Rangers allowed to have full capacity crowd with “ voluntary compliance” of masks requirement

bankshot1

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The point remains why risk spread of the virus, large scale infections, additional hosts for mutations, additional illness and deaths, when the vaccine seems to be working and with responsible government guidance, and a reliance on science and common sense social distancing and masking, we might be able to develop herd immunity in about 2 months.

oh right, Texans are mavericks and regulations are for other people.
 

DisgruntledSoxFan77

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The "majority" of people will never have the vaccine. And I'll make a friendly wager that a new strain will be here next winter, making this vaccination useless. We're on track for yearly Covid shots like we have flu shots. I think your baseline expectations arent going to end up being reasonable.
Perhaps, but this is the battle we're facing now. Keep the masks on and keep 6 feet away, maybe we can avoid the variance disaster. We've been wearing the masks for a year now. Is a little while longer that big a deal? I wear glasses and it's a bitch to keep my mask positioned to a degree where they don't fog up, but if I can make it work anyone else can too
 

Kenny F'ing Powers

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Perhaps, but this is the battle we're facing now. Keep the masks on and keep 6 feet away, maybe we can avoid the variance disaster. We've been wearing the masks for a year now. Is a little while longer that big a deal? I wear glasses and it's a bitch to keep my mask positioned to a degree where they don't fog up, but if I can make it work anyone else can too
I agree. But how long is "a little while longer"? Weve done this before. "Flatten the curve" and all. Another year? Five? Forever?
 

Red(s)HawksFan

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I agree. But how long is "a little while longer"? Weve done this before. "Flatten the curve" and all. Another year? Five? Forever?
How about until vaccination numbers reach a certain level? Say 50%? 60%? Whatever the CDC and health experts determine is appropriate.

10 months ago or even 4 months ago, the "how much longer?" question was more open ended and a stronger case for just saying fuck it. But there's now a finish line in sight with the vaccine roll-out. Now is not the time to say fuck it.
 

DisgruntledSoxFan77

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I agree. But how long is "a little while longer"? Weve done this before. "Flatten the curve" and all. Another year? Five? Forever?
Until the vaccine is available to anyone who wants it. Sure it's inconvenient and a little uncomfortable but it's a hell of a lot better than the alternative. A little while longer dude, it isn't that unreasonable when it's proven to be helping
 

PseuFighter

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I sorta agree that this is a test case, and like it or not, sooner than later, someone was going to be a first mover; zero surprise that it's Texas. I was surprised when I saw Colorado was going to 40%, but Maryland followed the next day with 50%. I guess this is all bound to happen and there's really not going to be any way to stop it.
 

YTF

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its not just texas, its MLB, there is no fucking chance this was announced without approval from Manfred. So Manfred seems perfectly fine killing fans for the Almighty $$$
Seems like Manfred is fine with the state of Texas being a willing guinea pig to gauge how quickly the rest of the league might expand attendance and relax social distancing protocols.
 

NJ_Sox_Fan

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How about until vaccination numbers reach a certain level? Say 50%? 60%? Whatever the CDC and health experts determine is appropriate.

10 months ago or even 4 months ago, the "how much longer?" question was more open ended and a stronger case for just saying fuck it. But there's now a finish line in sight with the vaccine roll-out. Now is not the time to say fuck it.
So what happens when by this winter there are 4 new strains that the current vaccines aren’t effective with? Shut everything again? If we wait for everything to be perfect we will be waiting forever. I just don’t see the big deal. No one is forcing 40k people to go to a game.
 

cadeni01

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Aug 15, 2009
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So what happens when by this winter there are 4 new strains that the current vaccines aren’t effective with? Shut everything again? If we wait for everything to be perfect we will be waiting forever. I just don’t see the big deal. No one is forcing 40k people to go to a game.
If there are 4 new strains that current vaccines aren't effective with it will be precisely because everything opened too quickly, before ~75% were vaccinated. Giving the virus more hosts makes it more likely that an escape variant will emerge.

And yes, if that happens, we'll be back in March 2020 again. So how about we not throw a pick-six when we're on the 1 yard line.
 

Red(s)HawksFan

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So what happens when by this winter there are 4 new strains that the current vaccines aren’t effective with? Shut everything again? If we wait for everything to be perfect we will be waiting forever. I just don’t see the big deal. No one is forcing 40k people to go to a game.
No one, including me in the post you quoted, is saying wait until everything is perfect. The point being made is that full capacity for Opening Day is too soon. If they'd come out and said 25% or 40% capacity as other teams are planning, this isn't a news story. The problem here is 100% capacity at this stage in the process.

