2018 U.S. Open--Shinnecock

johnmd20

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Berger and Finau were ELEVEN shots back on Friday night and both are in the final pairing on Sunday.

That most certainly has to be a record.
 

Deathofthebambino

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NO! It's unfair. Players are being punished and it's unfair. This isn't golf, it's luck, and anyone playing well is just ultra lucky and obviously rubbed a rabbit's foot this morning and the star players who missed the cut were just screwed over by the course.
Who is playing well?
 

Papelbon's Poutine

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So Rory playing horribly isn't the reason he missed the cut? It was the course.

And Spieth three putted on 17 yesterday and then missed a moderately short putt on 18 to make the cut. That was the course.

This course is the bogeyman. Thrashing children while they sleep.
I wasn’t able to watch every shot every golfer hit, as you obviously were, so I can’t comment on particulars like that. Perhaps somewhere on an earlier hole one of those guys hit what would be a perfect shot or what would normally be a tough leave but workable and instead it ended up being a double because the conditions were so hard that it ended up rolling into a swell forty yards away. Then that putt Speith missed doesn’t mean as much.

I really don’t know what you’re looking for here. Do the conditions and setup bring luck into play more than usual? I think that’s hard to argue against. Would the game, in general, benefit more from there being bigger names in the mix tomorrow? I would say yes, you obviously disagree. Did they go too far? I think when you are getting footprints on the greens, Fay is agreeing on air and we see them watering greens all day, it’s hard to say they don’t agree with that. When I watch a golf tournament and a handful of holes the announcers are saying things like ‘it’s impossible to get close to this pin’ or ‘if you go a foot past it’s gone’ on an approach, yeah I think they went too far. They could have simply moved to easier pin positions and had it balance out a bit.

Maybe settle down on insinuating that anyone who’s getting tired of the drama the USGA feels the need to inject into this tournament year after year - either with ridiculous conditions or setup or courses like Chambers Bay - is clutching pearls. None of the other majors have this issue, I just don’t get why the US Open has to.
 

dcmissle

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Here we go with Phil DQ question ... matter of time with this panel.
 

dcmissle

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Great, no DQ ... they are not going to Roger Goodell this thing when they have a rule on point.

Fuck you Buck with your “feel.”

14-5 Very Clear
 

cshea

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I fall in the camp where this is probably unfair but is still wildly entertaining. Looking forward to tomorrow.
 

dcmissle

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I fall in the camp where this is probably unfair but is still wildly entertaining. Looking forward to tomorrow.
They acknowledged things got out of hand with pin placement on 3 holes. They admitted they did not foresee the strength of the wind. They promised to remedy this tonight.

That is remarkable candor for a professional sport. One can only imagine the NFL or NBA in a comparable situation.
 

cshea

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Yeah, they put it too close to the edge and had no out for the change in weather.

Like I said I still find it all wildly entertaining from a viewing standpoint, but Mike Davis shouldn’t be at the center of this thing every single year.
 

( . ) ( . ) and (_!_)

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There is an interview with Beef where he says that he and Phil were taking before the rules official spoke to Phil. Beef said that they talked about neither of them knowing what the penalty for that was going to be.
Phil’s I’m taking advantage of the rules line is BS. And if you can’t trust a guy named Beef to be honest then who can you trust?
 

dcmissle

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Absolute fire.(paraphrasing) “Show me the video of Hogan, Snead, Palmer (other legends) doing something like this. This was Phil Michelson disrespecting his position in the game, the game.”
Maybe presumptuous to grant Phil a position among that triumvirate, which I don’t recall Phil ever claiming for himself.

Quick — someone send a camera crew over to Tom Watson’s house for a hot take.
 

dcmissle

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There is an interview with Beef where he says that he and Phil were taking before the rules official spoke to Phil. Beef said that they talked about neither of them knowing what the penalty for that was going to be.
Phil’s I’m taking advantage of the rules line is BS. And if you can’t trust a guy named Beef to be honest then who can you trust?
The explanation doesn’t ring true. What rings true is that Phil lost his composure. He then felt more embarrassed about that than about offering an explanation that doesn’t pass the smell test but casts him in a composed and calculating light.

The problem for Phil is that the explanation will soon become more embarrassing than the loss of composure.
 

cshea

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There is an interview with Beef where he says that he and Phil were taking before the rules official spoke to Phil. Beef said that they talked about neither of them knowing what the penalty for that was going to be.
Phil’s I’m taking advantage of the rules line is BS. And if you can’t trust a guy named Beef to be honest then who can you trust?
The standard bearer also heard Phil say “whatever I get, I get.”

I’m going with it was a mix of frustration realizing another US Open was lost as well as giving an FU to the USGA.
 

BigMike

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Definitely. 2015 was pretty good but the US Open has had some clunkers(2017, 2016, and, the worst golf tourney ever. in 2014, in particular) in recent years. At least watching today, you've got a lot of people to root for. Could be very tight tomorrow.
2015 was competitive, but it was played in a freaking amusement park, where you were often better off aiming at some mound 20 yards past the hole, and 25 yards to the right, rather than hitting a shot towards the cup, I know good courses sometime have the occasional backstop (ridge), behind the whole which can be used, but that course was unforgivably silly.

