypress tree groupings that force you to work the ball (both ways). Some cool elevation changes around the green complexes.

In my opinion, the worst part of the course is the size and flatness of the greens, but that is understandable given there are 65,000 rounds played annually. With a lot of the pin placements I've seen thus far, many putts just don't move that much.
No worries.

I agree with @cshea that Torrey Pines is a pretty good comp, although I like Torrey a bit more. Harding Park has a beautiful setting: there are few things prettier in the world than cypress trees, and Lake Merced is a nice backdrop. But it's really flat - I don't see many holes with rolling terrain, and the only significant elevation change around a green I can remember is on #18 (which not coincidentally is the most memorable hole on the course). The bunkers are large, shallow, mostly featureless and almost never a "hazard" in the true sense of that term. And narrow fairways are a poor substitute, IMO, for tilted fairways into which you have to shape the ball. Compare Harding Park to the Olympic Club just down the road: you could almost cut the fairways at Olympic twice as wide as they are at Harding Park and they'd still be tougher to hit.

But again, I am a golf course architecture curmudgeon, so what do I know? :)
 

Phragle

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Can you be more specific? What do you like about it?
Sorry.

It is a stunning piece of rolling terrain on a peninsula exposed to the elements. Narrow fairways with some blind landing areas in between really interesting cypress tree groupings that force you to work the ball (both ways). Some cool elevation changes around the green complexes.

In my opinion, the worst part of the course is the size and flatness of the greens, but that is understandable given there are 65,000 rounds played annually. With a lot of the pin placements I've seen thus far, many putts just don't move that much.
I agree it's on a great piece of land. That's what I should have said instead of SF -- it's a great location. You can tell it's old just from the design. With all the work that's been done to it you'd think they would have added more complexity with smaller, tougher greens and more bunkers -- both greenside and fairway. So many of the holes are straight with no trouble and run parallel to each other, and I disagree about the elevation. It's pretty flat. It's not Florida flat, but for a costal California course next to a lake I would want more. The strategy is hit it long and straight and go right at the flag. The player don't have to think. I'm describing the courses I play, not the ones that host majors. Without the juiced up rough and thinner fairways it would be getting run over and while making fairways skinnier and rough longer makes a course play hard it takes away from strategy. It's a difficult balance but the design didn't leave them many options IMO. Maybe I'm an elitist but I just think the course could be so much more.
 
It isn't fair to compare Harding Park to Olympic or any major-worthy private golf course. It's OK to appreciate it for what it is. They just can't do what you would want them to do to it.
No, it's that the PGA of America can choose any course in the US - public or private - to host one of the four most important golf tournaments of the year. If they're going to choose a public course, they really ought to choose a course at least as good as Bethpage Black. And Harding Park currently charges $180 for a weekday greens fee and $200 at the weekend, which doesn't sound like muni prices to me. (Bethpage is $130/$150, by the way, and half of that for New Yorkers.) I'd rather see the majors played at the best courses in the world, or at least a course worthy to be ranked among the Top 100 Public Courses in the US.

(I started a rant about how the club and ball technology arms race have rendered a lot of great potential courses obsolete at the elite level, but I won't derail this thread any further by going down that road.)
 

Freddy Linn

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No, it's that the PGA of America can choose any course in the US - public or private - to host one of the four most important golf tournaments of the year. If they're going to choose a public course, they really ought to choose a course at least as good as Bethpage Black. And Harding Park currently charges $180 for a weekday greens fee and $200 at the weekend, which doesn't sound like muni prices to me. (Bethpage is $130/$150, by the way, and half of that for New Yorkers.) I'd rather see the majors played at the best courses in the world, or at least a course worthy to be ranked among the Top 100 Public Courses in the US.

(I started a rant about how the club and ball technology arms race have rendered a lot of great potential courses obsolete at the elite level, but I won't derail this thread any further by going down that road.)
The PGA of America can most certainly not pick any course in America.

