There's bad clock management, there's terrible clock management, there's historically bad clock management ... and then there's what we saw today.
2015 Boston College Football: Daz'd and Confused
- Thread starter The Talented Allen Ripley
- Start date
Golden's nephew was a student of mine and I think he told me Golden got unlucky as he had a couple of good options, chose Miami and then they got nailed with violations.berniecarbo1 said:
Bill O'brien takes the BC job? Why would he ever do that? It would be a quantum leap backwards.
Yesterday was the worst sporting event I have ever been to EVER dating back to 1960 for Sox and 1962 for BC football
More to come later and I'm still fucking pissed
More to come later and I'm still fucking pissed
What's going to be important coming out of this is the whisper campaign from the AD's office. Bates owns Daz and the discontent is starting. The Heights absolutely ripped Daz today, which isn't a huge deal by itself, but I think two shutouts at home and embarrassing end of half/game management means Bates is going to have to deal with unhappy people. I know with certainty Bates has already been under fire from people who matter (not Leahy but others who matter) for the weak scheduling and now his head coach is vomiting on himself.
There is absolutely no chance of anything bad happening to Daz until the end of next season, but this should start the whispering.
There is absolutely no chance of anything bad happening to Daz until the end of next season, but this should start the whispering.
Spoke to a prominent booster yesterday but there is a cursory interest in Bates for Michigan's AD opening. He doesn't want him and thinks it's stupid to limit the search to Michigan Men but it came up out of the blue.
He is getting about $2M a year through 2020. I think he's sticking around at least through 2018. Time to change the title of this thread to "2015 BC Football.....Dazed and Confused".
I can't believe the way "the Dude" fails to have situational game plans on offense. It is amazing. The fact he can't get a reliable kicker is jaw dropping. How many have they gone through in the past 2 years...5?
I'm beginning to think both Bates and Daz are in over their heads. This is Dazzler's team and the fact that he is a marginal recruiter and is having trouble coaching up his team (bear in mind he owns the offense, he gave the D to Donnie Brown) is exposing him for what, regrettably, he is and that is a career assistant. First we had Spaz who was an assistant and now we have Daz. I was wrong fellas. I really thought he would be a great fit but yesterday showed me just how inept he is. I'm placing over under at 6 for the balance of the season. That's not wins but touchdowns scored by the offense. If I'm in Vegas, I take the under.
The high rollers shouldn't be pissed about the weak scheduling. They should be pissed about the no scheduling. Other than ND, who is given to him by the ACC they have 1 P5 opponent scheduled over the next 8 years. It's looking real bad and between Daz and his inability to coach in game, Bates failure to amp up the schedule and trying to move past Spaz, the program is quickly being relegated to what the basketball program is....a schedule filler. Pathetic.
I can't believe the way "the Dude" fails to have situational game plans on offense. It is amazing. The fact he can't get a reliable kicker is jaw dropping. How many have they gone through in the past 2 years...5?
I'm beginning to think both Bates and Daz are in over their heads. This is Dazzler's team and the fact that he is a marginal recruiter and is having trouble coaching up his team (bear in mind he owns the offense, he gave the D to Donnie Brown) is exposing him for what, regrettably, he is and that is a career assistant. First we had Spaz who was an assistant and now we have Daz. I was wrong fellas. I really thought he would be a great fit but yesterday showed me just how inept he is. I'm placing over under at 6 for the balance of the season. That's not wins but touchdowns scored by the offense. If I'm in Vegas, I take the under.
The high rollers shouldn't be pissed about the weak scheduling. They should be pissed about the no scheduling. Other than ND, who is given to him by the ACC they have 1 P5 opponent scheduled over the next 8 years. It's looking real bad and between Daz and his inability to coach in game, Bates failure to amp up the schedule and trying to move past Spaz, the program is quickly being relegated to what the basketball program is....a schedule filler. Pathetic.
Just to clarify, the basketball team is not beyond hope. They are currently doing a great job on the recruiting front.
Daz has been at his worst this year but I think the recruiting coming into this year has been good.
I do find it interesting that no one will mention that the starting RB, QB and TE are all out from an already thin team depth wise.
