There is absolutely, positively, unequivocally no way that Danny Ainge is moving Marcus Smart.
Unless he does, of course.
Celtics FA/Trade Rumors and News
- Thread starter RedOctober3829
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Unless he does, of course.
#6 has more value than one year of a guy who won't re-sign, if they want a vet to try and get the 8 seed, they can find ones on longer deals, or just more willing to be there.
Indy doesn't want Hayward that bad. I mean I'm sure they'd like him, but they aren't turning down a Jrue type deal to get him, no team is.
Under that logic, there is no possibility of the Celtics being a contender in the EC in the future either. They may as well clear out and restart.
So, probably was expected, but Zach Harper mentioned that Ainge was trying to get picks for Jrue before MIL blew it out of the water, and the way he was shopping for them was by offering up Kemba.
Probably expected, but makes it more clear that Kemba is decidedly available
Probably expected, but makes it more clear that Kemba is decidedly available
Boston has Tatum for a minimum of six years. Jrue and the The Beard are on the wrong side of 30. They might not be a contender in 2021 or 2022, but the Jay Crew will get better.
That fits with the rumors that the Knicks have cooled on Westbrook.They might see Walker as either an alternative or a chance to drive the asking price for RWB down. Giannis signing an extension would help Boston out to as teams hoarding cap space for him will start looking for alternatives if he commits to the Bucks.
Question: It would seem like Boston has enough assets to put in a very competitive bid for Harden (centered around JB and picks). The fact that he might otherwise end up on Brooklyn or Philly adds to the pressure to consider this. Any rumors that the Cs are in on this? If not, why not?
None I've heard.
And likely the answer is.... the Celtics aren't really interested in sending out the 4-5 unprotected 1sts down the line it would take to get Harden.
The Celtics are built around Tatum and Brown really. Harden changes your timeline, and also changes your team, you aren't a switch everything tough defensive team anymore, you aren't a find the right man shared offense with Tatum as the closer. You're going to be the Rockets, one way or another.
Here's another Isaac Okoro rumor: https://www.celticsblog.com/2020/11/17/21566927/what-exactly-is-boston-celtics-strategy-heading-into-the-nba-draft
They had a chat with Isaiah Stewart: https://celticswire.usatoday.com/2020/11/16/nba-boston-celtics-isaiah-stewart-fit-in-boston/
And were not impressed with Killian Hayes: https://celticswire.usatoday.com/2020/11/16/nba-boston-celtics-hayes-workout-dod-not-work-out-so-well/
They had a chat with Isaiah Stewart: https://celticswire.usatoday.com/2020/11/16/nba-boston-celtics-isaiah-stewart-fit-in-boston/
And were not impressed with Killian Hayes: https://celticswire.usatoday.com/2020/11/16/nba-boston-celtics-hayes-workout-dod-not-work-out-so-well/
I am not sure what the Chronomancer means here, can some-one help me decipher this tweet?
Harden on the Nets might be a shit-show of too much ego, not enough ball and not enough bench.
If 76ers can get Harden with Embiid and Simmons. that would be a beast and nightmare in the East. But who's left to trade that's remotely of interest, Horford and... Plus there would need to be basket of 1s going to Houston.
I don't want to see Harden on the Celts, I like the way they play the game, ball movement and D, and his throwing up 20 shots from 3-land would wear thin very quickly.
Weren't the C's one of the more iso heavy offenses last year? And there seemed to be no shortage of 3 chucking either.
Even if the 76ers could get Harden without giving up Simmons, I'm not sure how desirable it is. How does Harden function when put on the court with Simmons, who won't shoot 3s, and Embiid, who shouldn't shoot 3s? Not to mention Philly would really be hurting its depth since a deal without Simmons presumably includes Thybulle and Richardson plus. The depth issue is probably fixable with vet ring chasers, but is the basketball fit really there?
BSJ weighs in, speculating Brown, Smart and picks. I just don't see how KW and Harden make up a winning backcourt. Or Irving and Harden. Harden makes more sense for Philly, but you'd probably have to trade Simmons to make it a competitive offer.
https://www.bostonsportsjournal.com/2020/11/17/celtics-pursue-james-harden-trade/
https://www.bostonsportsjournal.com/2020/11/17/celtics-pursue-james-harden-trade/
I just took a look at some stats, Celts were #13 for 3s taken with 34.5 shots taken pg. League average was 34.1. Houston led the league with 45.3
https://www.basketball-reference.com/leagues/NBA_2020.html
scroll down a little
I doubt the Celtics are even considering Harden but I would not watch a single game if he were a Celtic. There is no player in the league I enjoy watching less. I’d rather go watch basketball at my local YMCA
Agreed. Putting aside whether the Celtics would even be a better team, Harden's style is extremely exhausting and frustrating to watch for a single game, much less an entire season + playoffs.
I can't imagine that Ainge isn't considering Harden. This is why he collects assets: to be poised when a top 5 player comes available. I'm not saying that he's going to trade Brown and Smart or partner Walker with Harden. But I'd be stunned if he isn't try to consummate a deal.