You're right, no one is forcing 40K to go to the game. But some aspects of life are going to force thousands of people to interact with those 40K in the following days. Unless you believe the 40K will go to the game then go home and isolate for a week, this isn't just about the 40K in the ballpark. It never is just about the people at a given event.
 

bsj

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not specific to this but moreof a general statement moving forward...i really hope the tailgate ban doesnt become a thing into football season especially IF we are going allow full capacity.

every tailgate i have ever gone to is FAR more spread out than if am going to be in a full stadium. If we get to a point where we are allowing 60K in a football stadium, even with masks, we should be letting people spread farther out and have a beer together before the game
 

johnmd20

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No one, including me in the post you quoted, is saying wait until everything is perfect. The point being made is that full capacity for Opening Day is too soon. If they'd come out and said 25% or 40% capacity as other teams are planning, this isn't a news story. The problem here is 100% capacity at this stage in the process.

You're right, no one is forcing 40K to go to the game. But some aspects of life are going to force thousands of people to interact with those 40K in the following days. Unless you believe the 40K will go to the game then go home and isolate for a week, this isn't just about the 40K in the ballpark. It never is just about the people at a given event.
There are places in this country and in the world that have been going about their business like there wasn't even a pandemic happening. This game is a bad idea and it's an aggressive decision but it won't change the trajectory of the covid situation in any way.
 

joe dokes

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So what happens when by this winter there are 4 new strains that the current vaccines aren’t effective with? Shut everything again? If we wait for everything to be perfect we will be waiting forever. I just don’t see the big deal. No one is forcing 40k people to go to a game.
The "when" questions have been red herrings for 12 months now. One answer to "when" is "not now." The more sciency answer to "when" is probably when we reach some combination of vaccinated people and currently infected people.

The fact that the Rangers are allowing full capacity *only* for Opening Day undermines just about any defense of allowing full capacity for Opening Day.
 

NJ_Sox_Fan

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The "when" questions have been red herrings for 12 months now. One answer to "when" is "not now." The more sciency answer to "when" is probably when we reach some combination of vaccinated people and currently infected people.

The fact that the Rangers are allowing full capacity *only* for Opening Day undermines just about any defense of allowing full capacity for Opening Day.
I actually missed that it was only opening day. If they are opening to full capacity for opening day, it should be full capacity for all 81 home games.
 

cornwalls@6

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Completely stupid and premature by Texas, the Rangers, and MLB. Given the rate of the vaccine rollout, they may have even been able to do this safely by May, strong likelihood by the end of June. By jumping the gun, they've almost certainly ensured that this will be the mother of all super spreader events. I'm not a dogmatic, quarantine absolutist, particularly now that the vaccine is rolling out in earnest. I'm for phasing things back in, and even accelerating that process to a degree. But this is reckless and irresponsible, and smells like it's being driven by considerations that have little to do with sound public heath data and policy.
 
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geoduck no quahog

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It's the folks that have no choice but to work at jobs where they encounter thousands of maskless people in close proximity.

So, to all who'd like to go to those games, show some solidarity and don't wear a mask, squeeze yourself between strangers, catch a sneeze and a cough or two from the guy behind you...and show those workers how unplussed you are. It's the least you could do.

(You could practice at a local restaurant or bar in the meantime so that waitstaff also see you're willing to take the same risks.)

In short, what's the big deal about being conservative about stopping the spread of this thing? It's been a year. Maybe try to ease our way out of it instead of throwing the door wide open?
 

nvalvo

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Epidemiologically, it's just a terrible idea. That's obvious.

But from a PR perspective, it might be even worse. You have the New England Journal of Medicine out here saying that baseball stadiums (among other large scale vax sites) have been crucial to the response, and giving baseball an opportunity to talk about its important contributions to civil society — and then you go and let the Rangers do this, just because they want to launch their new stadium with a full crowd?

I get that it's really Governor Abbott's responsibility to prevent things like this, not Manfred's. But is Manfred confident (for example) that the players are going to be two weeks post-vaccination by Opening Day? Maybe the union should stop it.
 

Fishercat

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I'm a tiny bit surprised that people, especially folks here, still don't seem to grasp (or don't want to grasp) the concept that with a virus that is a substantial contagion that doesn't give one flying hoot about individual autonomous rights and that a non inconsequential portion of the population won't have the ability to avoid humanity for two weeks. It's not just the risk of the stadium goers to take, but everyone they interact with and we equated this theory to a myriad of other cultural phenomenon it wouldn't fly here at all.

That isn't to say anything about this proposal (I generally side with the folks here who agree that it's a bad idea even as I'm more amenable to more aggressive reopening proposals in every day life) itself. We won't be screwed due to this as a whole but I'd be stunned if some people, even among those who aren't at the game (or who are compelled to be at the game) aren't severely negatively effected by the decisions of others to be there and the MLB and Texas are prioritizing money and optics over it.
 

Red(s)HawksFan

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38,000 plus and only about 10% masked.

