2015 Bengals: Nobody's Burfict

Rudy's Curve

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It's time to talk about everyone's favorite perennial one-and-done team: your Cincinnati Bengals. With the head coach and a ton of important players, including the quarterback, entering contract years (or essentially contract years), this may be the last chance for this group to make a run.
 
Although he shit the bed again in the playoffs in 2013, there were high hopes for Andy Dalton and the passing game coming into last season as they moved to the more balanced ways of new OC Hue Jackson after pass-happy Jay Gruden left. Unfortunately, those hopes were predicated on Marvin Jones (10 TD in 2013 in just 555 snaps while averaging 14 yards per catch) and Tyler Eifert (2013 first-rounder at a position that generally has a large second-year growth) taking the next step forward. In true Bengal fashion, Jones hurt his foot in offseason workouts and never played while Eifert suffered a gruesome elbow injury in Week 1 (after catching three balls for 37 yards in the first quarter) and was supposed to be back for the home stretch but never fully recovered. In addition, A.J. Green missed four games (including the playoffs) and large parts of two others. That forced the team to overextend Mohamed Sanu (and for me to put the SoSH FC curse on him) and rely on street bodies like Greg Little. An upper-tier quarterback would still be able to make chicken salad out of chicken shit, but Dalton is certainly not that guy and the result was the lowest touchdown total and highest interception rate of his career. Given that the team can easily get out of his contract after this season, I would have to imagine they mercifully will if he doesn't show serious progress. Jones and Eifert playing full seasons would certainly help that.
 
Jackson's impact was certainly felt in the running game as the team was fifth in attempts and tied for 10th in yards per carry. The latter certainly would've been higher if they just gave Jeremy Hill the bulk of the carries from day one instead of waiting until Week 15. Hill established himself as a true lead back, averaging over five yards a carry and had four games of 147+ rushing yards. Gio Bernard didn't hold up to the rigors of being a lead back as he's on the smaller side and broke down in the middle of the year, but is still an excellent change-of-pace back. He needs to be used more in the passing game though, as he had nearly the same amount of carries as his rookie season but saw 12 fewer targets and caught 13 fewer balls. They also found a gem of an undrafted FA in H-Back Ryan Hewitt who paved the way for many of Hill's runs. They will also likely draft a blocking TE as they are expected to finally move on from Jermaine Gresham.
 
The offensive line continued to be a strength, led by criminally underrated LT Andrew Whitworth who might be the best pass protector in the league. The team should definitely prioritize resigning LG Clint Boling, who is a very good puller and athletic in space. RG Kevin Zeitler finally played like a first-round guard last year but missed time with injuries for the second straight year. On the downside, usual stalwart RT Andre Smith struggled and was lost for the season with a torn triceps midway through. Rookie C Russell Bodine was heavily overmatched at times, so hopefully the year of experience will be pivotal since there wasn't much optimism in his play. Whitworth and Smith are both free agents after this year and the Bengals have been linked to a tackle in the first round, as the team has historically prioritized the position.
 
The single biggest disappointment of this past season was the decline of the pass rush. Sacks aren't everything, but going from 43 in 2013 to a league-worst 20 last year is, uh, not good. Wallace Gilberry was an excellent rotational player but was exposed as a starter, and he had to play that many snaps because 2013 second-rounder Margus Hunt failed to step up. Robert Geathers was finally released (many years too late) as he offered less than nothing as the nickel rusher. They're definitely going to be in the market for defensive ends - Trent Cole makes a ton of sense as he is from the area, went to college there and has had a lot of success in a 4-3. I also wouldn't be surprised to see them in the market for Greg Hardy if he's going to come at a discount as they have a glaring need for a RE. They're also going to need Geno Atkins to return to his pre-ACL form, as he only managed three sacks last year and wasn't the continually disruptive presence he had been. Hopefully he'll be a lot better in his second year of recovery as that's one of main things the success of the defense will depend on.
 
