2018 Patriots Roster

[BaseballJones]

They also got one stop on a completely fluky tip-drill INT and another stop on an unforced error when Ertz false-started on 2nd-and-2 and Philadelphia had to settle for a field goal. The Eagles also only had 10 offensive possessions. It was every bit as bad a performance as the 41 points suggests.

And Philly - who averaged about 2 offensive holding penalties a game during the year - got called for zero (same with NE). Either of those likely stops a drive. And I was texting an Eagle friend of mine during the game and he was lamenting their blown coverages and I was lamenting their incredible catches. He said, "You can't count on blown coverages all game," and I said, "Well, true, but you can't count on Philly making perfect passes and incredible catches all game," and he said, "True."

And yet.... it happened. All game long. I mean, to count on a great catch or two...sure. They had a BUNCH of them. It was exceptional, and many of them came with great defense all over the play.

So yeah, the Pats' defense was B-A-D. But Philly's offense also played out of their minds.

 

[wnyghost]

The Eagles offense also torched the Vikings defense. Nothing lucky about it. They earned the crown.

 

[bsj]

Hannable speculating on the idea of Jimmy Graham

 

[TheoShmeo]

Hannable speculating on the idea of Jimmy Graham

FWIW, Andy Hart threw that out on WEEI yesterday morning. A Greek Chorus — if this becomes that — on a Pats free agent idea almost always results in nothing happening. Still, it’s an interesting idea.

 

[slamminsammya]

32 year old coming off his worst season? The defense needs some love folks.

 

[BigSoxFan]

On a cheap 1 year deal? Sure. But he won’t sign for that so very unlikely. A red zone pairing of Gronk/Graham would be pretty sweet though.

 

[BaseballJones]

The Eagles offense also torched the Vikings defense. Nothing lucky about it. They earned the crown.

Yep, no doubt. Here's the other interesting thing...Philly's defense, and how good the Pats' offense was in the Super Bowl.

In their last four games prior to the Super Bowl (2 reg season, 2 postseason), the Eagles allowed:

vs Oak: 10 points, 274 yards, 13 first downs
vs Dal: 6 points, 301 yards, 16 first downs
vs Atl: 10 points, 281 yards, 19 first downs
vs Min: 7 points, 333 yards, 22 first downs

AVG: 8.3 points, 297.3 yards, 17.5 first downs

vs NE: 33 points, 613 yards, 29 first downs

I mean, holy crap did the Pats' offense just utterly abuse what was a very, very, very good defense. Special teams screw-ups aside, and the Pats really should have had 37 points in that game. They just plain-old kicked the crap out of the Eagles' elite defense.

Sadly.... Philly's offense kicked the crap out of the Patriots' defense too.......

 

[Mystic Merlin]

At some point the marginal value of devoting dollars to offensive skill players has to be lower than devoting dollars to the defense, and I'm pretty sure the Pats are at that point.

Pass. Add some damn linebackers with that money.

 

[slamminsammya]

At some point the marginal value of devoting dollars to offensive skill players has to be lower than devoting dollars to the defense, and I'm pretty sure the Pats are at that point.

Pass. Add some damn linebackers with that money.

Get this man some v day chocolate.

The presence of Marquise Flowers and Pierre Woods in big time snaps in super bowls is something less than an abomination. But something worse than ok.

 

[RedOctober3829]

They need to devote their big FA dollars to the front seven, a LT, and a Butler replacement. Graham would be great, but not exactly at the top of their needs unless Gronk decides to retire.

 

[tims4wins]

Hoping Solder decides to come back for a short deal without breaking the bank. Then they can draft their future LT this year or next. He can retire along with Scar after 2018 or 2019.

 

[Valek123]

Seeing Graham and Gronk together would be amazing but likely at the cost of the needed defensive improvements and resigning.

The real question for me is where to they focus draft capital? I think a QB is somewhere in there and likely all the rest in this draft is Defense with the exception of a guard/tackle.

 

[jsinger121]

Seeing Graham and Gronk together would be amazing but likely at the cost of the needed defensive improvements and resigning.

The real question for me is where to they focus draft capital? I think a QB is somewhere in there and likely all the rest in this draft is Defense with the exception of a guard/tackle.

