Christian Arroyo

bluefenderstrat · Apr 21, 2021

It's just too soon to know what he is, at least offensively--less than 50 plate appearances this season and ~350 for his career. He was fairly highly regarded as a prospect at one point and his minor league stats look decent. Seems like he struggled in his brief introduction to the majors as a 22 year old in 2017, and kind of got lost in the shuffle since. He was the "main piece" in the Longoria trade, but I'm not sure how much weight that carries given where Longoria was in his career at that point. I think if we get a season of offensive and defensive competency out of Arroyo as the starting 2B, we should be thrilled, but maybe there's even some upside to be found. And if he's just the useful utility guy when Jeter Downs is the presumed starter at 2B next year, that's still a terrific outcome for a guy they got for free.

JBJ_HOF · Apr 21, 2021

He had a bunch of random injuries and multiple hand surgeries in 2017-2019.

chawson · Apr 21, 2021

I’m happy he’s gotten the opportunity, and it’s definitely a nice situation for a guy many thought wouldn’t make the 26 coming out of spring training.

In a way, Arroyo is probably exactly what Bloom was hoping for when he signed Jose Peraza. His upside seems like a low power, solid batting average type who can play anywhere on the diamond (I’m thinking Ty France, Donovan Solano or Starlin Castro), a player type that’s a little more useful than they were five years ago because widespread defensive shifting has eaten into the value of low-power LHB infielders.

Arroyo’s not quite making enough contact, or hard contact, or hitting the ball in the air or walking as much as those guys yet, but his baseline skills are solid. He also seems likable and sparkpluggy, which makes for a nice teammate. His youth, salary and controllability also make him the most tradeable of the six(!) infield utility players we have on the 40-man roster (counting Santana, who I expect the team will call up by his April 30 opt-out date).

reggiecleveland · Apr 22, 2021

It is not worth much perhaps, other than what Cora may have said in an interview, but the last two games the Jays announcing crew have been all over praising Arroyo as great pickup for the Sox. They keep repeating he was highly regarded prospect, considered a talent, and his hitting seems to have turned a corner, great guy, etc. It stood out since most of what was said about others was standard "Renfroe great power potential' "Kiki, popular in LA plays lots of positions. Pat Tabler even said his impression talking to Cora, was Arroyo had won the 2b competition, and Cora thinks he will hit if he just leaves him alone.

bsj · Jun 17, 2021

This thread deserves bumpage. Love what he is developing into on this roster.

A few weeks ago I considered 2B and 1B the two biggest holes in the roster. I'm good with Arroyo there and focusing on getting a reasonably priced upgrade over Dalbec (Asdrubal?) if the chance arises

RIrooter09 · Jun 17, 2021

bsj said:
This thread deserves bumpage. Love what he is developing into on this roster.

A few weeks ago I considered 2B and 1B the two biggest holes in the roster. I'm good with Arroyo there and focusing on getting a reasonably priced upgrade over Dalbec (Asdrubal?) if the chance arises

I like Santana or Aguilar more than Asdrubal.

cantor44 · Jun 18, 2021

Sandy Leon Trotsky said:
I know Arroyo is having all sorts of BABiP luck currently but watching him swing looks like he has some skills in putting the ball in play against the defensive shifts. He might be getting lucky, but I suspect he might have some skill there. He really should be at the top of the order currently.
Beside that though.... it's nice to have what seems like a weakness, as you mentioned, being addressed. 1B to me is the true weakness but CF (Kiké) is horrendous. I mentioned this in the Duran thread... but wondering if he could move to LF in Fenway... move Dugo to CF and keep Renfroe in RF. Keep Kiké as an overpaid late inning defensive replacement.... then you're really only looking at one trade around July to address Dalbec (won't discuss the BP or starting rotation here).

Agreed. At this moment at least, Arroyo's all-around solid contributions seem to plug one of the big holes. Maybe a Duran promotion plugs a second, and a trade for first baseman the third. And then the position player roster seems set health provided .... then ... for a quality starter or two ... sigh.

soxhop411 · Jun 18, 2021

These were all the called strikes against Arroyo today that ended in him getting ejected

via
https://baseballsavant.mlb.com/gamefeed?gamePk=633683&game_date=6/18/2021&date=6/18/2021

cmaxwell's silver hammer · Jun 19, 2021

Bring on the automated strike zone. It can't be any worse than what that chart shows.

joe dokes · Jun 19, 2021

"Hey, I got 3 out of 5. Aint no hitters batting .600."

JimD · Jun 21, 2021

Any news on his knee injury?

Pedroia's Itchy Nose · Jun 21, 2021

JimD said:
Any news on his knee injury?