Yesterday's ending was inexcusable but this is not yet Spaz.
Daz has been at his worst this year but I think the recruiting coming into this year has been good.
I do find it interesting that no one will mention that the starting RB, QB and TE are all out from an already thin team depth wise.
Yesterday's ending was inexcusable but this is not yet Spaz.
Dave
The guy can't coach. He might be able to positional coach linemen, maybe, and he can talk a good game but his play calling is horrible, his 2 deep is weak and yes he has some injuries but that is part of football and the fact he was totally incapable of adjusting his offense to suit his players after Wade was hurt is telling on him as an offensive coach, which is what he touts isn't it.
He came on board in 2013 and brought in Donnie Brown. He gave him the D. In the same period of time, Brown has molded the D into a Top 5 national unit. Dazzler?? His unit literally is a Bottom 5 national unit. Some people have said they should fire Daz and elevate Brown. Not sure that would save this season but I can assure you the entire team would play aggressive football.
As for the hoops reference, I must respectfully stand by my statement. It may change but as we sit here today and dissect this athletic program, it is schedule filler. Very disappointed in the entire department top to bottom, Jerry York excepted.
The guy can't coach. He might be able to positional coach linemen, maybe, and he can talk a good game but his play calling is horrible, his 2 deep is weak and yes he has some injuries but that is part of football and the fact he was totally incapable of adjusting his offense to suit his players after Wade was hurt is telling on him as an offensive coach, which is what he touts isn't it.
He came on board in 2013 and brought in Donnie Brown. He gave him the D. In the same period of time, Brown has molded the D into a Top 5 national unit. Dazzler?? His unit literally is a Bottom 5 national unit. Some people have said they should fire Daz and elevate Brown. Not sure that would save this season but I can assure you the entire team would play aggressive football.
As for the hoops reference, I must respectfully stand by my statement. It may change but as we sit here today and dissect this athletic program, it is schedule filler. Very disappointed in the entire department top to bottom, Jerry York excepted.
Dave - you're always much more rational about the program than I am.
On hoops, JC has whiffed on every local kid in the last two years, many of whom were gettable. The story attached to him is he can't close, and the results suggest it so far. He does seem like a very good game coach, to try to be fair. We'll know more in a couple years. Hopefully the kids hehas brought in can play like Skinners out of town kids.
On Daz, I think you have a guy whose view of offense is at best stunted. They have relied on one trick pony offenses for the last two seasons, don't coach a two minute drill, as of yet have not recruited a legitimate receiver or even show a signal that they care about throwing the ball. They can't recruit or coach special teams.
Again, I don't want to go back to this, but going back to 1991, when BC joined the Big East, only the first year of Tom Coughlin (overcoming the end of the Bicknell era), the last two years of an incompetent Dan Henning and the first two of the Hen (overcoming the incompetentence of Henning), BC has been an 8-9 win team every single year for 25 years outside of hiring fools in Henning and Spaziani. Daziani has proven nothing. The evidence shows him to be overwhelmed by anything involving game management. He deserves every ounce of the anger he is causing and the fact he won't take full responsibility for this mess, instead blaming the QB, the youth...just read yesterday's press transcript. Complete Baghdad Bob routine.
On hoops, JC has whiffed on every local kid in the last two years, many of whom were gettable. The story attached to him is he can't close, and the results suggest it so far. He does seem like a very good game coach, to try to be fair. We'll know more in a couple years. Hopefully the kids hehas brought in can play like Skinners out of town kids.
On Daz, I think you have a guy whose view of offense is at best stunted. They have relied on one trick pony offenses for the last two seasons, don't coach a two minute drill, as of yet have not recruited a legitimate receiver or even show a signal that they care about throwing the ball. They can't recruit or coach special teams.
Again, I don't want to go back to this, but going back to 1991, when BC joined the Big East, only the first year of Tom Coughlin (overcoming the end of the Bicknell era), the last two years of an incompetent Dan Henning and the first two of the Hen (overcoming the incompetentence of Henning), BC has been an 8-9 win team every single year for 25 years outside of hiring fools in Henning and Spaziani. Daziani has proven nothing. The evidence shows him to be overwhelmed by anything involving game management. He deserves every ounce of the anger he is causing and the fact he won't take full responsibility for this mess, instead blaming the QB, the youth...just read yesterday's press transcript. Complete Baghdad Bob routine.