I think trading down out of 31 if this is a deep draft might be benefit the Patriots to pick up extra picks as they really need them as they gave away picks for Cassius Marsh and others as well. They need to restock the cupboard.

 

[E5 Yaz]

How many "extra picks," though, can be reasonably expected from trading out of 31?

 

[DourDoerr]

UFDA's will also play a large part. Depending on how FA goes, I wouldn't bet against a RB or 2 coming to camp. Haven't read this, but I'd guess the Pats have a real advantage with UFDA's, as they give those players real chances to play, have multiple success stories and the coaching staff has a rep of coaching a player up.

 

[jsinger121]

How many "extra picks," though, can be reasonably expected from trading out of 31?

Depends on how far they move down. They could pick up a 2nd, 3rd and another lower pick using the this draft value chart.

http://walterfootball.com/draftchart.php

 

[RedOctober3829]

Seeing Graham and Gronk together would be amazing but likely at the cost of the needed defensive improvements and resigning.

The real question for me is where to they focus draft capital? I think a QB is somewhere in there and likely all the rest in this draft is Defense with the exception of a guard/tackle.

They need to address front seven, CB, QB, and RB in the draft.

 

[Papelbon's Poutine]

I think trading down out of 31 if this is a deep draft might be benefit the Patriots to pick up extra picks as they really need them as they gave away picks for Cassius Marsh and others as well. They need to restock the cupboard.

Didn’t we establish that they basically are only down a 5th for that trade since they got a 7th back from Seattle?

 

[jsinger121]

Didn’t we establish that they basically are only down a 5th for that trade since they got a 7th back from Seattle?

They currently have 31, 63, 95, no 4th, no 5th, 6th round, no 7th. They haven't yet determined the comp picks yet.

 

[tims4wins]

They'll definitely get a 4th round comp

 

[BigSoxFan]

They currently have 31, 63, 95, no 4th, no 5th, 6th round, no 7th. They haven't yet determined the comp picks yet.

We should get a 4 for Sheard, right? Will be interesting to see if we get anything for Bennett. He would probably be another 5/6.

 

[tims4wins]

I think the calculus is

+ Gilmore
- Bennett, Blount, Ryan

Any others?

 

[pappymojo]

Over the Cap projects the Patriots to receive a 4th round comp pick for Sheard. Also points out the unknown in regards to Bennett.

https://overthecap.com/projecting-2018-compensatory-picks/

Finally, for the first time ever (as far as I can tell), a CFA that was cut before Week 10 was claimed off waivers. The window for this possibility is very narrow, as it can only happen in the two weeks between the trade deadline of Week 8 and the comp pick cutoff mark of Week 10. But that’s what happened when Green Bay cut Martellus Bennett after Week 9, and was then claimed by New England—the very team that lost Bennett in free agency. Suffice to say, these circumstances are highly unusual. Does the Week 10 rule still apply to players claimed on waivers? If not, are the Packers still charged with a CFA gained even if they’re relieved from a contract that’s still active? Are the Patriots charged with a CFA gained as well—and if so, does that mean Bennett cancels himself out in the Patriots’ ledger? Because the Patriots are very knowledgeable and mindful about comp picks, it’s reasonable to guess that New England may have asked for a clarification on Bennett’s status before issuing a waiver claim for him. To keep it simple I’m guessing that Bennett will not qualify. But I have low confidence in that guess, and if I’m wrong, it could possibly complicate comp picks for both Green Bay and New England.

If Martellus Bennett qualifies but is not charged as a CFA gained against them, New England will get a 5th for him.

 

[SMU_Sox]

Antonio Garcia was reportedly down to 260, but does anyone actually know what happened to him (non-Football injury)? Is there a chance he plays in 2018 or 2019? I haven’t found anything online that has anything other than basic reporting that’s he’s out for the year. Obviously hope it’s not life threatening and he recovers.

 

[steveluck7]

They currently have 31, 63, 95, no 4th, no 5th, 6th round, no 7th. They haven't yet determined the comp picks yet.

also # 43 for Jimmy G

 

[BaseballJones]

They need to address front seven, CB, QB, and RB in the draft.