The postgame article on redsox.com last night described it as a "shin bruise" and said that x-rays were negative and no structural damage: link

bsj · Jul 16, 2021

bsj said:
This thread deserves bumpage. Love what he is developing into on this roster.

A few weeks ago I considered 2B and 1B the two biggest holes in the roster. I'm good with Arroyo there and focusing on getting a reasonably priced upgrade over Dalbec (Asdrubal?) if the chance arises

Arroyo at 1st. I love that Bloom is exploring all of these options. Doesn't take us out of the mix at the deadline, but just makes it less urgent if there isnt a good deal to be had.

gryoung · Jul 17, 2021

I just learned that both Arroyo and Renfroe were 1st round selections from the 2013 draft.

Cesar Crespo · Jul 17, 2021

gryoung said:
I just learned that both Arroyo and Renfroe were 1st round selections from the 2013 draft.

Benintendi was picked in the 31st round that year by the Reds.

sean1562 · Jul 17, 2021

Considering that Downs is hitting .215/.291/.348/.639 in AAA, has any of the desire to flip this guy for something else died down? It doesn't seem like Downs will be ready for a starting role on this squad next season.

Arroyo has been a completely different player since he cam back from that hand injury in late May. April 4-May 6 his stat line was .275/.333/.377/.710 with a BABIP of .373. From May 26 through now, .265/.322/.542/.864 with a BABIP of .291. All 6 of his home runs have come after May 26.

ehaz · Jul 17, 2021

Renfroe and Arroyo don’t even reach free agency until 2024 and 2025. Arroyo is still pre-arb.

It’ll be huge if both are for real. It’s very possible as they’re both talented, former 1sts. Arroyo as a guy who can cover every infield position and hit with a ~.900 OPS vs lefties is a very useful player.

Cesar Crespo · Jul 17, 2021

ehaz said:
Renfroe and Arroyo don’t even reach free agency until 2024 and 2025. Arroyo is still pre-arb.

It’ll be huge if both are for real. It’s very possible as they’re both talented, former 1sts. Arroyo as a guy who can cover every infield position and hit with a ~.900 OPS vs lefties is a very useful player.

Renfroe has been good for awhile now outside a small sample size in 2020. He has a 106 OPS+ this year. His Career OPS + is 106 in 1905 PA. Arroyo doesn't have nearly the sample size.

Cesar Crespo · Jul 17, 2021

sean1562 said:
Considering that Downs is hitting .215/.291/.348/.639 in AAA, has any of the desire to flip this guy for something else died down? It doesn't seem like Downs will be ready for a starting role on this squad next season.

Arroyo has been a completely different player since he cam back from that hand injury in late May. April 4-May 6 his stat line was .275/.333/.377/.710 with a BABIP of .373. From May 26 through now, .265/.322/.542/.864 with a BABIP of .291. All 6 of his home runs have come after May 26.

How long is Arroyo under control for? For some reason Bbref doesn't say when he becomes a FA. Downs is interesting because there's some 19 year old in Salem hitting .374/.469/.561 with 17bb/17k in his last 130 PA that plays his position. There also isn't an obvious place for Downs in the OF. Probably not a good idea to trade him when his value is Downs though. Plus be basically skipped AA so his struggles aren't shocking. He just becomes more expandable if Nick Yorke is legit.

chawson · Jul 17, 2021

sean1562 said:
Considering that Downs is hitting .215/.291/.348/.639 in AAA, has any of the desire to flip this guy for something else died down? It doesn't seem like Downs will be ready for a starting role on this squad next season.

Arroyo has been a completely different player since he cam back from that hand injury in late May. April 4-May 6 his stat line was .275/.333/.377/.710 with a BABIP of .373. From May 26 through now, .265/.322/.542/.864 with a BABIP of .291. All 6 of his home runs have come after May 26.

Not really. I definitely think they should trade Arroyo to a rebuilding team but maybe it happens this winter.

ehaz · Jul 17, 2021

Cesar Crespo said:
How long is Arroyo under control for? For some reason Bbref doesn't say when he becomes a FA. Downs is interesting because there's some 19 year old in Salem hitting .374/.469/.561 with 17bb/17k in his last 130 PA that plays his position. There also isn't an obvious place for Downs in the OF. Probably not a good idea to trade him when his value is Downs though. Plus be basically skipped AA so his struggles aren't shocking. He just becomes more expandable if Nick Yorke is legit.

Bbref and Fangraphs each show 2025 for me.

