2023 Hall of Fame Finalists

E5 Yaz

Transcends message boarding
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
Apr 25, 2002
90,020
Oregon
The 2023 modern-era player finalists with their positions, years and teams:
  • Jared Allen, DE – 2004-2007 Kansas City Chiefs, 2008-2013 Minnesota Vikings, 2014-2015 Chicago Bears, 2015 Carolina Panthers
  • Willie Anderson, OT -- 1996-2007 Cincinnati Bengals, 2008 Baltimore Ravens
  • Ronde Barber, DB – 1997-2012 Tampa Bay Buccaneers
  • Dwight Freeney, DE -- 2002-2012 Indianapolis Colts, 2013-14 San Diego Chargers, 2015 Arizona Cardinals, 2016 Atlanta Falcons, 2017 Detroit Lions, 2017 Seattle Seahawks
  • Devin Hester, PR/KR/WR -- 2006-2013 Chicago Bears, 2014-2015 Atlanta Falcons, 2016 Baltimore Ravens, 2016 Seattle Seahawks
  • Torry Holt, WR -- 1999-2008 St. Louis Rams, 2009 Jacksonville Jaguars
  • Andre Johnson, WR -- 2003-2014 Houston Texans, 2015 Indianapolis Colts, 2016 Tennessee Titans
  • Albert Lewis, CB -- 1983-1993 Kansas City Chiefs, 1994-1998 Los Angeles/Oakland Raiders
  • Darrelle Revis, CB -- 2007-2012/2015-16 New York Jets, 2013 Tampa Bay Buccaneers, 2014 New England Patriots, 2017 Kansas City Chiefs
  • Zach Thomas, LB -- 1996-2007 Miami Dolphins, 2008 Dallas Cowboys
  • Joe Thomas, LT -- 2007-2017 Cleveland Browns
  • DeMarcus Ware, LB -- 2005-2013 Dallas Cowboys, 2014-2016 Denver Broncos
  • Reggie Wayne, WR -- 2001-2014 Indianapolis Colts
  • Patrick Willis, LB -- 2007-2014 San Francisco 49ers
  • Darren Woodson, S -- 1992-2003 Dallas Cowboys
In addition to the modern-era finalists will be senior finalists Chuck Howley, Joe Klecko and Ken Riley, and contributor/coach finalist Don Coryell.

https://www.nfl.com/news/finalists-for-pro-football-hall-of-fame-class-of-2023-revealed
 
Last edited:

bsj

Renegade Crazed Genius
SoSH Member
Dec 6, 2003
22,774
Central NJ SoSH Chapter
Revis, Freeney, Allen, Thomas...I dont know how you can vote Johnson and not Wayne or vice versa. Their numbers are so damn close.

Wayne
14 seasons
14,345 rec yards
82 rec TD
13.4 yds per rec

Johnson
14 seasons
14,185 rec yards
70 rec TD
13.4 yds per rec
 

BigSoxFan

Member
SoSH Member
May 31, 2007
47,094
Revis, Freeney, Allen, Thomas...I dont know how you can vote Johnson and not Wayne or vice versa. Their numbers are so damn close.

Wayne
14 seasons
14,345 rec yards
82 rec TD
13.4 yds per rec

Johnson
14 seasons
14,185 rec yards
70 rec TD
13.4 yds per rec
Johnson’s are more impressive when you consider that he had Schaub throwing to him while Wayne had Manning and Harrison to take attention away. Johnson basically got DJ Moore’d every year.
 

BigSoxFan

Member
SoSH Member
May 31, 2007
47,094
Yeah I feel the same re Freeney. I suspect both are on outside this round but who knows
I think Ware’s peak was higher than Freeney’s but, yeah, good luck differentiating between Allen, Freeney, and Ware. All are deserving and should eventually get in soon.
 

Rudy's Curve

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 4, 2006
2,333
Blind homer alert, but Willie Anderson is likely the best RT in modern football history - here's a good thread recognizing how hard it was to be honored at RT, and he made four straight AP teams with three first-teams. This is a loaded class and Joe Thomas will get in for sure which probably hurts him, but he's got a damn good case.
 