The linebacking unit is also very much in the air. Vontaze Burfict missed two games and parts of others with concussions and then was lost for the season halfway through with a knee injury that ended up turning into microfracture surgery. The hope is for him to be ready for training camp, but who knows with a procedure of that severity or if he'll regain his previous form. Rey Maualuga probably had his best season in the middle as he was a huge key in the turnaround of the run defense the second half of the year (they allowed 3.57 YPC with him on the field and 4.25 without). That said, he's a pretty one-dimensional player and they can certainly upgrade there. There were high hopes for Emmanuel Lamur as he's very rangy for his size, but he struggled taking on blocks and was out of place on the strong side. Ideally, they'd get someone that offers some pass rush ability on the strong side, move Lamur to the weak side and kick Burfict inside.
 
The secondary was clearly the most valuable unit on the team last year, as they posted stingy pass defense numbers (6.6 YPA, 18/20 TD/INT) despite no help from the pass rush. Top corner Leon Hall struggled though in his comeback from his second Achilles tear as he wasn't the elite player he'd been in the past. This is a pivotal year for him as he's going on 31 and entering a contract year. The ageless Terence Newman continued his solid play on the other site, but they'll probably move on with former first-rounders Dre Kirkpatrick (who came on at the end of the year) and Darqueze Dennard waiting. After a rough start to the year, Adam Jones continued to provide solid play in nickel packages and should be counted on for a similar role. The safety play was excellent, as George Iloka was outstanding in coverage and Reggie Nelson continued to be very good in run support. Both are free agents after this year though, and an extension for Iloka should be a priority.
 
The Bengals continued to have quality, if unspectacular, special teams. They were third in FOs net punting, as Kevin Huber had a strong year with assists from gunners Kirkpatrick and Dennard. Mike Nugent rebounded after a horrible first six weeks but that's a spot where they could upgrade. Jones provided a huge boost to the return games as he was fifth in punt return average and second returning kicks. The team appears finally ready to move on from Brandon Tate as they hosted Jacoby Jones for a visit and will sign or draft someone of that ilk.
 
As aforementioned, Lewis is in the final year of his contract. Even if they finally decide to move on after this season, they should at least give him a token one-year extension to avoid lame duck status, as the last time that happened was in 2010 which produced a disastrous result. The schedule won't be easy as they have to play both West divisions (at least they get Seattle at home although they have to travel to Denver) with strength of schedule games against Buffalo and Houston.
 

Rudy's Curve

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It looks like Maualuga is coming back per club website writer Geoff Hobson. I don't hate the move as he's a solid-two down player and they need bodies with the uncertainty around Burfict, but I think they could have upgraded and it likely means Lamur out of place on the strong side again.
 

Rudy's Curve

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Santa Clara, here we come!
 
In all seriousness, the Bengals did lock up their most important free agent in LG Clint Boling at a pretty reasonable 5/26. It seems like big money for a guard, but that's the way the market has gone with Iupati getting 5/40 and Franklin 5/35.5 (each about a year and a half older than Boling). They also signed AJ Hawk at a reasonable deal to be the starting SAM, moving Emmanuel Lamur back to his natural nickel LB spot as he's just not strong enough against the run. They still have a glaring hole at right end though and were never in on Trent Cole or Jabaal Sheard. Old friend Michael Johnson was released by Tampa Bay and would certainly be welcomed back, but his first visit is to Minnesota with old defensive coordinator Mike Zimmer. That would just leave Greg Hardy for legitimate starters available and it's unlikely they're going to find an impact starter from day one there through the draft.
 

Rudy's Curve

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Michael Johnson is in Mike Brown's box and Michael Johnson is coming back! Oh my goodness gracious! Of all the dramatic things I've ever seen, Michael Johnson standing in Mike Brown's box announcing he is back! Michael Johnson is a Cincinnati Bengal!
 
It didn't quite happen that way, but this is a huge coup as the Bengals had possibly the league's worst right end play last year from failing to replace Johnson. Wallace Gilberry was a very good rotational player but couldn't handle starter snaps while Margus Hunt failed to develop and Will Clarke redshirted. Assuming he's over the high ankle sprain that limited him last year, Johnson is a solid pass rusher and an excellent run defender who plays a ton of snaps, moving Gilberry back to a nickel rusher and taking the pressure off Hunt and Clarke to provide a big impact. They also won't have to reach for a rusher in the draft if they were going to. This should wrap it up for them in free agency, as the only box they haven't checked is a blocking TE which should come in the draft.
 