We are talking about a course being unplayable where the 2 new leaders shot 66 today. I know they went out early and the course played harder as the day went on, but the course was set up to be playable today.
 

Deathofthebambino

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2015 was competitive, but it was played in a freaking amusement park, where you were often better off aiming at some mound 20 yards past the hole, and 25 yards to the right, rather than hitting a shot towards the cup, I know good courses sometime have the occasional backstop (ridge), behind the whole which can be used, but that course was unforgivably silly.

We are talking about a course being unplayable where the 2 new leaders shot 66 today. I know they went out early and the course played harder as the day went on, but the course was set up to be playable today.
That's a bit disingenuous. 2 guys shot 66, and one guy shot 68. That's it. There was a grand total of 3 golfers out of 67 that were below par today. The same amount of golfers shot 80+ as shot +1 or better today.

These are the best golfers in the world. Just because 3 of them got really lucky (and I guarantee if you go back and watch their rounds, not only did they get lucky with the conditions in the morning, I'm sure they got a couple of lucky breaks with good lies in the rough, decent bounces, etc.) doesn't make the course "playable," it makes them the exception to the rule.
 

cshea

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The last five groups averaged scoring was 3.5 shots higher than the first five groups. Typically courses do get harder as the day goes on, but that an enormous difference.
 

Bob Montgomery's Helmet Hat

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The last five groups averaged scoring was 3.5 shots higher than the first five groups. Typically courses do get harder as the day goes on, but that an enormous difference.
Especially given that the guys in the last 5 groups were playing considerably better than the guys in the first 5 for the first two full rounds.
 

Average Reds

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Great, no DQ ... they are not going to Roger Goodell this thing when they have a rule on point.

Fuck you Buck with your “feel.”

14-5 Very Clear
The rules of golf are complicated, often contradictory and asinine.

Under 14-5 he is not disqualified. Under 1-2 he absolutely should be. They chose not to apply it, which is their right. The whole thing makes the USGA look silly.

The only time I can think of when a player did that on a US Open was Daly in ‘99. He was not disqualified because he did it in the fourth round, and I guess they are using that as precedent.

I don’t much care one way or another. It’s kind of a shame that Phil’s arrogance is driving the story and not the tournament.

FWIW, I’m always amused at the players complaining about how hard the course is because they can go -25 at the Quad Cities Open.
 

Byrdbrain

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The rule needs to be clarified, 14-5 should be for inadvertently hitting a ball in motion and should be a 2 stroke penalty. Purposely hitting a ball in motion to gain an advantage should be a DQ and should be covered by a different rule.
 

PaulinMyrBch

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USGA screwed this up. The players don’t complain because a course is hard, they complain when it crosses the line and they aren’t rewarded for good shots. You hit it 15 feet from the pin you shouldn’t have to be focused on how not to 4 putt. No one is looking for a course where the winning score is -20. But today, when the leaders make the turn to the back nine, the guy who shoots +1 from there probably wins. Not exactly what you want to see.
 

Zomp

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At the end of the day, these guys all play the same course. So if it’s hard, it’s hard for everyone.

I get the argument that the first groups out have an advantage because once the course dries out it becomes a lot harder however that's when you consider the extreme of the first group out vs the last group out which is usually at least an 8-10 shot swing.

If this were Thursday or Friday I'd have more of an issue but this was on Saturday so I think all of the groups coming in had an equal playing field, which is all I can ask for.
 

Average Reds

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The rule needs to be clarified, 14-5 should be for inadvertently hitting a ball in motion and should be a 2 stroke penalty. Purposely hitting a ball in motion to gain an advantage should be a DQ and should be covered by a different rule.
Rule 1-2 is all about intent, so the reality is that this distinction exists now. The USGA just chose not to apply it.

Moving on. Should be a great last round, with tons of players in contention.
 

Byrdbrain

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Rule 1-2 is all about intent, so the reality is that this distinction exists now. The USGA just chose not to apply it.

Moving on. Should be a great last round, with tons of players in contention.
Yeah that is why I said clarified and not changed, obviously there is some wiggle room that allowed them to apply 14-5 which they used to supersede 1-2, the wording should be changed so that wiggle room goes away.
 

lapa

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Makes no sense to me whatsoever that Phil didn't DQ himself, what is he hoping to gain by playing on? He's not winning this and he's hardly relying on the cash he'll win here. You would think taking the high road and saying ok my bad would be a lot more valuable to him in the long run than duffing around today
 

RedOctober3829

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No matter how much water they put on the course, it’s going to bake in the afternoon. It’s the hottest day of the week and the winds will pick up later in the day as they usually do.

I think anyone from +7 and up can win this. Just hoping for an exciting finish so there’s something else to talk about besides Rolling Ball Gate.