Last edited:

E5 Yaz

Transcends message boarding
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
Apr 25, 2002
90,020
Oregon
The players eliminated in this round
  • Eric Allen, cornerback
  • Anquan Boldin, wide receiver
  • Henry Ellard, wide receiver
  • Jahri Evans, offensive guard
  • London Fletcher, linebacker
  • James Harrison, linebacker
  • Rodney Harrison, safety
  • Robert Mathis, defensive end/linebacker
  • Steve Smith Sr., wide receiver
  • Fred Taylor, running back
  • Hines Ward, wide receiver
  • Ricky Watters, running back
  • Vince Wilfork, defensive tackle
https://www.nfl.com/news/pro-football-hall-of-fame-reveals-28-semifinalists-for-class-of-2023
 
Last edited:

E5 Yaz

Transcends message boarding
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
Apr 25, 2002
90,020
Oregon
Is Reggie Wayne a finalist or eliminated?
Finalist ... still cross-checking

edit: You'd think they would have included this in their story, but then they didn't even get the full list right the first time
 

AB in DC

OG Football Writing
SoSH Member
Jul 10, 2002
13,632
Springfield, VA
What's the story with Albert Lewis? He's never been a finalist before, and I don't remember ever seeing him on a semifinalist list, either.
 

Seels

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 20, 2005
4,948
NH
The 2023 modern-era player finalists with their positions, years and teams:
  • Jared Allen, DE – 2004-2007 Kansas City Chiefs, 2008-2013 Minnesota Vikings, 2014-2015 Chicago Bears, 2015 Carolina Panthers
  • Willie Anderson, OT -- 1996-2007 Cincinnati Bengals, 2008 Baltimore Ravens
  • Ronde Barber, DB – 1997-2012 Tampa Bay Buccaneers
  • Dwight Freeney, DE -- 2002-2012 Indianapolis Colts, 2013-14 San Diego Chargers, 2015 Arizona Cardinals, 2016 Atlanta Falcons, 2017 Detroit Lions, 2017 Seattle Seahawks
  • Devin Hester, PR/KR/WR -- 2006-2013 Chicago Bears, 2014-2015 Atlanta Falcons, 2016 Baltimore Ravens, 2016 Seattle Seahawks
  • Torry Holt, WR -- 1999-2008 St. Louis Rams, 2009 Jacksonville Jaguars
  • Andre Johnson, WR -- 2003-2014 Houston Texans, 2015 Indianapolis Colts, 2016 Tennessee Titans
  • Albert Lewis, CB -- 1983-1993 Kansas City Chiefs, 1994-1998 Los Angeles/Oakland Raiders
  • Darrelle Revis, CB -- 2007-2012/2015-16 New York Jets, 2013 Tampa Bay Buccaneers, 2014 New England Patriots, 2017 Kansas City Chiefs
  • Zach Thomas, LB -- 1996-2007 Miami Dolphins, 2008 Dallas Cowboys
  • Joe Thomas, LT -- 2007-2017 Cleveland Browns
  • DeMarcus Ware, LB -- 2005-2013 Dallas Cowboys, 2014-2016 Denver Broncos
  • Reggie Wayne, WR -- 2001-2014 Indianapolis Colts
  • Patrick Willis, LB -- 2007-2014 San Francisco 49ers
  • Darren Woodson, S -- 1992-2003 Dallas Cowboys
In addition to the modern-era finalists will be senior finalists Chuck Howley, Joe Klecko and Ken Riley, and contributor/coach finalist Don Coryell.

https://www.nfl.com/news/finalists-for-pro-football-hall-of-fame-class-of-2023-revealed
Barber, Revis, Joe Thomas, Ware, Willis, Woodson.

I see a lot of talk about Zach Thomas making it but he was never a HoF in my eyes.

Wayne will eventually make it in, but not this year.
 

Kliq

Member
SoSH Member
Mar 31, 2013
22,673
There is a big glut of both wide receivers and pass rushers with very similar credentials, so it's hard for people to differentiate themselves. Steve Smith might be the receiver with the best case and he didn't make the finals.