Rudy's Curve

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JohnnyK said:
What's funny is that they should also get a third-round comp pick for him leaving last year.
 
Unfortunately the Bengals already re-signed Eric Winston to be their swing tackle, or else they could have also brought back Anthony Collins while netting a pick from Tampa for him too. 
 

Rudy's Curve

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The Bengals continue bringing the band back together as they signed DT Pat Sims who played his first five years in Cincinnati before spending the last two in Oakland. He brings a sorely needed presence as a run-stuffer as his teams have allowed fewer YPC when he's been on the field every year, and sometimes by a significant margin. This also puts Devon Still on the outside of a roster spot as Domata Peko, Geno Atkins and Brandon Thompson are going to be the other three DTs.
 

Rudy's Curve

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The preseason starts tonight as they host the Giants and this is as optimistic as I've been in a long time. It's going to be a test to see if Dalton can still fuck up an otherwise very good team. The offense wasn't good last year, but Green was banged up all season, Marvin Jones (who is very good at football) played zero snaps and Tyler Eifert (who is likely to be very good at football) played one quarter. In addition, they didn't unleash Jeremy Hill until the second half of the season where he went on to be the best RB in football in that period. They scored 27 PPG in 2013 and Jones wasn't a full-time player until midway through the season while the Eifert and Hill roles were played by Gresham and BJGE. They probably have the best 10 guys around the quarterback in football and should light up the scoreboard even with Dalton at the helm.
 
Defensively, the pass rush dropped off sharply last year which was the biggest reason for the decline. They never replaced Michael Johnson as Wallace Gilberry was exposed as a situational player in a full-time role and Margus Hunt didn't take a step forward. Now Johnson is back and assuming he recovers fully from an MCL sprain that will keep him out through the preseason, he'll be a massive upgrade over the likely league-worst play they got at RE last year. In addition, Geno Atkins wasn't himself as he was tentative recovering from a torn ACL suffered halfway through 2013. Considering he was playing at a HOF-level prior to that and by all accounts so far in OTAs and camp that he's back, I'm rather optimistic that the pass rush and the defense will return to form. 
 
The health of Vontaze Burfict is the biggest question as he recovers from microfracture surgery. There's still hope he'll be on the field in Oakland Week 1, but it's probably more likely he'll be PUPd and return midseason. However, they're much better equipped to handle his absence this season with the addition of A.J. Hawk and drafting P.J. Dawson as opposed to last where at times they ran out a unit of Jayson DiManche (STer), Nico Johnson (street FA) and Marquis Flowers (rookie sixth-rounder). The secondary continues to be talented and deep as Dre Kirkpatrick (who showed his first-round ability down the stretch last year) moves into the starting spot vacated by Terence Newman.
 
If you like money, pound the over on 8.5 wins. This team is going to be really good.
 

soxfan121

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Rudy's Curve said:
The preseason starts tonight as they host the Giants and this is as optimistic as I've been in a long time.
 
If you like money, pound the over on 8.5 wins. This team is going to be really good.
 
I'd be interested in reading more about this. Perhaps in a longer article? ;-)
 

Rudy's Curve

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So far, so good. Dalton hasn't fucked up a very good team, Marvin Jones is still very good at football and Eifert is very good at football. The one downside with the offense is Hill hasn't gotten going yet (3.0 YPC), but Bernard (5.7) has picked up the slack. The next three weeks against the defenses of Kansas City, Seattle and Buffalo will be a tough test, but this offense looks pretty hard to stop. Defensively, Atkins is back to his pre-injury self and they've generally played well with the exception of a communication breakdown which led to a long TD against San Diego and poor tackling yesterday. The LB unit isn't great, especially in coverage, but that will likely be rectified as Burfict should be ready to go when he's eligible to come off PUP in Week 8 against Pittsburgh. Going back to the second half of 2012, they're 31-14-1 in their last 46 games and have the fourth-best record in that period (and since the start of 2013), only behind New England, Seattle and Denver.
 
