2019-2020 Celtics Regular Season Thread

lovegtm

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If the Celtics internally evaluate Capela highly, it does. Also depends what pieces are going the other way.

If Capela is motivated and in-shape, I disagree that he doesn’t fit the Celtics system. They don’t rely on the big to space with shooting: Theis would still be effective without that mediocre 3-ball. They rely on their bigs to screen, run DHO, roll, and seal. I think Capela would fit well with that if his head is in it.
 

amarshal2

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There’s an interesting question about including Theis vs Kanter — they make the same money.

Some random thoughts:
-Theis is the better player between him and Kanter in a vacuum
-Kanter has size that the Celtics would lack if they traded him (given that VP is not playable/salary filler and Tacko is not playable)
-Theis is 75% the player Capela is at 40% the cost, but that slight difference could swing a close series
 

DeJesus Built My Hotrod

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If the Celtics internally evaluate Capela highly, it does. Also depends what pieces are going the other way.

If Capela is motivated and in-shape, I disagree that he doesn’t fit the Celtics system. They don’t rely on the big to space with shooting: Theis would still be effective without that mediocre 3-ball. They rely on their bigs to screen, run DHO, roll, and seal. I think Capela would fit well with that if his head is in it.
I don't understand the shape thing though he is reported to have heel problems. Statistically, Capela is producing at roughly at or just below what he has done the past two seasons. His peripheral stats are down but who knows what that is a function of - Westbrook's introduction impacted the flow of their offense.

I want to clarify what I mean by fit - Boston/Stevens can literally take any player and make them fit. Many players acquired by Ainge have been integrated into the Boston offense because Stevens and his staff focus on maximizing strengths. But if you are trading away assets and paying ~$18mm a year for a player, you probably want that player to be able to do a bit of everything even if its not perfect. Capela can certainly work but they will be paying top dollar for a guy who plays a big role in a more traditional sense with perimeter defense but no perimeter offense. He is an upgrade on their current bigs but is that really worth ~3X what they are paying someone like Theis?
 

lovegtm

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I don't understand the shape thing though he is reported to have heel problems. Statistically, Capela is producing at roughly at or just below what he has done the past two seasons. His peripheral stats are down but who knows what that is a function of - Westbrook's introduction impacted the flow of their offense.

I want to clarify what I mean by fit - Boston/Stevens can literally take any player and make them fit. Many players acquired by Ainge have been integrated into the Boston offense because Stevens and his staff focus on maximizing strengths. But if you are trading away assets and paying ~$18mm a year for a player, you probably want that player to be able to do a bit of everything even if its not perfect. Capela can certainly work but they will be paying top dollar for a guy who plays a big role in a more traditional sense with perimeter defense but no perimeter offense. He is an upgrade on their current bigs but is that really worth ~3X what they are paying someone like Theis?
You’re preaching to the choir wrt salary. All I can say is that if they want him, they think that the cumulative upgrade moves the needle meaningfully.

The point I was making about offensive fit was more that the current iteration of the Celtics doesn’t really rely much at all on bigs to space the floor with shooting, and opposing centers generally play quite far off. Theis takes wide open 3s once in awhile, but it’s not a key part of the scheme the way the Horford pick-and-pop was.
 

DeJesus Built My Hotrod

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The other thing to consider is that taking on a big who makes about as much as their entire front-court (that includes Granite and TimeLord), is coming from an entirely unique system and is used to playing ~10 MPG more than the current big rotation is a pretty big pivot for the organization. That may well be a function of the C's lack of big, cheap options leading into the season but its a change regardless.

Would Boston use Capela for almost 33 MPG vs ~23 MPG for Theis? And the actions that lovegtm refers to aren't unique but the players running them are - presumably any big brought in is going to have to adjust to the C's system as well as the style of play of their teammates.

In short, a Capela acquisition is interesting but to me its not plug and play.
 

RedOctober3829

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The other thing to consider is that taking on a big who makes about as much as their entire front-court (that includes Granite and TimeLord), is coming from an entirely unique system and is used to playing ~10 MPG more than the current big rotation is a pretty big pivot for the organization. That may well be a function of the C's lack of big, cheap options leading into the season but its a change regardless.

Would Boston use Capela for almost 33 MPG vs ~23 MPG for Theis? And the actions that lovegtm refers to aren't unique but the players running them are - presumably any big brought in is going to have to adjust to the C's system as well as the style of play of their teammates.