We can't take the bball discussion to that forum but I will tell you right now good things are happening right now.
As far as fball, Spaz did so much damage to the program that I don't think we really know how bad it was. And I think the fact that temple is performing well with the class that Daz recruited bodes well.
I maintain that a glorified gym coach can do well if he surrounds himself with the right guys. Brown ... Check. Day was growing into the role and he whiffed on Fitch.
As far as fball, Spaz did so much damage to the program that I don't think we really know how bad it was. And I think the fact that temple is performing well with the class that Daz recruited bodes well.
I maintain that a glorified gym coach can do well if he surrounds himself with the right guys. Brown ... Check. Day was growing into the role and he whiffed on Fitch.
Of course not. If and when BOB gets fired, he'll be weighing offers from the likes of Texas, Miami, or Nebraska.gryoung said:
http://ajerseyguy.com/?p=12811
boy, can't wait to play you guys again. that 3-0 thrashing by Wake will look like Baylor vs TCU compared to UConn vs BC
boy, can't wait to play you guys again. that 3-0 thrashing by Wake will look like Baylor vs TCU compared to UConn vs BC
The non Confetence schedule is pathetic. UMass, Buffalo and Wagner?? At least UConn is an AAC opponent. So they give up a Confetence home game and play an FCS and basically 2 MAC teams and UConn. These two guys are destroying an already damaged product. UgghClears Cleaver said:
How come we can't get schedules like this......
http://www.fbschedules.com/ncaa-16/2016-umass-minutemen-football-schedule.php
http://www.fbschedules.com/ncaa-16/2016-umass-minutemen-football-schedule.php
UConn is working on the rivalry trophy as we speak. BC may or may not be told about this, however.
The 84-90 or Fight Bowl?
The 84-90 or Fight Bowl?
berniecarbo1 said:
You know the answer to this. BC isn't going to play games without a return trip and it is difficult to get teams to commit to play a BC team that doesn't have the cache but is still a risk to knock them off given the year and circumstances. Bates has a huge challenge given the ACC vote to remove the 9th conference game (and NDs move to an ACC schedule) but that doesn't absolve him. It's a big time job and his role is to be creative and get things done. I give him a pass on this year and last given the ACC pulling the rug but going forward something has to be done.
Dave Stapleton said:
Which other programs face this obstacle, and how do they deal with it? Or is BC the only cachet-challenged team capable of winning a game under certain circumstances?
As to BC refusing to play games without a return trip, if that's the case, your administration is doing it wrong. As you note, BC has little cache[t]; certainly not enough to dictate terms to major programs. And when it's putting fewer than 30,000 asses in Alumni on a regular basis, it should not be objecting to collecting a big payday for an appearance at a place that will sell around 100,000 tickets. Other similarly situated teams like Oregon State understand their position, and choose to go on the road to power conferences for one-and-dones rather than loading up on FCS opponents. Such a strategy has a better EV both in the short-term financially, and exposure-wise longterm.
Honestly, I have no issue with them playing road games in large P5 stadiums. The atmosphere is pretty impressive, one can tailgate, and if you are talking about an area of the country that has D1 level recruits and a reasonable alumni base, it helps not only the program but alumni relations and recruiting students in general. As a point of reference, the third largest alumni pool (outside of Mass and the Tri State area)is California. Further, according to the admissions office, California is the fifth largest state of current students at BC. Yes I am bias to Cali as I live out here but if you have 12,000 alumni here, your 5th largest pool of students is here, and you actually have recruited Cali players (Chase Rettig for example) and this is an area that produces a number of D1 caliber players, why would you not, when Stanford has an open date and you have an open date in the same year, get them on the schedule for a road game? That was the case for 2016 until recently. When they played USC, they sold 6,000 tickets to that game. The alumni base is larger in the Bay area than around LA and a trip to San Francisco, Napa, Pebble Beach in late September is a great trip for the Boston/NY area alums.