I don't think it is some sort of travesty that they went to Harding Park. The PGA picks vanilla courses all the time (I took offense to the word mundane, HP is more interesting than that to me, unlike Hazeltine or Sahalee or Bellerive). There aren't that many great golf courses that want the PGA.

Like Bethpage, it is great that they are having a major at a public course in a huge metro area, where Bay Area residents can get on for $64. Is HP the Black? No, but not many places are.
 
I don't think it is some sort of travesty that they went to Harding Park. The PGA picks vanilla courses all the time (I took offense to the word mundane, HP is more interesting than that to me, unlike Hazeltine or Sahalee or Bellerive).
I don't think it's a travesty. And Sahalee and Bellerive are probably less exciting than Harding Park - particularly visually - although I'd probably prefer Hazeltine. I do think there are plenty of resort courses across America that would *love* to get the publicity of hosting a major, but I'm happy to let this topic drop.

So...anyone watching the golf today? Haotong Li and Tommy Fleetwood currently your Top 2.
 

Phragle

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The PGA of America can most certainly not pick any course in America.

I don't think it is some sort of travesty that they went to Harding Park. The PGA picks vanilla courses all the time (I took offense to the word mundane, HP is more interesting than that to me, unlike Hazeltine or Sahalee or Bellerive). There aren't that many great golf courses that want the PGA.

Like Bethpage, it is great that they are having a major at a public course in a huge metro area, where Bay Area residents can get on for $64. Is HP the Black? No, but not many places are.
IDK what they're allowed to do or not with regulations but the trees are dying so I imagine it's do for more work in the future. Hopefully they can give it some teeth and accompanying strategy. I don't mean to offend but for a design nerd like me the course doesn't do much and it would be a shame to keep it that given it's importance, history, and location
 

Pablo's TB Lover

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Justin Thomas is all of us on this 13th hole. Hits a tree to the right off the tee with a thud, short of the fairway. 2nd shot goes in a fairway bunker. Then 3rd shot in fairway still way short of the green.
 

tbrep

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Koepka with some really clutch putts to save par - really well done. Jason Day looked like he’d run away with the lead until the double bogey sapped his momentum. Justin Rose was really solid. Pretty tasty weekend up ahead.

Saddest moment of the day was Rory’s triple bogey after getting on a roll with 4 straight birdies. Tiger just couldn’t make a putt on the front 9 - could easily have had another 3-4 strokes if they were falling.
 

ezemerson

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Haha Reed and DeChambeau playing together tomorrow, too bad there aren't fans on the course for this pairing
 

Zomp

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I love Prime Time golf so much. Especially now with young children. After they go to bed I can watch the finish live.


I'm enjoying the course, but honestly I think I'm just enjoying having a major on TV again.
 

FL4WL3SS

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Let's talk about how awesome Rory is, and I'm not talking about as a golfer. I don't know how many saw it yesterday, but on the 3rd hole he couldn't find his ball in the rough until someone literally stepped on it. He got a drop that ended up being way more favorable, so instead of taking advantage of the rules, he pushed his ball deeper into the rough.

I placed it, and the rule is try to replicate the lie. No one really knew what the lie was, but if everyone is going around looking for it, it obviously wasn’t too good. So I placed it, I was like: ‘That just doesn’t look right to me.’ So I just placed it down a little bit.
For all the BS that Reed and Bryson try to pull, it's refreshing to root for a guy like Rory. Such a stud.
 

E5 Yaz

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"Please welcome to the tee ..."

I mean, at what point do they realize that it sounds more than a little silly in these conditions?
 

cshea

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I’m a Spieth fan but, man, it really is tough to watch him right now. Completely lost.

Wonder if he needs to move on from McCormick or Greller or something just get a new voice/perspective in his ear.
 

Average Game James

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Reed and Bubba? Reed and Sergio? Reed at least is always one of the pair.
Maybe Reed and Sergio, though old Sergio is certainly more palatable than young Sergio. Bubba is at least fun to watch with all the crazy ways he shapes shots. I really want to like Bryson, I just can't...