2018 Little League World Series

savage362 · Aug 3, 2018

The New England Regional tournament runs August 5-11. Below are the representatives. I always like to follow this region in particular since I played in the tournament back in 2000.

Connecticut Fairfield American LL Fairfield 0-0
Maine Saco/Maremont LL Saco 0-0
Massachusetts Pittsfield American LL Pittsfield 0-0
New Hampshire Goffstown Junior Baseball LL Goffstown 0-0
Rhode Island Coventry LL Coventry 0-0
Vermont South Burlington LL South Burlington 0-0

montoursvillefan · Aug 10, 2018

Here are the links I've been posting for a number of years now, enjoy.

http://sonsofsamhorn.net/index.php?threads/2017-little-league-world-series-thread.20542/

Signed,
Williamsport Native

budcrew08 · Aug 11, 2018

This kid has the right idea.

montoursvillefan · Aug 12, 2018

Some background, history.

https://www.northcentralpa.com/sports/the-road-to-williamsport/article_639be864-9da9-11e8-bd46-a301e0fd4dc4.html#utm_campaign=blox&utm_source=facebook&utm_medium=social

moondog80 · Aug 12, 2018

I know they were in the New England finals this year and the game could have gone either way, but theories on why MA hasn’t gone to Williamsport this decade, while RI has now gone 5 times, despite an over sixfold advantage in population by MA? Just random variation?

DeJesus Built My Hotrod · Aug 12, 2018

moondog80 said:
I know they were in the New England finals this year and the game could have gone either way, but theories on why MA hasn’t gone to Williamsport this decade, while RI has now gone 5 times, despite an over sixfold advantage in population by MA? Just random variation?

I cannot speak to the MA vs RI question but some local LL teams are essentially travel programs that play little league during the spring so they can qualify for all-stars (for those unfamiliar, these teams going to the LLWS are actually all-star teams comprised of the best kids in their local league). These teams have a huge advantage as any team with long-standing members does - from pitching roles to the batting order to double-plays to OF assists, the familiarity makes a big difference.

Meanwhile, some local LL areas aim for parity and will essentially work to ensure that the best players are spread out amongst the teams. They can all wind up on an AS team together at the end but its a bit more complicated in terms of who gets to manage the club, which players from each team get selected etc. This model makes climbing out of the district, sectional etc a lot tougher.

canderson · Aug 13, 2018

A family member is on the Post Oak team. They should wreck shop in the American bracket.

If you’ve never been it’s a really wonderful event - go in the early rounds though before the massive crowds arrive.

LoweTek · Aug 13, 2018

DeJesus Built My Hotrod said:
I cannot speak to the MA vs RI question but some local LL teams are essentially travel programs that play little league during the spring so they can qualify for all-stars (for those unfamiliar, these teams going to the LLWS are actually all-star teams comprised of the best kids in their local league). These teams have a huge advantage as any team with long-standing members does - from pitching roles to the batting order to double-plays to OF assists, the familiarity makes a big difference.

Meanwhile, some local LL areas aim for parity and will essentially work to ensure that the best players are spread out amongst the teams. They can all wind up on an AS team together at the end but its a bit more complicated in terms of who gets to manage the club, which players from each team get selected etc. This model makes climbing out of the district, sectional etc a lot tougher.

So you're saying all-star teams are allowed to compete intact during a LL regular season schedule against teams who are drafted on an even playing field? Doesn't sound right. We have small towns who might be able to field only one team who play an interleague (other nearby towns) regular season schedule. When a town tried to pull this they were promptly excluded from the future scheduling. Why would fairly balanced teams want to schedule regular season games against some all-star squad? Makes no sense.

BigMike · Aug 13, 2018

LoweTek said:
So you're saying all-star teams are allowed to compete intact during a LL regular season schedule against teams who are drafted on an even playing field? Doesn't sound right. We have small towns who might be able to field only one team who play an interleague (other nearby towns) regular season schedule. When a town tried to pull this they were promptly excluded from the future scheduling. Why would fairly balanced teams want to schedule regular season games against some all-star squad? Makes no sense.