You can play Stanford, UCLA, USC and Cal out here every couple of years until you build up that cachet as mentioned above and once you start winning 9-10 games a year and begin beating these teams on a more consistent basis, then you start scheduling home/home games. The program needs a reboot. There was a time when BC was Boise before Boise was Boise. That is they would play anyone, anywhere at any time to build up the program. Time to start doing this again.
You can play Stanford, UCLA, USC and Cal out here every couple of years until you build up that cachet as mentioned above and once you start winning 9-10 games a year and begin beating these teams on a more consistent basis, then you start scheduling home/home games. The program needs a reboot. There was a time when BC was Boise before Boise was Boise. That is they would play anyone, anywhere at any time to build up the program. Time to start doing this again.
Bernie. Fair points. It would be great to hear from Bates and understand his strategy for scheduling. I was at the Advocare Bowl a couple of years ago and listened to Bates at an event the night before. He was talking with a small group and was extremely frustrated at the scheduling "game". Pointed out that he had a few handshake agreements with a few opponents and it was routine for them to simply back out. It seems like he is still having trouble adapting to the process.
I don't know that BC is demanding return trips. I am making the assumption bases on the results.BigSoxFan said:
Not for nothin' but it was announced today (or maybe yesterday) that Stanford signed a 2 game series with Kansas State. Next year at Stanford and 2021 at Kansas State. You mean to tell me that Stanford had an open date next year and was looking for P5 opponent and BC had an open date next year and wouldn't sign a deal with them?? Bates is the WORST scheduler out there...even worse than the godfather and I can't believe I am saying this. This guy needs to go. He is not a fit at BC. Maybe he will be great someplace else, but not at BC.
BC football is unusual in that it makes a ton of money on parking -- probably more than they make on tickets. Most of that parking money comes from a relatively small group of alumni (a few thousand, perhaps), each of whom makes a sizable donation (not a per-game fee) for the privilege. Giving up a home game hurts the value proposition for those donors -- so you're putting a lot more at risk than the modest amount you make selling tickets for a game against an FCS opponent like Maine. And because parking money isn't split with the visiting team, coming to The Heights is an unattractive financial proposition for most other P5 schools.
So adding it all up, BC's scheduling strategy makes sense. And even if they wanted to schedule more quality opponents, they would have a hard time persuading anyone to travel to Boston.
So adding it all up, BC's scheduling strategy makes sense. And even if they wanted to schedule more quality opponents, they would have a hard time persuading anyone to travel to Boston.
The home-and-home with K-State was a much better deal for Stanford -- more money, better quality opponent.berniecarbo1 said:
LOL!!!! Thank you Gene!BigSoxFan said:
I'm beginning to think that Bates can't close deals. If it is gate receipts then you make up the difference with a guarantee to bring in P5 opponents. You agree to 3-1 deals with large P5 opponents. You schedule games with AAC and MWC opponents who aren't as difficult to get on your schedule yet still are viable opponents.
Right now they have their 8 ACC games, the New England FBS game, the "good for the CAA or New England" game and Notre Dame every 3 years. Very frustrating. There has to be a solution to this.
maufman said:
This is a mischaracterization of a few things. BC's parking system is not substantially different than many other schools', where there's a level of annual giving required to be eligible for parking. At BC it's to the Flynn Fund, at Kansas State it's the Ahearn Fund, and at Michigan it's based on priority points. BC's "free" parking ranges from a $150 annual donation for the farthest lot, to $10,000 annual gift for Edmonds. At Michigan, it ranges from a minimum of 500 points (which equates to $50,000 lifetime donations to the Athletic Department of $500k to the University) for the worst lot (plus $200/game) to $25,000 in annual giving (plus $60/game) for the best lot.
At each of these schools, yes the more home games there are, the more "value" the donors get from their gifts, but it's a stretch to maintain that the parking is what's driving the giving bus or that major donors are likely to dial down their gifts because BC plays Georgia on the road rather than Howard at home. Most of these schools (BC included) also condition access to seats on the same annual gift that controls parking. So, if you give your $2,500 to be able to get your season tickets in one of the midfield sections, it automatically entitles you to free parking in the Beacon Street Garage.