Jed Zeppelin · Jul 17, 2021

Not to look too far ahead or make too many assumptions, but if Duran sticks, Kiké slots into 2b, and next year’s opening day 1B is keeping the seat warm for Casas, then there is opportunity for Arroyo to become the Marwin supersub, except a guy who can really hit and cover the whole infield.

Obviously if a great trade opportunity comes around, you pick up the phone, but I’m loving him on the roster right now and there should be room for him moving forward. Cost-controlled, great teammate. But it depends what’s out there, of course.

Not worried about Downs. Basically jumped from A to AAA.

nvalvo · Jul 17, 2021

Jed Zeppelin said:
Not worried about Downs. Basically jumped from A to AAA.

Exactly this. K rate, in 12 game slices: 44%, 30%, 24%, 28%. He seems like he's figuring things out.

Let's see where things stand this time next year.

Sin Duda · Jul 17, 2021

As of the end of July 16, anyone as surprised as I that this is the team's order by OPS? JD, X, Raffy, Christian A, Renfro, Verdugo, Kike, BobbyD, Christian V, Marwin (min. 150 ABs)? Arroyo is outhitting several regulars with more ABs, plays up the middle, and has 0 errors. Huh.

beautokyo · Jul 18, 2021

Anyone have an update on his injury tonight?

LesterFan · Jul 18, 2021

View: https://twitter.com/IanMBrowne/status/1416956500111761409

Red(s)HawksFan · Jul 19, 2021

Sandy Leon Trotsky said:
I missed the game. What happened? Bad?

Pulled his hamstring stretching for a throw at 1B. Bad enough he immediately left the game.

I can't wait for the chunderhead sports radio callers to decry him playing a new position and it getting him hurt immediately, a la Ellsbury or Swihart in LF.

BroodsSexton · Jul 19, 2021

Sandy Leon Trotsky said:
I missed the game. What happened? Bad?

Here’s the stretch. I yelped.

https://www.mlb.com/news/christian-arroyo-plays-1st-mlb-game-at-1st-base

Red(s)HawksFan said:
Pulled his hamstring stretching for a throw at 1B. Bad enough he immediately left the game.

I can't wait for the chunderhead sports radio callers to decry him playing a new position and it getting him hurt immediately, a la Ellsbury or Swihart in LF.

I mean, sure, but he had no chance at that play. Better to just field it off the base than fall into a split. A more experienced 1B might not have stretched there. And, might have been better at stretching without ripping his groin.

richgedman'sghost · Jul 19, 2021

The Sox were trying for a double play and on the reley to first Arroyo did the splits in attempting to catch the throw while keeping his leg on the bag. Looked pretty bad. Did not even protest coming out of the game.

Captaincoop · Jul 19, 2021

BroodsSexton said:
Here’s the stretch. I yelped.

https://www.mlb.com/news/christian-arroyo-plays-1st-mlb-game-at-1st-base

I mean, sure, but he had no chance at that play. Better to just field it off the base than fall into a split. A more experienced 1B might not have stretched there. And, might have been better at stretching without ripping his groin.

Seems like a fair criticism. They put him at a position he had never played, and he injured himself doing something only asked of that position.

richgedman'sghost · Jul 19, 2021

Captaincoop said:
Seems like a fair criticism. They put him at a position he had never played, and he injured himself doing something only asked of that position.

No I've seen lots of middle infielders often stretch for throws like a first baseman on force plays at second particularly if they know a double play is not possible at first. What Arroyo did was not uncommon to the position.
What Swithart did was play a completely foreign position with completely different movements than catcher.

richgedman'sghost · Jul 19, 2021

Sandy Leon Trotsky said:
Seems like we can blame this on Dalbec then.

Huh? Dalbec was on the bench. He only came into the game to replace Arroyo.

BroodsSexton · Jul 19, 2021

richgedman'sghost said:
Huh? Dalbec was on the bench. He only came into the game to replace Arroyo.

Exactly. He gets the blame for sucking.

Jed Zeppelin · Jul 19, 2021

richgedman'sghost said:
Huh? Dalbec was on the bench. He only came into the game to replace Arroyo.

The point is if Dalbec weren’t having such a dreadful season on both sides of the ball, there’s be less need to put anyone out of position to fill in for him.

gryoung · Jul 19, 2021

Red(s)HawksFan said:
Pulled his hamstring stretching for a throw at 1B. Bad enough he immediately left the game.

I can't wait for the chunderhead sports radio callers to decry him playing a new position and it getting him hurt immediately, a la Ellsbury or Swihart in LF.

As already stated, some criticism is actually warranted. Playing a new position for 1st time, making a move that was not necessary and would have been played differently by a seasoned player at that position, etc.

Outside of first base, the full stretch is not used by other infielders. A partial stretch, sure. Full split not so much.

