1/26-Dubs

Eddie Jurak

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Kyrie was great except for the 3 TO.
One turnover was a lazy pass, the others were him trying to do it all himself and getting trapped. Between 2 of his turnovers, he gambled on a steal and let his man (Livingston) score an easy fast break basket.

Overall, he was great tonight, but at crucial moments he tried to do it all himself and failed.
 

TripleOT

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Forget boxing out. Why doesn't Brad have 4 Celtics in the lane on the free throw? Why is Marcus running form half court to get in front of the shooter? Of course he's going to be out of position, he's sprinting 50 feet and trying to time it perfectly. I have no idea why they didn't stack the lane with everyone, and bring Baynes off the bench.
I often wonder why they use this kind of box out scheme in the NBA, It's standard, and everyone does it that way. Smart's run into the lane is only a few steps, from the three point line. He just ran in too far, instead of boxing out.
 

RoDaddy

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Wish Hayward was more consistent tat thi
Too much hero ball from Kyrie. If he makes even a tiny effort to occasionally involve Tatum in the 4th quarter, they win this.
Too much Kyrie dribbling with everyone standing around watching. We all know he has a great handle but...

Need more from Hayward at this stage in his recovery

Sucks that GS was able to add Cousins to an already great team. How the eff did that happen?!
 

teddykgb

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Forget boxing out. Why doesn't Brad have 4 Celtics in the lane on the free throw? Why is Marcus running form half court to get in front of the shooter? Of course he's going to be out of position, he's sprinting 50 feet and trying to time it perfectly. I have no idea why they didn't stack the lane with everyone, and bring Baynes off the bench.
Marcus was at the 3 point line and went to crash to help on a more normal rebound. Basically got caught cheating a bit but he has always done that and it has helped us in the past. Brutal bounce on the rebound although the book says he should be there
 

lars10

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Celtics made a lot of bad mistakes in the 4th but played really well. Came down to execution and we just didn’t execute well enough when it mattered. Kyrie certainly got caught trying to do too much and Morris had a bit of a rough night.
34 free throws to 15.. The offensive possessions in the fourth the Celts actually played a hell of a fourth quarter.. they executed on a large number of possessions with more or less no free throws.. Golden State didn't execute all that well..unless you count their 14? free throws in the fourth?

edit: taking away snark
 

chilidawg

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Great game, tough loss, give GS credit they played great 4th Q defense, we had a tough time getting good looks.

Time to start another win streak.
 

Deathofthebambino

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Does anyone else think this game plays out differently if instead of Hayward getting 22 minutes and Rozier getting 19, Smart played more than 29 minutes and Brown played more than 22 minutes?
 

CreedBratton

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I wish I could be as confident as others here about winning the East. a lot of shit to fix in three months for that.
They showed they could hang tonight but are going to have to beat the bucks & raps both on the road just to get to the warriors. Tall task for anyone.
 

Deathofthebambino

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I often wonder why they use this kind of box out scheme in the NBA, It's standard, and everyone does it that way. Smart's run into the lane is only a few steps, from the three point line. He just ran in too far, instead of boxing out.
No, it wasn't from the 3 point line. Even the announcer said something about it. He said Smart was way too far back at the start of the play.
 

Jed Zeppelin

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Haven’t seen anything this season to suggest they will beat Kawhi/Toronto as the road team this spring.

They can certainly turn it on but if they do it will mean they have suddenly advanced past what they have shown so far.
 

HomeRunBaker

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Forget boxing out. Why doesn't Brad have 4 Celtics in the lane on the free throw? Why is Marcus running form half court to get in front of the shooter? Of course he's going to be out of position, he's sprinting 50 feet and trying to time it perfectly. I have no idea why they didn't stack the lane with everyone, and bring Baynes off the bench.
League rules do not allow for this. Smart should be positioned behind the arc and box out the shooter by entering the lane on release.
 

teddykgb

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34 free throws to 15.. The offensive possessions in the fourth the Celts actually played a hell of a fourth quarter.. they executed on a large number of possessions with more or less no free throws.. Golden State didn't execute all that well..unless you count their 14? free throws in the fourth?

edit: taking away snark
I don’t know how far back you’d have to go to find a game thread where the consensus isn’t that the Celtics are getting screwed by the refs. I’m usually up for some real ref hatred and hate the way things are called in the NBA but the Celtics has too many poor possessions down the stretch. They struggled to get the shots they wanted and ended up deep in the shot clock with the wrong people shooting. They got caught on the break and turned the ball over. When they got Morris a late attempt it didn’t fall. This all happens, it’s fine. If we are lucky enough to play these guys in a series we have to hope it comes down to late game execution and that we can do better
 

HomeRunBaker

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Haven’t seen anything this season to suggest they will beat Kawhi/Toronto as the road team this spring.

