2019-2020 Celtics Regular Season Thread

lovegtm

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Bjelica is an effective floor spacer and elite 3-pt shooter on one end. Where did the idea come from that he can defend 5's? He can maybe be passable defending backup 4's masquerading at the 5 on a second unit but he's a perimeter player and quite possibly a worse defender of real 5's than Kanter.
He’s (sort of) tall and got some rebounds against the Celtics.
 

benhogan

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Bjelica is an effective floor spacer and elite 3-pt shooter on one end. Where did the idea come from that he can defend 5's? He can maybe be passable defending backup 4's masquerading at the 5 on a second unit but he's a perimeter player and quite possibly a worse defender of real 5's than Kanter.
yea Bjelica at the 5 does not excite me. The concept of having 5 shooters stand around the offensive perimeter like potted plants, each looking for their shot, sucks. Especially when you compromise the defense to have the 5th shooter on the floor. I've seen that 5 wide crap before and it didn't play well last year.

You need one lunchpail guy on the floor, a defense-first player who takes pride in setting picks, screens, tipping balls out, moving the ball and deferring on offense.

Bjelica (at the 4) on the 2nd unit at the cost of Kanter and a late first is not a bad idea. If Sac fades they will get lots of interest in Bjelica
 

lovegtm

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yea Bjelica at the 5 does not excite me. The concept of having 5 shooters stand around the offensive perimeter like potted plants, each looking for their shot, sucks. Especially when you compromise the defense to have the 5th shooter on the floor. I've seen that 5 wide crap before and it didn't play well last year.

You need one lunchpail guy on the floor, a defense-first player who takes pride in setting picks, screens, tipping balls out, moving the ball and deferring on offense.

Bjelica (at the 4) on the 2nd unit at the cost of Kanter and a late first is not a bad idea. If Sac fades they will get lots of interest in Bjelica
I'd way rather get someone like Noel for that late first, and I think you would too.
 

benhogan

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I'd way rather get someone like Noel for that late first, and I think you would too.
yea, watched some of Noel last night in Laker/Pels game. Think he'd fit in nicely with Brad's speed team.

If OKC is out early it may just cost a VP or Semi and a 2nd.

Not many teams will see the value of a skinny 5 that can't shoot the 3, Noel's demand will probably be lower than Bjelica
 

Jimbodandy

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yea, watched some of Noel last night in Laker/Pels game. Think he'd fit in nicely with Brad's speed team.

If OKC is out early it may just cost a VP or Semi and a 2nd.

Not many teams will see the value of a skinny 5 that can't shoot the 3, Noel's demand will probably be lower than Bjelica
Words.

Bjelica is a much better player and more valuable to most teams. We can pick up a Noel on the cheap, most likely.

I still don't know what to think about Poirier, but someone will have to go if Noel is inbound.
 

HowBoutDemSox

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Nice Ringer article on how Brown and Tatum are leading the Celtics to their hot start this season:
https://www.theringer.com/nba/2019/11/20/20972750/boston-celtics-wings-jayson-tatum-jaylen-brown
One thing that jumps out to me is usage numbers last year:
Tatum was sixth on the team in touches (45.3 per game) while Brown moved to the bench and finished ninth (31.8). The duo played only 884 minutes together last season, tied for 16th most among two-man lineups on the Celtics.

This season has been a different story. Brown is back in the starting lineup and has played 224 minutes with Tatum in just 10 games. Tatum is second in touches (67.5), and Brown is fifth (47.2). The team’s top four players in touches last season (Kyrie, Al Horford, Terry Rozier, and Marcus Morris) are gone. Their replacements have accepted smaller roles in the offense, giving Brown and Tatum the opportunity to both average career highs in points, rebounds, assists, steals, and free throw attempts.
Having both on the court together is also key for creating mismatches:
Many NBA teams don’t have one wing with the size and athleticism of Tatum and Brown, much less two. Because of that, at least one has a mismatch in almost every game. According to NBA Advanced Stats, big men like Julius Randle, Dario Saric, and Nemanja Bjelica are among the most frequent defenders on Brown this season, while Tatum has spent a lot of time being guarded by undersized perimeter defenders like Bradley Beal and Kyle Lowry.
And their switchability helps all over on the defensive end:
The beauty of building a team around long and athletic forwards like Tatum and Brown is that the mismatches rarely go both ways. There are a lot of players whom they can guard who can’t guard them. They have the speed to stay in front of smaller players on the perimeter and the size to hold their own against bigger players inside. The Celtics are interchangeable on defense, especially when Marcus Smart is playing with their two young wings. They can switch every screen across three positions and take turns on the best perimeter scorers on the opposing team.

