This seems to be not a problem for most of this board and the Patriots organization. Apparently everyone is just fine with scoring 21 points a game but holding the Bills, Chiefs, Bengals, Dolphins, and now probably the Jets to 24. I don't get it and I feel like I'm taking crazy pills.B
Wasn’t our (far and away) biggest weakness last year not being able to score points? Love Gonzalez, but we’re going into the fourth round and our biggest playmaker is JuJu Smith-Schuster.
Would it be better to score 24 while allowing 27? They addressed two high value positions of need with guys who were great scheme fits at draft slots 10+ picks back of where most experts projected them to go. It’s just really hard not to be happy with that.This seems to be not a problem for most of this board and the Patriots organization. Apparently everyone is just fine with scoring 21 points a game but holding the Bills, Chiefs, Bengals, Dolphins, and now probably the Jets to 24. I don't get it and I feel like I'm taking crazy pills.
I don’t get it either. We need weapons (plural) on offense to compete in our division. But thank God for special teams aces.This seems to be not a problem for most of this board and the Patriots organization. Apparently everyone is just fine with scoring 21 points a game but holding the Bills, Chiefs, Bengals, Dolphins, and now probably the Jets to 24. I don't get it and I feel like I'm taking crazy pills.
Sure, but going into the draft we had some talent on defense. We have none outside Rham on offense. This team is going to give up 24 to the Chiefs, Bills, and probably Jets of the world and score 14-17.Would it be better to score 24 while allowing 27? They addressed two high value positions of need with guys who were great scheme fits at draft slots 10+ picks back of where most experts projected them to go. It’s just really hard not to be happy with that.
also.. I mean, how many rookies are true impact players on offense.Would it be better to score 24 while allowing 27? They addressed two high value positions of need with guys who were great scheme fits at draft slots 10+ picks back of where most experts projected them to go. It’s just really hard not to be happy with that.
Nobody drafted in the 3rd round is likely to be better than any of these guys next year:Sure, but going into the draft we had some talent on defense. We have none outside Rham on offense. This team is going to give up 24 to the Chiefs, Bills, and probably Jets of the world and score 14-17.
Problem is, you can't have it both ways as a GM. You can't say "we won't trade the draft capital to acquire an elite WR via trade" and then at not figure out a way, even if a trade up is the way to do so, to get that weapon in the draft. Doing that means that yet again, for probably at least the 15th season in the Belichick era, entering the season with a bottom 10 WR corps and without the GOAT who could make them better because of how great he was.The weaponz argument is fine, but like... what offensive player could they have drafted with either of their last 2 picks who would have projected to be a significant upgrade this year?
Definitely not a TE or RB. Which leaves a bunch of ~ok WR. Would any of them be significant upgrades over JuJu, Parker & Bourne this year?
I think you’re overstating the talent level of the defense. Besides Judon, Dugger, and maybe healthy Barmore there aren’t any real impact guys and that’s probably why the Pats have struggled against top offenses. They might actually have a chance to get off the field on 3rd down a couple times against Buffalo now.Sure, but going into the draft we had some talent on defense. We have none outside Rham on offense. This team is going to give up 24 to the Chiefs, Bills, and probably Jets of the world and score 14-17.
I would quibble that any tight end coming out of college can be considered a 1. The position is almost always trash in the first season or two and a lot of guys never pan out at all, including supposed can’t miss 1st rounders.There were #1 TE’s though for the long-term and Downs projects as a guy that can be a real threat to move chains. Not to mention, this was a fairly deep CB class, and you could have taken JSN instead of Gonzalez and a Smith, Stevenson, or Turner in R2 @ CB.
There’s always a talent trade-off in R2, I get that, but right now our DB room is more talented than our WR room (so much so that the team is raiding the DB room to fill voids at the WR position).
I’m not unhappy with the first two picks. Just questioning what the hell BB is trying to build to compete with KC and Buffalo?
I sure hope you’re right, here. No pressure, BOB.Yes, offense still needs work surely but really really bad coaching skewed things.
There aren't any elite WRs available through trade. & maybe they'll still make a move for a DHop or Jeudy, but those guys aren't going to do much to mask Mac's actual limitations. So we might as well take some pressure off him by playing defense & hopefully not getting down early, allowing the run & play action games to cook.Problem is, you can't have it both ways as a GM. You can't say "we won't trade the draft capital to acquire an elite WR via trade" and then at not figure out a way, even if a trade up is the way to do so, to get that weapon in the draft. Doing that means that yet again, for probably at least the 15th season in the Belichick era, entering the season with a bottom 10 WR corps and without the GOAT who could make them better because of how great he was.
I would be willing to bet no more than 2 of the top 8 end up better than either Gesicki or Henry, decent change none of them are. We have good TEs, I'm baffled by people acting like Dalton Kincaid and Luke Musgrave are locks to be better than either of those guys.I would quibble that any tight end coming out of college can be considered a 1. The position is almost always trash in the first season or two and a lot of guys never pan out at all, including supposed can’t miss 1st rounders.
I’m not sure that’s true? Dugger is definitely better than any of the TE/WR core, but beyond that are you sure that’s the case? Like, JuJu/Parker/Bourne feels kinda analogous to the Joneses and Mills. Solid guys, but no real number 1, and can get exposed against elite opponents.There’s always a talent trade-off in R2, I get that, but right now our DB room is more talented than our WR room (so much so that the team is raiding the DB room to fill voids at the WR position).