Here is an article which I think talks mostly about what DBMH is talking about

https://nypost.com/2016/06/20/little-league-coach-accused-of-using-shady-loophole-to-build-all-star-team/

So reading this, coach creates an all star team in the fall with his 11 year olds, Works the kids all winter on his travelling team. then the players played for existing teams during the Spring league. Then the coach picks the 12 best kids from his travel team the previous fall/winter, and takes that team with him to compete in LL Distict competition.

As someone who coaches, it is so hard these days. Half of the better kids you get are playing in travel leagues. A couple years ago, I think 12 of the 18 best players in our spring league citywide were playing in AAU leagues as well.

moondog80 · Aug 13, 2018

BigMike said:
As someone who coaches, it is so hard these days. Half of the better kids you get are playing in travel leagues. A couple years ago, I think 12 of the 18 best players in our spring league citywide were playing in AAU leagues as well.

That few? In my league (in RI), it is almost 100%. I wonder if RI being so small means more of the best players play LL, because the chance to go Williamsport seems more real?

LoweTek · Aug 14, 2018

Yes, I coach as well. Our town has Babe Ruth/Cal Ripken instead of LL. I have been coaching there almost 14 years. The player deterioration started at the Senior division (18U). There hasn't been enough players to field even one 18U team for more than 10 years. There used to be four of them in the league. Then it moved to Juniors (15U). There were six 15U teams 10 years ago. Now there is one. 12U: there were six also, now two. 10U and 8U used to have 8-10 teams, now 4-5 each. Only T-Ball seems to sustain 8-10 teams but the attrition from T-Ball to 8U is more than 50%.

All the kids who formerly played rec baseball now play other sports, have dropped out altogether or they play travel ball (TB) exclusively. All this of course has negative consequences on competitiveness in the rec league. The coaching is generally poor and kids of limited ability are ignored in favor of kids with TB potential. Kids can be in the league five plus years and still execute every fundamental incorrectly. I used to get them in 18U, 10+ years in rec league and they didn't even throw correctly, forget rule, play or strategy subtleties. I remember having to explain in detail to an 18 year old kid why he should have run out a pop-up to 1B with no outs and a runner on.

Many of the rec coaches also coach low-level or what I would describe as temporary local TB teams simultaneous to the rec league season, using the rec league as not much more than a Minor League for their TB rosters. The league also has coaches who recruit kids for private pitching or hitting lessons of dubious value. Nobody sees anything wrong with this.

It's clear the side-effect is parents, if they determine a kid is not good enough to play TB, they move him along to another sport. Or worse, they are convinced by some TB coach on the idea the kid is good enough and they get him involved in $300-$500 monthly dues commitments to play on questionably coached travel teams where the bulk of the money goes into coaches' pockets. Flattery can make some parents commit quite a lot of money to a kid who won't crack a HS JV roster on his best day.

I'm outside Orlando so we're year-round with regular season schedules both in the Spring (actually late Winter through May) and in the Fall (starting this coming Saturday and running to early November). Kids will play on TB teams during the Summer months and scattered amongst Winter Holidays and during the Rec League seasons.

We have debates in other threads about why baseball is in trouble with young people? This is a big reason.

DeJesus Built My Hotrod · Aug 14, 2018

Thanks guys and yes that article is an example of what I was getting at. I have also heard of some leagues that allow regular season teams to be formed outside of a draft which can also be used to game the system.

I have been coaching LL and travel (in the same district as the OP) for over a decade at every level and the observations by BM and LT are spot on. Travel clearly siphons off talent as do other sports. However there are other factors as well.

For example, our league's numbers swelled after the Giants won the WS the first two times. But the afterglow faded and people stopped signing their kids up.

The other thing is the time commitment for both the kids and parents. Asking kids to patiently wait their turn to hit and have them stand around "doing nothing" during the course of a two hour game (never mind the extra hour plus of warmups plus post game speeches in addition to the 2-4 hours of practice a week) is one thing but asking parents to sit through that or drive to/from is something else. Parents love youth soccer or basketball because the action is constant and the the time commitment is much less onerous. Furthermore, those sports tend to only highlight really good players versus baseball which exposes everyone at one point or another - its always pretty clear who the worst players are on a diamond. That is a bitter pill for some parents.