In short, a Capela acquisition is interesting but to me its not plug and play.
Another thing people aren't bringing up is how much of a better overall defensive team Capela would be joining. Getting away from D'Antoni's system and into Brad's with much better defensive personnel around him could make him better. He wouldn't have to be constantly helping when Harden and Westbrook decide it's not important to play defense.
 

DeJesus Built My Hotrod

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Another thing people aren't bringing up is how much of a better overall defensive team Capela would be joining. Getting away from D'Antoni's system and into Brad's with much better defensive personnel around him could make him better. He wouldn't have to be constantly helping when Harden and Westbrook decide it's not important to play defense.
Its hard to say. I am not really sure how much of a defensive upgrade this is for Boston but again, I am in the camp that this move isn't as obvious as it is to some others. I would rather the C's spend resources on more scoring and find another big body when people bring them out to the curb after the deadline.
 

mcpickl

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Yeah, if they go that route, they're going to need to do some consolidation, since they'll need to find 3 more roster spots. I also somewhat question the wisdom of an all-rookie/2nd-year bench when you're a legit title contender, which I think this team pretty clearly is.

I don't think they're going to be what they really can be until they get a lights-out shooter. They're generating and missing too many good looks, and it would further add extra space for Tatum and Brown and Kemba, who are really good when the floor is spaced and they can attack the mismatches that most teams have against them.
This is a big part of why I think the Celtics will trade at least one of their late firsts for a player who can help them now. With it looking likely they'll have 3 1sts this year, plus Brooklyns 2nd and a fair shot of keeping their own second, there just won't be enough spots on the roster if they want to contend next year. They'd have Robert Williams, Grant Williams, Langford, Carsen Edwards, the 3 1sts taking up 7 spots. Then if they want to hang on to Waters and Tacko that's 9 of your 15 roster spots. And that's assuming the second rounders are willing to take 2 Ways or are Euro stashes. Unless the Celtics have their eyes set on a Euro stash or two with their first round picks, they'll have to trade some of their kids/picks for probably less than good value just to consolidate. Probably trading something like 23+30 to move up a couple spots, or making a deal like the Phoenix trade from last draft where they took the Milwaukee pick knowing it was likely to be a loss of value just to not have to make another choice last year.

I'd much rather they deal from a position of strength now to get a rotation player when a first round pick has more buying power than it will in June.
 

nighthob

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Even though we’re in the smallball era there is a 0% chance that Boston will keep three guards under 6’ on the roster. If they decide to keep Waters then Edwards will be dealt. I think Waters might have more trade value, though, so I expect that he’s the one outbound.
 

benhogan

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I'd much rather they deal from a position of strength now to get a rotation player when a first round pick has more buying power than it will in June.
yea, the C's should be able to get a decent rotational player by stapling the Celtics 1st to a cheap youngster & cheap filler (VP)

A lot of contenders don't have 1st rounders to deal

Even though we’re in the smallball era there is a 0% chance that Boston will keep three guards under 6’ on the roster. If they decide to keep Waters then Edwards will be dealt. I think Waters might have more trade value, though, so I expect that he’s the one outbound.
plus getting a small/older PG on the cheap in the 2020 2nd round is easy (Howard, Jones, Winston, Pritchard, Flynn, Mack).

Sacramento or San Antonio can dream on Carsen Edwards or Tre if Danny can add a rotational playoff player. Plus the C's can probably bring back BW on the cheap next season as deep depth
 

Eddie Jurak

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Its hard to say. I am not really sure how much of a defensive upgrade this is for Boston but again, I am in the camp that this move isn't as obvious as it is to some others. I would rather the C's spend resources on more scoring and find another big body when people bring them out to the curb after the deadline.
I agree with you.
plus getting a small/older PG on the cheap in the 2020 2nd round is easy (Howard, Jones, Winston, Pritchard, Flynn, Mack).
I think an interesting question going forward is what kind of player the Celtics want at PG long term.

Ever since Isaiah was acquired, nearly 6 years ago, the Celtics' offense has been led by a scoring PG. Will that continue to be the case going forward, or will the Celtics be more of a wing-led team behind Tatum and Brown and maybe Hayward if he sticks around.
 
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benhogan

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I think an interesting question going forward is what kind of player the Celtics want at PG long term.