I really think Ronde Barber is getting overlooked. He was an excellent, complete corner who forced a lot of turnovers and also tackled really well. He compares favorably to a guy like Revis, who has a briefly higher peak but nowhere close to the longevity.
 

bsj

Renegade Crazed Genius
SoSH Member
Dec 6, 2003
22,774
Central NJ SoSH Chapter
There is a big glut of both wide receivers and pass rushers with very similar credentials, so it's hard for people to differentiate themselves. Steve Smith might be the receiver with the best case and he didn't make the finals.

I really think Ronde Barber is getting overlooked. He was an excellent, complete corner who forced a lot of turnovers and also tackled really well. He compares favorably to a guy like Revis, who has a briefly higher peak but nowhere close to the longevity.
Fitz is gonna be a first ballot guy, right? His numbers blow away all the other WRs on this list.
 

Saints Rest

Well-Known Member
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
Johnson’s are more impressive when you consider that he had Schaub throwing to him while Wayne had Manning and Harrison to take attention away. Johnson basically got DJ Moore’d every year.
I agree completely. Wayne also had Edgerrin James and Dallas Clark pulling defense's attention away from him.

In year-end accolades:
Wayne had one first-team All-Pro; two second team; and six Pro Bowls.
Johnson had 2, 2, and 7.
 

tims4wins

PN23's replacement
SoSH Member
Jul 15, 2005
37,059
Hingham, MA
So the committee can select up to 8 players. Here's my ballot:

Willie Anderson
Darrelle Revis
Zach Thomas
DeMarcus Ware
Dwight Freeney
Ronde Barber
Andre Johnson
Joe Thomas

I leave Holt and Wayne off due to the surrounding talent issue that's been discussed. They probably get in on a future ballot.

Not sure that Allen, Hester, Lewis, Willis, or Woodson will / should ever make it.
 

Rudy's Curve

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 4, 2006
2,333
So the committee can select up to 8 players. Here's my ballot:

Willie Anderson
Darrelle Revis
Zach Thomas
DeMarcus Ware
Dwight Freeney
Ronde Barber
Andre Johnson
Joe Thomas

I leave Holt and Wayne off due to the surrounding talent issue that's been discussed. They probably get in on a future ballot.

Not sure that Allen, Hester, Lewis, Willis, or Woodson will / should ever make it.
I'd be more likely to say Willis gets in on the first ballot than doesn't make it. He obviously didn't have a long career by HOF standards, but he had a huge peak - DROY, six consecutive AP teams (five first-team) and a 20 AV season. He was the premier player at his position for a pretty good stretch.
 

E5 Yaz

Transcends message boarding
Lifetime Member
SoSH Member
Apr 25, 2002
90,020
Oregon
So the committee can select up to 8 players. Here's my ballot:

Willie Anderson
Darrelle Revis
Zach Thomas
DeMarcus Ware
Dwight Freeney
Ronde Barber
Andre Johnson
Joe Thomas

I leave Holt and Wayne off due to the surrounding talent issue that's been discussed. They probably get in on a future ballot.

Not sure that Allen, Hester, Lewis, Willis, or Woodson will / should ever make it.
Does the eight the committee picks include the senior candidates? Because I don't think they would shut out the senior picks
 

tims4wins

PN23's replacement
SoSH Member
Jul 15, 2005
37,059
Hingham, MA
Does the eight the committee picks include the senior candidates? Because I don't think they would shut out the senior picks
I was wrong, it's 9 now, but only 5 modern era players

Therefore, the new max class size of nine would include up to five modern-era players, as many as three seniors and up to one coach/contributor.

Re-casted ballot:

Willie Anderson
Darrelle Revis
Zach Thomas
DeMarcus Ware
Dwight Freeney
Ronde Barber

Andre Johnson
Joe Thomas
 

Ralphwiggum

Member
SoSH Member
Jun 27, 2012
9,827
Needham, MA
My votes:
Darrelle Revis
Joe Thomas
Patrick Willis
Andre Johnson
DeMarcus Ware

I don't think Zach Thomas is a HOFer. Willis to me gets in as a high peak guy. Particularly in the NFL I think you have to recognize guys who were great but had shorter careers than some others.
 

coremiller

Member
SoSH Member
Jul 14, 2005
5,846
I wouldn't be surprised if 13 of the finalists eventually get in. I don't see a case for Lewis and Woodson, and I'm not pro-Hester but I understand there are arguments. Everyone else has a solid case.