D-line, yes
Speedy LB, YES YES YES
CB, yes, but could be mitigated by how well Jonathan Jones comes along
RB, not necessarily. UDFA would be fine, and they seem to have no problem picking up a RB castoff and plugging him in just fine. And of course, Burkhead just might be back, and Lewis too if nobody is willing to pay him big money.

 

[EL Jeffe]

Keionta Davis is a pretty interesting guy who doesn't get talked about much. Rapaport previously tweeted he had a 3rd-5th round grade before the bulging disc issue popped up in the pre-draft process. He's got intriguing measurables (6'3", 271lb with 34"+ arms), had good production, albeit at a small school (10.5 sacks as a senior, and played well against SEC schools in Alabama and Tennessee) and he showed well at the Senior Bowl. Trait-wise, he has some similarities to Trey Flowers (short for an end, small for a tackle but long arms, good leverage and quickness). Combine that with a 4.72 40, 37.5" vertical, 30 bench reps - he's got real athletic ability.

I'm not saying he should be counted on because mid-round picks bust all the time. But sometimes you hit on a Trey Flowers. He was assigned #42, so I'm wondering if they're starting him as a rush end/OLB. He's got the speed and they have a need there. In any event, he'll be an interesting guy to follow this off-season to see if they hit on something.

 

[Captaincoop]

They need to address front seven, CB, QB, and RB in the draft.

I wonder how they're feeling about Derek Rivers. In theory he's one of the things they need.

 

[E5 Yaz]

They need to address TE

 

[RedOctober3829]

I wonder how they're feeling about Derek Rivers. In theory he's one of the things they need.

I'm sure they are high on Rivers but they need more help.

 

[mcpickl]

Hannable speculating on the idea of Jimmy Graham

If they were going after a TE, I'd be surprised if they targeted a guy at the end of the road like Graham.

I'd be going after Trey Burton.

 

[tims4wins]

Should Shelden Richardson become a cap casualty in Seattle... would he be a fit in the Patriots front? Would he be worth the $$? Could the Pats afford him?

 

[jsinger121]

Should Shelden Richardson become a cap casualty in Seattle... would he be a fit in the Patriots front? Would he be worth the $$? Could the Pats afford him?

Same thing for Mohammed Wilkerson

 

[Super Nomario]

Same thing for Mohammed Wilkerson

Wilkerson seems like a Pats signing. Has played for losers, perceived to be on the decline, in need of an image rehab. He can spend a year with NE, winning some games and showing he can toe the line for a season, then get a bigger deal next offseason.

 

[Ed Hillel]

I was thinking a few days ago that I really hope they extend Cooks and save a few million on this season’s cap in the process. I would guess something like 5/60/30 might get it done? Give him 15 million as a signing bonus immediately and another 15 in guaranteed salary. Cut his 2018 salary to 2-3 million with pro bowl incentives to get the cap hit down to 5-6 million.

Let’s say Brady has 2-4 years left. It sure would be nice to have a very good young receiver like Cooks with him the rest of the way. I think if they go into next offseason with him as a FA, they are in trouble.

 

[Super Nomario]

I was thinking a few days ago that I really hope they extend Cooks and save a few million on this season’s cap in the process. I would guess something like 5/60/30 might get it done? Give him 15 million as a signing bonus immediately and another 15 in guaranteed salary. Cut his 2018 salary to 2-3 million with pro bowl incentives to get the cap hit down to 5-6 million.

Let’s say Brady has 2-4 years left. It sure would be nice to have a very good young receiver like Cooks with him the rest of the way. I think if they go into next offseason with him as a FA, they are in trouble.

It's interesting. They're going to be spending a lot of money on the offense. Brady is north of $20 MM, Gronk more than $10 MM, and if they bring Solder back he's likely in the $12 range. Cannon's not cheap, Mason won't be cheap soon, Edelman is a bargain but still makes a lot more than a rookie, as Amendola will if they bring him back. Allen and Bennett are pricey and while they're not likely to be back at their contracts, they need to replace those guys. And they don't have much for RB under contract. It's a veteran-heavy offense that is pretty expensive. Can they add another $12 MM / year contract to that group? And does it make sense to do that?