Ever since Isaiah was acquired, nearly 6 years ago, the Celtics' offense has been led by a scoring PG. Will that continue to be the case going forward, or will the Celtics be more of a wing-led team behind Tatum and Brown and maybe Hayward if he sticks around.
Kemba, Kyrie, IT

They want a score-first, shooting PG that can break down defenses (like everyone). That can get the ball to the wings in good spots.

How they fill out the bench may be a different story. They may want to compliment the score first PG with a defense-first/bigger/stronger/distributing PGs (Smart/BW) since Brad likes to play Kemba off the ball. Or add a super quick ball hawk (ie Tre Waters steals video)...Since those 3 (JT/JB/KW) will soak up a lot of the cap, they will fill out the bench on the cheap with flawed vets and younger players.

I just listed all the potential 2nd round PGs in the upcoming draft that could possibly replace losing Tre or Carsen (for the Celtics) in a trade. If an NBA team out of the playoff picture wants to provide ~30 games of NBA minutes to Carsen Edwards/Tre Waters this season they may be rewarded. Cheap lottery tickets. I agree with the above that Waters has shown more then Edwards this season and if he could help add a rotational player then I'd hope Danny would make a move. There's going to be an end of the roster #s crunch with (7) current rookies and (5) 2020 draft picks. No need to hoard them. Even after the trade market is over there will be buyout candidates that could help and the Celtics will need roster flexibility then.
 
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Eddie Jurak

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Kemba, Kyrie, IT

They want a score-first, shooting PG that can break down defenses (like everyone). That can get the ball to the wings in good spots.
That has been the pattern of the past 6 years, yes. But it is also true that the greatest success the team has experienced over that span was done without a score-first PG (the 2017-18 playoffs when they came one win away from the finals). Kemba's not going anywhere, of course, but they might try something different after him.
 

lovegtm

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That has been the pattern of the past 6 years, yes. But it is also true that the greatest success the team has experienced over that span was done without a score-first PG (the 2017-18 playoffs when they came one win away from the finals). Kemba's not going anywhere, of course, but they might try something different after him.
Yeah, I think IT, Kyrie, and Kemba were all instances of the best players available (in FA or trade at a reasonable price) being small guards. My impression of Brad is that his dream isn't small-ball per se; it's wing-ball. If Tatum and Brown (and to some degree Smart) can get to the point where they are primary creators, I don't think he'd hesitate to play them as initiators and go big.

At the same time, as benhogan said, smaller quick guys have a fundamental advantage in offensive basketball, particularly with the current rules. So it might end up being one of those things where you're repeatedly finding value at that position and working with it.
 

HomeRunBaker

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View: https://twitter.com/chrisgrenham/status/1224430722515193856?s=20

On Lowe Post, Windhorst suggested Theis, Poirier, Langford and a 1.
It isn’t by choice. Houston is requiring a #1 in return and we need to match $10m in salary. For that purpose, Langford would almost certainly have to be included which would also clear his dead future salary off the books if he isn’t able to contribute.

Moving one of our #1’s was going to happen anyway since it wouldn’t be prudent to add 3 more multi-year guaranteed deals who likely wouldn’t contribute much to the rotation as rookies.
 

InstaFace

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I'd rather move Carsen Edwards + Poirier than Langford if we had to unload $3.6M worth of salary. I see more promise in him than either of the other two, in terms of NBA-level athleticism.

I'm all-in on moving some of our picks to upgrade the rotation, maybe even Memphis if the return is right. We simply don't have enough roster spots to go around, even accounting for letting fringe players compete to show they deserve a spot. The unspoken clause to the GM's dictum, "acquire more picks", is that in the NBA's case, they need to be GOOD picks.
 

BaseballJones

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I just can't love this enough:

Kemba: 22.0 ppg, 4.0 rpg, 5.0 apg, 1.0 spg
Tatum: 21.7 ppg, 6.8 rpg, 2.9 apg, 1.4 spg
Brown: 20.4 ppg, 6.6 rpg, 2.3 apg, 1.2 spg
Hayward: 17.0 ppg, 6.4 rpg, 3.9 apg, 0.7 spg
Theis: 8.1 ppg, 6.1 rpg, 1.6 apg, 0.7 spg
Smart: 12.4 ppg, 4.8 rpg, 4.8 apg, 1.5 spg

I mean, that is a gorgeous set of numbers from your starting lineup plus sixth man. I love how the scoring is distributed. Any of the top 4 could go off for 30 any night. Heck, even Smart has been 20+ four times this year so he's capable. Plus, of course, these guys are plus defenders.
 