The division is certainly theirs for the taking with Roethlisberger on the shelf and the Ravens out of it. With the Patriots very likely to get a bye and Denver also 3-0, they probably have to win two of the next three before the bye to have a good shot at one. The playoff failures will keep being brought up until they win one, but they've never been this good.
 
 
 

Rudy's Curve

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It's probably time to start taking them for real if you haven't already. This offense is just so multi-dimensional and Dalton has taken a huge step forward. If you want to sell out to stop Eifert like Baltimore did, then Green will go off for 200+. If you want to bracket Green like the Bills did yesterday, that Marvin Jones guy is pretty good. The OL continues to be excellent in protection shutting out the Bills DL and Hali/Houston a couple weeks ago. Hill still hasn't gotten going (although he showed his best burst of the season yesterday) but Bernard is a real weapon as a complementary back when he doesn't have to carry the load. Defensively, they've had multiple breakdowns in the secondary leading to wide open TDs which need to be fixed (especially with the Steelers on deck after the bye) but have been solid overall as the DL has been excellent with Atkins returning to form and Dunlap finally turning hurries into sacks.
 
The Steelers at Heinz are going to be a big test after the bye (and there's a one million percent chance Ben plays), but at least they're assured of leaving there still in first. Unfortunately, it seems like it's going to take at least 13 wins to get a bye, although they'll certainly have their say when they travel to Denver in December.
 

ethangl

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http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2015/11/17/andy-dalton-miffed-by-j-j-watts-comments/

“Our goal was to come out here and make the Red Rifle look like a Red Ryder BB Gun,” Watt said on ESPN.

“I’m disappointed in him,” Dalton said in his postgame press conference. “The integrity of this game — I have a lot of respect for him. He’s a really good player. There’s a lot of kids and a lot of people who look up to him. For him to make comments like that, he’s showing that’s acceptable to do that kind of stuff, to say that kind of stuff. It’s disappointing for one of the best players in this league to come out and say something like that. That’s all I’m going to say about that. I think J.J. is a good player, but for him to be one of the best in this league and to show that integrity, and to show that type of … it shows what he’s about, which is disappointing.”

Really, Andy?
 

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That is a hideous loss yesterday. Texans are awful and now they're losing the common games tiebreaker to New England.
 

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I haven't watched them play last night but the offense really surprised me. Jackson came out very aggressive with the cool formations, but it seemed very vanilla after the first couple of drives. I can't tell if it was the game plan or maybe a lack of trust in Dalton. They definitely dialed it back after the long INT. Granted, the Eifert drops really killed them, but I'm surprised they didn't try target some of HOU's weaker corners.
 

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Pats have NEVER played well in Houston.

2003: won in OT 23-20, crazy game
2009: lost Welker, lost the game
2013: barely escaped 34-31 after being down 31-21
 

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http://profootballtalk.nbcsports.com/2015/11/17/andy-dalton-miffed-by-j-j-watts-comments/

“Our goal was to come out here and make the Red Rifle look like a Red Ryder BB Gun,” Watt said on ESPN.

“I’m disappointed in him,” Dalton said in his postgame press conference. “The integrity of this game — I have a lot of respect for him. He’s a really good player. There’s a lot of kids and a lot of people who look up to him. For him to make comments like that, he’s showing that’s acceptable to do that kind of stuff, to say that kind of stuff. It’s disappointing for one of the best players in this league to come out and say something like that. That’s all I’m going to say about that. I think J.J. is a good player, but for him to be one of the best in this league and to show that integrity, and to show that type of … it shows what he’s about, which is disappointing.”