They can certainly turn it on but if they do it will mean they have suddenly advanced past what they have shown so far.
Milwaukee may be the worst matchup of all for us too. Winning games on the road in Milwaukee and Toronto will be a tall order.
 

teddykgb

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No, it wasn't from the 3 point line. Even the announcer said something about it. He said Smart was way too far back at the start of the play.
It was definitely the 3 point line. He and Kyrie switched positions just before the shot so he could crash. And the box out the shooter thing is overrated. NBA players don’t brick free throws in general. Yeah , you want to put a body there so he can’t crash but our middle and high school coaches worried about the shooter more because we were all shitty FT shooters
 

Average Game James

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I don’t know how far back you’d have to go to find a game thread where the consensus isn’t that the Celtics are getting screwed by the refs. I’m usually up for some real ref hatred and hate the way things are called in the NBA but the Celtics has too many poor possessions down the stretch. They struggled to get the shots they wanted and ended up deep in the shot clock with the wrong people shooting. They got caught on the break and turned the ball over. When they got Morris a late attempt it didn’t fall. This all happens, it’s fine. If we are lucky enough to play these guys in a series we have to hope it comes down to late game execution and that we can do better
The Celtics didn’t play great, I don’t think anyone is saying that. But neither did GS. One team got bailed out by whistles, the other didn’t. Before the intentional fouls, GS took 30 FT to the C’s 15. And the Celtics outscored GS in the paint, so it’s not like it’s because the Cs were just jacking up 3s.
 

benhogan

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34 free throws to 15.. The offensive possessions in the fourth the Celts actually played a hell of a fourth quarter.. they executed on a large number of possessions with more or less no free throws.. Golden State didn't execute all that well..unless you count their 14? free throws in the fourth?

edit: taking away snark
I asked my wife if 34 is larger than 15

she confirmed it was
 

Deathofthebambino

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It was definitely the 3 point line. He and Kyrie switched positions just before the shot so he could crash. And the box out the shooter thing is overrated. NBA players don’t brick free throws in general. Yeah , you want to put a body there so he can’t crash but our middle and high school coaches worried about the shooter more because we were all shitty FT shooters
I would love to know what percentage of offensive rebounds on a missed free throw are by the shooter? I'll bet it's actually pretty high. Right after Green missed the first one, I was saying to myself, just get the rebound, and my only fear is that the shooter is going to back rim it and it's going to be a long rebound. It's pretty much the only chance a shooting team should have on a free throw. You have to box out the shooter in that situation. If that happens in the 2nd quarter, so be it, but with 8 seconds left, down by 2 points, you have to make sure nobody else can get that board. The non-shooting team has a huge advantage on free throws for that reason.
 

HomeRunBaker

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Did not know this? You can only have one of the third spaces occupied in the NBA?
Correct. The 3rd player is generally on the side with the greatest OffRebiunding threat to pinch down on him while the 4th rebounder (in this case Smart) enters the lane on release to block out the shooter.
 

BigSoxFan

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Sometimes whining about calls is perfectly valid. Tonight was one of those nights. Celtics didn’t get the same calls as GS. Pretty tough to beat a team like that when they’re also getting a disproportionate share of calls.
 

RedOctober3829

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Does anyone else think this game plays out differently if instead of Hayward getting 22 minutes and Rozier getting 19, Smart played more than 29 minutes and Brown played more than 22 minutes?
No. Brown wasn’t all that good tonight. 10 points but only shot 3-8 and was a -8.

Hayward was pretty awful tonight though. You have to ride the ups and downs with him, but this was a big down.
 

Mueller's Twin Grannies

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No. Brown wasn’t all that good tonight. 10 points but only shot 3-8 and was a -8.

Hayward was pretty awful tonight though. You have to ride the ups and downs with him, but this was a big down.
How many down games has he had by comparison?

I don't think he's ever going to be the player they signed again. They would be wise to cut bait in the off-season, in my opinion.

I'm also on board with getting rid of Brown ASAP. I'll never forgive him for Game 7.
 

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No. Brown wasn’t all that good tonight. 10 points but only shot 3-8 and was a -8.

Hayward was pretty awful tonight though. You have to ride the ups and downs with him, but this was a big down.
I actually thought GH was pretty active on defense. Obviously, he was terrible offensively.
 

fairlee76

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How can you say it was just an unlucky bounce? The Celtics grab that rebound if they box out the shooter. Bounce or no bounce.
Yep. Entertaining game but frustrating as hell to watch pros fuck up things that we all learned during 6th grade Saturday AM basketball.
 

Deathofthebambino

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No. Brown wasn’t all that good tonight. 10 points but only shot 3-8 and was a -8.

Hayward was pretty awful tonight though. You have to ride the ups and downs with him, but this was a big down.
If he makes his next shot, he's 4/9, which is fine. There's also the other end of the floor. Defensively, he was doing a great job on Durant when he was in there. The -8 is because almost all of his minutes were spent with Hayward and Rozier, which is the problem with that statistic.
 

Deathofthebambino

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How many down games has he had by comparison?

I don't think he's ever going to be the player they signed again. They would be wise to cut bait in the off-season, in my opinion.