Their perimeter length covers up for their lack of size upfront. For all the noise surrounding Kyrie’s departure, the biggest concern for Boston coming into the season wasn’t at point guard but at center, where it had to replace Al Horford and Aron Baynes. Enes Kanter started on opening night, but a knee injury opened a spot for Daniel Theis, a third-year big man from Germany. While he’s averaging only 6.4 points per game on 45.6 percent shooting, he’s a smart player who cleans the glass (7.2 rebounds per game), protects the rim (1.7 blocks), and is almost always in the right position on both ends of the floor. Theis is thriving despite being the smallest starting 5 (6-foot-8, 215 pounds) in the league.
 

RorschachsMask

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yea, watched some of Noel last night in Laker/Pels game. Think he'd fit in nicely with Brad's speed team.

If OKC is out early it may just cost a VP or Semi and a 2nd.

Not many teams will see the value of a skinny 5 that can't shoot the 3, Noel's demand will probably be lower than Bjelica
I like Noel, but him being back around his friends in this area is probably something best avoided. I have heard quite a few stories, none of them good.

A shame too, dude can fly around the court, and is a surprisingly good passer. A Smart/Jaylen/Tatum/Grant/Noel lineup would be about as good as it gets defensively.
 

shoelace

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He’s (sort of) tall and got some rebounds against the Celtics.
I haven't suggested that Bjelica is a starting 5 or that he would be able to defend someone like Embiid. He is not the solution to the Celtics matchup problem with players like Embiid. There really are not an abundance of those players available and one, Baynes, is not an option for the Celtics. HRB acknowledges that Bjelica could take minutes as a small ball, backup 5. This is what I was suggesting. He's the kind of player who, against the 76ers, would match up against Horford when Horford plays the 5 with the second unit. A number of teams run small lineups with 4s slotting into the 5 spot. I certainly think he gives you more in that kind of matchup than someone like Kanter. Going small has been very effective for the Celtics this season, and I think using Bjelica as a small ball 5 could be effective for the Celtics in a wider range of matchups than what Kanter provides, and his contract is more flexible than Kanter's as well. I feel like Bjelica offers more as a second unit player than Kanter, especially because he can catch and shoot threes and doesn't require the ball in the post to be effective offensively. He's also depth for injuries at the 4.

The thinking behind the move is to replace a player (Kanter) offering the Celtics very little (who also has a player option for next season) and replacing him with a better player who can improve the quality of the bench, and give them some shooting and frontcourt versatility they don't have. This would make them a better regular season team, and I think this team should be trying to amass as many regular season wins as possible and shoot for the 1 seed. I understand if folks want to disagree with the substance of the idea (that a late 1st is too much to give up for a roleplayer, that a 5 out offense might not be effective as benhogan suggests above, or that Bjelica at the 5 lineups would not be effective in the playoffs) or would prefer to make a move for a defensively minded player, that seems like fodder for a fruitful discussion, but I don't think the disingenuous framing of my proposal here is fair.
 
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NomarsFool

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You need one lunchpail guy on the floor, a defense-first player who takes pride in setting picks, screens, tipping balls out, moving the ball and deferring on offense.
The way that the Celtics run their offense, it is extremely helpful if the guy setting those high picks can also hit a 3 once in awhile (like Baynes and Horford did last year). That's why it'd be soooo helpful if GW could get that wide open 3 to fall.

When the TL is on the floor, his role on offense is pretty much just handing off the ball when someone loses the dribble. In the first few games they were running lots of alley oops for him - but I feel like have gone away from that, maybe other teams were picking up on it. I remember a few games where they seemed to have the timing off or something.
 

Big John

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What can Nerlins Noel do that TL cannot? I have no interest in Noel. Bjelica would be ok because he is a sniper, not because he solves any defensive issues at the center position. If the team needs more beef against players like Embiid, Richaun Holmes is the type of player they should be looking for, not Bjelica.
 