Cesar Crespo

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I'd rather move Carsen Edwards + Poirier than Langford if we had to unload $3.6M worth of salary. I see more promise in him than either of the other two, in terms of NBA-level athleticism.

I'm all-in on moving some of our picks to upgrade the rotation, maybe even Memphis if the return is right. We simply don't have enough roster spots to go around, even accounting for letting fringe players compete to show they deserve a spot. The unspoken clause to the GM's dictum, "acquire more picks", is that in the NBA's case, they need to be GOOD picks.
That and the Celtics can't really carry both Edwards and Waters with Walker on the team. I'm not sure how much value Edwards has though. They should have just left him in Maine to get hot and maybe gain the interest of some other teams. If Langford is just in their for salary purposes, that means the Celtics aren't very high on him. I'm guessing Houston specifically wants Langford.
 

the moops

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I'd rather move Carsen Edwards + Poirier than Langford if we had to unload $3.6M worth of salary. I see more promise in him than either of the other two, in terms of NBA-level athleticism.
I think everyone would agree. Problem is that Langford still has some positive value, while Poirier has shown nothing and Edwards is a 2nd round pick who hasn't shot the ball well in his limited time. So the question would be how much draft pick compensation you would need to include to equal out the difference in value between Langford and Edwards/Poirier
 

RetractableRoof

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I just can't love this enough:

Kemba: 22.0 ppg, 4.0 rpg, 5.0 apg, 1.0 spg
Tatum: 21.7 ppg, 6.8 rpg, 2.9 apg, 1.4 spg
Brown: 20.4 ppg, 6.6 rpg, 2.3 apg, 1.2 spg
Hayward: 17.0 ppg, 6.4 rpg, 3.9 apg, 0.7 spg
Theis: 8.1 ppg, 6.1 rpg, 1.6 apg, 0.7 spg
Smart: 12.4 ppg, 4.8 rpg, 4.8 apg, 1.5 spg

I mean, that is a gorgeous set of numbers from your starting lineup plus sixth man. I love how the scoring is distributed. Any of the top 4 could go off for 30 any night. Heck, even Smart has been 20+ four times this year so he's capable. Plus, of course, these guys are plus defenders.
And one could argue that Haywire would be nearer to the 20ppg number himself without the injury setbacks interfering with his on court rhythms. One more successful 3 a game, or a couple more free throws because he felt good enough to attack the basket and draw a foul isn't a big difference given what he's missed.

I'm in total agreement, those numbers are awful nice.
 

chilidawg

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I just can't love this enough:

Kemba: 22.0 ppg, 4.0 rpg, 5.0 apg, 1.0 spg
Tatum: 21.7 ppg, 6.8 rpg, 2.9 apg, 1.4 spg
Brown: 20.4 ppg, 6.6 rpg, 2.3 apg, 1.2 spg
Hayward: 17.0 ppg, 6.4 rpg, 3.9 apg, 0.7 spg
Theis: 8.1 ppg, 6.1 rpg, 1.6 apg, 0.7 spg
Smart: 12.4 ppg, 4.8 rpg, 4.8 apg, 1.5 spg

I mean, that is a gorgeous set of numbers from your starting lineup plus sixth man. I love how the scoring is distributed. Any of the top 4 could go off for 30 any night. Heck, even Smart has been 20+ four times this year so he's capable. Plus, of course, these guys are plus defenders.
Kanter's numbers fit pretty nicely as well. We're a strong 7 deep
 

benhogan

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So what do the Celtics end up doing today? Adding quality depth? Shooting or big man? Nothing?
Greatest odds in order
1. Nothing- which is fine. The locker room was a point of emphasis this summer and it seems good right now. Adding Turner as a buyout candidate only enhances that
2. Add a bench shooter, by consolidating picks and young players going to a tanker (Wiz/Kings/Pistons)
3. Very small chance Danny adds a 3rd string center as Theis/Kanter injury insurance (probably buyout market)

 
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lovegtm

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Greatest odds in order
1. Nothing
2. add a bench shooter, by consolidating picks and young players going to a tanker (Wiz/Kings/Pistons)
3. very small chance Danny adds a 3rd string center as Theis/Kanter injury insurance (probably buyout market)
My favorite shooter trade so far is Kennard, since you get to delay paying him by one year, by which time you can get both a salary cap/luxury tax bump up, and finality with the Hayward situation. I would love love love Bertans, but I acknowledge that next year will be tricky with him. If Hayward does a S&T or ownership is willing to pay ~$30M in luxury tax for one year, Bertans is an option though.