Idiots.
The thing I'm left wondering about is actually about the folks that were masked. As much as I disagree with them opening the park to full capacity at this point, I understand what all the maskless folks are doing. They're mostly comprised of the assholes who've been defying the mask mandates since the beginning. That they're there makes sense. The masked folks are more vexing to me.

While watching the highlights this morning, I was thinking I'd be masked if I was there, but there's not a chance in hell I'd put myself in that position in the first place. I miss going to games but not that much. So are those 10% masked folks simply responsible citizens who just couldn't wait any longer to attend? Are they vaccinated folks (so relatively safe themselves) who are making a statement with the masks? Something else?
 

Comfortably Lomb

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A consideration with masks, as most people on this forum are aware, is that they're more protective of others than the mask wearer. And not most effective unless both parties are wearing a mask. I'm assuming the mask wearers in the Rangers full capacity ballpark don't understand that nuance.
 

NJ_Sox_Fan

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Will be interesting to see if there is any spike. So far, the states with less restrictions really are not doing any worse than those states with the most restrictions. For example, Texas is doing far better than NJ.
 

Pablo's TB Lover

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Of course the loudest people on social media are saying "cases are down since the loosening of restrictions" yadda yadda. To have an argument with the shrillest voices is useless since they also happen to not know how viruses work, in that you need a few weeks at minimum to see the impact of regulations or non-regulation as the case may be. I'm going to keep an eye on Tarrant county over the next few weeks to see if anything drastically changes. Of course there will come a time that due to the majority of the most vulnerable people being vaccinated and the preponderance of asymptomatic cases amongst younger people, who don't realize it and are not tested, we'll continue the decline of cases even with significant reopening. I will fucking celebrate when this happens, although the reason for continued decline won't be what the virus deniers think it is.
 

Red Averages

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Has anyone seen the implications of the full stadium yet? Would be curious as a test case for re-opening if there were any lessons learned.
 

NYCSox

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And another SOSH Covid thread filled with panic, hysteria and preposterous hot takes (starting with the OP) goes to waste. Film at 11.
 

Light-Tower-Power

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Speaking of that - 12% capacity at Fenway is laughable. There are entire sections of the park that are completely empty. Surely they could go to 20% or 25% capacity or more and still keep people separated. Also hoping that there are plans for at least a half-full Garden come playoff time in a month, even if that means limiting attendance to those who are vaccinated.
 

Ale Xander

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Speaking of that - 12% capacity at Fenway is laughable. There are entire sections of the park that are completely empty. Surely they could go to 20% or 25% capacity or more and still keep people separated. Also hoping that there are plans for at least a half-full Garden come playoff time in a month, even if that means limiting attendance to those who are vaccinated.
Anyone know why BL 36 is always empty? (I know 34 and 35 are batters eye, but why 36?)
 

Light-Tower-Power

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Anyone know why BL 36 is always empty? (I know 34 and 35 are batters eye, but why 36?)
Yeah, that is what I noticed. It looks like the top 15 or so rows behind the bullpen are empty too. Not sure if it's intentional or just people don't want to sit alone in the nosebleeds.
 

PseuFighter

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Speaking of that - 12% capacity at Fenway is laughable. There are entire sections of the park that are completely empty. Surely they could go to 20% or 25% capacity or more and still keep people separated. Also hoping that there are plans for at least a half-full Garden come playoff time in a month, even if that means limiting attendance to those who are vaccinated.
i think the red sox have the tightest attendance cap in mlb at the moment.
 

azsoxpatsfan

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Yeah, that is what I noticed. It looks like the top 15 or so rows behind the bullpen are empty too. Not sure if it's intentional or just people don't want to sit alone in the nosebleeds.
I haven’t noticed that behind the bullpen, the guy who caught dugies homer was right behind it and the section looked as full as it could be given the 12.5%
 

Red Averages

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Has anyone seen data now that we are a few months out from this superspreader event, that show how many tens of thousands were impacted?
 

moondog80

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Has anyone seen data now that we are a few months out from this superspreader event, that show how many tens of thousands were impacted?
Immediately following Texas' opening up, hospitalizations increased by a fair amount...in Massachusetts. In Texas, they continued to decline at a steady rate.

https://www.mass.gov/info-details/covid-19-response-reporting#covid-19-interactive-data-dashboard-
https://txdshs.maps.arcgis.com/apps/dashboards/0d8bdf9be927459d9cb11b9eaef6101f
 

LogansDad

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Anecdotal, but I don't get the feeling they think there have been large spikes at all. In fact, MLB just removed their mask policy at the AA stadium I work at, and is no longer requiring fans to wear masks at all. I am still not allowed to let fans near the players for autographs, but at least I don't have to tell thousands of Arkansans to wear a mask every night just to have them smirk at me and ignore me.