RorschachsMask

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What can Nerlins Noel do that TL cannot? I have no interest in Noel. Bjelica would be ok because he is a sniper, not because he solves any defensive issues at the center position. If the team needs more beef against players like Embiid, Richaun Holmes is the type of player they should be looking for, not Bjelica.
He's more disciplined, and he's a monster defending the PnR, which is TL's biggest issue defensively.

Now long term I think Williams gets there, I'm just speaking for this season.
 
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lovegtm

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You mean, other than getting utterly destroyed by him in 5 games last spring while all of us just sat around complaining about the whistle he was getting on drives?
You have to have everyone committed to your scheme in order to stop Giannis. The Celtics had one guy last year who had a hard time sticking with the scheme when his own shot wasn’t falling...
 

Light-Tower-Power

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You have to have everyone committed to your scheme in order to stop Giannis. The Celtics had one guy last year who had a hard time sticking with the scheme when his own shot wasn’t falling...
The same guy who inexplicably switched onto Giannis for multiple possessions. I don't think we'll have that problem this season.
 

benhogan

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What can Nerlins Noel do that TL cannot? I have no interest in Noel. Bjelica would be ok because he is a sniper, not because he solves any defensive issues at the center position. If the team needs more beef against players like Embiid, Richaun Holmes is the type of player they should be looking for, not Bjelica.
similar players, Noel more experienced then TL...actually it's their similarities that I like

TL isn't exactly an IRON MAN, having more than 1 of him is good
 

benhogan

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You have to have everyone committed to your scheme in order to stop Giannis. The Celtics had one several guys last year who had a hard time sticking with the defensive scheme when his own their shots wasn’t falling...
MaMo and Rozier antics after a missed shot bled into the defense also

BUT when your self-anointed leader does it constantly it becomes a team habit
 
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HomeRunBaker

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Windy weighing in on the Celtics 5/size situation

https://www.espn.com/nba/story/_/id/28088068/do-boston-celtics-embiid-sized-hole-their-lineup
I'm doubling down on Brad. I think they should play faster to combat Philly. Double Embiid down low, pack the lane.
As bearish I am on the Sixers and bullish on the Celtics this year.....I don't think we can ignore the potential matchup problems that the Sixers length caused us in our first meeting. Obv a small sample but the second matchup in 3 weeks is going to be very telling if we are able to adjust to their length or if this will be one of the leagues nightmare matchups for whatever reason.
 

HomeRunBaker

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You have to have everyone committed to your scheme in order to stop Giannis. The Celtics had one guy last year who had a hard time sticking with the scheme when his own shot wasn’t falling...
This is common in the NBA and at all levels of basketball. The players are human and not robots. When an engaged player is defending they will defend better.....when a player is making shots he is going to be more engaged. I'd be interested if next level defensive analytics would show this to be accurate and to what degree. There are reasons why the NBA is a game of runs......is it random variance or lack of defensive engagement due to missed shots/runouts?
 

benhogan

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As bearish I am on the Sixers and bullish on the Celtics this year.....I don't think we can ignore the potential matchup problems that the Sixers length caused us in our first meeting. Obv a small sample but the second matchup in 3 weeks is going to be very telling if we are able to adjust to their length or if this will be one of the leagues nightmare matchups for whatever reason.
Philly game 1 excuses: first road game, opening night, stale after waiting over a week to play.

We get Philly on the 2nd night of a back to back, no Hayward, SSS, etc...so I have my new excuses already lined up

Regardless of the result, I'll be focused on how Kanter handles Embiid again. If Enes does a decent job, lovegtm and I will have to stop trying to ship him out:)

I also think Grant (and Semi) could be very effective against Philly, both are strong and move their feet enough to combat Philly's height advantage.
 

lovegtm

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This is common in the NBA and at all levels of basketball. The players are human and not robots. When an engaged player is defending they will defend better.....when a player is making shots he is going to be more engaged. I'd be interested if next level defensive analytics would show this to be accurate and to what degree. There are reasons why the NBA is a game of runs......is it random variance or lack of defensive engagement due to missed shots/runouts?
I think that purely stat-based metrics would have a hard time quantifying it, but I bet when we get better player tracking we’ll see guys flying around the court better (and to the right spots) when their shot is falling.

