Didn’t kickers used to tamper with balls, like severely? It was around ~2000 that the NFL curtailed the practice, leading to a drop in distance and accuracy.
20 years ago today...
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They also OVERTURNED Hines Ward’s fumble, even though it was obvious the ball was coming out before his helmet hit the ground. That was mind-numbingly terrible. Ball didn’t lie, as very next snap was fumbled and Pats recovered, but it cost them 25 yards in field position and maybe 4 points.
Yes, though I can’t recall if catch rules were different. He definitely lost control when he rolled over.
Yeah the fumble overturn was weird. Hochuli blew a ton of calls in that game. His crew was so bad. They called intentional grounding on Drew on the pass he threw backwards over his head - but Redmond was pretty close. It negated a holding penalty on the Steelers that would have extended that drive that they recovered the fumbled snap on, and definitely cost them points. Then on 3rd down of that same drive, 3rd and 7 from the 33, Drew was strip sacked and had the old open palm and the ball went forward, the officials called incomplete. But it was clearly a fumble and the Pats recovered it like 3 yards down field. They went for 4th and 7 from the 33, but wonder if they would have kicked the 47 yard field goal if they had the chance.
What's weird about the Patten catch is that they didn't review it despite the play occurring inside two minutes. And yet, they did review the Super Bowl TD, which didn't even look controversial.
The weather in NE today is very similar to the weather of the tuck rule game. (I watched the game in Bar Harbor, Maine and we were experiencing the same storm that Foxboro was.)
Also, I watch the video in the opening post, and one thing that I'ver never seen before is that some guy in a red jacket -- under the goalpost to the right -- takes a wicked fall as the first kick sails through.
Also, I watch the video in the opening post, and one thing that I'ver never seen before is that some guy in a red jacket -- under the goalpost to the right -- takes a wicked fall as the first kick sails through.
I'll never forget Troy Brown's 55 yard S - shaped punt return for a touchdown to get the lead. Is this going to be our post-season or what?
Harris is clearly behind Brown when the lateral happens, but it did travel forwards because they were both running at the time.
Yeah, it's an optical illusion. It 100% looks like a lateral live, but you gotta remember Brown keeps moving forward after he releases it. I don't think there were coach's challenges at this point, correct? It was something initiated by the booth, I believe. Back then, it's understandable something that looked ok live would not get a second look, but it was still another blown call in a game full of them.
So the AFC act wanted you to soak up the sun while the NFC one was more interested in scattered showers?
I went to the first Pats-Broncos AFC Championship and the halftime act was The Fray. The fuckin' Fray. They sounded okay when I was in line in the bathroom.
That was the game that the Steelers somehow let it be known that the players were all instructed to bring their luggage with them to the game because they'd be leaving for New Orleans immediately afterwards.
Didn't he also save a sack by throwing a pass over his shoulder that was much, much closer to being picked off than to being caught?
February 3 is a pretty good day for the Pats.
February 3, 2002: Pats 20, Rams 17
February 3, 2019: Pats 13, Rams 3
Of course there was also February 3, 2008...
2 outta 3 ain't bad?!
Edit: "And now, ladies and gentlemen, choosing to be introduced as a team"... chokes me up EVERY time.
View: https://twitter.com/PatsTimeMachine/status/1489248560646217730
February 3, 2002: Pats 20, Rams 17
February 3, 2019: Pats 13, Rams 3
Of course there was also February 3, 2008...
2 outta 3 ain't bad?!
Edit: "And now, ladies and gentlemen, choosing to be introduced as a team"... chokes me up EVERY time.
View: https://twitter.com/PatsTimeMachine/status/1489248560646217730
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Exactly. It's clear on replay Brown tosses it at almost exactly the 50 yard line, Harris keeps running and catches it at the Steelers' 49, exactly a yard forward. I'm personally glad this wasn't overturned -- maybe I'm just a homer, but I feel like this is one of those "fingertips come off the bag on a slide" style situations, where in slow motion replay technically it violated the rule but the actual spirit of the rule wasn't violated. Brown turned and lateraled to a player who was behind him when he tossed it and still behind him when he caught it -- yadda yadda physics, objects in motion and all that, but I don't think it should have been overturned.
Couldn’t have been overturned since TDs weren’t automatically reviewed and the Steelers were out of challenges due to Hochuli’s crew’s incompetence to that point in the game.
Yes, sorry, I just mean if this play happened today/if the Steelers had a challenge left, I still hope this wouldn't have been overturned.
You have to have some kind of angle to see it. Looks like one of the camera shots might show proof one way or the other. I assume the referee gets to see every camera when he does the replay (which the audience often doesn't get)?
It's a lot like this play with Russell Wilson: https://www.nbcsports.com/philadelphia/the700level/nfl-rule-says-russell-wilsons-lateral-illegal-forward-pass
IMO, neither play would have had conclusive enough evidence to overturn. The issue isn't that the players are moving, it's that the cameras themselves are moving (that's how the camera is able to follow a player down the field on these plays), so while we think it was thrown here, or it was caught there, it's impossible to know based on that. In both Wilson's case and Troy Brown's, it appears pretty clear they are releasing the ball backwards from where they are. I suppose due to them running downfield, the ball went backwards, but the forward momentum of the thrower, with the forward momentum of the Wilson/Brown made the ball end up further downfield making it illegal.
But I'll ask this, what if the person that caught the lateral didn't catch it? Do folks really think the correct call would be a 5 yard penalty and the Pats/Seahawks retain possession, as opposed to a fumble? If Troy Brown makes that "pass" and it's not caught and it's recovered by Pitt, would BB have called for a review and said it wasn't a fumble, because it was an illegal forward pass?
Maybe by definition and by the angle on the cameras, these were both illegal forward passes, but the spirit of the rule lived, IMO.
Yeah that was a legal lateral imho. The head slap on Warner in the super bowl probably should have been a penalty tho.
What is the rule @CFB_Rules ? Is it just that the "receiving" player needs to be behind the "lateralling" player at the time of "reception"? Can the ball move forward?
No, whether a thrown ball is a forward pass or, conversely, a backward pass, depends on whether the ball travels closer to the opposing goal line after leaving the player’s hand. It doesn’t matter where the player who catches the ball is standing relative to the thrower when the ball is released or where the player who throws the ball is standing relative to the receiver when the ball is caught. All that matters is whether the ball contacts the receiver or the ground at a point closer to the opposing goal line than the thrower’s release point.
Merlin has got it right. A pass is forward if it first touches anything in advance of where it is thrown. Anything else is backwards. So if you are standing still and throw a ball directly over your shoulder behind you, and the wind somehow blew it to land in front of you, it's a forward pass.
Thanks. So if that play (the block FG return, not your example) went to review, you'd call it an illegal forward pass?
Yeah that's 100% forward. Those are hard to get in real time, but as an on-field official I've basically come to the conclusion that if a player is running full speed down the field it is almost impossible for them to throw a backwards pass.