I think Joe Thomas and Revis are easy first-ballot choices. After that, I'd take Allen, Ware, and Willis (homer pick for me as an SF fan). I think Ware and Allen were more complete players than Freeney (who was an infamous run-game liability).

I would rank the receivers Johnson, Holt, Wayne, in that order, but it's picking hairs. My only real complaint is that I think Steve Smith might have been better than any of the three receivers who made the finalist list. But he played on run-oriented teams with mediocre QBs so outside of 2005 he didn't put up great single-season stats and accordingly didn't get a lot of all-pro recognition.
 

Mystic Merlin

Member
SoSH Member
Sep 21, 2007
46,769
Hartford, CT
My votes:
Darrelle Revis
Joe Thomas
Patrick Willis
Andre Johnson
DeMarcus Ware

I don't think Zach Thomas is a HOFer. Willis to me gets in as a high peak guy. Particularly in the NFL I think you have to recognize guys who were great but had shorter careers than some others.
I agree Willis should ultimately get in the HOF, whether this year or next year. Why isn't Thomas a HOFer? The biggest distinguishing characteristics between he and Urlacher are seemingly draft stock and hype. Thomas had 7 All Pro nods and was a member of the 2000s All-Decade Team, and his counting stats are very impressive/compare favorably to Urlacher.
 

Ralphwiggum

Member
SoSH Member
Jun 27, 2012
9,827
Needham, MA
I agree Willis should ultimately get in the HOF, whether this year or next year. Why isn't Thomas a HOFer? The biggest distinguishing characteristics between he and Urlacher are seemingly draft stock and hype. Thomas had 7 All Pro nods and was a member of the 2000s All-Decade Team, and his counting stats are very impressive/compare favorably to Urlacher.
Fair enough. I just remember him as a very good not great player but I certainly could be underrating him.
 

Kliq

Member
SoSH Member
Mar 31, 2013
22,673
Patrick Willis and Luke Kuechly have almost the exact same career to the degree that it's eerie.
 

Deathofthebambino

Drive Carefully
SoSH Member
Apr 12, 2005
41,948
The 2023 modern-era player finalists with their positions, years and teams:
  • Jared Allen, DE – 2004-2007 Kansas City Chiefs, 2008-2013 Minnesota Vikings, 2014-2015 Chicago Bears, 2015 Carolina Panthers
  • Willie Anderson, OT -- 1996-2007 Cincinnati Bengals, 2008 Baltimore Ravens
  • Ronde Barber, DB – 1997-2012 Tampa Bay Buccaneers
  • Dwight Freeney, DE -- 2002-2012 Indianapolis Colts, 2013-14 San Diego Chargers, 2015 Arizona Cardinals, 2016 Atlanta Falcons, 2017 Detroit Lions, 2017 Seattle Seahawks
  • Devin Hester, PR/KR/WR -- 2006-2013 Chicago Bears, 2014-2015 Atlanta Falcons, 2016 Baltimore Ravens, 2016 Seattle Seahawks
  • Torry Holt, WR -- 1999-2008 St. Louis Rams, 2009 Jacksonville Jaguars
  • Andre Johnson, WR -- 2003-2014 Houston Texans, 2015 Indianapolis Colts, 2016 Tennessee Titans
  • Albert Lewis, CB -- 1983-1993 Kansas City Chiefs, 1994-1998 Los Angeles/Oakland Raiders
  • Darrelle Revis, CB -- 2007-2012/2015-16 New York Jets, 2013 Tampa Bay Buccaneers, 2014 New England Patriots, 2017 Kansas City Chiefs
  • Zach Thomas, LB -- 1996-2007 Miami Dolphins, 2008 Dallas Cowboys
  • Joe Thomas, LT -- 2007-2017 Cleveland Browns
  • DeMarcus Ware, LB -- 2005-2013 Dallas Cowboys, 2014-2016 Denver Broncos
  • Reggie Wayne, WR -- 2001-2014 Indianapolis Colts
  • Patrick Willis, LB -- 2007-2014 San Francisco 49ers
  • Darren Woodson, S -- 1992-2003 Dallas Cowboys
In addition to the modern-era finalists will be senior finalists Chuck Howley, Joe Klecko and Ken Riley, and contributor/coach finalist Don Coryell.

https://www.nfl.com/news/finalists-for-pro-football-hall-of-fame-class-of-2023-revealed
For me, Anderson and Joe Thomas are automatic. Two of the best OLineman to ever play the game.