Really, Andy?
Would have been much better to give it a laugh and say that the joke is on him.
 

dcmissle

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Fine, but they have not invented the lipstick for last night. It was hideous. Yes Houston was coming off a bye, but it was a damn home game at a time they could have maintained pressure on NE. Sure made a fool out of me. Took a look at their schedule yesterday and saw only three remaining games where they appeared to be at risk -- at Ari, at Den and home to Pitts. Things often don't go to form but that was a porcelain God game.
 

snowmanny

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I must be a horrible person because I don't even understand Dalton's complaint. Is it just that it's not cool to talk smack about an opponent? If so I suppose I agree with that general point, although it happens all over the place including in Dalton's own comments that basically say Watt is not a suitable role-model for kids (so stop putting him in TV commercials).
 

Rudy's Curve

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It's an inexcusable loss - they could have afforded one Sunday to Arizona on its own since it has no tiebreaker implications but now that would pretty much be a death knell to HFA since it's very hard to see the Pats ending up with more than two losses. It also brings the Denver head-to-head back into play which they could have made moot by building a two-game lead. The real problem again is if you cover Dalton's first read and get the slightest hint of pressure, he runs from the pocket immediately. Take a look at these splits since 2012 - common opponents are teams the Bengals played the year prior (h/t Joe Goodberry who's the best Bengals follow - take a look at his timeline for a film breakdown of last night):



It's no coincidence his other terrible game this year was against the Steelers, and while they've played above expectations defensively and Houston has some talent, neither of them are good but they have a book on him. The only uncommon opponent they could play in the playoffs is the Jets and that would be in the first round.

As for the comments, it just confirms he's a huge loser. It was a totally innocent thing and Watt had every right to say whatever he wanted since he's a HOFer who was a huge factor in his team winning. It's unfathomable that Brady/Rivers/Ben, etc. would react like that since all they care about is winning.
 
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IdiotKicker

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I put together a look at Cedric Peerman, who is basically the Bengals equivalent of Matthew Slater. Really good player on kickoffs, and a guy who I think would fit great in Foxboro when his contract is up at the end of this season.
 

Rudy's Curve

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I put together a look at Cedric Peerman, who is basically the Bengals equivalent of Matthew Slater. Really good player on kickoffs, and a guy who I think would fit great in Foxboro when his contract is up at the end of this season.
Thanks, Chuck - that's a tremendous breakdown of a guy who has been the biggest reason for their special teams turnaround the last few years. They were gashed repeatedly in 2010 (hello Brandon Tate) breaking in a bunch of new players (him included), but since then have been an above-average unit. With two running backs guaranteed to be on the team next year, a third likely and two on the practice squad, they may decide to move on although they certainly know how valuable he is to them.

As for the game, it was an outcome I could live with had they won last week and not pulled defeat from potentially the jaws of victory last night. It's hardly surprising that they had a tough time against the Cardinals offense in Arizona without Adam Jones, but even after that the game was still right there for the taking. With 3rd and 2 at the 25 down three with 1:08 left, two timeouts and the Cardinals none, you have to run the ball - even if you get stuffed, it burns 40 seconds and makes it very hard for them to win in regulation if you make the FG. Instead they throw a low-percentage bomb which is predictably incomplete and the rest is history. Dalton's stat line wasn't terrible but he continued to vacate the pocket once his first read was covered and took sacks (including a fumble inside his own 20) that he shouldn't have. I was hoping that wouldn't be the case against a defense that didn't have a book on him but it looks like he's regressed back to doing it no matter the opponent. Defensively, it's become mystifying how they picked up Dre Kirkpatrick's option for next year - he's been a regular burn victim and threw in a couple missed tackles for good measure last night.

That should all but end their quest for HFA and makes it all the more likely the Week 16 matchup in Denver will decide the two seed. Needless to say, I'm not looking forward to that. They're also only two up in the division now but will likely hold the tiebreaker even if the Steelers beat them in a few weeks, plus Pittsburgh only has two more home games (one against Denver) and has to go to Seattle next week.
 

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Yes, yes, yes, good analysis, they need to run the ball there or throw something like a screen that's highly likely to be completed for all the reasons you mentioned. Even if they score the TD on that play Arizona might go down and tie it given how destroyed the secondary was at that point.
 