We may see Jeter Downs sooner than planned.

Red(s)HawksFan · Jul 19, 2021

gryoung said:
As already stated, some criticism is actually warranted. Playing a new position for 1st time, making a move that was not necessary and would have been played differently by a seasoned player at that position, etc.

Outside of first base, the full stretch is not used by other infielders. A partial stretch, sure. Full split not so much.

We may see Jeter Downs sooner than planned.

Criticism of Arroyo for trying to do something he either wasn't physically capable of or something that was unwise/unnecessary in the situation? Sure, I get that.

Criticism of using Arroyo at 1B at all? That's what's for the chunderheads. Swihart, for example, got hurt (over?)aggressively pursing a flyball into foul territory. It was a fluke occurrence. Ellsbury got trucked by Adrian Beltre. Again, a fluke occurrence. But that didn't stop the chunderheads from ripping Sox management for playing those guys "out of position" in LF and causing their fluke injuries.

While he hasn't gotten hurt doing so, I've seen Dalbec making similar poor decisions that a more experienced 1B would know not to make (like backing off a short throw and catching it on a high hop instead of stretching to pick it on the short hop). Just as he'll figure it out with experience, so can Arroyo though unfortunately Christian might be learning the hard way.

Cesar Crespo · Jul 19, 2021

gryoung said:
As already stated, some criticism is actually warranted. Playing a new position for 1st time, making a move that was not necessary and would have been played differently by a seasoned player at that position, etc.

Outside of first base, the full stretch is not used by other infielders. A partial stretch, sure. Full split not so much.

We may see Jeter Downs sooner than planned.

We aren't seeing Jeter Downs anytime soon. You do see the year he's having in AAA right? .213/.288/.344. He's hitting worse than Dalbec in a much inferior league.

Red(s)HawksFan · Jul 19, 2021

Cesar Crespo said:
We aren't seeing Jeter Downs anytime soon. You do see the year he's having in AAA right? .213/.288/.344. He's hitting worse than Dalbec in a much inferior league.

Yeah, not to mention they have three other guys other than Arroyo who have already seen significant time at 2B this season. One might be on the IL and one might be in Worcester at the moment, but I suspect both remain well ahead of Downs on the organizational depth chart.

greek_gawd_of_walks · Jul 19, 2021

I don't know who we see to replace Arroyo, but Michael Chavis needs to be shot into the sun. He's about as useful as a raging case of hemorrhoids. Go with Arauz. At least he has a very good glove. And it's pretty much impossible to be worse than Chavis with the bat

cournoyer · Jul 19, 2021

greek_gawd_of_walks said:
I don't know who we see to replace Arroyo, but Michael Chavis needs to be shot into the sun. He's about as useful as a raging case of hemorrhoids. Go with Arauz. At least he has a very good glove. And it's pretty much impossible to be worse than Chavis with the bat

What's funny is he actually started off really strong in the Spring, I thought he'd be pushing Arroyo big time for the starting job this year. Of course, now we're 60 at bats in with a .200 average, one homer and -.5 WAR. He's looked as lost as ever, and as you alluded to he's just not a good fielder at any position.

Rovin Romine · Jul 19, 2021

Captaincoop said:
Seems like a fair criticism. They put him at a position he had never played, and he injured himself doing something only asked of that position.

Cora approaching Farrell.

View: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=98bDpmuIl9w

YTF · Jul 19, 2021

greek_gawd_of_walks said:
I don't know who we see to replace Arroyo, but Michael Chavis needs to be shot into the sun. He's about as useful as a raging case of hemorrhoids. Go with Arauz. At least he has a very good glove. And it's pretty much impossible to be worse than Chavis with the bat

I get what you're saying, but the need might be at first rather than second. Maybe it's Franchy time.

chawson · Jul 19, 2021

YTF said:
I get what you're saying, but the need might be at first rather than second. Maybe it's Franchy time.

I’m trying to verify this, but I believe that Franchy has played the requisite number of minor league games so as to trigger a fourth arb year of team control. So maybe it is.

gryoung · Jul 19, 2021

Cesar Crespo said:
We aren't seeing Jeter Downs anytime soon. You do see the year he's having in AAA right? .213/.288/.344. He's hitting worse than Dalbec in a much inferior league.

I see what he's doing/not doing in Worcester. It was a weak attempt at sarcasm. I'll practice more before I try again.

bsj · Jul 19, 2021

bsj said:
Arroyo at 1st. I love that Bloom is exploring all of these options. Doesn't take us out of the mix at the deadline, but just makes it less urgent if there isnt a good deal to be had.

Sorry.

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