If your goal is competing with KC & Buffalo, covering Kelce & Kincaid would be a pretty good place to start. If this guy can actually do those things.There were #1 TE’s though for the long-term and Downs projects as a guy that can be a real threat to move chains. Not to mention, this was a fairly deep CB class, and you could have taken JSN instead of Gonzalez and a Smith, Stevenson, or Turner in R2 @ CB.
There’s always a talent trade-off in R2, I get that, but right now our DB room is more talented than our WR room (so much so that the team is raiding the DB room to fill voids at the WR position).
I’m not unhappy with the first two picks. Just questioning what the hell BB is trying to build to compete with KC and Buffalo?
This is my hope. As a fan watching on TV, not to mention the success of the team, watching the inability of the defense, despite being a high quality unit, to make critical plays to get off the field is one of the more frustrating experiences.I think you’re overstating the talent level of the defense. Besides Judon, Dugger, and maybe healthy Barmore there aren’t any real impact guys and that’s probably why the Pats have struggled against top offenses. They might actually have a chance to get off the field on 3rd down a couple times against Buffalo now.
The bottom line is that their defense was not the problem and is typically not the problem. They had a historically pathetic offense and apparently most of you believe that adding Bill O'Brien, JuJu, Gesicki, Rieff and Calvin Anderson is an appropriate deployment of resources to address their problems.In the first and second rounds we drafted the best player available that also filled a major need and were perfect scheme fits. It’s hard to argue with that.
I'll concede that I should have worded it better. Defense is a problem but not nearly as much of an issue as the offense is. I feel like we are mostly on the same page otherwise so I'll just stop here.I agree that the offense was, and is, in dire need of an influx of protection for Mac and playmakers. TE was a deep position in this draft and now even that Kraft guy is gone. I do NOT agree that the D has not been a problem. They have more talent on that side of the ball, but have sneaky-struggled to shut down above average offenses.
Hoping White and Gonzalez pan out as some here expect, but I feel like it’s reckless/stubborn/shortsighted for BB to just watch as the offensive parade passes by. How exactly is anyone meant to properly evaluate Mac in 2024 with these fairly pedestrian “weapons?” I love BOB and think he’ll improve the O, but not THAT much bc there ain’t that much there. Is Thornton going to make an enormous leap? I hope so.
They’d better hope so too.
I mean if it's about evaluating Mac.... who could they have drafted that helps there? I mean that honestly. No TE drafted will be as good this year as either of the 2 on the roster (rookie TEs are almost always not good), at WR... what maybe JSN? They had the bad luck to have a top 15 pick in a draft where the only blue chip immediate impact offensive talent was at QB and RB.I agree that the offense was, and is, in dire need of an influx of protection for Mac and playmakers. TE was a deep position in this draft and now even that Kraft guy is gone. I do NOT agree that the D has not been a problem. They have more talent on that side of the ball, but have sneaky-struggled to shut down above average offenses.
Hoping White and Gonzalez pan out as some here expect, but I feel like it’s reckless/stubborn/shortsighted for BB to just watch as the offensive parade passes by. How exactly is anyone meant to properly evaluate Mac in 2024 with these fairly pedestrian “weapons?” I love BOB and think he’ll improve the O, but not THAT much bc there ain’t that much there. Is Thornton going to make an enormous leap? I hope so.
They’d better hope so too.
Yes, I totally get that. This will be another rebuilding block year, I can’t imagine the team making an offensive leap into the stratosphere of a Buffalo or KC or even the NYJ, at this point. I guess I just feel like you have to start somewhere, and you’ve got those teams, along with a divisional team like Miami, who are wildly better at the offensive weapons position, and we need to BEGIN to address it.This idea that we were going to come into this draft, and grab some WR or TE that was going to transform this offense, and be so amazing that we could score with KC and BUF and CIN with their much better QBs was delusional. There is no Jamar Chase in this draft, there is no Jaylen Waddle.
yeah, the thing to me is... if we take say.... Perry and Scott at 107 and 117. If we took either of those guys at 76 people would have been happy. Heck we probably could have taken them at 46 and people would have said "well we need WR". I like Warren not much if any less than Steen, others are big fans of SAldiveri, Jones or DuncanPsst. *whispers* The WRs day 3... some of them are pretty good. And the RBs too. And there are a couple of OTs... and, oh yeah, some really good IOL prospects too!
A+ because the first two picks are A+s and the third one makes a ton of sense. I weight based on likely impact and ceilings and they got two guys with all-pro or pro-bowl kind of traits.
You got a top 5-6-7 pick at 17 and added a 4th. You got a top 30 pick at 46. Both are valuable positions and could change the defense. When Phillips leaves and Peppers goes you will have Mapu. I love this so much. This is so much better than last year imo.
Better than Gesicki? He couldn't get open with Hill and Waddle dragging defenses attention on every play. And Gesicki and Henry might actually be the worst top 2 tight ends when it comes to blocking, a huge part of their job, in the entire league. Arookie TE may not cone in and drop Gronk receiving numbers, but a bunch of them aren't literal turnstiles either.I would be willing to bet no more than 2 of the top 8 end up better than either Gesicki or Henry, decent change none of them are. We have good TEs, I'm baffled by people acting like Dalton Kincaid and Luke Musgrave are locks to be better than either of those guys.
Also, let's point out the obvious... no WR or TE makes us competitive with BUF or KC, they have elite QBs, we don't, we aren't beating them with our offense scoring a ton of points, if we want to compete a big part of it will be defense, and that's a big part of where BUF in particular has killed us, we can't cover Diggs or Knox and we didn't ahve the speed and pass rush to contain and/or sack Allen.