Rudy's Curve

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Yes, yes, yes, good analysis, they need to run the ball there or throw something like a screen that's highly likely to be completed for all the reasons you mentioned. Even if they score the TD on that play Arizona might go down and tie it given how destroyed the secondary was at that point.
If they had to pass, roll Dalton outside the pocket and fall down if nothing is there - a loss would make it a tougher FG but still a very makeable one and the marginal gain of time elapsing is much greater. You just cannot have the clock stop without a first down and that falls on the coach and the quarterback. Same shit, different year.
 

Super Nomario

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If they had to pass, roll Dalton outside the pocket and fall down if nothing is there - a loss would make it a tougher FG but still a very makeable one and the marginal gain of time elapsing is much greater. You just cannot have the clock stop without a first down and that falls on the coach and the quarterback. Same shit, different year.
On the road, against a good team, taking a shot at a go-ahead TD makes some sense. Cincy was certainly no lock to win in OT. At the end of the day, they lost the game because they gave up 27 second-half points. The offense did its job - an encouraging sign given Dalton's struggles in big games. The defense was awful in the second half.
 

Rudy's Curve

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On the road, against a good team, taking a shot at a go-ahead TD makes some sense. Cincy was certainly no lock to win in OT. At the end of the day, they lost the game because they gave up 27 second-half points. The offense did its job - an encouraging sign given Dalton's struggles in big games. The defense was awful in the second half.
It obviously has big upside, but it's a low-percentage play that also has considerable downside. Plus as Stitch mentioned, that's still a decent amount of time (even without timeouts) for Arizona to go down the field and score given how they were ripping off chunk plays against a decimated secondary. If you want to throw the ball, why not use the short middle area of the field that's much higher percentage and still gives you plenty of time to score a touchdown? Taking a deep shot also puts you at a much higher risk of a sack which potentially would've put them on the outskirts of Nugent's range.
 

Super Nomario

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It obviously has big upside, but it's a low-percentage play that also has considerable downside. Plus as Stitch mentioned, that's still a decent amount of time (even without timeouts) for Arizona to go down the field and score given how they were ripping off chunk plays against a decimated secondary. If you want to throw the ball, why not use the short middle area of the field that's much higher percentage and still gives you plenty of time to score a touchdown? Taking a deep shot also puts you at a much higher risk of a sack which potentially would've put them on the outskirts of Nugent's range.
Yeah, I think a more intermediate route would have made sense.

Dalton did a play fake out of a read option look on that play - I wonder if it was a designed shot or if it was a post-snap read out of a packaged play. He might have had a run/pass option and didn't like the run look.
 

soxhop411

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“@GeoffHobsonCin: Andy says there is a fracture”




“@AKinkhabwala: Marvin Lewis says Andy will be ”out for a bit.“ Ask him what’s a bit. ”We’ll see… Can’t heal bones.“”
 

DaveRoberts'Shoes

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At the earliest he could be back for the divisional round, I would think. Even that would be pushing it, given that it's his throwing hand. And it also pre-supposes that they could win in the first round of the playoffs...
 

Rudy's Curve

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Can somebody please tell the idiot media, the head coach and the players that they haven't won the division yet?

Lewis:

Well, winning the division is big. I think that’s a key element, so I’m proud of them for that. Somebody told me I think it’s the third time that we’ve done it in the last seven years, so that’s key.
Question to Hill:

Can you talk about winning the AFC North? “That is good. That is always the number one goal at the beginning of the season to win the AFC North and I guess that we have done it. We still have a lot of work to do, though.”
All they have to do is beat the Schaub/Clausen Ravens at home to do it (or just win this week), but it's pretty alarming that the head coach didn't know.

The running game was pretty poor yesterday especially in short yardage, but the Niners have actually played good defense at home and the game didn't mean a ton to the Bengals outside of clinching a playoff spot. Although McCarron missed some throws, he did what he had to do averaging over nine YPA and not turning it over. The Niners are especially poor offensively, but this is a damn good defense at full strength when Burfict is playing three downs. As long as Jones and Hall don't suffer any setbacks and Iloka returns, they'll be fully healthy there heading into Denver.