Finally, I think the lack of instant gratification in baseball also hurts it with today's kids. Baseball is my sons best sport and he played from Farm all the way through HS in some very competitive leagues. But it's not his favorite sport for many of the reasons mentioned. In some ways, the immediacy of everything in the digital age has made the game obsolete.

Anyhow, I love LL (not so much travel which has some good aspects but a lot of darker ones too) and I think allstars and the LLWS is about as pure a high level sports experience as you can get, even when you account for the seedy stuff that goes on. These kids are, generally speaking, all playing on a level field and the lack of a profit motive at the team level (a huge issue in travel) means that most playing time and positions are based on merit. Meanwhile, the general level of play at the LLWS is impressive, especially for kids who are so young.

Doug Beerabelli · Aug 14, 2018

I typed this up but didn't send, but it's in line with what others have written about the effect of travel baseball:

Travel has really changed things IMO. Beyond what DBMH wrote, which I agree with, lots of the best players don't even play LL. Travel ball may have too many games to allow for LL participation- coached really have to coordinate and cooperate to make it work. Also, there can be a disparity in quality of play when travel is compared to local LL that'll make players and parents decide against playing LL. These LLWS teams are all great, and their players could compete well with most good travel teams (likely because many play travel already), but LL is no longer the clear cut end all be all of where kids (or their parents) want to play baseball.

SSS - My son pkays travel ball, and has since he was 7/8. He's young (June B-day), so he would have been eligible for LLWS this year. He hasn't played on 46/60 since...2015. 50/70 previous two years, and 60/90 this past year. I asst coached his teams all along (our organization is all volunteer), and as a staff and a program we allowed kids to also play LL in the spring, but none ever did. Usually the game and practice schedule was too much for kids to also do LL, although a few other age divisions pulled it off.

I support the local LL, and am a board member on it. The best kids generally play travel in our area and state. (CT), and travel programs have grown a lot. With many of the negative side effects mentioned above.

DeJesus Built My Hotrod · Aug 15, 2018

Since we are waiting for the games, a few other observations about travel baseball.

When you look at it from a distance, its insanity. The number of hours spent not just practicing but traveling to/from tourneys as well as waiting for games. In addition, the cost, which as LT points out, can be exorbitant (our program cost a player ~$500 for about 6-8 tourneys and uniforms per season but it was a not-for-profit program - he is right that sometimes teams will charge three to four times that amount). And then there are the 8am games which are heaped upon late entrant teams and those who perform poorly early on in their brackets. You add in the unreasonable parental expectations and behavior as well as the aforementioned ubiquitous individual batting and pitching coaches - we estimate that one legitimate guy here in the SF Bay area makes somewhere around $200-300k from his hitting and pitching instruction, extra from his travel programs and even more from coaching pros - and all adds up to something that defies logic.

That said, at its best, travel baseball is the game played at the highest level by some very young players. We started with a U10 group and by the time they were in the midst of their U11 season, it was rare to have a fielder make an error on a routine play. By U12, our team, which was built on defense and pitching versus teams that have line-ups of stocky cage monkeys all swinging the most expensive bats, was routinely playing in low scoring one run games that featured one or two errors on tough plays at most. And as DB, notes, they got to play on bigger diamonds than the U12 LL small field.

Asking kids and coaches who have tasted that experience to go back and play on a team where about half the roster ranges from kids who are athletic but don't know the game to those who just don't have the motor function to field a routine ground ball or pop-fly, let alone hit a straight fastball is just tough. Some kids welcome being a big fish in a small pond of course but those who really love the sport strongly prefer travel baseball.

The problem for LL is that, at least on the small field, they need these players as they showcase the program. We purposely skipped the travel season during our kids last season on the small field so they could get their shot at all-stars and the LLWS but as DB points out, others don't do this. At some point, LL needs to figure out how to retain these kids or else leagues may die off, especially with the other issues we've discussed upthread.

Again, LL and the LLWS is awesome. The former gives kids who aren't baseball junkies an entry into the sport while the latter shows people how good relatively young kids can get at the sport. Unfortunately, both are under threat from a variety of forces that may render them irrelevant in the not too distant future.