It would be nice to pair Brady with a good young receiver but it would also be nice to have a defense such that Brady doesn't have to lead the league in pass attempts again. Would I rather have Cooks at that contract or another key defensive piece at that price? They need to find a bargain somewhere on the offensive side, whether that's trading Cooks or letting Solder walk or something else.

There's a weird corollary here where, contrary to current needs, it might make sense to look to the offense in the draft, to fill out some roles with cheaper players to offset the big-ticket guys. Can they find a rookie to fill Dwayne Allen's role, Dion Lewis' role, Danny Amendola's role?

 

[tims4wins]

Dola should still be cheap. < $4M. Allen could be cut and brought back cheap. I could even see Solder back on a 1-2 year "bargain" type deal. Say 2/$18M or something.

 

[dcmissle]

I understand sunk cost and that every transaction has to be evaluated looking forward and compared to other alternatives.

But a first round pick for only one year of service, albeit good service, for Cooks?

If that happens, people shouldn’t be scratching their heads downstream about talent depletion.

 

[Papelbon's Poutine]

Yeah, there’s little to no chance (in my opinion) that Cooks goes anywhere. That was not an ‘all in’ type move, BB doesn’t do that. They will extend him. Frankly they need to.

 

[Super Nomario]

Dola should still be cheap. < $4M. Allen could be cut and brought back cheap. I could even see Solder back on a 1-2 year "bargain" type deal. Say 2/$18M or something.

Solder will be doing them a huge favor if he signs that cheap. He signed for 2 / $21 a couple years ago and the Pats had leverage because he was still a year from FA. Now he has the leverage of FA and he's coming off a good year.

And the issue is not so much the deals individually but the deals collectively. The offense has almost no one on rookie contract. So $4 MM for Amendola and $3.5 MM for Hogan and $5 MM for Edelman and $9 MM for Cooks are all good deals individually, but that's a lot of money to be spending at one position (especially since you've also got pass-catchers $11 MM for Gronk and $3 MM for James White.

The offense looks like this (2018 cap #s):
Veterans: Brady (22), Gronk (11), Cooks (8.5), Cannon (6), Edelman (4), Hogan (3.3), White (2.5), Andrews (1.7), Britt (1.5), Develin (1.3), Hoyer (1)
Likely cuts: Bennett (6), Allen (5), Gillislee (2.2)
Rookie contracts: Mason (2), Dorsett (1.5), Thuney, Garcia, Mitchell, Karras, Hollister, Croston (all sub-1)
Not under contract yet: Solder/LT, Waddle/Fleming/backup OT, maybe 2 (unless they think Garcia and / or Croston can do this), Amendola / backup slot WR, Lewis/Burkhead/at least two RBs, at least one more TE assuming Bennett/Allen are cut

I understand sunk cost and that every transaction has to be evaluated looking forward and compared to other alternatives.

But a first round pick for only one year of service, albeit good service, for Cooks?

If that happens, people shouldn’t be scratching their heads downstream about talent depletion.

I'm still pretty mystified by the Cooks trade, honestly. It wasn't a terrible trade, but it was one of the most out-of-character things Belichick has done.

Cutting Cooks doesn't make any sense, but what if they can trade him for a 2?

 

[SMU_Sox]

To add onto complications resigning Solder this is both a weak draft and free agent class for tackles.

 

[ZMart100]

To add onto complications resigning Solder this is both a weak draft and free agent class for tackles.

Interesting, I haven't worked through it fully, but my early impression is that this is a really deep draft for Patriots O-tackles.

 

[Papelbon's Poutine]

Cutting Cooks doesn't make any sense, but what if they can trade him for a 2?

Then they wasted that draft capital for one year of Cooks and leave themselves with an old and injured WR corps. Who are they working with going forward? Hogan and Mitchell?

I don't find it to of character at all for BB, he saw an undervalued asset and pounced on it. Cooks isn't much older than a first round pick would be but he's proven. I don't find it odd BB would value that in trade for the salary difference between the two and we know he has a penchant for falling in love with guys they do combined practices with. This was just a bit more high profile a player.

If Edelman hadn't blown his knee out, the offense would have looked a lot different with both and we might very well be fitting ourselves for another ring.