Failing all this, just get it done with Bjelica, Danny.

(To be clear, I have no idea what the Bertans/Kennard price is--I just like the players, and the MEM pick is an appealing part of a package for that level of guy.)
 

NomarsFool

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Honestly, I hope nothing. I think GW has been making nice strides, and Wannamaker has been doing really well at the catch and shoot threes.
 

Jed Zeppelin

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It's pretty simple for Wanamaker.

Catch and shoot 3pt: 46%
Pull-up 3pt: 24%

If he has to dribble, he shouldn't be shooting from range at all. When the top 4 are healthy and humming on offense, he is perfectly fine in his role. Much less so when he tries to do too much. When he is fully engaged on D, his size is helpful and he can be pretty crafty.
 

benhogan

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It's pretty simple for Wanamaker.

Catch and shoot 3pt: 46%
Pull-up 3pt: 24%


If he has to dribble, he shouldn't be shooting from range at all. When the top 4 are healthy and humming on offense, he is perfectly fine in his role. Much less so when he tries to do too much. When he is fully engaged on D, his size is helpful and he can be pretty crafty.
good pick up, confirms the eye test

While there is a select few that want to cut Wanamaker, he fills a deep bench role on the cheap. The team is jammed full of 1st year/young players, you just don't get rid of veteran pg like Brad when you pay him a minimum deal.
 

CoffeeNerdness

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Now if only the coach could coach him out of his worst tendencies: low percentage threes, ball hogging, and dribbling his way into nowheresville and getting stuffed/stripped.
 

DeJesus Built My Hotrod

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Nobody here in non-gamethreads is actively calling for Wanamaker to be cut.

Maybe we should do one of those "learning" exercises where a poster dunks on others by pulling up old takes because if someone here said Wanamker absolutely needs to be gone, I missed it.

That said, I stand by the fact that he had a terrible two months, even relative to his role and cost. I will stand by that statement.
 

Jimbodandy

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Nobody here in non-gamethreads is actively calling for Wanamaker to be cut.

Maybe we should do one of those "learning" exercises where a poster dunks on others by pulling up old takes because if someone here said Wanamker absolutely needs to be gone, I missed it.

That said, I stand by the fact that he had a terrible two months, even relative to his role and cost. I will stand by that statement.
I'll fall on my sword for calling for his replacement by Waters before the season. He has exceeded my expectations, but he drives me nuts sometimes. All in all, better to keep him and Waters where they are. The Wanamakerphiles were correct.
 

benhogan

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I'll fall on my sword for calling for his replacement by Waters before the season. He has exceeded my expectations, but he drives me nuts sometimes. All in all, better to keep him and Waters where they are. The Wanamakerphiles were correct.
No need to fall on any swords, we're all just kicking it around. ;)

The spread between Waters and Wanamaker is pretty tight, so it's not a huge deal. AND if you're thinking about 2021 and beyond then there is a very fair argument that handing minutes to Waters is a better idea then handing them to Brad W right now.

BUT I do think CBS is inclined to go with the vets (Wana, Semi, etc) over the rookies (Grant, Romeo, Waters) and it's hard to question Brad this season, he has pulled all the right levers.
 

lovegtm

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No need to fall on any swords, we're all just kicking it around. ;)

The spread between Waters and Wanamaker is pretty tight, so it's not a huge deal. AND if you're thinking about 2021 and beyond then there is a very fair argument that handing minutes to Waters is a better idea then handing them to Brad W right now.

BUT I do think CBS is inclined to go with the vets (Wana, Semi, etc) over the rookies (Grant, Romeo, Waters) and it's hard to question Brad this season, he has pulled all the right levers.
The lack of respect Wanamaker’s D gets is criminal. I love Waters, but Wanamaker is a different level, and has a lot more size too.
 

benhogan

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The lack of respect Wanamaker’s D gets is criminal. I love Waters, but Wanamaker is a different level, and has a lot more size too.
yep, he's got "man" strength, so when he gets switched to a wing it's not a problem.