I also bet some teams have internal access to that data right now.

Incidentally, this is one reason why I’ve been impressed with Tatum this year: he generally hasn’t let his offensive frustrations affect him on the defensive end. That’s probably why Brad seems to trust him a lot, whether it’s eyetest or analytics based.
 

lovegtm

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Philly game 1 excuses: first road game, opening night, stale after waiting over a week to play.

We get Philly on the 2nd night of a back to back, no Hayward, SSS, etc...so I have my new excuses already lined up

Regardless of the result, I'll be focused on how Kanter handles Embiid again. If Enes does a decent job, lovegtm and I will have to stop trying to ship him out:)

I also think Grant (and Semi) could be very effective against Philly, both are strong and move their feet enough to combat Philly's height advantage.
I also wonder whether they’ll just double Embiid a lot (at the right time) and trust their speed/smarts plus the Sixers lack of shooting to make the ensuing scramble not a huge disadvantage.
 

HomeRunBaker

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Philly game 1 excuses: first road game, opening night, stale after waiting over a week to play.

We get Philly on the 2nd night of a back to back, no Hayward, SSS, etc...so I have my new excuses already lined up

Regardless of the result, I'll be focused on how Kanter handles Embiid again. If Enes does a decent job, lovegtm and I will have to stop trying to ship him out:)

I also think Grant (and Semi) could be very effective against Philly, both are strong and move their feet enough to combat Philly's height advantage.
Issue 1: Game 1 certainly wasn't an ideal setting.
Issue 2: It was clear we struggled with their length.

Game 2 will answer many questions whether our problems in G1 was due more to issue 1 or issue 2. My point was that many questions will be answered in 3 weeks.
 

TripleOT

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If the Celtics play their style and make baskets at their usual rate, they can beat any team in a playoff series. In that first Philly game, they shot 37/27/59%, and missed 14 FTs in Philly. If they shoot that poorly, they can have the best defensive center of all time and still struggle to win.

We saw early in that game how a playoff series could go in the first 10 minutes opening night, when the Cs were up 22-14, even though they were missing easy shots, starting the game 6-16. Philly had trouble keeping up with their speed and quickness. In the first six minutes of the second half, Boston couldn't make a jumper and that allowed Philly to play to their style, pounding the paint.

I too am looking forward to their matchup in Boston. If the Celtics can start quickly and put 30+ points on the Sixers, they can control the game.
 

Big John

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This notion that the Celtics' big man rotation is inferior is an ESPN/SiriusXM narrative that is plain silly. Having three guys who can play-- each with different skills-- is a strength, not a weakness. If Embiid sits out, the Sixers are probably toast against good teams. The Celtics can afford an injury or rest day (or two or three) and still be competitive against anyone. Newsflash: Daniel Theis is markedly superior to journeymen like Nerlins Noel or washed up bozos like DeAndre Jordan.

The Celtics are currently 11-2, having played 8 out of 13 games on the road. They are a perfect 5-0 at home and 6-2 on the road-- and if Smart's floater had bounced in they would be 7-1 on the road, in spite of a torrid night by Buddy Hield. Even if they lose the next two-- a real possibility-- they will be 6-4 on the road, with three of the four road losses coming against legitimate contenders (Philly, LAC, Denver).

The Lakers have a slightly better record, but have played 9 out of 14 games at home, and have a home loss to the Raptors, a team that the Celtics beat in Toronto.

The Celtics don't need to "shore up the front court." At the moment they are fifth in the league in blocked shots and a respectable 10th in rebounding. They just need to keep doing what they've been doing, and to keep doing it after Hayward gets back.
 
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benhogan

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Issue 1: Game 1 certainly wasn't an ideal setting.
Issue 2: It was clear we struggled with their length.