LoweTek · Aug 15, 2018

Agreed DBMH. I look forward to watching as many LLWS games as I can. In addition, I will dutifully show up Saturday and assess players for my 10U Red Sox team and again on Sunday to draft them and probably next Tuesday for a first practice or parents meeting. I'm not giving up. Yet.

DeJesus Built My Hotrod · Aug 17, 2018

Michigan with the first walk off win, coming back from down three in the bottom of the sixth to beat Idaho.

Hendu for Kutch · Aug 17, 2018

Anyone else watching this Georgia-Hawaii game? Flipped it on as a scoreless tie in the 6th after the Sox game was over, figured I'd see how it ended. We're currently still scoreless in the 10th.

Hawaii had a bases-loaded, 1 out opportunity in the 8th with a new pitcher brought in. Kid calmly fielded a hard comebacker and started a 1-2-3 double play to get out of it.

jmcc5400 · Aug 17, 2018

Yep. Been accidentally riveted to the last two games

Bigpupp · Aug 17, 2018

Bigpupp · Aug 17, 2018

This game got me thinking though: now that there is a pitch count in little league, what would happen if a team runs out of pitchers? Do they forfeit?

DeJesus Built My Hotrod · Aug 18, 2018

Bigpupp, I tried to look it up because LL has rules for just about everything (the Green Book is the bible and is dense with rules that have been amended and updated just about every year) but I couldn't find anything.

That said, most of these teams carry 12 or 13 players and roughly half of those guys would have been their team's best pitchers as well as position players - and most of the balance would have pitched at least some during their regular season. So at 85 pitches a player, they would have to burn through quite a few arms before they would run out. The catcher cannot pitch if they catch four innings or more per game and a pitcher cannot catch if they throw more than 40 pitches so the managers need to make sure they don't run into problems there (I would argue that a catcher that can block in LL is, perhaps, the most important fielder on the diamond at any given time).

You also have to factor in that were a game to go deep into extras and late into the evening, there is a curfew which would render the game suspended.

The biggest problem from a really extended game that burns a lot of arms is that the winner would be at a material disadvantage going forward in terms of available arms. The reality is that most of these teams have two or three dominant arms and then enough depth behind them because they wouldn't have made it this far otherwise. I know the announcers allude to this on occasion but these teams have been playing since late June - its a grind to get all the way here and its really difficult to do without good pitching depth.

canderson · Aug 18, 2018

Sorry NE guys, Post Oak wins 3-1.

BigMike · Aug 18, 2018

Bigpupp said:
This game got me thinking though: now that there is a pitch count in little league, what would happen if a team runs out of pitchers? Do they forfeit?

To follow up on what Dejesus said.

In order tot have reached this level a team would need at least 3 pitchers, and probably closer to 5 who can pitch competitively at the level. Now, with the exception of the very top few teams usually there is a gap between #1 and the rest, and 2-3 might be reasonable equal. 4-5 might a step down, but have had to log a lot of innings.

But as stated probably 8 of the 12 on most teams have pitched a good pit in their little league career, their might be a small group who never did.

So you do see teams run out of LL tournament quality pitchers from time to time, and when that happens generally the game ends pretty quickly on the field as the pitcher will either start walking people and or get hit very hard and mercy rule (or end of game) approaches

DeJesus Built My Hotrod · Aug 18, 2018

I know Macklemore is widely disliked but that Dicks commercial is really well done.

Bigpupp · Aug 18, 2018

I agree that it's doubtful we ever see a team actually run out of pitchers, but I became curious after a quick search didn't turn up any rules in the event it did happen.

BigMike · Aug 19, 2018

Bigpupp said:
I agree that it's doubtful we ever see a team actually run out of pitchers, but I became curious after a quick search didn't turn up any rules in the event it did happen.

I don't think there are any rules, because it is almost unthinkable. Say you have 8 kids who have been consistent pitchers during their LL career, and use up all 8. The coach would the but in pitcher #9 even if he has never pitched in his life, and that pitcher would be left in for 85 potential pitches, then #10 and he could throw 85. And every time you bring in a less experienced pitcher, the likelyhood that the game ends in that inning icreases

DeJesus Built My Hotrod · Aug 19, 2018

Michigan is about to lose to an extremely impressive Hawaii team but this kid Jaren Purify continues to be a beast in the field and at the plate. Hopefully he sticks with baseball (hopefully all these kids do).