 

[tims4wins]

While Cooks is a UFA after 2018, and will be paid well, he doesn’t strike me as being the prototype WR that will break the bank. He doesn’t have the size of a prime Julio or AJ Green or Dez or Megatron or Fitz. So I think there is some wiggle room there for a fair but not exorbitant contract.

 

[Super Nomario]

Then they wasted that draft capital for one year of Cooks and leave themselves with an old and injured WR corps. Who are they working with going forward? Hogan and Mitchell?

That draft capital is gone. They already got the biggest return on it - the one year of Cooks on a rookie deal. Now they have to decide what to do moving forward. Maybe resigning Cooks makes the most sense, but maybe it doesn't.

I don't find it to of character at all for BB, he saw an undervalued asset and pounced on it. Cooks isn't much older than a first round pick would be but he's proven. I don't find it odd BB would value that in trade for the salary difference between the two and we know he has a penchant for falling in love with guys they do combined practices with. This was just a bit more high profile a player.

I call it out-of-character because 1) Belichick doesn't invest in WR. They were the only team in the league that hadn't used a first-rounder on a WR since 2000. 2) When he does grab WR, they tend to be slot guys like Welker or Amendola. The outside guys have been a revolving door of cheap FA - LaFell, Lloyd, Hogan, even Moss was cheap when they got him. 3) Cooks produced a lot with Brees in NO - usually BB buys low on guys, grabbing players who were misused, in low-volume offenses, or paired with a bad QB. Cooks was none of those. They paid market rate for him; I don't think he was undervalued. And while you're right he is young, he is not cheap any longer.

EDIT: Also, Belichick values versatility and toughness, and Cooks is pretty limited in usage and he's a finesse guy.

If Edelman hadn't blown his knee out, the offense would have looked a lot different with both and we might very well be fitting ourselves for another ring.

The offense was the best in the league anyway. Unless Edelman is going to unlock some sort of 2013 Broncos next level, it makes sense to me to divert some resources to the defensive side of the ball.

While Cooks is a UFA after 2018, and will be paid well, he doesn’t strike me as being the prototype WR that will break the bank. He doesn’t have the size of a prime Julio or AJ Green or Dez or Megatron or Fitz. So I think there is some wiggle room there for a fair but not exorbitant contract.

TY Hilton signed for 5, $65. Nuk Hopkins was 5, $81. Davante Adams just signed for 4, $58. I'm not seeing a lot of bargains in that next tier, either.

 

[tims4wins]

Not total bargain but in the Gilmore range, not stupid money. But I agree

 

[Hoodie Sleeves]

Then they wasted that draft capital for one year of Cooks and leave themselves with an old and injured WR corps. Who are they working with going forward? Hogan and Mitchell?

I don't find it to of character at all for BB, he saw an undervalued asset and pounced on it. Cooks isn't much older than a first round pick would be but he's proven. I don't find it odd BB would value that in trade for the salary difference between the two and we know he has a penchant for falling in love with guys they do combined practices with. This was just a bit more high profile a player.

If Edelman hadn't blown his knee out, the offense would have looked a lot different with both and we might very well be fitting ourselves for another ring.

Agree - I don't understand people's issue with the Cooks trade. They have an old WR corps in general, and Cooks is a young, elite player, at a position they've had trouble developing. Yes, he'll cost significant cash to extend, but I'd much rather have them make that trade then go out and spend a first on a WR.

It seems like a long term move to me - not any 'go for it now' type thing.

 

[RedOctober3829]

Marty B wants to continue playing next year per RapSheet. I wonder if Pats would bring him back at the cap figure he has or cut him and bring him back at a lower price.

 

[slamminsammya]

Marty B wants to continue playing next year per RapSheet. I wonder if Pats would bring him back at the cap figure he has or cut him and bring him back at a lower price.

Given his performance and injuries last year I see zero chance he comes back at his current price. They need to create quite a bit of room just to bring back Solder and fill the roster.

 

[tims4wins]

Jags have released Chris Ivory as expected. He turns 30 next month. Could be a good depth signing on a 1-2 year deal if Lewis and Burkhead leave as free agents.