I'm also on board with getting rid of Brown ASAP. I'll never forgive him for Game 7.
You blame Brown for Game 7? Rozier and Smart took 24 shots, including 14 3 pointers, and they scored a total of 8 points. Brown had a bad game, but man, there were a lot of goats in that one.
 

mostman

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I actually thought GH was pretty active on defense. Obviously, he was terrible offensively.
He was complete trash on defense. Active? Maybe if you count chasing his guy from behind. If you recorded the game, go watch his minutes towards the end of the second quarter. He was out of position on most plays, and on others he was just standing around watching the game play around him. There were at least three plays where his man got an offensive board while he was all but looking in the wrong direction.

I’m totally done with him. He’s not getting better. His minutes have to be cut in half. Play Semi if you have to.
 

BigSoxFan

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An interesting point from KOC about Hayward. He is extremely passive. He’s passed on half his drives compared to 33% from 13 to 17.
Clearly the effect of the injury. We all hope he’ll get better but there is a very real chance of this suboptimal version being all we get in 2018-2019. And if that’s the case, then Brad is going to have some tough decisions to make come playoff time.
 

benhogan

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Clearly the effect of the injury. We all hope he’ll get better but there is a very real chance of this suboptimal version being all we get in 2018-2019. And if that’s the case, then Brad is going to have some tough decisions to make come playoff time.
Brad has been trying his best w/ Gordon, but his MPG have been coming down from November pretty steadily.
 

LesterFan

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Folks often talk about the schedule and how it can affect the players.. well this was the perfect spot for the Celtics being at home for a week and not having played since Wednesday, with Kyrie and Horford not playing since Monday. While the Warriors are at the end of a long road trip. Disappointing to not win this game, especially given the chances they had.
 

RGREELEY33

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The Celtics didn’t play that well, had some really bad turnovers and fouls, Kyrie was uncharacteristically sloppy/careless down the stretch, and Hayward is still playing meaningful/important minutes, and they lost by 4 — and probably should have won this game. I am totally fine with it, and things will be different/better in May/June.
 

lars10

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I don’t know how far back you’d have to go to find a game thread where the consensus isn’t that the Celtics are getting screwed by the refs. I’m usually up for some real ref hatred and hate the way things are called in the NBA but the Celtics has too many poor possessions down the stretch. They struggled to get the shots they wanted and ended up deep in the shot clock with the wrong people shooting. They got caught on the break and turned the ball over. When they got Morris a late attempt it didn’t fall. This all happens, it’s fine. If we are lucky enough to play these guys in a series we have to hope it comes down to late game execution and that we can do better
Look at the numbers though!! 19 more free throws for a three point shooting team. It’s ok if sometimes the moaning about the refs is actually right.. Klay was allowed to put two hands, or hand check, kyrie all fourth quarter.. that’s not legal anymore.. meanwhile going the other way there were touch foul after touch foul.. they turned the ball over on two possessions or so (in the fourth)? They executed most of the fourth without the benefit of foul calls.. a fairly large number of possessions the other way the warriors were bailed out with foul calls.. the celts weren’t allowed to play the same physical defense.. whatever.. they hung with them and lost by four even with all that. GG
 
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DeJesus Built My Hotrod

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Clearly the effect of the injury. We all hope he’ll get better but there is a very real chance of this suboptimal version being all we get in 2018-2019. And if that’s the case, then Brad is going to have some tough decisions to make come playoff time.
I am not a big game score fan but four of Hayward's top ten game scores have come in the month of January and six of the top ten have been over December and January. Hayward clearly didn't play well tonight, especially on offense, though his two steals and seven boards don't paint as dire a picture as our eyes might tell us.

Its frustrating to watch because some nights the guy looks like he doesn't really belong in the NBA but my understanding is that recovery from an injury like his is often non-linear. Contrast it with Cousins who is being asked to do a lot less and is surrounded by more talent (on the Warriors starting squad at least). Boogie has looked great in this small sample when doing some things such as playing down low but he has routinely been getting beaten off the dribble by bigs and smalls alike - its one of the reasons he is racking up so many fouls.

Paul George would be another comp but recall that the guy came back for a stretch at the end of the season after his summer injury. He had a lot more time between his in-season recovery and the summer to get himself in shape. Hayward's second surgery deprived him of the same sort of opportunity last spring.
 
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Brand Name

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how many times would any team beat the Warriors if the Warriors went to the line 20 more times?
I can find a total one game where the Warriors had 30+ FTAs, and the opponent won, with sub 20 attempts since Kerr's hiring: January 6th, 2017, by Memphis, with a 39-19 disparity. That's the lone win in 9 (10 if you include tonight) such occurances within that time frame, including a 2OT loss by the Celts, in the Garden, in 2015.

Tonight felt like a lot of rushed deep threes late, unnecessarily, Kyrie in particular with about 20 on the clock, just outside the top of the key. In what was a one posession game, I understand taking that with the clock winding down, but it was suboptimal within the game's context and flow, especially given the look wasn't especially great.
 

wade boggs chicken dinner

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Tonight felt like a lot of rushed deep threes late, unnecessarily, Kyrie in particular with about 20 on the clock, just outside the top of the key. In what was a one posession game, I understand taking that with the clock winding down, but it was suboptimal within the game's context and flow, especially given the look wasn't especially great.
Trying to replicate the TOR shot I think.