One thing though - down 8-1 with nobody out in the top of the sixth and Purify on first, the Michigan coach has one of his subs sac bunt. WTF? Bunts are way overused at all levels of baseball but a LL manager has to let this kid, who presumably doesn't get many ABs to begin with, swing the damn bat. Youth coaches who call for bunts when they really aren't appropriate drive me up the wall. Let the kids swing the stick, coach!

edit: and now Michigan is mounting a rally of sorts but burned an out on that stupid bunt.

tonyarmasjr · Aug 20, 2018

DeJesus Built My Hotrod said:
Michigan is about to lose to an extremely impressive Hawaii team but this kid Jaren Purify continues to be a beast in the field and at the plate. Hopefully he sticks with baseball (hopefully all these kids do).

One thing though - down 8-1 with nobody out in the top of the sixth and Purify on first, the Michigan coach has one of his subs sac bunt. WTF? Bunts are way overused at all levels of baseball but a LL manager has to let this kid, who presumably doesn't get many ABs to begin with, swing the damn bat. Youth coaches who call for bunts when they really aren't appropriate drive me up the wall. Let the kids swing the stick, coach!

edit: and now Michigan is mounting a rally of sorts but burned an out on that stupid bunt.

He made several really good plays in the two games of theirs I watched. His start of a 5-4-3 against Idaho was on par with a really good high school 3B, and it was more impressive to me than the plays he's made diving toward the line. I'm glad they won today just because I've enjoyed watching him at third and it gets to continue.

DeJesus Built My Hotrod · Aug 20, 2018

Texas had a 4-0 lead versus Georgia but LL gonna LL. 5-5 now going into the bottom of the seventh!

canderson · Aug 21, 2018

DeJesus Built My Hotrod said:
Texas had a 4-0 lead versus Georgia but LL gonna LL. 5-5 now going into the bottom of the seventh!

Georgia walked it off with a sac fly. My brother is pissed, but hey it's a great fun tourney.

montoursvillefan · Aug 21, 2018

All games cancelled today, rain. Gonna try to squeeze in 4 tomorrow, 2 elimination games and 2 undefeated games. 2 at 3PM and 2 at 7:30PM. Chance for showers tomorrow also. Busy...

DeJesus Built My Hotrod · Aug 21, 2018

montoursvillefan said:
All games cancelled today, rain. Gonna try to squeeze in 4 tomorrow, 2 elimination games and 2 undefeated games. 2 at 3PM and 2 at 7:30PM. Chance for showers tomorrow also. Busy...

Thank you for this. I was trying to watch both the 7:30pm ET and the Sox game at the same time. Now I am now just down to the pros.

How do those fields drain? There is nothing worse than a ballfield that retains water. I also suspect the people who maintain those grounds are really good at getting the fields to dry off.

montoursvillefan · Aug 22, 2018

DeJesus Built My Hotrod said:
Thank you for this. I was trying to watch both the 7:30pm ET and the Sox game at the same time. Now I am now just down to the pros.

How do those fields drain? There is nothing worse than a ballfield that retains water. I also suspect the people who maintain those grounds are really good at getting the fields to dry off.

The head groundskeeper explains:

http://www.sungazette.com/news/top-news/2018/08/series-complex-prepared-for-the-spotty-weather/

montoursvillefan · Aug 22, 2018

Don't be surprised with a delay, it is pouring here.

montoursvillefan · Aug 22, 2018

Some groundscrew tv coverage:

https://wnep.com/2018/08/22/grounds-crew-keeping-little-league-fields-ready-to-play/

DeJesus Built My Hotrod · Aug 22, 2018

montoursvillefan said:
Some groundscrew tv coverage:

https://wnep.com/2018/08/22/grounds-crew-keeping-little-league-fields-ready-to-play/

Thank you - its amazing. These guys mostly unpaid volunteers which is the case for most other adults associated with LL.

In other news, Hawaii flat out destroyed Staten Island in a mercy rule game.

mauidano · Aug 23, 2018

Watching Staten Island and Georgia play. These kids on Staten Island can NOT catch a simple fly ball. Incredibly embarrassing! Three drops in one inning.

moondog80 · Aug 23, 2018

mauidano said:
Watching Staten Island and Georgia play. These kids on Staten Island can NOT catch a simple fly ball. Incredibly embarrassing! Three drops in one inning.