Game 2 will answer many questions whether our problems in G1 was due more to issue 1 or issue 2. My point was that many questions will be answered in 3 weeks.
Absolutely. I believe Brad will learn and adjust from the Philly game. That's been his plan since the preseason
 

RorschachsMask

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I also wonder whether they’ll just double Embiid a lot (at the right time) and trust their speed/smarts plus the Sixers lack of shooting to make the ensuing scramble not a huge disadvantage.
100%. Embiid is extraordinarily talented, but he gets really out of control when teams double him and are disciplined about recovering.
 

wade boggs chicken dinner

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There are reasons why the NBA is a game of runs......is it random variance or lack of defensive engagement due to missed shots/runouts?
It's random variance. See here: https://arxiv.org/ftp/arxiv/papers/1903/1903.08716.pdf/. Here's the abstract: "

Basketball is often referred to as “a game of runs.” We investigate the appropriateness of this claim using data from the full NBA 2016-17 season, comparing actual longest runs of scoring events to what long run theory predicts under the assumption that team “momentum” is not present. We provide several different variations of the analysis. Our results consistently indicate that the lengths of longest runs in NBA games are no longer than those that would occur naturally when scoring events are generated by a random process, rather than one that is influenced by “momentum".
 

lovegtm

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It's random variance. See here: https://arxiv.org/ftp/arxiv/papers/1903/1903.08716.pdf/. Here's the abstract: "

Basketball is often referred to as “a game of runs.” We investigate the appropriateness of this claim using data from the full NBA 2016-17 season, comparing actual longest runs of scoring events to what long run theory predicts under the assumption that team “momentum” is not present. We provide several different variations of the analysis. Our results consistently indicate that the lengths of longest runs in NBA games are no longer than those that would occur naturally when scoring events are generated by a random process, rather than one that is influenced by “momentum".
There’s clearly a ton of inherent variance, but it’s hard/impossible to answer the question of whether players’ defensive effort is affected by their offense using such lumpy data.

This study feels very Sabermetrics 1.0, and that approach isn’t really sufficient for a sport with as many confounding variables as basketball imo.
 

wade boggs chicken dinner

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In that first Philly game, they shot 37/27/59%, and missed 14 FTs in Philly. If they shoot that poorly, they can have the best defensive center of all time and still struggle to win.
It was even worse than the way you write it. The Cs were 20-34 from the line and they lost by 14. They are currently shooting just under 80% from the FT line. So if they hit their season average that would have been 7 more points.

But going back to the PbP, the Cs made 5 of their last 6 FTs. So after Kemba missed his FT when Embiid fouled Smart, the Cs were 15-28 and it was a 69-77 game with 10:56 left in the 4Q. If they had hit their season average, the game would have been tied and the dynamics would have been completely different.
 

HomeRunBaker

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It's random variance. See here: https://arxiv.org/ftp/arxiv/papers/1903/1903.08716.pdf/. Here's the abstract: "

Basketball is often referred to as “a game of runs.” We investigate the appropriateness of this claim using data from the full NBA 2016-17 season, comparing actual longest runs of scoring events to what long run theory predicts under the assumption that team “momentum” is not present. We provide several different variations of the analysis. Our results consistently indicate that the lengths of longest runs in NBA games are no longer than those that would occur naturally when scoring events are generated by a random process, rather than one that is influenced by “momentum".
Hmmmm. I’d be interested in digging further. There isn’t a study alive that can dispute my knowledge from my playing days that defensive intensity was higher following offensive success.
 

Kliq

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Hmmmm. I’d be interested in digging further. There isn’t a study alive that can dispute my knowledge from my playing days that defensive intensity was higher following offensive success.
I expect it effects people differently. For me, I tend to get angrier and more intense if I'm having a bad shooting game. Especially if I miss a layup or a bunny; I definitely find myself playing harder on defense and crashing the boards harder.
 

benhogan

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I don't think the disingenuous framing of my proposal here is fair.
a favorite past time here at SoSH;) just kidding

I think you've made a fair/cognizant argument and like your "fake trade" proposal as far as trading for Bjelica and using him on the 2nd unit. I think he brings more to the offense than Kanter. ALSO getting rid of Enis would offload a weak defensive player. I believe the Celtics/Brad's system thrives when the frontcourt has strong defensive 4 & 5s

My small quibble is how you'd want to use him. I'd want an active, defense-first 5 (Theis, TL or Noel?) on the floor with Bjelica
 

Jimbodandy

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a favorite past time here at SoSH;) just kidding

I think you've made a fair/cognizant argument and like your "fake trade" proposal as far as trading for Bjelica and using him on the 2nd unit. I think he brings more to the offense than Kanter. ALSO getting rid of Enis would offload a weak defensive player. I believe the Celtics/Brad's system thrives when the frontcourt has strong defensive 4 & 5s

My small quibble is how you'd want to use him. I'd want an active, defense-first 5 (Theis, TL or Noel?) on the floor with Bjelica
Yeah that's what it comes down to for me also.