Parking is great, but it's a perk, and it's about the weakest justification for bad scheduling I've ever heard.
berniecarbo1 said:
I don't know that they can't close deals. I mean come on he closed the UConn deal.
I think it is more than Bates. I think it is all of football ops and they want to schedule the way they run an offense. Sadly I think Bates, Daz, and maybe others are perfectly fine having UConn as the Prime OOC opponent. Heck there is a good chance that game will actually make ESPN, or at least one of the ESPN broadcast channels.
If they can go 4-0 in OOC play then all you have to do is steal 2 ACC games, and your program gets to go to Detroit and everyone can pat themselves on the back and call it a successful year
BigMike said:
I think this is probably the closest thing to correct. I think the powers that be are just fine taking their four OOC wins against the Sisters of the Poor and sneaking into the Humiliation Bowl in front of 5,000 people against Central Michigan with a 7-5 record. What good would it be for the program to schedule the Stanford's of the world, lose half their OOC games and finish with 3-4 wins? Does more exposure getting beat down by a good team for one Saturday do more in the long run than going out and beating some no name school on ESPN14 and making a bowl game nobody cares about, but guarantees an extra paycheck?
I really don't know the answer, but I know this. BC will get more quality opponents on their schedule when BC gets back to being a quality opponent themselves.
Sounds like they are settling. That's not the BC I knew. This athletic department sucks. These guys have ruined it if this is actually the mind set. For Chrissakes they are not a national program so they should act like they used to. Play Michigan at Michigan. Play USC in LA. Play LSU in Baton Rouge. Play your league games, schedule 6 home games and play anyone. Anywhere, anytime. Just like they did back in the 70s, 80s and 90s. Get a nice payday and maybe, just maybe, you knock off one these giants once in a while. Get some balls athletic department!!!
Bill Flynn is rolling over in his grave with this scheduling. Back in the early 70s the total schedule was shit like the upcoming OOC schedule. Buffalo, William & Mary, VMI, 'Nova, Mass Aggie and the fucking Cross. Army and Navy were big games. Bill Flynn decided to like was said 'be Bosie before they were Bosie' and played anyone/anytime/anywhere. That scheduling was years in advance, oh they'd be a ND in 75 and of course the home/home with Texas in 76 and 77 (one of the greatest games I've ever been at, unlike last week). And that scheduling along with the arrival and success of 22 put BC football back on the map.
Now the '16 schedule is Yukon, Mass Aggie, Buffalo and Wagner? What the fuck is Wagner? I mean seriously thank god Hofstra and Northeastern dropped football.
What a fucking joke
Now the '16 schedule is Yukon, Mass Aggie, Buffalo and Wagner? What the fuck is Wagner? I mean seriously thank god Hofstra and Northeastern dropped football.
What a fucking joke
In 2017 the OOC consists of UMass, N Illinois (road game), SBCC and Richmond. But for the ACC contract with the Irish they would be playing URI. It just keeps getting better. No more schedule talk for a while.doldmoose34 said:
Holy shit after a pic by Symmons, smith hit Bobby Woford on the one and he brought the ball into what they call the 'end zone'
What is this end zone ? What is this 'touchdown' they are talking about
What is this end zone ? What is this 'touchdown' they are talking about
Agree. Glad they are aggressive but the special teams just cost them 7 points. Every game they either leave points on the field or give them away. They kill games. Real real problem.
I mean, the guy acts like he has ADD - can't decide if he's a conservative ball control guy, wants to throw, wants to run spread, I have to imagine working for him must be very frustrating. There's no team identity at all. He can blame everything he wants on youth but his inability to manage game situations or put a game plan together ain't the kids.
But if he wants to play really aggressively I have no issue there. Losing 42-10 is the same as 21-10
But if he wants to play really aggressively I have no issue there. Losing 42-10 is the same as 21-10
Clemson up by 10, have figured out the defense. Game is over midway through the first half. No way this O is going to score 11 more points or that the D is suddenly going shut down Clemson's O.
More clock management failure. Only BC could have 1st & Goal with 21 seconds to go, 1 timeout and only manage to run 1 play. That is incompetence.