That LF had a tough time out there but there’s no way way a kid playing SS at this level isn’t a really good little leaguer. He just made a bad play.

DeJesus Built My Hotrod · Aug 23, 2018

mauidano said:
Watching Staten Island and Georgia play. These kids on Staten Island can NOT catch a simple fly ball. Incredibly embarrassing! Three drops in one inning.

You are used to watching that Hawaii team who is clearly one of the most polished squads in the tourney. This is what Little League looks like - a bunch of 12 and 13 year old kids, most of whom are dealing with adversity on a big stage for the first time.

Stay safe & dry btw

DeJesus Built My Hotrod · Aug 23, 2018

moondog80 said:
That LF had a tough time out there but there’s no way way a kid playing SS at this level isn’t a really good little leaguer. He just made a bad play.

True. I haven't watched Staten Island play much but I would bet their LF is in the line-up for his bat and their manager was hoping to hide him out there. Meanwhile, the wind is swirling pretty good as the GA LF also had a tough go with a simple flyball.

DeJesus Built My Hotrod · Aug 23, 2018

Wow. LL Umpiring just cost Staten Island a much needed baserunner. First base ump made an out call when the runner was clearly safe on a slow roller to 3B. SI was out of challenges so the umps met to discuss. You could see the base ump who made the bad call arguing forcefully that he was right. He was not.

And wouldnt you know it, SI hits a ball over the GA RF's head that would have scored the runner and narrowed the gap to 7-4 which is manageable in LL.

DeJesus Built My Hotrod · Aug 23, 2018

In the US championship game, it will be a rematch of Georgia vs. Hawaii on Saturday at 3:30pm

DeJesus Built My Hotrod · Aug 25, 2018

Honolulu, Hawaii goes to championship vs South Korea after defeating Peachtree, Georgia 3-0. The Hawaii pitcher had 15 Ks in a six inning game. Flat out dominant.

mauidano · Aug 26, 2018

Let’s go Hawaii!! Imua!

Deathofthebambino · Aug 26, 2018

Anyone else tuned in? Hawaii up 3-0, and they are hitting in the bottom of the 4th. Hawaii looks fantastic in every facet. Two great defensive plays in the top of the inning. Hawaii's pitching staff has something like a 0.36 ERA for the tournament.

DeJesus Built My Hotrod · Aug 26, 2018

Deathofthebambino said:
Anyone else tuned in? Hawaii up 3-0, and they are hitting in the bottom of the 4th. Hawaii looks fantastic in every facet. Two great defensive plays in the top of the inning. Hawaii's pitching staff has something like a 0.36 ERA for the tournament.

And they win it all and finish with a 0.35 ERA for the entire tourney as DOTB notes. They ran the table all All-Star/LLWS season too. Pretty amazing run. I hope these kids stick with baseball.

Deathofthebambino · Aug 26, 2018

DeJesus Built My Hotrod said:
And they win it all and finish with a 0.35 ERA for the entire tourney as DOTB notes. They ran the table all All-Star/LLWS season too. Pretty amazing run. I hope these kids stick with baseball.

Yep, in their 5 LLWS games, they gave up a total of 2 earned runs. Really impressive stuff. Seems like a good group of kids, and the Coach seems like a fantastic guy.

DeJesus Built My Hotrod · Aug 26, 2018

Once again I will say that, while it has its flaws, Little League is one of the purest sporting organizations out there. The organizers for each local league across the country/world to those who work the district, sectional and regional tourneys - largely volunteers as noted by Hawaii coach Oda - spend a lot of energy making sure this is one of the best and fairest activities in youth sports. To be sure, the leagues are all beset, to some degree or another by politics, bad actors and less than honorable behavior. However they get it mostly right and it culminates in this tourney that should get more eyeballs from kids and adults alike.

Again, I hope all of the kids keep playing baseball and that this generates more interest to play for younger kids. IMHO, baseball is the most rewarding sport because of how hard it is and its also one of the best at providing young people with teachable moments for life.

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