Bjelica is a fine player, but he's a tall wing. That's his game. We have loads of wings. He's not taking minutes from Brown, Tatum, or healthy Hayward. Sure, I'd rather run him out there than Green. But Green's not getting any minutes on a healthy team either, nor is Romeo.

He's not a defensive big, so he's not taking minutes from Theis or either Williams.

He's not a ballhandler, so he's not taking minutes from Kemba, Edwards, or Wanamaker.

He's not a lockdown anything, so he's not taking minutes from Smart or whatever Ojeleye gets.

So how much do we want to spend on a guy who's an upgrade on Kanter and Poirier?

If he were brought in today, he might be the 5th/6th most useful guy on the roster but also have the 11th man's responsibility most nights (12th when we play Milwaukee), simply because of what he can't do.
 

wade boggs chicken dinner

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I expect it effects people differently. For me, I tend to get angrier and more intense if I'm having a bad shooting game. Especially if I miss a layup or a bunny; I definitely find myself playing harder on defense and crashing the boards harder.
For me, defense depends almost entirely on how much sleep I got the night before. Guess that happens when you get to my age.
 

Big John

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If they want a tall wing who can shoot, Davis Bertans ($7M), Nicolo Melli ($4.1M) or T.J. Leaf ($2.8M) might fill the bill as well as Bjelica. But that's not what the Celtics need, since Hayward will assume that role upon his return.
 

benhogan

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If they want a tall wing who can shoot, Davis Bertans ($7M), Nicolo Melli ($4.1M) or T.J. Leaf ($2.8M) might fill the bill as well as Bjelica. But that's not what the Celtics need, since Hayward will assume that role upon his return.
depth is a good thing since injuries can happen or players can opt for FA at seasons end

not a bad list of additional players to keep in mind
 
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Big John

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Well sure, and if they could get any of those 3 players or Bejelica, I'd be fine with it. But in exchange for what? They'd be giving up depth as well as acquiring it.
 

k-factory

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If the issue is Philly it comes down to dictating tempo. That’s really their most viable path. And it increasingly seems like the correct gambit. This team can run and win on athleticism. Getting some reliable three point shooting off the bench is more important than another mediocre lumbering big. Keep the pressure on Philly to run and out score. If Carsen cannot be that threat they need to find one but they have some time to figure that out. Seems like he’s the biggest beneficiary of minutes in Hayward’s absence.
 

sox311

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That's what she said.
Great game tonight with some shitty calls costing the Celts an almost clear win. But, when Kawhi and PG13 gel with Lou and put Beverly and Trez on the floor in crunch time, no one is beating them in a seven game series.

Tatum disappearing in the 4th killed us along with Kemba not being able to ever get going because of the Clippers D. They just shut him down with his drives. Great game by Theis, Kanter was good when in, and even Rob Williams was.

Jaylen was invisible on offense as well. Interesting game, Jayson shouldn't have gone radio silent in the 4th, those are the games he needs to keep going and take it over. Fun game, and overall a great showing by the Cs.

Just like the Clippers, the Celts are also still learning how to play with each other. I like it.
 

lovegtm

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Great game tonight with some shitty calls costing the Celts an almost clear win. But, when Kawhi and PG13 gel with Lou and put Beverly and Trez on the floor in crunch time, no one is beating them in a seven game series.

Tatum disappearing in the 4th killed us along with Kemba not being able to ever get going because of the Clippers D. They just shut him down with his drives. Great game by Theis, Kanter was good when in, and even Rob Williams was.

Jaylen was invisible on offense as well. Interesting game, Jayson shouldn't have gone radio silent in the 4th, those are the games he needs to keep going and take it over. Fun game, and overall a great showing by the Cs.

Just like the Clippers, the Celts are also still learning how to play with each other. I like it.
I mean...the Celtics were playing without their 2nd-best, maybe best player, and he would have been huge in a game where they were trapping and helping like crazy on Kemba. Defensively they were far superior until the end, and generated a lot of good looks from 3 off of paint touches.