After that it gets hairy for the next 3 spots. Of the 3 defensive backs, I'm putting in Ronde Barber over Revis and Woodson (although unlike many here, Woodson is my 2nd choice over Revis. Woodson had almost the same numbers as Revis over his career, while playing safety and making double the amount of tackles).

Then you have the 3 pass rushers. Allen, Freeney and Ware.

Here's some numbers:

Allen: 187 games, 6 ints, 32 FF, 19 FR, 136 sacks, 648 tackles (171 for losses), 228QB hits, 4 safeties,5 time all pro, 4 career td's.
Freeney: 218 games, O ints, 47ff, 4FR, 125.5 sacks, 350 tackles (120 for losses), 148 QB hits, 1 safety, 5 time all pro, 1td
Ware: 178 games, 3 ints, 35 FF, 8FR, 138.5 sacks, 657 tackles (171 for losses), 229 QB hits, 7 time all pro, 3 td's.

I think Freeney is out based on the numbers, as he didn't do as much outside of rushing the passer. Based on the numbers alone, I'd probably go Ware, but leaving Allen off the ballot hurts.

I want Andre Johnson to get in, because he's a friend of my brother's. And I think Hester should get in too, but I think he can get in during upcoming years.

So I'm going with

Anderson
Joe Thomas
Ronde
Ware
Andre Johnson/Allen
 

Average Game James

Member
SoSH Member
Apr 28, 2016
4,346

tims4wins

PN23's replacement
SoSH Member
Jul 15, 2005
37,059
Hingham, MA
I mean, on raw counting numbers, sure. But Zach Thomas was a 5x first team all pro. Bruschi made a couple 2nd teams, I think? I always thought Thomas was the poster child for how undervalued MLB were by the hall voters - seemed nuts to me that a guy who was the best at his position for half a decade was struggling to make it in.
But why did Thomas make more teams?
 

Ed Hillel

Wants to be startin somethin
SoSH Member
Dec 12, 2007
43,559
Here
I mean look at the tackling numbers, they are world’s apart. Thomas was a better player, and I LOVE Bruschi.
 

Ed Hillel

Wants to be startin somethin
SoSH Member
Dec 12, 2007
43,559
Here
There's no sport where basic stats are less valuable than football.

Maybe pickleball, but probably not.
For a middle linebacker, tackles are a pretty darned good indication of production.

I also don't really agree with the general assertion, but that's another story.
I get it, but tackles can be an overrated stat. Who made more big plays?
Bruschi made more plays in big games because his team was much better and played in more big games. I think those work in favor of Bruschi, who probably still falls just short of being a Hall of Fame level player, but it can't take anything away from Thomas imo. The team around him was not very good.
 

Kenny F'ing Powers

posts way less than 18% useful shit
SoSH Member
Nov 17, 2010
14,427
Yeah, I love Tedy, but he's not in the same league as Thomas. Tackles may not be the best way to analyze success, but for a guy like Thomas, its a pretty good indicator of how good he was. He was really, really good at getting downhill fast, and was somehow even better with his sideline-to-sideline speed/anticipation.

If tackles are a poor indicator of success, than SB rings should be homeless.Being on a SB team is the end goal every season, but it certainly isnt a barometer of skill.

Was Zach Thomas one of the best players ever? Probably not. But he WAS on of the best middle linebackers ever. Im fine with him being in the HoF.
 

Ale Xander

Hamilton
SoSH Member
Oct 31, 2013
72,464
For a middle linebacker, tackles are a pretty darned good indication of production.

I also don't really agree with the general assertion, but that's another story.
Bruschi made more plays in big games because his team was much better and played in more big games. I think those work in favor of Bruschi, who probably still falls just short of being a Hall of Fame level player, but it can't take anything away from Thomas imo. The team around him was not very good.
Jason Taylor was responsible for a lot of the tackles Zach made.