Monday's game is obviously massive - win and they clinch a bye with the opportunity to rest all the banged up guys Week 17 and likely have Dalton back for the divisional round, lose and they'll likely have to beat Baltimore to win the division with a bye unlikely. Atkins and Dunlap should really have their way with Denver's OL and the Broncos are a little banged up defensively so hopefully that will be enough to win it.
 
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Rudy's Curve

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Well that was pretty much rock bottom. They could've re-signed Josh Brown three years ago after Nugent got hurt but why do that when you can bring back the same LS/P/K combination every year? Continuity! All that being said, they still have to win the game up 14-3 at the half at near full strength on defense facing a team without a big passing game. Lewis has done a lot of good things and they've won a lot of games the last five years (especially since the second half of 2012) but second half adjustments in big games continue to be a problem. They've been outscored 84-13 (not a typo) in the second halves of the six playoff losses and 51-20 in the three primetime losses this year including 17-3 last night. At some point, that has to fall on the head coach.

They can still get a bye with a win or a KC win and a Denver loss but as much as I love Rivers, I can't see how that OL holds up against the Denver pass rush especially with receivers that can't get open. Hopefully the common/uncommon theory above with Dalton applies to the whole offense and they get the Jets in the first round but it's hard to be optimistic at this point.
 

Rudy's Curve

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If Dalton can come back, and that is a big if, I think they destroy Denver if they meet again, even at Mile High.
I think they're a better team than Denver at full strength but that's a wildly optimistic projection. It's not like Dalton (especially coming off an injury) is a lock to succeed against that defense and he couldn't have done anything about the Bengals defense folding in the second half.
 

Silverdude2167

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That defense looked very tired and even with barely playing in the first half the first four drives with 3, 3 and outs and a drive of 5 plays put them in a terrible situation at that altitude.
 

soxfan121

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@Rudy's Curve did you have any issues with the play calling on those 2nd half drives? I know Hue has been wildly creative and effective, but if there was ever a situation to come out with heavy personnel and run the ball with Hill, it was in the second half. Can they just not do that?
 

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@Rudy's Curve did you have any issues with the play calling on those 2nd half drives? I know Hue has been wildly creative and effective, but if there was ever a situation to come out with heavy personnel and run the ball with Hill, it was in the second half. Can they just not do that?
Pretty much. They lost their FB Ryan Hewitt early in the game and even if he was healthy, they're just not a power running team. The OL is very good but it's much more in pass protection/space than power and the center (Bodine) gets consistently pushed into the backfield so it's hard to establish a power running game. I don't think they would've been able to grind down the clock trying to run against that front.

Hill had a ton of success last year running behind Hewitt which was their main personnel grouping since they were decimated at WR/TE. Now that they've been healthy there this year, they haven't played much 21 personnel. I think that's a big reason for Hill's dropoff, but it still doesn't explain why he's averaging 3.4 YPC while Bernard, a supposedly inferior runner, is averaging 4.7 behind the same line.
 

jsinger121

@jsinger121
SoSH Member
Jul 25, 2005
17,679
Marvin Lewis needs a pink slip tomorrow since he can't control a bunch of thugs.
 

BigSoxFan

Member
SoSH Member
May 31, 2007
47,211
I mean - that was the most Bengaliest loss I've ever seen. They really are just the Browns with more talent. What a loser organization. I do find comfort in knowing how much that bothered Collinsworth. Fuck him.
 

mwonow

Member
SoSH Member
Sep 4, 2005
7,120
I wish I knew where to find a Goat thread for the Bungles. If the Pats had blown up like that, well...the server would have been even worse!
 

ManicCompression

Member
SoSH Member
May 14, 2015
1,367
I can't agree with the sentiment that this was bungled. Yes, they made some dumb mistakes but:
- that shazier hit was dirtier than either the brown or Wheaton hit and led to an important change of possession
- what was Joey porter doing on the field? How is a linebackers coach provoking an opposing player not a penalty?

They had some awful calls against them. Plus, give them a healthy dalton and that game is totally different