The only team with enough first round picks to tempt Houston into trading an MVP level player for Horford's ginormous contract is Oklahoma City. And it would cost them all 15 of them. If Harden is Philly bound it's because Simmons is outbound and Morey's building a contender around Harden and Embiid.
From Houston's perspective, if they get a package including Brown and Smart they could turn around and auction off Brown to a contender for a bunch of picks to help rebuild. I'm sure the Rockets would love to do this deal, but the chances that Danny would do it are about as much as I have of playing PG for the Celtics.
I suspect Jrue’s “decline” has more to do with the Pelicans system and pace while having less to do with his defensive ability eroding.
Just to put it out there....
Walker/Brown for Harden/Tucker/House works cap-wise. Add in picks as you'd think necessary.
Not saying I'd be in favor, but seems a closer call to me than Brown/Smart. Houston may well be able to do better but it depends on how they view things---and whether they are sure they are dumping Westbrook. Given they don't own their picks, it is not all that appealing to them to lost 60 games is it?
Walker/Brown for Harden/Tucker/House works cap-wise. Add in picks as you'd think necessary.
Not saying I'd be in favor, but seems a closer call to me than Brown/Smart. Houston may well be able to do better but it depends on how they view things---and whether they are sure they are dumping Westbrook. Given they don't own their picks, it is not all that appealing to them to lost 60 games is it?
I appreciate that the NBA is a star's league and that you very very rarely win without a top-5 kind of guy....and I still don't love idea of Harden.
It isn't happening, but you all are goddamn crazy if you don't think that Stevens would love love to build an offense around Harden and Tatum
I think part of it is that he doesn't have one of the top 5 defensive players in the league behind him.
Harden Tatum Smart is pretty damn good. It isnt my Celtics Utopia but I'm still all in. If I can watch Toine, Ricky, and Raef, I can watch Harden.
You don't build an offense around Harden and "player X", if his time in HOU has proven anything. You build around Harden.
That's my concern with Harden, he's had a lot of teammates in HOU and none of them worked out, and all of them ended badly and quickly. Harden is an elite player, he also seems to not be able/willing to team with anyone, and he's toxic in the lockerroom. He's like Kyrie in that his talent says he should elevate you, but the results seem to be plateaued.
I mean I hope that Boston's making calls so that Morey is forced to ante up for Harden, because a deal built around Harden for Simmons/Richardson seems natural. It allows Houston to compete while rebuilding.
If they have Simmons/Richardson coming in, can work out a deal with the Knicks to get off Westbrook, and then draft someone like Nesmith or Saddiq Bey at #16, they might not be half bad. Simmons at 6'10" 240 can be a point center in their five out offense. If they can work an RWB for #8 trade, adding Vassell and Saddiq Bey, with Richardson, Eric Gordon, and the rest of their floor-spacing roleplayers they could make an actual playoff run.
Remember that Jordan didn’t win his first title til age 27. Neither did LeBron. It’s ok if it takes the J’s a few more years.
Yeah, no. Harden makes a lot of money. Hayward would have to be playing for Marcus money for that to make financial sense.
Again, I'm not advocating the rumored package, but I suspect that Ainge is in the discussion just like he was when Kyrie became available. This type of opportunity is the reason that he collects assets.
If you trade for Harden honestly you're committing to blowing out the tax ceiling for 2-3 years. You don't mortgage the future and trade Brown plus, to then cheap out on Hayward. You're all in on the short window
Yeah, that's the point. Assuming that the Harden to Philly rumors have merit, even though Boston might not seriously challenge for an EC title in '21 or '22, they're still going to have an MVP level player and a likely all star one to build around.
Boston is in the enviable position of having a young core that's matured in to team leadership roles. In the previous stage everything was about getting the team the vet leaders needed to teach the kids how to win. Now Marcus and Jaylen are ready to assume those roles and they can feel absolutely comfortable going forward shedding Hayward and walker knowing that in '23 they're absolutely going to be competing for titles.
You aren't keeping three 30% max guys in addition to a 35% max one. You're talking about $150 million on just four guys. Saying pay the tax sounds good in theory until the payroll bills start exceeding $300 million and the team starts losing money.
Not saying that they couldn't keep him, but it remains to be seen how they handle their roster after the Harden/Westbrook trades. If they could get good returns for guys like Brown, Dinwiddie, etc. why not look to stockpile a bunch of picks and have payroll flexibility while rebuilding? They're certainly not winning anything with the guys they get back for their stars, so tearing it down to the studs may be the way to go.
Yes I agree with you. I think a tandem of Harden and Tatum surrounded by quality role players can win the East.
The only team with the logical capital is Oklahoma City, and all Houston would be getting back is one of their picks. And while getting their '21 pick would help in an implosion, keeping Brown and preventing the implosion is probably better.
For 1 year remember, then you decide what to do with Hayward.
More likely though, if you trade Smart and Brown for Harden, you want to keep Hayward long-term and dump Kemba, the fit of Kemba and Harden is awful.