Would you bring Brad back on the cheap next season? He's dirt cheap
 

Jimbodandy

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yep, he's got "man" strength, so when he gets switched to a wing it's not a problem
I agree, and that's probably more valuable than Waters' superior ability to stay in front of quick 1s. At the end of the day, quick 1s get by their guy more often than not anyway, so it's a percentage difference between BW and TW. But TW is 100x more likely to get bulled by a wing than BW is.
 

benhogan

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I agree, and that's probably more valuable than Waters' superior ability to stay in front of quick 1s. At the end of the day, quick 1s get by their guy more often than not anyway, so it's a percentage difference between BW and TW. But TW is 100x more likely to get bulled by a wing than BW is.
I do think Waters could do a more credible job guarding a player like Trae Young.
Slowing Jitterbug guards down has been a weakness for the C's over the last few seasons. So Waters could offer something defensively as the 4th PG.
 

RetractableRoof

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I agree, and that's probably more valuable than Waters' superior ability to stay in front of quick 1s. At the end of the day, quick 1s get by their guy more often than not anyway, so it's a percentage difference between BW and TW. But TW is 100x more likely to get bulled by a wing than BW is.
Actually, if the Cs have no one else who can do so, a unique ability to stay in front of the Trae Young's is important. When you consider that Brad is more than willing to create matchups or minimize losing matchups having that tool on the bench isn't necessarily less valuable than BW with a redundant skill set to other players.

I like having them both, and think Waters is a decent get by Ainge - it wouldn't surprise me based on the link someone on this forum provided previously if Waters was a higher value asset if a deal needs to be made. I believe the quote was something like "he could be a backup point guard for a number of teams in the league already".
 

benhogan

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Greatest odds in order
1. Nothing- which is fine. The locker room was a point of emphasis this summer and it seems good right now. Adding Turner as a buyout candidate only enhances that
2. Add a bench shooter, by consolidating picks and young players going to a tanker (Wiz/Kings/Pistons)
3. Very small chance Danny adds a 3rd string center as Theis/Kanter injury insurance (probably buyout market)

Looks like NOTHING was the winner.
 

NomarsFool

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It's pretty simple for Wanamaker.

Catch and shoot 3pt: 46%
Pull-up 3pt: 24%
Very nice. Is it just me, or is his three point shot a bit more line drive than others?

I've been a big non-fan of his most of the season, but he's been killing it on the catch and shoot threes lately - which is a great asset to the team. I don't know if there's a way to get at his stats for break-away layups where he get blocked instead of passing the ball or just holding onto it - but that'd be something I'd like him to change :)
 

mostman

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Very nice. Is it just me, or is his three point shot a bit more line drive than others?

I've been a big non-fan of his most of the season, but he's been killing it on the catch and shoot threes lately - which is a great asset to the team. I don't know if there's a way to get at his stats for break-away layups where he get blocked instead of passing the ball or just holding onto it - but that'd be something I'd like him to change :)
It’s not just you. They look like they go in at a horizontal angle.
 

RetractableRoof

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Question... and I'm quasi-serious.

If as rumored, IT4 is going to be bought out/waived after being traded to GSW... does Danny consider kicking the tires for the 15th spot on the bench? Maybe Edwards spot? He's hitting 40+% from 3 in limited attempts.
 

Light-Tower-Power

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Jun 14, 2013
8,994
IT4 is my favorite Celtic ever. But he sucks. The 41% from deep is literally the only thing he isn't atrocious at. Edwards hasn't shown much of anything but I doubt Danny would waive him for IT4.

That said, the Green Teamer in me would love him to come back, sit on the end of the bench, and bomb threes for 10-15 minutes a night. I love that dude.
 
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DeJesus Built My Hotrod

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Dec 24, 2002
32,311
I would bet the Cs are using the buyout market to shop for an end of the bench big and then maybe another wing. But standing pat tells you that they have determined that what they have is superior to what they may have brought in given that they would have to send out or waive a player to make room.
 

Red Averages

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Apr 20, 2003
5,564
I would hate to bring IT back to sit on the bench and wrack up DNP and I fear his personality would not mesh well with the guys that were rookies when he was the alpha getting all of the run.
 
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scottyno

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Dec 7, 2008
5,504
I would hate to bring IT back to sit on the bench and wreck up DNP and I fear his personality would not mess well with the guys that were rookies when he was the alpha getting all of the run.
If we think the "we want tacko" chants are bad, bringing back IT would be those chants on steroids from fans who haven't actually watched him play in 3 years and just remember the king of the 4th glory days.