This is a game where last year they would have absolutely mailed it in on D when shots weren't falling early and been down 17 at the half.

I was really impressed with the Clippers' defense, and I think they're likely the best team in the west. But at the same, it's not homer-ish to say that this Celtics team can be really good this year.
 

lovegtm

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On the negative side, they need to gameplan for when Kemba gets trapped aggressively. It's starting to become a thing. Likely solvable, but they haven't handled it great.
 

Devizier

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I stayed up late to watch the f'in Golden State game and was in bed before this one tipped off. Huge regrets there, despite the results of the respective contests.

I had really chalked this one up as an easy schedule loss so I'm impressed that the C's played so well.
 

Jimbodandy

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On the negative side, they need to gameplan for when Kemba gets trapped aggressively. It's starting to become a thing. Likely solvable, but they haven't handled it great.
I went to bed at halftime but definitely noticed this in the first half. It is becoming a thing, as it isn't the first time that we have seen it recently. Worked on Kyrie and IT over the last few years too.

I'm kind of glad to see it coming out now. I do think that having Hayward as an option helps with that. Definitely needs some kind of game plan and reps.

Let's look at the silver lining on this one. Fully loaded Clips on the road, we shot like garbage, didn't have GH, lost in OT. Good learning experience.
 

NomarsFool

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Not exactly fully loaded, as this was PG and KL's first game together - right? But, still a good test to go up against a really good team. There was some carelessness with passing at the end and a team like LAC really takes advantage of that. I hope the Celtics learn that lesson.
 

benhogan

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I went to bed at halftime but definitely noticed this in the first half. It is becoming a thing, as it isn't the first time that we have seen it recently. Worked on Kyrie and IT over the last few years too.

I'm kind of glad to see it coming out now. I do think that having Hayward as an option helps with that. Definitely needs some kind of game plan and reps.

Let's look at the silver lining on this one. Fully loaded Clips on the road, we shot like garbage, didn't have GH, lost in OT. Good learning experience.
agree

Utah Gordan*, with his strong ballhandling and ability score at the rim or distribute while driving, is the antidote to teams double-teaming Kemba. Too many times Smart had the ball in his hands during crunch time w/ no GH. I like Tatum and Brown as 3PT spot-up shooters or slashing to the rim.

I really like what I'm seeing with the Celtics defensive speed, help, and rotation. They are a threat on defense at all times. Not many easy baskets for the Clips, even in transition. Beverly hit some big 3s down the stretch, but the guy came in hitting 19% (SSS aside), so him taking those instead of Lou, PG, Kawhi or Harrell down low is something you have to live with.

The TL/Theis combo is good as active, aggressive 5s. I'd still look to add Noel (for VP & a 2nd) to insure against those guys injuring themselves. (Anyone that doesn't see one of Theis or TL going down, with their usage up, has not been paying attention). I'm becoming even more convinced that that the Celtics team speed/double-teaming can handle the Sixers-Bucks-Pacers-Heat size/bulk. Kanter in small minutes also has a role. So a 4-headed 5, that insures against inevitable injury, is the only move the team really needs to do IMO

A healthy Utah Gordon will be a huge difference-maker in these close losses. Once he's back this team will take another, huge step forward IMO...looking forward to seeing how they react against Denver.

*note: Brad Wanamaker did a great job playing that Hayward role of strong ballhandler, driving to the hoop, drawing or dishing. He was solid last season and he has been very consistent this season. Nice to have Brad as a key veteran/deep bench piece.
Glad we didn't cut him to keep Max Strus:eek: or rush Tremont Waters
 
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PedrosRedGlove

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Dec 5, 2005
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Agreed on the Wanamaker point. He was nothing more than a warm NBA body to eat up blowout minutes to me last year. I questioned whether he was really worth the roster spot given the available young options and front court deficiencies but he has definitely shown he can be a contributor in the 3rd PG role so far this season.

I don't know where it was mentioned here about him being engaged and willing to be in the gym at all hours with the young guys on the roster but that also improved my opinion. I think he may have an understated effect as a glue guy on the team, you can be pretty sure he's a positive influence on them considering he clawed his way into the league as a 30 year old.